Dee74

I don't have any AA experience, but I hope you won't let this derail or postpone your recovery programme Gabe, cos that's the really important thing

D

Gabe1980

Morning everyone, and firstly thank you so much for all your responses. I am just going to let you know a bit about where I got to yesterday, instead of answering everyone individually. I hope that is OK.

I got in touch in touch with the sponsor and thanked her for her help. I explained about my not being able to commit to the meeting schedule and my reasons why. She was nice about it and wished me well, so I don't feel too bad about wasting her time.

I did however, end up feeling really miserable. Disappointed mainly, I think, and my thinking wasn't great. I didn't consider drinking really but this has been the first time since October 2nd when I questioned if this was really my time. I have been so certain and I just felt devastated. I am much better today and I think this has all been a very positive thing. Here's why....

1) It made me realise and appreciate the commitment and dedication AAers have and the work they put it. I haven't been going to as many meetings as might be beneficial to me and I plan to increase this to 4 a week - I can manage that. I also have more of a sense of what I can be doing in my daily routine, reading etc, which I think will really help. I plan to go, listen, share and learn.

2) Even in AA there is no one size fits all. Ive been learning that about recovery in general but was under the impression that there was ONE way to do AA. There obviously isn't and different things have worked for different people.

3) It's OK to take my time. I had the fear that is I didn't do the steps right now I would inevitably relapse. But Why? Plenty people stay sober using different methods and it sounds like people in AA get sponsors at different times and work in different ways.

4) I don't need to say yes to things that don't feel right, even if someone tells me I NEED to do things a certain way. Trust myself and trust what I know I can manage. I am serious and I am committed to this process, to my life. I maybe don't need someone else running if for me (well maybe to that extent.)

5) I may be powerless over alcohol but I am not powerless in the rest of my life. I know myself and I am starting to really understand this addiction I have. I also know what I respond well too and what helps support my thinking. I lacked a proper committment before but I have that now. There is no reason why a combination of things I put together can't work for me.

6) I still want to find a sponsor but maybe I'll just take me time until I meet someone who I connect with and will be happy to work at the pace I need.

SO......

Here's what I am going to do....

1) Increase the number of meetings I go to. I'm thinking four is manageable. Including a Step work and a BB meeting. Learn, meet loads of people and really become part of the community. Ask questions too and keep my eyes open for a sponsor.

2) Start doing some step work reading on my own and taking my thoughts into my alcohol counselling. Working though my understanding of what alcohol has done for and to me. Continue to lay a strong foundation for my life and to understand my emotional vulnerability and my strengths.

3) Continue to try and listen and trust myself about my self- care. Get plenty rest and look after myself. If I am too tired to do something in the evening then it ok to choose to rest, so long as there is a balance between this and action.

4) Keep coming here and asking questions. I almost accepted her terms as I thought saying no was a sign of my lack of commitment, when in fact it was my common sense talking. I'm so glad that I understand that now.

So....all in all a bit stressful, upsetting and disappointing but I think also really useful. Thanks again for all your help everyone in supporting me to find my way through this. Gabe xxx

Tetrax

It sounds to me that this is your time as you're rightly taking it seriously. I also think you did the right thing not going with that sponsor; it's YOUR recovery and I say if something doesn't sit well with you then move on. And it sounds like a good plan moving forwards

venuscat

Gabe ~ that is a life plan, a fabulous and comprehensive life plan that encompasses all you need to be happy and healthy and sober.

In my opinion, anyway. ❤️

sugarbear1

My sponsor knows I am an adult. I choose the number of meetings I make a week. The only thing my sponsor did do was to ask me to make a commitment to a specific number of meetings a week and to keep that commitment.

A sponsor's role is to guide you through the steps, not to tell you how to live.

If you work the steps, you won't need a meeting to stay sober, you have a new design for living your life.

DriGuy

Like the rest of us in this forum, I think she wanted to share things that worked for her. Your sponsor probably found nightly meetings especially useful for her, and that demand was her way of helping. And all of us, 12 Steppers or Freelancers, tend to regard what worked for us as sacrosanct. I thought she bowed out quite gracefully.

Bingo! There is most important common denominator of recovery: Dedication and work. A commitment to some set of tools that you have confidence in and a willingness to go the extra mile to seem them through.

