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Just need an ear to hear and understanding heart

Old 03-08-2006, 08:52 PM
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Unhappy Just need an ear to hear and understanding heart

Boy oh boy......let's see.....hello to all on the board. Trying not to sound like a fool, have rose colored glasses on, etc. I have a story to share and I hope someone available has the heart to help me to sort thru these feelings I'm having right now and to try and put things in perspective.

Here goes,

10 months ago I met a woman online in a chat room and after a 10 minute conversation we decided to try a phone call, hit it off IMMEDIATELY and talked everyday....for at least 4 - 5 hours a day...for the next 3 months. There had never been a women in my life before that I cared for as much as I had grown to care for her. We'd spend hours finishing each other's sentences, talking about things we had in come such as family values and how we grew up, relationships we'd been in with old friends and how we grew from those experiences.... I could go on and on but to make a long story short, we agreed upon a visit, me coming from the east coast to fly out to the west coast to see her.

From the day I got there we were like old friends that hadn't seen each other in over 20 years. Man if you could have seen us, you'd think we'd been married for 30 years.....and I mean one of those long rare good marriages where two people that could have grown to that stage wherein they "level off" not doing things they once did for one another, STILL act as if they are courting in high school, but are committed one to another, two peas in a pod, I have your back-you have mine, we function as a TEAM...as one...we love each other.

This was August of last year I got there and I ended up staying. I found a good job full time, and a small part time job without having to sacrifice any of our personal time together. Money was decent, I was finishing up self paced studies on financial management, investing, and finacial skill that would enable me to establish, and build residual income. Money I'd make for a one-time effort, for the rest of my life.

Soon we were able to move into a small apartment in a seemingly quiet neighborhood, both from what we'd observed and from what the apartment manager told us when we questioned him about the area. It turns out that the area was a crack haven. This was November of last year..... well.....we'd been there about a month and a half....and were in bed one afternoon and she looks over and tells me, "on new years eve I smoked crack with my cousin when she came to visit....I know that you were wondering why I was isolating myself from you and that is why." I looked at her in suprise.... After a long silence...I asked her if it had control of her because I've dealt with two family members that damn near went down the drain for that mess. She says, "No". Then she goes on to explain to me about the difference between a "smoker" and a "crack head". I simply said....that if she was gonna do it that she was to limit herself and not let it get out of control. Boy was I naive. She agreed and assured me it would'nt.

It went down hilll from there pretty much as day after day she'd lock herself in the bathroom or bedroom for hours on end. Then came the late night outings to around three to four o'clock in the morning. I knew where she'd been and what she'd been doing and asked less and less. Pretty soon money was growing short as I was continually paying back loans to people she'd owed that gave her a "piece" on credit. She even once dipped into our rent money to finance her high with the lost money being made up from our second source of income from my part time job. From there I started waking up at three in the morning to see strange and varied people leaving the house with her coming behind to shut the door as they went out in darkness.

As the days went by I began to fear what could possibly happen to me if I remained there or what might happen to her and the pain of seeing it. Plus I was living in agonizing pain watching her on a spiral. I had a feeling the police were watching the house and my suspicions were confirmed two days after leaving there (I'm back east now) when she told me that they had knocked the night before "asking" if someone there had called. And then again about a week ago.

Since returning to the east coast I have had sleepless night after sleepless night thinking about her, missing her, wondering "WHY"..... I have continuously called her with her rathering to get off the phone (I hear company in the background so I know they are in the backroom smoking) than talk to me. I've kept in contact with one of her relatives that she's closest to moreso than anyone in her family, and that I've developed a friendship with. This relative and she had a conversation the otherday wherein she stated to her relative that she was angry with me and does'nt "pay any attention" to me when I call. And when asked by her relative "why are you angry at him"....she says nothing. Just goes silent and won't answer.

I'm hurt by all of this. I'm dealing with the reality that our relationship is no more and where she may end up if she don't stop though I know it's pointless because she's gotta hit rock bottom before she quits. All I can think of are the times before she started smoking. The laughs....everything. If anyone can help me understand....please post? Thanks.
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Old 03-08-2006, 09:02 PM
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Oh, what could have been......

