Forgiving yourself
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 177
Forgiving yourself
Hi there soberfriends.
Like a lot of people in recovery, I have suffered from great feelings of guilt when quitting drinking. I felt guilty about the time I wasted, the friends I lost because I was too wasted to spend time with them and generally spending a good few years acting like an idiot.
I guess I didn't want to forgive myself because I considered it a selfish act, I felt like I deserved to feel like this for my mistakes.
However, during my last relapse, this guilt was a huge part of the reason I drank again.
When going through my cbt book I was thinking about this and it occurred to me that I have this all backwards. I cannot change the past, only the future and the only way I can make a positive change is by staying sober. Forgiving myself is an important part of staying sober, so forgiving myself is not only what I need to do, its the right thing to do in order to make amends for the mistakes I have made.
My loved ones deserve me sober, and I owe them that.
Like a lot of people in recovery, I have suffered from great feelings of guilt when quitting drinking. I felt guilty about the time I wasted, the friends I lost because I was too wasted to spend time with them and generally spending a good few years acting like an idiot.
I guess I didn't want to forgive myself because I considered it a selfish act, I felt like I deserved to feel like this for my mistakes.
However, during my last relapse, this guilt was a huge part of the reason I drank again.
When going through my cbt book I was thinking about this and it occurred to me that I have this all backwards. I cannot change the past, only the future and the only way I can make a positive change is by staying sober. Forgiving myself is an important part of staying sober, so forgiving myself is not only what I need to do, its the right thing to do in order to make amends for the mistakes I have made.
My loved ones deserve me sober, and I owe them that.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Adelaide, Australia
Posts: 28,668
AA (oh the irony!), I agree. I find forgiving myself very hard to do. My dad was a priest- and happiness was a reward from god- unhappiness was a deserving place to merit punishment for sins. To live in the past- blocks the present which alters the future. I do not know if I will every truly forgive myself- but ACCEPTING that is who I was and who I am now is am important distinction. CBT has been such a valuable tool for this. Well done for us (yay).
Member
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 2,909
Guilt, shame, remorse are symptoms of lack of acceptance. Acceptance is not to be confused with liking, condoning, agreeing with, etc. It has nothing to do with those any more than it is about disliking, condemning, disagreeing with etc.
True acceptance is free from any value judgements. It is an honest appraisal and acknowledgment of something being exactly as it is or was.
I should be better than that. I know better than that. That isn't the real me. etc. etc.
The fact is...in the past, yes I did, or was, whatever caused me to have those feelings. I have to accept that, in order to be free.
I can not change the past, but I do not have to repeat whatever I did, or was, in the past.
True acceptance is free from any value judgements. It is an honest appraisal and acknowledgment of something being exactly as it is or was.
I should be better than that. I know better than that. That isn't the real me. etc. etc.
The fact is...in the past, yes I did, or was, whatever caused me to have those feelings. I have to accept that, in order to be free.
I can not change the past, but I do not have to repeat whatever I did, or was, in the past.
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,439
The more I did good things, the less the bad things I'd done seemed to matter.
Its not that I feel absolved or that I'm no longer responsible...but my todays mean more to me than yesterdays now, if that makes sense?
D
Its not that I feel absolved or that I'm no longer responsible...but my todays mean more to me than yesterdays now, if that makes sense?
D
Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
This is exactly what the steps of AA are for.....
But whether you do them just like they're prescribed (which I did not)...
Or do them in your own way, in your own time, in your own order, along with your own types of support - such as counseling, journaling, introspection, self-reflection, asking Spirit's forgiveness, forgiving yourself ceremonially, etc. (which I did)....
The key is that you really take the time and the ACTION to identify all those things you're carrying the burden of guilt and shame for - then work them gone.
But whether you do them just like they're prescribed (which I did not)...
Or do them in your own way, in your own time, in your own order, along with your own types of support - such as counseling, journaling, introspection, self-reflection, asking Spirit's forgiveness, forgiving yourself ceremonially, etc. (which I did)....
The key is that you really take the time and the ACTION to identify all those things you're carrying the burden of guilt and shame for - then work them gone.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: France
Posts: 3,040
Guilt is what makes most go back to the Devils p*ss, we cant look back only forward, I always say to myself would I have done that sober NO, so its the disease that is at fault, keep moving forward, everything happens for a reason good luck
Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: UK, South Coast
Posts: 605
Originally Posted by Andagain 
When going through my cbt book I was thinking about this and it occurred to me that I have this all backwards. I cannot change the past, only the future and the only way I can make a positive change is by staying sober. Forgiving myself is an important part of staying sober, so forgiving myself is not only what I need to do, its the right thing to do in order to make amends for the mistakes I have made.