The AA program was written by a guy with specific personal issues that are not common to everyone. The big issues in his life, may not be yours. The one issue that is common is alcoholism, the relevance of the other issues varies widely from person to person.

I think you need to stop drinking right away, but getting your bearings is not unhealthy. Recovery involves constantly getting your bearings as life continually presents new situations you will face. Now's a good time to get started.

Stop there and absorb the importance of this insight. It's huge. "Powerless over alcohol, but not the rest of your life." You have the power to think and choose, and as the cravings for alcohol subside that power becomes even greater. And it's power you can use when your AV starts playing head games. It's the power you use to lay out a path for the rest of your life.

It's kind of embarrassing to fire a sponsor. Get to know the people in the group and choosing will be easier.

I think you're going to be fine. You're mindful enough to recognize when you need to add something to your plan or reset a direction. I read the rest of what you going to do, and you're off to a good start.

August252015

Soooo. Gabe. I LOVE your update. So many reasons why, and among them is you have identified that learning to apply your intuition and good judgment to what is right for you is possible and important. Also, people might not always get this from what I say, but I do fully believe what the BB says: suggestions that have proven successful to [us]. So what I suggest by way of telling what I do is not telling you (anyone) what they should do - rather, it's sharing exactly what helped me in the beginning, "looking for the people who had what I wanted."

I loved DriGuy's post too (as usual!) and I smiled at the breaking up w a sponsor part because Jesus H on a Piece of Toast have I agonized about this one a few times!! That people pleaser part of me, the self-critical part about whether I can trust my judgment, am I doing the program for real...totally made breakups in dating hard and in sponsor life It's really ok tho (and I should have broken up with more boys sooner, real talk!).

So so glad you are here. Last note for now - I've found that sometimes the kind of devastation you describe (spot on word, btw) brings the best growth in understanding, forward movement and choices that strengthen my sobriety. If I can frame it that way like you are trying to do, it's a really good part of my recovery path.

Dee74

Hi Beav

Anna and I are the forum mods - we're the best people to ask about questions of policy

Yes, we have a policy of 'no recovery method debates' here in this forum.

Debates in this sense means situations where people are fighting over opinions.

Discussions - in this sense, a conversation when all parties are listening to each other and sharing ideas and allowing people their own opinion, are fine.

Discussions are showing an interest in understanding why another feels a certain way.

This thread has been great in that everyones focused on Gabes initial post and tried to be helpful. So far at least I consider it a discussion not a debate

If anyone disagrees you can always report a post and we'll look at it again

thanks

Dee
Administrator
SR

Gabe1980

YAY!!! I feel a lot more confident now that I am on the right track. It's been a real learning curve this weekend and I've really been through the mill emotionally but I have learned so much.

Thank you so much again everyone for your advice and feedback. It's, as always, much appreciated

I've talked a wee bit about balance and struggling with being tired. I was a bit proactive today and spoke to my work about starting a bit later in the morning (I'm fortunate in managing my own diary). My reason for this is that I need to factor in more exercise because my anxiety is really interfering with how I feel day to day and my just being to appreciate things. Swimming really works well for me and I think hitting the pool three times a week will make a big difference, so I'm going to go before work.

It's not that big a deal but a subtle change in my thinking, I'm moving away from that all or nothing mentality. Swimming 3 times per week is manageable, meetings 3/4 times per week is manageable, checking in on SR daily but posting more at the weekends is manageable....

I'm NOT going to be tripped up by the same things and the same thinking that leads to relapse. It's not all or nothing. It's not all right now and it doesn't have to be perfect. It IS about planning for the rest of my life. My SOBER life.I am finally getting that. Steady, slowly and keep building. Listen to my body, listen to my instincts and look after myself. Balance. Understanding my limitations right now.

Relating to the AA discussion - I have found that so helpful and none of it sounded like criticism to me, just differing views and experiences. I think that was most evident in what my (would have been sponsor) asked of me (as that worked for her) and then what people here have shared worked for them.

