Switching addictions
No expectations!
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,732
((((alison)))),
Would it be so bad to STAY on the Subutex? At least until you get more solid in your recovery? Are you going to any meetings? It sounds like you could use the face-to-face support. That would be my suggestion. Try Narcotics Anonymous. You're right that you can't do it. You can't do it ALONE. You've reached out for help here, now try it in person, OK?
Love and hugs,
Eddie
Would it be so bad to STAY on the Subutex? At least until you get more solid in your recovery? Are you going to any meetings? It sounds like you could use the face-to-face support. That would be my suggestion. Try Narcotics Anonymous. You're right that you can't do it. You can't do it ALONE. You've reached out for help here, now try it in person, OK?
Love and hugs,
Eddie
Member
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 1,432
Re: whether you should exercise....
I meant that basically you shouldn't do it without guidance from your doctor.
If you're going to exercise, be very gentle. You're not well enough to sustain vigorous exercise.
IMO.
Don S
I meant that basically you shouldn't do it without guidance from your doctor.
If you're going to exercise, be very gentle. You're not well enough to sustain vigorous exercise.
IMO.
Don S
Still Standing
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Here @ SR.
Posts: 3,296
Ashes,
You definitely shouldn't do it. You have no fuel to run on, to just exist, so you definitely don't have any extra fuel for exercise. Besides, if you don't get the help you need, you will be dead, or permanently damaged, so that the way you look, weightwise, completely won't matter. The dirt that will cover you, won't care what you look like. Sorry to be so blunt, but I'm really scared for you. Please go get help. If you've been through this before, as you say, then you know where to go to get the help you need & you can choose a different Dr. if you don't like the ones you had. Make a wise choice PLEASE !!!!!! I repeat; YOU ARE WORTH IT. Do whatever it takes to get healthy & stay that way. ********{Hugs}}}}}
You definitely shouldn't do it. You have no fuel to run on, to just exist, so you definitely don't have any extra fuel for exercise. Besides, if you don't get the help you need, you will be dead, or permanently damaged, so that the way you look, weightwise, completely won't matter. The dirt that will cover you, won't care what you look like. Sorry to be so blunt, but I'm really scared for you. Please go get help. If you've been through this before, as you say, then you know where to go to get the help you need & you can choose a different Dr. if you don't like the ones you had. Make a wise choice PLEASE !!!!!! I repeat; YOU ARE WORTH IT. Do whatever it takes to get healthy & stay that way. ********{Hugs}}}}}
Try A Little Tenderness...
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Ultimately, finding grace.
Posts: 200
I used to be anorexic.
Originally Posted by Ashes
I can't go to the hospital. I really just can't. Or maybe I won't. Any other ideas would be appreciated.
Okay, I have a question. (Thanks for the offer!) If I'm still not underweight (actually a bit overweight) does that rule still apply? Won't I burn fat first? And does it matter how I do it, as far as exercising while restricting calories and stuff? Sorry; I guess that was more than one question! Thanks in advance.
with a feeling of fear (I could die in my sleep) and pride (look what I can do.)
Does that mean that exercising is okay, or that I shouldn't do it?
There is no such thing as "I used to be anorexic."
Anorexia is a disorder of the mind. Notice how you're skipping over the negative information and still trying to figure out how to keep going as you are...but in a "safer way"? There is no safer way to starve yourself.
You need help now, before you do serious and permenant damage to your body. Deep down you know this...but you're afraid. I'm sure you feel very powerful. I'm sure you feel as though no one really understands you. It's your little secret. Your little secret will destroy you, Ashes.
You need help. Whether or not you reach out for that help is up to you. No one can make you see how serious this is...you have to realize it. You know when we have those moments of extreme clarity, honesty and self awareness? We all have them. You probably had one when you woke up on the floor. Listen to that voice...the one that tells you that it's time to find a better way. Follow the sound of that voice.
You can be brave...it just takes one moment of courage to reach out and ask for help. Call a hotline that can direct you to services in your area. You can find the number in your local yellow pages. You only need to take one first step...and then you're already one step ahead. Big, super lovey hugs to you, Ashes, because you sound like you could really use one.
sober in KY
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Wonderland
Posts: 64
Lizzy... how did you get to be so smart? I wish I could be like you. Thanks for the advice. I'll take it to heart.