My loved ones deserve me sober, and I owe them that.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 403
My opinion might not be popular, but here it is anyway:
Some things deserve to be confined to the the drunken period of our lives and the fallout must be accepted without hoping, asking, or pleading for forgiveness. Ultimately, we chose to be drunk, and there are consequences, sometimes dire. If we would have killed someone under the influence, consequences wouldn't be mollified or modified. I don't expect anyone to forgive me and, in fact, some of my social crimes were so egregious that I'm resigned to deal with the extreme guilt. I feel that asking for forgiveness or explaining my behaviors away would ultimately be followed by a but, i.e., I'm sorry for doing that, BUT[I was drinking]. People who don't drink like us probably can't understand how out of our minds we were and frankly, they shouldn't have to.
I've told my story before: when I was going through major marital problems related almost exclusively to my out of control drinking, I called upon some mutual friends (that is, mutual to my husband and me) to counsel me and see me through over the epi-center of the disaster (about four months in time). These people are upstanding in every way--morally, within their communities, etc. Other friends of ours enjoyed the games and probably had a lot of schadenfreude and were super immature.
In any case, one night, my husband called on them (in a faraway state) to intervene because I had gotten so drunk I grabbed the steering wheel in a fight. True to form, they calmed me down. Then my husband left with my child.
He wouldn't answer my calls, so I decided, while browned out, to punish him in any way I could. My goal was to make my husband look bad in their eyes because I wanted to "win". What I wanted to win--who knows? The drunken mind is an enigma. I say browned out because I remember, even in my stupor, telling myself that what I was about to do was awful and unheard of. That tells you something if even my drunk self knew.
Next morning, when I was half in the bag *still, I was going through my fb messages. Yep. you guessed it. I sent it. My husband is uber critical and had commented on them aging, their looks, their children's looks, etc. Not constantly and not really insidiously. Just passing comments like, "Yep, they (and all of us) are getting older." Not sticking up for my husband, it was more just him speaking out loud because they'd moved away and he's been friends with them since they were teens. He'd also made comments about their kids. The discussion about my husband's ethics is one that I'll save for another day (I've complained about him a ton on here).
I sent them a text--as even a middle schooler would not--and informed them of the nasty things--their looks, their children's looks, etc. Just goes to show you how vile I can be (I'm not totally blaming this on drinking. I know I have a mean streak but I would NEVER utter something like this sober or even buzzed).
I gave a half-assed apology and chugged more to block it out. It wasn't until after my hospital stay (which was only a week after that) that I realized the gravity of what I'd done--that, and other things. They graciously ignored the incident. But, they also shunned me (rightfully). Both of their FBs went from being social and regular to me being blocked (well, I'm assuming).
I thought and thought about how to apologize (last summer). I can't. It's too late. The damage will never be undone and it's all an excuse for extremely pathetic and mismanaged behavior. The guilt of that is overwhelming and it's something I have to live with. I don't want forgiveness, actually.
Anyway, sorry to go on, but it helps me write about it.
Sometimes, we have to accept that in some instances, there is no damage control and never will be.
Some things deserve to be confined to the the drunken period of our lives and the fallout must be accepted without hoping, asking, or pleading for forgiveness. Ultimately, we chose to be drunk, and there are consequences, sometimes dire. If we would have killed someone under the influence, consequences wouldn't be mollified or modified. I don't expect anyone to forgive me and, in fact, some of my social crimes were so egregious that I'm resigned to deal with the extreme guilt. I feel that asking for forgiveness or explaining my behaviors away would ultimately be followed by a but, i.e., I'm sorry for doing that, BUT[I was drinking]. People who don't drink like us probably can't understand how out of our minds we were and frankly, they shouldn't have to.
I've told my story before: when I was going through major marital problems related almost exclusively to my out of control drinking, I called upon some mutual friends (that is, mutual to my husband and me) to counsel me and see me through over the epi-center of the disaster (about four months in time). These people are upstanding in every way--morally, within their communities, etc. Other friends of ours enjoyed the games and probably had a lot of schadenfreude and were super immature.
In any case, one night, my husband called on them (in a faraway state) to intervene because I had gotten so drunk I grabbed the steering wheel in a fight. True to form, they calmed me down. Then my husband left with my child.