There is loads to learn, understand and incorporate but there are some things that may never fit for me and that's totally ok too. I think in AA there are always people who are very literal about everything, and the is ONE way to do AA but that obviously isn't the case for everyone. Understanding that is awesome - I had a huge emotional and psychological exhale, when that understanding settled on me. It has made me more confident and I feel empowered by it. I love a lot about AA - that's enough. I also have faith a sponsor will appear when I am ready - keeping the faith daily. There is so much I can do RIGHT NOW - mostly it is being mindful of my thoughts and choosing better ones, but also meetings and becoming part of the community.

You lot are awesome and I'm so happy to be part of this community too!!

DriGuy

I did experience one all or nothing attitude in my recovery, and I've always considered it essential for everyone, regardless what program they follow. It's not like I wrote down an official plan, with numbered parts. It was more something I intuitively experienced as necessary. While I was quick to amend, swap, discard, cannibalize and incorporate parts of any program into my strategy, there was this one overriding uncompromising thing that presided over everything. I would not have another drink ever, not one day at a time. It would be forever.

Parts that I cobbled together became tools to maintain and protect that uncompromising goal, but none of the parts were sacrosanct by themselves. In fact, the most useful tools or parts I used, often came from AA members who through experience found them useful or necessary, and were often not even part of the AA literature. Examples would be 90 meetings, and pre planed escape routes with backups for any upcoming high risk situations. And the 90 meetings turned out to be nightly for a couple of years. Not because 90 days or nightly is some magical number, but because I just needed a routine to replace my nightly drinking. I suppose nightly swimming would accomplish the same thing. Meetings and socializing just fit me better and helped keep me focused on the issue.

But the one uncompromising rule, No More Alcohol, was never negotiable. I was "all in" on that. The rest not so much. Other parts could be temporarily raised to non negotiable status when necessary. And again, it wasn't a formal plan. It was intuitive paths and responses to situations that might lead me away from the one thing that I refused to compromise on.

My point in all of this is that everything may not have to be "all or nothing," but I think somethings might need to be. At least my inner sense experienced it that way.

August252015

^^^^What DriGuy said.

I do not literally apply everything in AA. No way. I do however consider "recovery the backdrop of my life," and ultimately "do or die." What that means to me might not always be clear, I guess, but it means that by striving for emotional sobriety every day, and protecting the "layers" between me and a drink (ie, AA, yoga when not injured, morning meditations that aren't from AA btw, psych and therapist care, time with my husband every day, naps, dog time, on and on and this list was in no particular order) is how I do it. Intuitive way of living with support and reminders might be a great way to describe the path I have found.

And truthfully, I sometimes have to remember to just assume people aren't bashing AA which I do perceive here - and better, let Dee and Anna remind people we can't slam other recovery methods from our own.

Gabe1980

Yes, I get that too. The all or nothing does apply to alcohol. No alcohol ever. Everything else is about supporting that decision just now.

I guess for me its learning the balance as I apply pressure and then can't maintain what I set out to do. That overwhelm then failure has been at the centre if every relapse.

This feels much better. Keeping my commitment to never drink again central but not beating myself over the head with it and finding enjoyable/fulfilling/practical ways to support that decision.

I think I'm growing!! 💕😂

DriGuy

That's what I was trying to get across. Recovery is the primary thing and all other takes a back seat. You live and breath recovery. Conflicts with other needs are always resolved in favor of recovery. Fortunately, this is easier to do than it sounds. At least it was for me. What I thought were going to be big sacrifices were not. The real sacrifice was the joy I gave up every time I drank.

Gabe1980

That's were I finally got too after many relapses. Recovery is at the centre and you build round it, choosing things that ultimately support that recovery centre.

Previously, I dipped in and out, prioritised other things or sometimes just drifted away. The commitment wasn't there and I didn't understand that recovery was about actively changing my life, not just stopping drinking but doing all the same stuff.

The exciting thing for me is I get to live a better and more honest life. I get to be a better person. How amazing is that?! 💕💕

August252015

You are super duper growing Gabe
It feels good, doesn't it?

And to add to what you and DriGuy and I are just saying - making recovery the center of my life means that....I don't live centered on alcohol, or by my disease. It's freedom because I have life priorities straight; alcohol is out of the equation, if I do what I need to do - mostly habit but some days choice!

Today, completely unrelated to alcohol, I woke up furious. I shared somewhere else earlier that I have made choices to keep me moving away from that awful head and heart space. It's a lot better here at 330p than 6 am, I can tell you!!