The funny thing (well, not "ha, ha" funny) was that right after I got sick I heard this song by Garbage... the first lyrics say:
"Avalanche is sullen and too thin
She starves herself to rid herself of sin
And the kick is so divine when she sees bones beneath her skin
And she says:
Hey baby can you bleed like me?
C'mon baby can you bleed like me"
I used to belong to a pro-ana site. That was about four years ago, and the site doesn't exist anymore, but there are still many of them out there. There are times that I miss the kind of advice I got there... other times I wish I'd never known about such a thing.
~ashes
The funny thing (well, not "ha, ha" funny) was that right after I got sick I heard this song by Garbage... the first lyrics say:
"Avalanche is sullen and too thin
She starves herself to rid herself of sin
And the kick is so divine when she sees bones beneath her skin
And she says:
Hey baby can you bleed like me?
C'mon baby can you bleed like me"
I used to belong to a pro-ana site. That was about four years ago, and the site doesn't exist anymore, but there are still many of them out there. There are times that I miss the kind of advice I got there... other times I wish I'd never known about such a thing.
~ashes
Putting it all together
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: St. Louis, MO.
Posts: 469
Oh, My.......
Originally Posted by Ashes
I feel guilty coming back here after I've been gone for a while and was completely unsupportive of everyone else by not reading or responding to anything. I'm sorry, and I'll try to be around more in the future, even though I haven't even been around that long yet!
Anyway, my problem is that I'm an alcoholic. I've been "mostly" sober for about 5 months, but now I'm regressing back to past addictions, I think. I used to be anorexic. I gained a lot of weight over the past two years, but I've recently lost a good bit of it. The problem is that as much as I've tried to diet in a healthy way, even if I follow a low-cal or low-carb or whatever kind of diet plan, I will still GAIN weight. I literally have to push myself to the limit with diet and exercise to lose weight anymore. And I need to, because I'm not a naturally small person.
I've been living on approximately 300-600 calories per day for the past month. I was feeling pretty good, if tired, but it is almost like a high. Then today, I came home after work and I fainted. I never did that before. I was feeling kind of sick and then I got into the door and sort of blacked out and had to sit down. I woke up probably only a few seconds later, lying on my floor. It totally scared me, but even after that, I can't eat anything. I feel like anything I put into my mouth is going to make me literally sick.
I'm currently sitting here shaking and not sure what to do. I don't want to tell anyone. I guess I just wanted some "anonymous" advice. Thanks in advance.
~ashes
Anyway, my problem is that I'm an alcoholic. I've been "mostly" sober for about 5 months, but now I'm regressing back to past addictions, I think. I used to be anorexic. I gained a lot of weight over the past two years, but I've recently lost a good bit of it. The problem is that as much as I've tried to diet in a healthy way, even if I follow a low-cal or low-carb or whatever kind of diet plan, I will still GAIN weight. I literally have to push myself to the limit with diet and exercise to lose weight anymore. And I need to, because I'm not a naturally small person.
I've been living on approximately 300-600 calories per day for the past month. I was feeling pretty good, if tired, but it is almost like a high. Then today, I came home after work and I fainted. I never did that before. I was feeling kind of sick and then I got into the door and sort of blacked out and had to sit down. I woke up probably only a few seconds later, lying on my floor. It totally scared me, but even after that, I can't eat anything. I feel like anything I put into my mouth is going to make me literally sick.
I'm currently sitting here shaking and not sure what to do. I don't want to tell anyone. I guess I just wanted some "anonymous" advice. Thanks in advance.
~ashes
everything is already ok
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Melbourne Victoria Australia
Posts: 19,789
Ashes, Life is great, stay around and enjoy it.
The ER is not too far away, that is the help you need right now is not too far away. All the advice you have got here is right on the button, I have a friend who is anorexic and she used to wriggle verbally every which way rather than take advice and get herself some help.
Thinking of you.
nogard
The ER is not too far away, that is the help you need right now is not too far away. All the advice you have got here is right on the button, I have a friend who is anorexic and she used to wriggle verbally every which way rather than take advice and get herself some help.
