fripfrop

Sometimes, I wish some scientist could prove that alcoholism were a physical malfunction.
Because then, it would prove to my (now grown) kids that it wasn't from lack of love that I drank for years.
As it stands, everyone I know thinks it was a simple choice of ..you WANTED that drink, so you had that drink. And yes, that's true to a point.
But I cannot explain to them how different the urge to drink is from just "wanting" ..especially in the beginning before I learnt a bit and wanted to stop. (Thats another point, I WANT to give up so badly, so if I'm so good at just doing what I want, why couldn't I just do that?)


I went without a lot while my kids were growing, as I was a single parent. Sometimes I went without food for a couple of days at a time so they could eat... before drinking became a problem (obviously after drinking became a problem, I had money for food, because otherwise I wouldn't have had money for drink either!)
No, no one poured it down my neck.
But I just wish someone could prove it wasn't a simple case of "I'll want so I'll have"
In the beginning, before I read around, the urges used to seem to overtake me (I do have SOME defences put in place now, can ride some urges a bit better)
What I'm trying to say in a very clumsy way is..I wish people I love knew, that it wasn't from lack of love for them that I drank

Dee74

The way I know to really explain things is to get sober and stay that way...

most of the times it hasn't even been necessary to put anything into words.

My actions show the person I really am, and trust is regained and things forgiven.

I hope you, and anyone else at the point you are at, will have that happen too.

D

fripfrop

But Dee, Sometimes I think, even if I was able to stop for good, it's too late to prove anything to them now, they have their own lives. Deep in my mind I think, they would be thinking.."well if you can give up now, why couldn't you have given up when it mattered?"
These thoughts always kick in after a couple of days of not drinking..and they always lead back to the same path..I have no idea why I torment myself, because it does no good to anyone, least of all them

Dee74

I'm not a parent, true, but I can only share how it worked with me.

I don't think my loved ones had any particular reason to forgive me if they wanted to keep resenting me - one of my exes has never talked to me again - but she was the minority.

Maybe I'm lucky - or maybe deep down I was a really nice guy and those closest to me knew that?

It's not a process that is done in weeks. In my experience it takes real change and real solid recovery.

Actions will always speak louder than words.

D

thomas11

I'm not a parent either, but I will add this. I know my father loves me, but he loves his whiskey just as much. Not more, but just as much. And it has caused tremendous heartache throughout the years. Its complicated, so I can see where you are coming from.

fripfrop

Thank you Dee and thomas for taking the time to reply.
It's not even that I LOVED drink, I didn't, I don't..for some reason I NEEDED it.
No, of course I don't need it, I THOUGHT I needed it.
When I started drinking probmatically at 36 years old, I felt trapped by my situation, which had really been there for the 7 years before that, but it was really getting to me. I had no money, even though I was working, I was barely keeping my head above water, some days I was starving hungry and didn't have the money to eat.
My shoes had cardboard in the soles to cover the holes (very uncomfortable when it rained and the cardboard went into lumps)
I had a set of work clothes and just other peoples second hand crap to wear the rest of the time. My kids father got off scot free living a good life with his new wife.
When I got a little better off, why did I turn to drink?
I just think, I could have spent it on better things, why did I choose to escape when things could have been looking up.
A counsellour once said "you were tired, tired of fighting all your life, and for once you chose the easy way out"
But it wasn't the easy way out, eveything in life must be paid for one way or another.
And I think part of the reason holding me back from getting and staying sober, is that the kids will think I can do it now, so why couldn't I do it then?

IvanMike

Been there, done that.

Putting the cart before the horse will get you nowhere.

Staying clean and sober is your top priority now. Are you going to meetings or some other face to face support?

In my experience, we have no choice but to keep using until we stop trying to justify it and become willing to do whatever it takes to stay clean and sober, even the things that we don't feel like doing.

Ariesagain

But it IS physical. It's old school thinking that alcoholics drink because they want to. It starts out that way, then it becomes a psychological crutch, but ultimately in the progression our brain chemistry becomes altered. Our brain cells no longer produce chemicals that help non-drinkers feel good because those cell receptors have become dependent on alcohol. At that point, we are physically addicted...and ultimately we need alcohol just to feel normal.

Your kids may not know or care about the science of alcohol addiction, but maybe you'd feel better if you tell them what you've told us?

And as long as we're on this side of the grass, we can get sober. Why not try a better way to live?