I will pray for you to move on as your ex girlfriend needs to hit rock bottom before she will quit and get some help...it is so very sad to see someone so vital and beautiful that you love go down the drain, so to speak. I wish you many nights of sleep and may you have good thoughts for a good future without thoughts of what "might have been"..........Kahlia....PEACE, my friend
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Old 03-08-2006, 09:37 PM
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Hey Fiya...

Welcome to SR...

Well crap eh...

How could something so right go so wrong.. !!

But yes..
that is life...

If it were a terminal illness.. you would be just as powerless as you are over her drug addiction...

But.. the looming question...
WHY..??

The short answer is that she is chasing feel-good...
And crack is very addictive physicly...

For anyone that has never chased the demon... it's hard to understand...
But.. another addict knows...


You were wise to remove yourself.
That probably more than anything made an impact on her.. as she is even unwilling to talk about it.. even derogatoraly about you...

Deep down.. I know she knows she's throwing her life away...
But.. the lure of the drug and the whole scene is still too alluring...

She hasnt hurt enough to want to get clean and take up her life again..

I hope that you count your blessings... grieve... and move on.

Trust me...
She'll catch up with you if it's meant to be...


I am sending a prayer out for you.. that you be able to understand and detach...

And I pray for her...
And for all addicts that are lost out there.. for they are lost.
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Old 03-08-2006, 09:40 PM
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Kahlia,

Thanks for those words. Her relative and I have been keeping contact and she's given us conflicting stories as to her rent money. She's not asking either of us for money. It's just in separate conversations that we had with her, she was very upset and irritable, and when asked why....she gave the reason being her rent money. But the reasons she gave to the both of us were different.

I love this woman dearly. But I'm no fool and since my experience I've received advice from people who once smoked, then quit to avoid being controlled by it and it's been years since they've touched the stuff, are doing EXTREMELY well in life, and have no intentions of doing it again. I will continue to be there for her....but not when it comes to money matters. Even now I call her often just to check up on her and will continue to do so til she tells me outright "leave me alone". If that ever happens. And I'm preparing for it.
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Old 03-08-2006, 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted by bikewench
Hey Fiya...

Welcome to SR...

Well crap eh...

How could something so right go so wrong.. !!

But yes..
that is life...

If it were a terminal illness.. you would be just as powerless as you are over her drug addiction...

But.. the looming question...
WHY..??

The short answer is that she is chasing feel-good...
And crack is very addictive physicly...

For anyone that has never chased the demon... it's hard to understand...
But.. another addict knows...


You were wise to remove yourself.
That probably more than anything made an impact on her.. as she is even unwilling to talk about it.. even derogatoraly about you...

Deep down.. I know she knows she's throwing her life away...
But.. the lure of the drug and the whole scene is still too alluring...

She hasnt hurt enough to want to get clean and take up her life again..

I hope that you count your blessings... grieve... and move on.

Trust me...
She'll catch up with you if it's meant to be...


I am sending a prayer out for you.. that you be able to understand and detach...

And I pray for her...
And for all addicts that are lost out there.. for they are lost.

Yeah...she's said that a couple times, especially in regard to the people who are closest to her right to my face. So I know she knows. Everyday I say within myself that I'll get through this and I'll be ok with the mindset that whenever times come I have to shed tears (and they come often) or get anything off my chest so it's not bottled up...that I will do them and like you said, grieve and move on.

Funny thing you say about "the scene". The people who I saw day in a day out around that place where working around the clock to get it, or sell it. Looking to get over on each other and sometimes were successful at doing it. Some of the sleepless nights I had out there leading up to my departure, I can remember seeing lights on in houses from the time the sun went down til dawn the next day. My house became one of them while I slept.
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Old 03-08-2006, 10:20 PM
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My house became one of them while I slept.
Yes...

It takes over...

