Tetrax

It all sounds so reasonable, you know compared to having a 'Higher Power' or whatever. We do live in the 21st Century, after all.

Freedom?

Offthemast

Why take a jab at people who do believe in God? Poor form.

Tetrax

Sorry, that wasn't my intention.

advbike

I didn't see it as a jab, but am more curious what the "Freedom Model" is..

Tetrax

It's a legit organisation made up of three ex-alcoholics that suggests recovery programmes aren't really up to scratch.

Offthemast

"Its so reasonable..." compared to being unreasonable. Join the 21st century ya rubes. That's what I got from it. I'm not offended, I just didn't think it was necessary.

Good luck. I'll bow out now.

Offthemast

I am interested in this. Having a hard time getting into AA.

My apologies if you did not mean it like that thats just the way I took it.

Tetrax

Sorry again. I actually was leaning towards AA stuff over Freedom Model stuff. I think honestly that it's a mental illness/linked to depression and OCD, and this needs to be looked at, in the 21st Century.

joe801

Interesting. I personally don't see alcoholism as a moral failing, just a chemical dependence. Fortunately everyone being different AA might help or hurt depends on the individual and same for the freedom approach.

advbike

-- triple post, lol --

advbike

- triple post, lol --

advbike

I'm all for modern scientific and evidence-based solutions. Real research, and understanding of addiction and the recovery process. It was sorely lacking in my AA experience, which lumps everyone together with a single approach, labels them as "alcoholic", and includes codewords, cliche's and the two I hate the most - Powerlessness, and "character defects". I definitely have agency to control what I do and don't think my drinking was a moral failing - rather it was a natural solution to my anxiety, OCD and childhood trauma. We also know now that AUD (Alcohol Use Disorder) affects people differently, and on a spectrum, hence there is a need for more than one solution.

EDIT - apologize for the multiple posts, I should know better than to do that by now..

samwitch

Totally agree ADV. No reason why different approaches can't coexist as the more people helped, the better.

Also agree with you Tetrax about the link/correlation to other issues such as depression and anxiety.

Zencat

Getting the addiction recovery services to the addict could use a big boots in social services offered to the public. Free and readily available detox, in-patient/out-patient, recovery homes and the like. IMO Lots of good free recovery programs seem to get underutilized.

samwitch

Very good point Zen. Unfortunately, mental health services in general aren't given the appropriate funding/attention the deserve.

I don't mean to hijack the thread though.
Edit to say this is just my observation from a Unites States healthcare perspective.

Offthemast

Apologies again. I've been irritable the last few days w some sudden cravings. I should've just scrolled past instead of looking for offense.

Dee74

they lost me. All kinds of nope.

D

ToughChoices

It sounds like this organization is trying to sell a program that tells those trapped in substance use that they don’t have to stop altogether. And don’t have to go to meetings or keep up recovery efforts.

They are selling the”dream” of moderation and normalcy to those who have regularly demonstrated an inability to moderate normally.

I think it sounds opportunistic and dangerous. It’s not that everyone has to do AA…..just that addiction requires real action and abstinence. Not just a credit card.

DriGuy

I didn't investigate it very deeply, but yikes, moderation for alcoholics? Sounds like they are appealing to every alcoholics pre-recovery fantasy. It might be a workable business model for a while, but what about the welfare of the clients?

joe801

I also didn't click & read the link, I tried what they're proposing/selling for years and that made me worse. Alcoholic and moderation don't mix.