You're doing great, Gabe.

DriGuy

For me, I can't remember saying , "I am committed to staying sober," and I don't remember administering such an oath to myself. As you seem to be noticing, it's something you sense. It's like finding it, instead of willing it to happen. I don't know if that's how it's supposed to feel in order to be real. It's just a thing I observed inside of myself. In your words, "It feels different, this time." In fact, I think your words are understated, but I don't have a clue how to state them to reflect the correct intensity.

Recovery is definitely about changing your life. AA emphasizes psychological and spiritual changes as a highest priority for changing your life, and most of that takes place in the steps. It can be a good place to start. IMO, I think it should go deeper and cover a wider scope of issues, and I think some in AA expand it themselves, just instinctively.

But do not undersell sobriety as a life change. It's enormously huge, and it creates additional life changes almost by itself. If the boost in confidence and pride were the only results of just staying sober, that in itself would be worth it.

The big book advocates dropping resentments, but doesn't explain how to do it. It might as well have ordered me to start speaking French instead of English. I learned how to deal with resentments from people in meetings who passed their experiences on to me. Some people may have been doing it since they were kids, but it was a major life change for me and I learned it in... Dare I say?... MEETINGS!... Ha!

But just staying sober was a major life change for me. And growing to love it is even bigger.

snitch

Gabe you are doing amazing!

keep it in the day.

Get your head on your pillow sober. Alot of time in early recovery and even now, that was all I really achieved in a day and you know what, that is ok!! If I am going to bed sober then it is a good day.

Yep, this is a jouney you are on now hon. Sometimes smooth , sometimes bumpy lol. Welcome to your new life! 😊😊😊

August252015

Great comments DriGuy.

One thing you said about resentments: AA tells us that it is generally the number one offender of us alcoholics. And I have found that the BB does give us tools to deal with them, perhaps thru people helping me study the book or meetings on the topic or certain pages and parts I now use to tackle resentments. One way is the 10/11 parts about daily inventory. I religiously read pp 84-88 and 417-418 every day til perhaps a couple months ago.

AA didn't invent the wheel on much - and def not on one of the biggest things all of us say we need to do, in our own words....flipping a resentment, quibble, hurt feelings, blame, so on from "how could they do this to me, etc?" to "why is this bothering me/what is my part/what can I do, etc" stuff. That helps me prevent resentments from forming. Ties into selfishness and self-centered thinking, too.

You're doing great!!

Gabe1980

Just a quick update - I'm in the middle of dental treatment and my face is rather sore!

I've been thinking about a few things....

Thinking about the difference between where I am now and those other times I've 'tried' at recovery. Driguy you are right about not willing it or forcing but that there is just a fundamental change, like a click and the light comes on. For me it was like I finally had the right platform of thinking to build my recovery house on. The commitment not to drink doesn't feel like pressured or punitive thing - it feels like a bud that I'm watering and I'm paying close attention to it. It is also an agreement with God which helps me a lot.

About resentments - I've been thinking about that and I plan on reading the pages you mentioned August (thank you!). For me I was not aware of feeling overly resentful but my goodness was I resentful about not being able to drink like everyone else. That massive underlying resentment. I think it applies also to feeling criticism and having hurt feelings. I think the feeling is the same 'you did this to me' kind of feeling. I also know that one of my resentments is feeling pressured to give up time for things when I don't want to, so I'm trying to focus on other people and what they need to.

An interesting thing happened at work today, wont bore you all with the details but I was really aware of not taking a situation personally when I almost certainly would have before. It was meant as constructive and I took it this way. That's a change. I'm becoming less vulnerable to those kinds of things. It's not all about me. Mostly nothing much is about me! what is about me is what happens in my head and the choices I make about how I think/feel.

That feels like freedom - that and focusing on the quality of my life and what I apply myself too. I think that feeling of having 'lost' something by giving up alcohol turns to gaining everything by closing the door on drinking and all the horrible crap that comes with it. Freedom .....

xxxx

Gabe1980

Thank you! I am in great company here. Each sober day is a success. Each day I'm not in rubbish mood and can appreciate all the little things life offers is even better.

I'm not sweating the small stuff. Just working really hard to remain calm and keep my focus. Finally got back to swimming again today, so the lethargy must be lifting