And all of them skirt the issues of what they are truly doing to themselves...

they tell themselves.. they're "cool"..

All the while they feel so totally alone...

And those that care about them get dragged behind...

One of the long term members on here had a slogan...

Let go or be dragged.. ;o)


Don't mean we can't still love them...

But.. the outcome of their lives is not in our hands...

That is what we have to give up on...

The outcome of their lives.

We are only responsible for the outcome of our own.... as self centered as that sounds.

Other People can choose to walk with us...
But.. we can't make em walk..

Don't let your love for her cloud your mind...

Your on the right path..
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Old 03-08-2006, 11:04 PM
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Fiya... man... I'm sorry to hear about your grieving. I don't think I have to tell you that you absolutely did the right thing... if I do... then here it is...

YOU completely and totally did the right thing.

Only she can get herself out of the mess she is in... and she has to want it badly. Some never climb back out. I sure hope she sees that smoking crack is a dead-end in all ways. But... you can't do it for her nor can you stop her from doing anything.

As Bikewench said... "Don't let your love for her cloud your mind..." cuz if she thinks she can get money from you for her habit chances are she will try every manipulative trick in the book to get it. Addiction is that ugly. It makes normally kind, sweet, and good people do things that are downright degrading in order to get their fix.

Hang in there.

Suga
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Old 03-09-2006, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Fiya
Kahlia,

Thanks for those words. Her relative and I have been keeping contact and she's given us conflicting stories as to her rent money. She's not asking either of us for money. It's just in separate conversations that we had with her, she was very upset and irritable, and when asked why....she gave the reason being her rent money. But the reasons she gave to the both of us were different.

I love this woman dearly. But I'm no fool and since my experience I've received advice from people who once smoked, then quit to avoid being controlled by it and it's been years since they've touched the stuff, are doing EXTREMELY well in life, and have no intentions of doing it again. I will continue to be there for her....but not when it comes to money matters. Even now I call her often just to check up on her and will continue to do so til she tells me outright "leave me alone". If that ever happens. And I'm preparing for it.
Fiya-Glad my words were of some help to you...she has ALREADY told you to leave her alone...she is USING....she is ALL CONSUMED by drugs. She may still love you in a sick sort of way BUT it is not the kind of love you WANT , NEED, OR, DESERVE. None of us did when we did it to other people that were trying to hang in there and HOPE that we would "quit" and get better and be our "old" selves. Even if she does "quit", Fiya, she has a LOAD of work to do, to get better, to figure out WHY she even started it all in the first place, she should not even have a relationship for the first year of her clean time, it should be used to focus on HER RECOVERY. She needs HELP, real HELP, before she ends up in the ground someplace. I ended up on life support, for God's sake. It take's EXTREME measures before we will STOP. we think we are invinsible. I am in no way trying to HURT you, I am telling you the true REALITY of what you are dealing with-a woman who is too sick to love anything but her DRUG.....I hope you will think about that and I DO admire you for NOT giving her any money...you are a very smart man. PLEASE move on with your live-you DESERVE one, there are so many woman out there that are waiting for a person like you, a good person that has intelligence, a good heart, a smart mind, and most of all a caring soul.....I hope you decide to find one.....I am only trying to tell you what I know from my own addiction..I BROKE someone's heart, he did not even know the "CLEAN" me....I was totally different....he was totally different to ME.....he waited and waited and I was so sad for him that I could NOT give him what he had waited for.....PLEASE do not let that be you.........PEACE, my friend...........Kahlia
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Old 03-10-2006, 08:32 AM
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Originally Posted by bikewench
Yes...

It takes over...

And all of them skirt the issues of what they are truly doing to themselves...

they tell themselves.. they're "cool"..

All the while they feel so totally alone...

And those that care about them get dragged behind...

One of the long term members on here had a slogan...

Let go or be dragged.. ;o)


Don't mean we can't still love them...

But.. the outcome of their lives is not in our hands...

That is what we have to give up on...

The outcome of their lives.