Thinking of you.
nogard
No expectations!
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,732
Originally Posted by Ashes
I used to belong to a pro-ana site.
Why won't you get help, huh?
Love and hugs,
Eddie
Member
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Anytown, USA
Posts: 1,019
Originally Posted by Ashes
Okay, I have a question. (Thanks for the offer!) If I'm still not underweight (actually a bit overweight) does that rule still apply? Won't I burn fat first? And does it matter how I do it, as far as exercising while restricting calories and stuff? Sorry; I guess that was more than one question! Thanks in advance.
~ashes
~ashes
As for exercising....NO. Exercising while being malnurished is like playing tackle football without pads. Your body is in a fragile state (and getting worse). Exercising will just worsen your symptoms, and put you at a far greater risk of injury/long term damage. If you look at the injuries to dancers, the majority of them can be traced to weakened muscles, brittle bones, and fatigue related injuries.
Exercising (in the sense I believe you mean it to mean) is overexercising and is yet another way to restrict caloric impact. I know girls who have run until they passed out, woken up, and then kept running.
-pedagogue
Member
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Anytown, USA
Posts: 1,019
Originally Posted by eddie z.
What does that mean? If it means what I think it does, then it's a good thing it doesn't exist anymore.
They have bullimic websites that follow a similar model (no pun intended).
LizzyB brought up a great point about 'use to be anorexic'. You need to look at it like alcoholics look at it....you are in recovery. E.D.'s are so ingrained, that it could be 20 years down the line, and it pops back up. A growing (and scary) trend is the immergence of anorexics and bulimics who are 40+. Some people blame the media, others blame mid-life crisises, but now more than ever....A.N. & B.N. are gaining prevelance in the 40+ crowd.
-pedagogue
Thanks, pedagogue! That's what I suspected. I just didn't want it to be true.sober in KY
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Wonderland
Posts: 64
Originally Posted by pedagogue
I know girls who have run until they passed out, woken up, and then kept running.
-pedagogue
-pedagogue
eddie z., yes I think it is what you think it is. And don't worry, I've avoided such places. That's why I'm here.
I still would feel ashamed, embarrassed, and foolish if I went to a doctor with this. Besides, I just had a physical on Tuesday (two days ago) and appeared healthy. My BP was 113/73, my heart rate was a little up (probably from being nervous) but I was told that I appeared healthy. I had lost eleven lbs since my last visit (about two months ago) so that isn't so bad. I'm still overweight.
I'm not trying to argue, because I totally appreciate all of you for offering advice. I hope I don't sound like I don't. I just wanted to sort of make things more clear. I think what happened last night was a fluke.
As always, thanks for the responses,
~ashes
Member
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Anytown, USA
Posts: 1,019
Ashes....if you are consuming 300-600 calories (heck, 600-800), you will have increased symptoms, and you NEED to get help. I want to be supportive, but if you don't go and get help NOW...I'm afraid you will slowly wither away and die.
You are still denying you have a problem...which is REALLY common. Anorexia is an Egosyntonic activity (in line with the ego). You are showing flashes of dystonic thinking (conflicting with ego), but you regress back when your thoughts approach anything that involves change.
*edit*
btw...11lbs (based on a weight of 130) is still a decrease of 8.5% of total body weight....which is a significant drop. You are well on your way to your 15%+ figure of being underweight. You may be much closer if you were on the light side of your range at the office.
-pedagogue
You are still denying you have a problem...which is REALLY common. Anorexia is an Egosyntonic activity (in line with the ego). You are showing flashes of dystonic thinking (conflicting with ego), but you regress back when your thoughts approach anything that involves change.
*edit*
btw...11lbs (based on a weight of 130) is still a decrease of 8.5% of total body weight....which is a significant drop. You are well on your way to your 15%+ figure of being underweight. You may be much closer if you were on the light side of your range at the office.
-pedagogue
No expectations!
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,732
Originally Posted by Ashes
I still would feel ashamed, embarrassed, and foollish if I went to a doctor with this.
Love and hugs,
Eddie
Try A Little Tenderness...
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Ultimately, finding grace.