He wouldn't answer my calls, so I decided, while browned out, to punish him in any way I could. My goal was to make my husband look bad in their eyes because I wanted to "win". What I wanted to win--who knows? The drunken mind is an enigma. I say browned out because I remember, even in my stupor, telling myself that what I was about to do was awful and unheard of. That tells you something if even my drunk self knew.
Next morning, when I was half in the bag *still, I was going through my fb messages. Yep. you guessed it. I sent it. My husband is uber critical and had commented on them aging, their looks, their children's looks, etc. Not constantly and not really insidiously. Just passing comments like, "Yep, they (and all of us) are getting older." Not sticking up for my husband, it was more just him speaking out loud because they'd moved away and he's been friends with them since they were teens. He'd also made comments about their kids. The discussion about my husband's ethics is one that I'll save for another day (I've complained about him a ton on here).
I sent them a text--as even a middle schooler would not--and informed them of the nasty things--their looks, their children's looks, etc. Just goes to show you how vile I can be (I'm not totally blaming this on drinking. I know I have a mean streak but I would NEVER utter something like this sober or even buzzed).
I gave a half-assed apology and chugged more to block it out. It wasn't until after my hospital stay (which was only a week after that) that I realized the gravity of what I'd done--that, and other things. They graciously ignored the incident. But, they also shunned me (rightfully). Both of their FBs went from being social and regular to me being blocked (well, I'm assuming).
I thought and thought about how to apologize (last summer). I can't. It's too late. The damage will never be undone and it's all an excuse for extremely pathetic and mismanaged behavior. The guilt of that is overwhelming and it's something I have to live with. I don't want forgiveness, actually.
Anyway, sorry to go on, but it helps me write about it.
Sometimes, we have to accept that in some instances, there is no damage control and never will be.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 403
I feel totally awful (getting back to your question about being driven to drink). That said, though, memories of those sort of life-changing things you say to purposely hurt other people in the most malicious way, helps me to remain sober. I did that to them and there were consequences to pay. Large ones--that's the issue of my guilt. But, I could have easily directed that wanton behavior in other ways and gotten myself fired from my job and had my livelihood ruined. I suspect the only thing that saved me from that is that work had ended for the time-period, I didn't have to be anywhere, my drinking increased exponentially, and I participated in chaotic behavior.
So, that helps me stay sober. The thoughts of just what I'm capable of doing, saying, etc., are scary.
So, that helps me stay sober. The thoughts of just what I'm capable of doing, saying, etc., are scary.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,298
Unfortunately most all of us have memories and moments of shame while drinking. Trying to make things as right as we can is all we can do. Then we need to recognize that the Good Lord has forgiven us, so forgiving ourselves is what is needed to continue getting healthy.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 6,902
From Just for Today for the 1st August... Just For Today August 1
August 1
Freedom from guilt
“Our addiction enslaved us. We were prisoners of our own mind and were condemned by our own guilt.”
Basic Text, p. 7
––––=––––
Guilt is one of the most commonly encountered stumbling blocks in recovery. One of the more notorious forms of guilt is the self-loathing that results when we try to forgive ourselves but don’t feel forgiven.
How can we forgive ourselves so we feel it? First, we remember that guilt and failure are not links in an unbreakable chain. Honestly sharing with a sponsor and with other addicts shows this to be true. Often the result of such sharing is a more sensible awareness of the part we ourselves have played in our affairs. Sometimes we realize that our expectations have been too high. We increase our willingness to participate in the solutions rather than dwelling on the problems.
Somewhere along the way, we discover who we really are. We usually find that we are neither the totally perfect nor the totally imperfect beings we have imagined ourselves to be. We need not live up to or down to our illusions; we need only live in reality.
––––=––––
Just for today: I am grateful for my assets and accept my liabilities. Through willingness and humility, I am freed to progress in my recovery and achieve freedom from guilt.
August 1
Freedom from guilt
“Our addiction enslaved us. We were prisoners of our own mind and were condemned by our own guilt.”
Basic Text, p. 7
––––=––––
Guilt is one of the most commonly encountered stumbling blocks in recovery. One of the more notorious forms of guilt is the self-loathing that results when we try to forgive ourselves but don’t feel forgiven.
How can we forgive ourselves so we feel it? First, we remember that guilt and failure are not links in an unbreakable chain. Honestly sharing with a sponsor and with other addicts shows this to be true. Often the result of such sharing is a more sensible awareness of the part we ourselves have played in our affairs. Sometimes we realize that our expectations have been too high. We increase our willingness to participate in the solutions rather than dwelling on the problems.