We are only responsible for the outcome of our own.... as self centered as that sounds.

Other People can choose to walk with us...
But.. we can't make em walk..

Don't let your love for her cloud your mind...

Your on the right path..

Yeah, it pretty much came down to survival, besides I was'nt in my element having only dealt with two people who were onced hooked. I never had to be exposed to it for a long period of time because these two were distant relatives and so I only saw them from time to time.

But functioning normaly everyday while everything around me was abnormal (people coming and going, the whole scene out there) was hurtful, confusing, and scary. So it was pretty simple from that point to make a decision. But I won't lie, it hurt. Worst pain I ever been thru.

And as you said, my love for her won't cloud my vision because like I told her, how can I love you when you won't let me, for one....and two.....how can you love me yet want me to watch you destroy yourself and all the while you get mad at me when I try to sit you down and talk to you about it?

On that last thing, she'd get fire red mad! And I'm starting to believe that she knows it all to well to be the truth.
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Old 03-10-2006, 08:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Sugasnaps
Fiya... man... I'm sorry to hear about your grieving. I don't think I have to tell you that you absolutely did the right thing... if I do... then here it is...

YOU completely and totally did the right thing.

Only she can get herself out of the mess she is in... and she has to want it badly. Some never climb back out. I sure hope she sees that smoking crack is a dead-end in all ways. But... you can't do it for her nor can you stop her from doing anything.

As Bikewench said... "Don't let your love for her cloud your mind..." cuz if she thinks she can get money from you for her habit chances are she will try every manipulative trick in the book to get it. Addiction is that ugly. It makes normally kind, sweet, and good people do things that are downright degrading in order to get their fix.

Hang in there.

Suga
Sugasnaps it's amazing how quickly she changed when she started using again. She's beautiful inside and out, she is sweet, she is kind, she has a smile that would melt an iceburg...bright as the sun, and a deep soulful laugh that would tame a madman. And even though I am "green" about this stuff...I think I understood enough to know that it was the side effect of the drug that bought about this Jekell-Hyde transformation when money was low and no one would give her rocks or "flakes" on credit.
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Old 03-10-2006, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Kahlia
Fiya-Glad my words were of some help to you...she has ALREADY told you to leave her alone...she is USING....she is ALL CONSUMED by drugs. She may still love you in a sick sort of way BUT it is not the kind of love you WANT , NEED, OR, DESERVE. None of us did when we did it to other people that were trying to hang in there and HOPE that we would "quit" and get better and be our "old" selves. Even if she does "quit", Fiya, she has a LOAD of work to do, to get better, to figure out WHY she even started it all in the first place, she should not even have a relationship for the first year of her clean time, it should be used to focus on HER RECOVERY. She needs HELP, real HELP, before she ends up in the ground someplace. I ended up on life support, for God's sake. It take's EXTREME measures before we will STOP. we think we are invinsible. I am in no way trying to HURT you, I am telling you the true REALITY of what you are dealing with-a woman who is too sick to love anything but her DRUG.....I hope you will think about that and I DO admire you for NOT giving her any money...you are a very smart man. PLEASE move on with your live-you DESERVE one, there are so many woman out there that are waiting for a person like you, a good person that has intelligence, a good heart, a smart mind, and most of all a caring soul.....I hope you decide to find one.....I am only trying to tell you what I know from my own addiction..I BROKE someone's heart, he did not even know the "CLEAN" me....I was totally different....he was totally different to ME.....he waited and waited and I was so sad for him that I could NOT give him what he had waited for.....PLEASE do not let that be you.........PEACE, my friend...........Kahlia

You know, funny thing is this. As she isolated herself from me day after day, I spent alot of time thinking about what was going on, and in particular how she was acting and things she had been saying....and I came to the conclusion that she's really depressed with some major things that have taken place in her life that she had never ever dealt with, nor had she even tried to talk to anyone about it. Not even her family. And after much thought, I sat her down one morning after first waking telling her what'd I'd been noticing in her words and actions, particular her use of crack and piecing together what she'd been telling me of her past and I told her, "you're depressed sweetness". She was silent, looking at the floor for a moment and she said, "I think maybe I am too." I said, "All the symptoms are there cause I've been through a year long fight with it, then my mother went thru the same thing and my Lady (my pet name for her) was exhibiting the same behaviour...so I knew. And I told her, "You know....you have to start dealing with these past things, and if it takes you crying and moving on...do it. Because bottling it up will destroy you...but that mess won't help you get thru it."