Sending you a hug.

fripfrop

The reason I don't like AA is because of this "We" selfish alcoholics notion bandied about. I have tried all my life, NOT to be selfish, yes, my drinking was selfish in as I wanted an escape from the situation I was in. But I wouldn't say I was a selfish person overall.
But if I stayed sober now, I would seem totally selfish, because I wouldn't be going back to it because "I" couldn't stand the grief it was giving me NOW. ..athough it has given me worse grief in the past!
I don't even know what I am trying to articulate.
My kids love me, my parents love me, my siblings love me..I have no idea why..but it's because I have let them down, even though they don't bang the point home that I feel so bad.

fripfrop

I'll try that thanks, but unless I write it , or am drunk I find it hard to explain myself to people

IvanMike

So continuing to get loaded and wallowing in self-pity is unselfish?

I did NOT want to go to NA, (to put it mildly) but going to a 12 step fellowship was the best thing I ever did.

If you want to stay miserable and shack up with regrets and self loathing, have at it.

There is a better way though.

fripfrop

Years and years ago, when I first thought I was getting in trouble with drinking I went to AA.
I'm in northan England, meetings 3 times a week in my town.
Travel costs to nearest city too much for my budget (pint of vodka much less)
I did manage to go to quite a few though.
One..the chair person was blind..rambled on about his recovery. Next week, saw him in a pub I worked in, rat arsed
Another one, was chairing a meeting, clearly in withdrawal
I went to about 100 of these meetings, some "old timers" were sitting asleep during them, some people saying they had 5 years sober and stinking of booze. Two people actually invited me to a pub down the street after a meeting.
Northan Engalnd..not a good example of what AA is meant to stand for

hopeful4

I can only say that it's never, ever too late. The only way to win the trust and show your family is to be sober, forever. It does not matter that it did not happen when they were under your roof. It just matters that it happens.

I feel for what you went through, but honestly, people go through hardship. They go through all sorts of things, death of loved ones, season changes, stress from loss of jobs, divorce, the list goes on. If these things are always a trigger to drink, you will never stop. Because life will go on, with or without you.

Love yourself first by being clean, prove it to those you love by staying clean.

I say this all gently b/c I know it's hard. However, you have to decide how badly you want it b/c only one person can do it, you. However, we all support you 100%!!!!

Opivotal

I understand what you're trying to get across, fripfrop. You feel guilty... plain and simple. Guilt keeps you from sustained recovery.

You need to forgive yourself. I know, I know, how do you do that? You start by staying sober and living life the best way you can. The rest will come the longer you're sober. We've all done things we wish we could take back... none of us can.

I love Oprah's quote; “Forgiveness is letting go of the hope that the past can be changed”

Also;

“You aren’t your past, you are probability of your future.”

This is from Maya Angelou;

“I did then what I knew how to do. Now that I know better, I do better.”

I hope this helps in some small way, fripfrop.

fripfrop

Thank you Opivotal, I do feel guilty
And I don't basically think that "we alcoholics" are selfish..therefore I can't connect to men from 70 years ago and their experiences (ie AA founders)
But my drinking was selfish.
And you are right, I have to forgive myself for that selfish behaviour, that put me out of pain for a while, and put my kids in it.
It does help..thank you

fripfrop

Thank you

fripfrop

I have had liver problems, and I have read on the forums of people and their loved ones of the nightmare they are going through because of their loved ones slowely dying.
The one thing I hold onto, is although my kids are up and gone, and happy in their lives, is that they won't have to see me fading and dying from liver failure.
I have had 2 friends die of that, on of septicempia, brought on by alcohol abuse, and one of general organ failure, through drink.
Since I drank like a maniac it just seems to lead into a world of worse and worse horror.
Seeing them yellow, but lucid, but knowing they only have a few days left.
Not nice
I feel so abandoned by my daughter
I gave up a good lifestyle to come back to the north to house her
In the south, I didn't even think about drinking, just for whatever reason, didn't do it
Now Im in a slum I hate being in
My ONLY saviour is my people still love and care (I don't even know why)
But my grandson, my baby, thinks Im IT and I want to be IT for him at least

But she is gone

Soberpotamus

If it helps, I always hoped my mom would quit for good. Even into my late 20s and early 30s. Children never stop hoping. I didn't, anyway.

I hope that helps in some way.

fripfrop

I have never wallowed in self pity in my life!!!
I feel guity, but not self pity..I think self pity is a man thing..a man who has never had to bring up 3 kids alone for decades..self pity? hmm

fripfrop

It does,
I just hope that when they see I have quit, they don't think I didn't love them enough to do it then, if I did it when they weren't here with me.
Its hard to articulate.
They will think, if I do it, if you can do it, why didn't you do it then?
And truth be told I think that too