Notices

some AA issues

Old 07-06-2016, 11:53 AM
  # 41 (permalink)  
EndGame
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 4,677
Originally Posted by uncorked View Post
EndGame, I apologize if I've offended you. I certainly didn't mean to. I am speaking about my experience with AA only. This was MY takeaway of the many meetings I have attended. Effortjoy had a very valid question, and it was one of mine when I first started going to the meetings. I don't think I was out of line in stating the facts. There are steps you must follow, and one of them is being ready to ask forgiveness for past wrongdoings. And relapsing/slipping means you start at Day 1. I think I also made the point that this approach works very well for some people, it just doesn't work for me. I don't see how you came to the conclusion that I am unhappy, resentful or unloving based on what I said. That's quite a lot to assume. If you met me in person, you'd find that I'd laugh at all your jokes, I suck at directions, but I make fantastic chocolate chip cookies. Please accept my apologies.
I don't have any conflict with you personally, uncorked. I only want to explain my reaction to what you wrote, and not to scold you for doing so. I'd also like to put line under my part of this discussion. I generally don't argue for or against different types of treatment. There's nothing in it to do so for me or anyone else.

Your OP doesn't suggest that what you wrote was your take on AA. The first bolded part, again, is a generalization about the program, and doesn't suggest a personal experience. If it is, then writing what you did as things that one must do is still inaccurate. There is no requirement to do anything in AA.

Posting inaccurate, negative comments about any kind of treatment is a very disruptive choice. Most people are ambivalent about getting any kind of treatment at all in the beginning, and we don't need help from other people in order to avoid specific available treatments.

If a patient of mine were to use any of the multiple Web sites where you can write a review about healthcare professionals, and stated that "My therapist was always telling me what to do, criticizing me, and didn't listen to what I said (these are common interpretations early on in psychotherapy, as many people bring everyday expectations from their lives on the outside into the consulting room)," then I'd have a very difficult time reading this in a public space.

Encouraging or recommending legitimate help or treatment of any kind is a good thing. To offer up reasons why people should steer clear of any type of legitimate treatment is only unhelpful. In the end, we each discover what's best for us. I don't at all believe that your motivations are sinister, but the words you chose can be read to mean something different than what you intended.

I never wrote or intended to suggest that you are any of the things in the second bolded statement above. I'm sure you're everything you say you are.
EndGameNYC is offline  
Old 07-06-2016, 11:54 AM
  # 42 (permalink)  
Member
 
Bunny211's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 1,601
Originally Posted by effortjoy View Post
I think it would be a good idea for me to go to at least one AA meeting a week. When I went through 6-8 months of sobriety the last couple of times, I didn't go to AA and I think that made relapse more likely especially because I had so many excuses why once a week binge drinking was fine for me. But I have a couple of issues with basic AA philosophy and I wonder if these will prevent me from being able to benefit from the meetings? One is that I think of my binge drinking as something that I can fight back against and treat. I just don't think it's healthy for me to tell myself that I am "powerless" over alcohol. Why should I make myself feel helpless when confronting an illness or any challenge? I believe that addiction is a disease, similar to obesity being a disease but we aren't "powerless" over our illnesses, there are always things we can do to treat them and improve our lives. Secondly, since addiction has unequivocally been scientifically proven to be a disease, why should I apologize to anyone for my drinking? Would a cancer patient apologize for being sick ? Why go back into the past and start dredging up the worst parts of when we were sick? Basically, I would like to know what's constructive about saying we are "powerless" over our illness and why it would make sense to have to take an inventory and ask forgiveness for being sick ? I respect and probably really need AA so any clarity on these issues would be much appreciated
I work a strict AA program of recovery so my comments should be taken along the line they are intended: To share the message of AA and save a life.

There are loads of other treatments for alcoholism. Medication. Therapy. Acupuncture. Hypnosis. Etc. Etc.

AA treats alcoholism as a SPIRITUAL malady. A spiritual disease. AA teaches that the disease of alcoholism centers in the MIND and not the body. It is different than a cancer or diabetes. And since the disease is spiritual in nature, so is the treatment (the 12 steps - taken from the Book of James, New Testament). The big book even tells us that "almost none among us" liked the soul searching and the dredging up of the past that the program requires. Who would? But the book also warns about looking for an "easer, softer way."

There's nothing wrong with disagreeing with AA and finding a program which works for you. But I think it would be hard to work an AA program and not take action and actually do the 12 steps. I mean, if you don't, you're just sitting in meetings right? And that's basically just group therapy. That's fellowship...but it's not the 12 steps of AA.

For me, I got to AA when I had no options left. Nothing else worked. Not a new boyfriend. Not a new job. Not moving across country. Not going to graduate school. Not therapy. Not anti-depressants. Not Naltrexone. Not rehabs. Not anti-anxiety medication. Not stints in mental hospitals. Not acupuncture. Not exercise. Nothing. I had to bite the bullet and work the steps. Once I did, MIRACULOUSLY, I got better.
Bunny211 is offline  
Old 07-06-2016, 12:15 PM
  # 43 (permalink)  
Member
 
Bunny211's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 1,601
Regarding Amends.

Here is what I was taught.

When I make an amends I am NOT apologizing for acting stupid when I was drunk. That is an excuse for my behavior. I am apologizing for the self centered, selfish nature of my behavior in the past. For example, I visited an aunt and uncle's beach house a few years ago with a few friends. I was invited. I showed up with 3 friends. We all sat around playing cards after dinner and got drunk. I got totally wasted drunk, started talking raunchy in front of my 60 year old aunt and uncle (cracking dirty jokes), and then the next morning we all packed up and went home.

My amends was to bring a gift to my aunt and uncle. I sat them down and apologized for my selfishness and said something along these lines "You've always been so good to me. You've always taken care to make me feel included and welcome at your house. I took advantage of you. I should not have shown up with a gaggle of guests. I acted irresponsibly. I was loud and crude and my behavior was unacceptable. I was so caught up in myself that I could not see how my behavior affected others. I regret that I was not able to simply come down to the cottage and spend quality time with you and appreciate all the love you have for me. My selfish, self centered ways were a part of who I was. I don't want to be that way anymore. None of it had to do with you." Then I ask if there was anything they (the person to whom I am making an amends) has to add. Most of the time they say no. This time, however, was very healing. My aunt said she was so proud of me and so happy to see me get well. Then she got quiet and said "One thing I want to add, I hope and pray to God that you never have to lie awake at night worrying about someone the way I worried about you. Your Mom made me promise to look after you and every night I laid awake worrying you would wrap your car around a tree or fall down the stairs and hit your head.." At this point we were both hugging and sobbing.

See, the amends was for my selfish behavior. When I decided to make my amends I was amending my selfish behavior...which related to acting irresponsible and crude when drunk. I never IMAGINED that my behavior caused my loved ones so much angst! I mean, I thought that they were angry with me for being a loud, obnoxious drunk! I never dreamed my aunt laid awake crying and worrying about my demise. By being willing to see my part in things I was able to repair a loving relationship with my Aunt.

Amends are not to be feared. Amends are wonderful!!
Bunny211 is offline  
Old 07-06-2016, 01:31 PM
  # 44 (permalink)  
Administrator
 
Anna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Dancing in the Light
Posts: 61,326
This thread is closed.

Please Read! The Newcomers Forum is a safe and welcoming place for newcomers. Respect is essential. Debates over Recovery Methods are not allowed on the Newcomer's Forum. Posts that violate this rule will be removed without notice. (Support and experience only please.)
Dee
Anna is offline  

Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:23 AM.