And on that last thing you said, I think she feels the same. She wants to do the right thing, but that desire for the drug is stronger than anything else right now. And only she can break it.

Her cousin tells me I left when the going got "tough". And my response was, "what would you have me to do when I TRIED talking to her....even from the time she first mentioned it to me...letting her KNOW that I wanted her to have nothing to do with it?"

I've pretty much let her know that I am in her life, unless she wants me gone. I've made it clear that I am (and I really am) a TRUE friend and will continue to be til the end. But that I will no longer live around it and that if this is what she wants to do, then I have to stay gone.
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Old 03-10-2006, 09:09 AM
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By the way Sugasnaps, I was in Sacramento for about 5 weeks, then moved to Fresno where things fell apart. California has some beautiful scenery man. The air is bad (lol), but the mountains had me in a trance and I'd sit and stare at them from one end to the next....especially going out to Clovis. And my eyes have not been dimmed because of the people I dealt with. I like Cali and hope to return someday and continue what CAN be a wonderful relationship with a wonderful woman. But I'm no fool and I know that it's something that may never be and have prepared for it, within my heart.
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Old 03-10-2006, 09:22 AM
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Hey Fiya...

Your love for her is apparent... and I believe will ground her to wellness....

Love is a powerful force in countering addiction...
but.. it can't be abused...

So.. she knows it's there..
she knows what she's giving up...

.. potentially.. ;o)


So.. you just hold your course..
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Old 03-10-2006, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by bikewench
Hey Fiya...

Your love for her is apparent... and I believe will ground her to wellness....

Love is a powerful force in countering addiction...
but.. it can't be abused...

So.. she knows it's there..
she knows what she's giving up...

.. potentially.. ;o)


So.. you just hold your course..
Bike.....

That's the BEST advice I've gotten from anyone concerning this matter. THANK YOU SO MUCH. I never thought that genuine love is what matters the most in this....I mean even if I have to be away for a while loving from a distance...or maybe keeping said distance for good.

Matter of fact, this evening when reflecting on things and her reponses to me when I call, it dawned on me that she tells me "I'm fine", whenever I call which says, she's content with where she is and nothing will change that until she get's fed up.....no matter what the reason is. And I felt better because believe me....I've been beating myself up over this.
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Old 03-11-2006, 11:03 AM
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WOW, I am SO STUNNED....

[QUOTE=Fiya]You know, funny thing is this. As she isolated herself from me day after day, I spent alot of time thinking about what was going on, and in particular how she was acting and things she had been saying....and I came to the conclusion that she's really depressed with some major things that have taken place in her life that she had never ever dealt with, nor had she even tried to talk to anyone about it. Not even her family. And after much thought, I sat her down one morning after first waking telling her what'd I'd been noticing in her words and actions, particular her use of crack and piecing together what she'd been telling me of her past and I told her, "you're depressed sweetness". She was silent, looking at the floor for a moment and she said, "I think maybe I am too." I said, "All the symptoms are there cause I've been through a year long fight with it, then my mother went thru the same thing and my Lady (my pet name for her) was exhibiting the same behaviour...so I knew. And I told her, "You know....you have to start dealing with these past things, and if it takes you crying and moving on...do it. Because bottling it up will destroy you...but that mess won't help you get thru it."

And on that last thing you said, I think she feels the same. She wants to do the right thing, but that desire for the drug is stronger than anything else right now. And only she can break it.

Her cousin tells me I left when the going got "tough". And my response was, "what would you have me to do when I TRIED talking to her....even from the time she first mentioned it to me...letting her KNOW that I wanted her to have nothing to do with it?"