Somewhere along the way, we discover who we really are. We usually find that we are neither the totally perfect nor the totally imperfect beings we have imagined ourselves to be. We need not live up to or down to our illusions; we need only live in reality.
––––=––––
Just for today: I am grateful for my assets and accept my liabilities. Through willingness and humility, I am freed to progress in my recovery and achieve freedom from guilt.
Guest
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 8,674
Originally Posted by Time2Rise
I have trouble forgiving myself and making peace with my past. I'm open to suggestions and direction for help on this issue. It's a bit of a roadblock for me.
I believe all this is an ongoing process- hence the Step 10 part about making amends quickly as things happen where we injure self or others (more emphasis on the latter there; also para 4th Ed)- and one that should continue for our lifetime as we grow spiritually and in our clear decision making and sober life.
All this takes effort- diligence- and is more than worth it for the freedom and peace I have certainly come to know.
A final note: NOT forgiving ourselves keeps us stuck. I saw this in my mom for years- she was an active alcoholic from the time I was 11-about 23, relapsed again when I was 29, and STILL (I am now almost 41 and she is 72) describes her guilt as a "knife edge to her heart over what she did to our family"....living with that crushing guilt- especially when we were willing to forgive her- is a terrible burden.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
Originally Posted by notgonnastoptry
My opinion might not be popular, but here it is anyway:
Some things deserve to be confined to the the drunken period of our lives and the fallout must be accepted without hoping, asking, or pleading for forgiveness. Ultimately, we chose to be drunk, and there are consequences, sometimes dire. If we would have killed someone under the influence, consequences wouldn't be mollified or modified. that, BUT[I was drinking].
.
Some things deserve to be confined to the the drunken period of our lives and the fallout must be accepted without hoping, asking, or pleading for forgiveness. Ultimately, we chose to be drunk, and there are consequences, sometimes dire. If we would have killed someone under the influence, consequences wouldn't be mollified or modified. that, BUT[I was drinking].
.
making amends isnt asking for forgiveness or saying im sorry and every single person i hurt deserved me making amends.
amends is telling what i did, why i did it, and what im doing to correct it and change. it is restoring justice as much as possible. there was no, nor should there be any,"but i was drinking" involved when making amends. i never mentioned i was drinking in any of my amends and quite a few of them didnt involve me drinking.
and not every amends i made was received with excitement or acceptance. i didnt expect them to all be accepted. i was cleaning of MY side of the street the best i could. i wanted my conscience to be free.
i am not part of the "we" that chose to drink. i crossed the line into full blown alcoholism and lost that power of choice. no matter how much i didnt want to drink, i couldnt not drink.
yes, there are consequences and im one who was responsible for the death of another human while drunk. i never expected any of the ramifications to be less because i was drunk and was rather screwed up for a long time because they werent harsher.never spent many years making excuses, blaming this, that and the other for it happening.
i spent YEARS stuffing my past in. YEARS i got drunk to try and forget it. for YEARS things from y past would come up in conversation and i would be appaled,embarrassed, etc and get drunk.
then i got sober and faced it all. i learned a LOT from it all. i made amends where possible.
and now it doesnt bother me. i can look at anything in my past and have no remorse,guilt,regret, or fear of it. theres a whole lot of it i can laugh at today because i can see the insanity. i can use my past to possibly help someone else.
and for that i am blessed and greatful.
and i was able to fogive myself. i wasnt a bad man, just a sick one. a bad man would have the remorse and guilt. a sick man would.
in short, the "we" and "our" used doesnt include me.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Kampala, Uganda
Posts: 327
Originally Posted by notgonnastoptry
I feel totally awful (getting back to your question about being driven to drink). That said, though, memories of those sort of life-changing things you say to purposely hurt other people in the most malicious way, helps me to remain sober. I did that to them and there were consequences to pay. Large ones--that's the issue of my guilt. But, I could have easily directed that wanton behavior in other ways and gotten myself fired from my job and had my livelihood ruined. I suspect the only thing that saved me from that is that work had ended for the time-period, I didn't have to be anywhere, my drinking increased exponentially, and I participated in chaotic behavior.
So, that helps me stay sober. The thoughts of just what I'm capable of doing, saying, etc., are scary.
So, that helps me stay sober. The thoughts of just what I'm capable of doing, saying, etc., are scary.
I am also mean when drunk but otherwise very sweet and accommodating when sober...
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