Posts: 200
Ashes, I really feel for you. You're a very smart woman, but just as the disease of addiction, (be it alcohol or drugs) anorexia is cunning and baffling. Perception becomes highly askewed. All the well meant advice, lecturing, graphic descriptions, and trying to reason with you, will fall on deaf ears...until you are truly ready for a change.
The fact is that you gain something very palpable and powerful from denying yourself the basic nutrients your body needs. You gain the idea that you are in control.
Any reasonably intelligent person understands that a human being cannot exist on 300 to 600 calories a day. You are an intelligent woman, you know this is dangerous. So you have to ask yourself, is this a problem I can overcome on my own? Were you able to overcome it on your own in the past? Ashes, no one in this world can go it alone.
Now you must believe that what I'm about to say, is said with love. Are you sure that the above statment is entirely the only thing preventing you from talking to someone about your problem? Or could it also be that seeking help would mean having to stop what you are doing? Relinquishing your power.
I'm sure there are two parts of you. The one who sees clearly the downward spiral this can take you on, and the side that just doesn't care, that would just rather be thin and beautiful at any cost.
Wouldn't it just be nice to stop punishing yourself? Wouldn't it be nice to love, nurture and respect your body? Our bodies are merely the vessel in which to house our souls...but, they're the only vessel we're given in this lifetime. You can reconcile your mind and body, Ashes, you just have to want it.
Life holds so much beauty, so much wonder. You have so much left to do. You are valuable and precious. Don't give up on life, when you've only just begun.
The fact is that you gain something very palpable and powerful from denying yourself the basic nutrients your body needs. You gain the idea that you are in control.
Any reasonably intelligent person understands that a human being cannot exist on 300 to 600 calories a day. You are an intelligent woman, you know this is dangerous. So you have to ask yourself, is this a problem I can overcome on my own? Were you able to overcome it on your own in the past? Ashes, no one in this world can go it alone.
I still would feel ashamed, embarrassed, and foolish if I went to a doctor with this.
I'm sure there are two parts of you. The one who sees clearly the downward spiral this can take you on, and the side that just doesn't care, that would just rather be thin and beautiful at any cost.
Wouldn't it just be nice to stop punishing yourself? Wouldn't it be nice to love, nurture and respect your body? Our bodies are merely the vessel in which to house our souls...but, they're the only vessel we're given in this lifetime. You can reconcile your mind and body, Ashes, you just have to want it.
Life holds so much beauty, so much wonder. You have so much left to do. You are valuable and precious. Don't give up on life, when you've only just begun.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Florida
Posts: 10
Well said Lizzy, u have wonderful insight!!
Originally Posted by LizzyB
Ashes, I really feel for you. You're a very smart woman, but just as the disease of addiction, (be it alcohol or drugs) anorexia is cunning and baffling. Perception becomes highly askewed. All the well meant advice, lecturing, graphic descriptions, and trying to reason with you, will fall on deaf ears...until you are truly ready for a change.
The fact is that you gain something very palpable and powerful from denying yourself the basic nutrients your body needs. You gain the idea that you are in control.
Any reasonably intelligent person understands that a human being cannot exist on 300 to 600 calories a day. You are an intelligent woman, you know this is dangerous. So you have to ask yourself, is this a problem I can overcome on my own? Were you able to overcome it on your own in the past? Ashes, no one in this world can go it alone.
Now you must believe that what I'm about to say, is said with love. Are you sure that the above statment is entirely the only thing preventing you from talking to someone about your problem? Or could it also be that seeking help would mean having to stop what you are doing? Relinquishing your power.
I'm sure there are two parts of you. The one who sees clearly the downward spiral this can take you on, and the side that just doesn't care, that would just rather be thin and beautiful at any cost.
Wouldn't it just be nice to stop punishing yourself? Wouldn't it be nice to love, nurture and respect your body? Our bodies are merely the vessel in which to house our souls...but, they're the only vessel we're given in this lifetime. You can reconcile your mind and body, Ashes, you just have to want it.
Life holds so much beauty, so much wonder. You have so much left to do. You are valuable and precious. Don't give up on life, when you've only just begun.
The fact is that you gain something very palpable and powerful from denying yourself the basic nutrients your body needs. You gain the idea that you are in control.