Fiya-I admire your tenacity for being such a good friend and hoping that things WILL change. I am going to PRAY that they do. I would LOVE to see this turn out the way you want it to because I have only seen ONE other person that I know that had as much love for someone as you and I have to go with that....I am honestly impressed. I just hope you do not get hurt BUT you have a great heart and an even more brilliant mind......many blessings coming your way and you are very right...your lady is very depressed...I sure was....so many "bad things", so much "old baggage" I finally unloaded all my bags and found out about addiction and PAIN...it is caused by TWO things, Fiya....Anger and fear..I got rid of those and am now OK....I hope she does too. I am hoping for one one those movie endings and I am hoping that you will walk hand in hand together...it would be SO very awesome..... I know it CAN happen......I saw it happen one time. I have seen many impossible things. Anything IS Possible. Many Blesssings to you, my friend and in no way did I ever mean to hurt you..........PEACE to you.........Kahlia
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Old 03-11-2006, 12:01 PM
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Fiya, thanks for taking the time to share your story. It breaks my heart whenever I read about an addict who is activially using.

Please feel free to stop by the Nar-Anon forums here as well. http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/nar-anon/
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Old 03-11-2006, 02:20 PM
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[QUOTE=Kahlia]
Originally Posted by Fiya
You know, funny thing is this. As she isolated herself from me day after day, I spent alot of time thinking about what was going on, and in particular how she was acting and things she had been saying....and I came to the conclusion that she's really depressed with some major things that have taken place in her life that she had never ever dealt with, nor had she even tried to talk to anyone about it. Not even her family. And after much thought, I sat her down one morning after first waking telling her what'd I'd been noticing in her words and actions, particular her use of crack and piecing together what she'd been telling me of her past and I told her, "you're depressed sweetness". She was silent, looking at the floor for a moment and she said, "I think maybe I am too." I said, "All the symptoms are there cause I've been through a year long fight with it, then my mother went thru the same thing and my Lady (my pet name for her) was exhibiting the same behaviour...so I knew. And I told her, "You know....you have to start dealing with these past things, and if it takes you crying and moving on...do it. Because bottling it up will destroy you...but that mess won't help you get thru it."

And on that last thing you said, I think she feels the same. She wants to do the right thing, but that desire for the drug is stronger than anything else right now. And only she can break it.

Her cousin tells me I left when the going got "tough". And my response was, "what would you have me to do when I TRIED talking to her....even from the time she first mentioned it to me...letting her KNOW that I wanted her to have nothing to do with it?"

Fiya-I admire your tenacity for being such a good friend and hoping that things WILL change. I am going to PRAY that they do. I would LOVE to see this turn out the way you want it to because I have only seen ONE other person that I know that had as much love for someone as you and I have to go with that....I am honestly impressed. I just hope you do not get hurt BUT you have a great heart and an even more brilliant mind......many blessings coming your way and you are very right...your lady is very depressed...I sure was....so many "bad things", so much "old baggage" I finally unloaded all my bags and found out about addiction and PAIN...it is caused by TWO things, Fiya....Anger and fear..I got rid of those and am now OK....I hope she does too. I am hoping for one one those movie endings and I am hoping that you will walk hand in hand together...it would be SO very awesome..... I know it CAN happen......I saw it happen one time. I have seen many impossible things. Anything IS Possible. Many Blesssings to you, my friend and in no way did I ever mean to hurt you..........PEACE to you.........Kahlia
Kahlia,
If I may.....would you mind me private messaging you because you have just said something I never thought about and I KNOW part of it IS the case. But the other part I have no idea of and I need your help to understand what it could be affecting her.

And being new to the forum I want to make 1 friend at a time though I appreciate the words of kindness and concern from everyone. (THANKS TO ALL WHO READ THIS!!) But you just said 2 WORDS that point to something MORE for me to understand so I can be better equipped to help her.....when she's ready that is.
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