Any reasonably intelligent person understands that a human being cannot exist on 300 to 600 calories a day. You are an intelligent woman, you know this is dangerous. So you have to ask yourself, is this a problem I can overcome on my own? Were you able to overcome it on your own in the past? Ashes, no one in this world can go it alone.
Now you must believe that what I'm about to say, is said with love. Are you sure that the above statment is entirely the only thing preventing you from talking to someone about your problem? Or could it also be that seeking help would mean having to stop what you are doing? Relinquishing your power.
I'm sure there are two parts of you. The one who sees clearly the downward spiral this can take you on, and the side that just doesn't care, that would just rather be thin and beautiful at any cost.
Wouldn't it just be nice to stop punishing yourself? Wouldn't it be nice to love, nurture and respect your body? Our bodies are merely the vessel in which to house our souls...but, they're the only vessel we're given in this lifetime. You can reconcile your mind and body, Ashes, you just have to want it.
Life holds so much beauty, so much wonder. You have so much left to do. You are valuable and precious. Don't give up on life, when you've only just begun.
Lizzy, I really love what u have said to ASHES, Ashes u know I too care and have given u my testimony in the past, any addiction is a hard one to break, but in your case it could mean some major consequences, always remember that your inner beauty is what matters in life, Please take all of the advice you have been given and please consult a doctor for your problem with Anorexia, this is nothing to play around with, I wish I was close by to give you a big hug and let u know how concrned I am about your welfare, you are loved by many, and always trust in the Lord he will always lead you in the right direction, don,t mistake Satans evil ways for the likes of god, If you dont go to the doctor or the emergency room Try going to Church or attend some bible studies, or even a AA OR NA MEETING AND SURROUND YOURSELF WITH POSITIVE PEOPLE, the sooner you leave the negativity in your life the better, GOD BLESS YOU GIRL, E-MAIL ME ANYTIME U LIKE I truely care about u, You have a friend in JESUS, LOVE aLWAYS, Jackie
aka
sunshine25642002******.com
sober in KY
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Wonderland
Posts: 64
I haven't been back here in a while, and I just read through all of the posts. I want to thank you all for your concern and advice. There were a lot of really helpful responses, and I know that I will read through them all again and again.
I'm still kind of stuck in a rut. I'm not restricting so much anymore, but still limit my food choices a lot. I keep very little food in the house, and only "safe" foods.
You know what is really hard too? People I know and people I work with have commented that I am looking really good lately, since I've "noticably" lost weight and had to buy smaller clothes and stuff. Even some people who knew that I used to have a bit of a problem. A couple guys I work with said that I looked really good and "you shouldn't lose much more weight!" "MUCH" more! What a motivation TO lose more weight! It's almost like a challenge now. God, I'm so hopeless. I'm sorry. I'm not going to hurt myself, and I really will try to be healthy. I'm just so FRUSTRATED with myself!
~ashes
I'm still kind of stuck in a rut. I'm not restricting so much anymore, but still limit my food choices a lot. I keep very little food in the house, and only "safe" foods.
You know what is really hard too? People I know and people I work with have commented that I am looking really good lately, since I've "noticably" lost weight and had to buy smaller clothes and stuff. Even some people who knew that I used to have a bit of a problem. A couple guys I work with said that I looked really good and "you shouldn't lose much more weight!" "MUCH" more! What a motivation TO lose more weight! It's almost like a challenge now. God, I'm so hopeless. I'm sorry. I'm not going to hurt myself, and I really will try to be healthy. I'm just so FRUSTRATED with myself!
~ashes
No expectations!
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,732
Originally Posted by Ashes
"you shouldn't lose much more weight!" "MUCH" more! What a motivation TO lose more weight! It's almost like a challenge now.
Love and hugs,
Eddie
Member
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Anytown, USA
Posts: 1,019
It can take time. Receiving conflicting messages from others is one of the biggest hurdles you will have. You are still speaking from your disorder. ("it's almost like a challenege now", "only safe foods", fixation of other's opinions about your physical appearance..without notice to the consequences of their comments)
I'm glad you came back. Don't be a stranger!
-pedagogue
I'm glad you came back. Don't be a stranger!
-pedagogue
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