Cutting down drinking-suggestions/advice?
Blue Belt
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Soberville, USA
Posts: 4,174
I can relate. I had years of stop and go, moderation, binge, etc etc.
It took a medical emergency to scare me into really trying to quit.
Some folks get a dui, others have a fall, hit their spouse, lose their job etc etc before they get serious.
If things a plugging nicely and you want to cut down, consider kindling and PAWS.
Thanks for the post.
It took a medical emergency to scare me into really trying to quit.
Some folks get a dui, others have a fall, hit their spouse, lose their job etc etc before they get serious.
If things a plugging nicely and you want to cut down, consider kindling and PAWS.
Thanks for the post.
quat
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: terra (mostly)firma
Posts: 4,822
The "THE" biggest lie , the worst untrue thinking the AV will throw at you( and I'm sure it will, and may continue to) is that you can't do this. I fell for that one for years. It wasn't until I took a leap of faith and tried to honestly believe that I had it within me to quit for good that I started to believe it and pretty soon it was evident that it was a lie after all.
Stop believing the lie, it is within you, it's within all of us, You Can Do This, believe it .
Rooting for ya
Stop believing the lie, it is within you, it's within all of us, You Can Do This, believe it .
Rooting for ya
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2016
Location: No idea, Nowhere.
Posts: 16
Okay, my 'plan' isn't a plan at all, I am convinced now. How do I know what is my mind speaking and what is the AV? This is difficult as before I do anything big in life I plan it, so I thought I was making a good, solid, helpful plan, when in fact I wasn't at all. I was making excuses to continue drinking.
Also, and no disrespect meant here and correct me if I'm wrong, but I have read many threads over the past week or so and many people have been told that they have to 'want to quit' and won't be able to do so until they 'want to quit enough'. That to me sounds like blaming; they haven't quit yet because they can't be bothered to put the effort in, and I don't see myself that way. I want to quit, I certainly do but apparently not enough. I don't understand how I can have failed before I have even started (or only 2 days after I have started).
I can't want to quit enough until I want to quit enough. That is in my mind, I can't change that. Does that mean continue trying and wait until I want it more?
How is it that I can want something more than I think I have ever wanted anything but not want it enough? And this isn't about effort or courage or determination or stamina or overcoming the odds, but about a person trying and trying and when they try a different tack being told they aren't trying hard enough. That is what I am getting here.
Again, I understand completely what you are saying, and the 'plan' is officially shelved, but what more do I need to do? Simple perseverance, I suppose.
No offence meant at all and I am not trying to be controversial or cause a ruckus; I asked for advice, I received it, I embrace it-now I am asking a general question to understand where to go from here, because I don't know how to change my minds way of thinking, or get rid of the wily AV (or even just quieten it), or force myself somehow to 'want it more'.
Confused as to what to do. Of course it's simple-don't drink! But it isn't as simple as that at all.
Also, and no disrespect meant here and correct me if I'm wrong, but I have read many threads over the past week or so and many people have been told that they have to 'want to quit' and won't be able to do so until they 'want to quit enough'. That to me sounds like blaming; they haven't quit yet because they can't be bothered to put the effort in, and I don't see myself that way. I want to quit, I certainly do but apparently not enough. I don't understand how I can have failed before I have even started (or only 2 days after I have started).
I can't want to quit enough until I want to quit enough. That is in my mind, I can't change that. Does that mean continue trying and wait until I want it more?
How is it that I can want something more than I think I have ever wanted anything but not want it enough? And this isn't about effort or courage or determination or stamina or overcoming the odds, but about a person trying and trying and when they try a different tack being told they aren't trying hard enough. That is what I am getting here.
Again, I understand completely what you are saying, and the 'plan' is officially shelved, but what more do I need to do? Simple perseverance, I suppose.
No offence meant at all and I am not trying to be controversial or cause a ruckus; I asked for advice, I received it, I embrace it-now I am asking a general question to understand where to go from here, because I don't know how to change my minds way of thinking, or get rid of the wily AV (or even just quieten it), or force myself somehow to 'want it more'.
Confused as to what to do. Of course it's simple-don't drink! But it isn't as simple as that at all.
quat
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: terra (mostly)firma
Posts: 4,822
It is as simple as that, or it should be. The solution is simple, but not easy. It does get easier to live with the solution, and not only live with it as in endure it but live with it, without alcohol.
There are different paths but they can lead to the same place. For me when I found SR , I also learned about RR and AVRT , there are great threads in the Secular Connections forum here on SR. Look through them see if they resonate , wish you well and hope to see you around
There are different paths but they can lead to the same place. For me when I found SR , I also learned about RR and AVRT , there are great threads in the Secular Connections forum here on SR. Look through them see if they resonate , wish you well and hope to see you around
Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 6,902
No. You're right. It's not as simple as all that. And that's why we need to get a plan together. Why not read through the links on the thread below and devise one...
The Alcoholism and Addictions Help Forums- by SoberRecovery.com covery/382110-psst-wanna-know-why-im-always-recommending-recovery-plans.html
Just stopping is what is referred to a white-knuckling it, and few people maintain that unhappy state of sobriety for long. In order to get comfortable in sobriety we need to recover, and grow. Most of us arrive with a very faulty alcoholic perspective which taints our view of ourselves, other people and the world. Recovery work helps us get things right-sized and keeps thing manageable, WITHOUT the need for alcohol or other mind-altering or mood-enhancing substances, and without succumbing to the temptation to replace one obsession for another.
I needed support to develop and stick to my plan, and got that from the folk on here, and my sponsor, close friends and other members at AA. There is help available for us. And once we have reached a state of acceptance and willingness, we can recover, and life will invariably get better than it ever was during our actively alcoholic periods. BUT, and I've capitalised it because (like mine) it's a big but... we do need to work for it. Once we've made our plan, we need to work on it. All the people I know who have a healthy and happy sobriety work to maintain it in different ways on a daily basis. The good news is that it tends to take up far less time and money than drinking ever did.
The Alcoholism and Addictions Help Forums- by SoberRecovery.com covery/382110-psst-wanna-know-why-im-always-recommending-recovery-plans.html
Just stopping is what is referred to a white-knuckling it, and few people maintain that unhappy state of sobriety for long. In order to get comfortable in sobriety we need to recover, and grow. Most of us arrive with a very faulty alcoholic perspective which taints our view of ourselves, other people and the world. Recovery work helps us get things right-sized and keeps thing manageable, WITHOUT the need for alcohol or other mind-altering or mood-enhancing substances, and without succumbing to the temptation to replace one obsession for another.
I needed support to develop and stick to my plan, and got that from the folk on here, and my sponsor, close friends and other members at AA. There is help available for us. And once we have reached a state of acceptance and willingness, we can recover, and life will invariably get better than it ever was during our actively alcoholic periods. BUT, and I've capitalised it because (like mine) it's a big but... we do need to work for it. Once we've made our plan, we need to work on it. All the people I know who have a healthy and happy sobriety work to maintain it in different ways on a daily basis. The good news is that it tends to take up far less time and money than drinking ever did.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Pacific Coast
Posts: 785
Ah, believe me, I suffered from the same dilemma. I wanted to want to quit, but the part of me that wanted to drink -- the addicted part -- always seemed to win out in the end. This went on for years, until one day the balance finally tipped. I was done drinking.
A wise old-timer I knew used to say, in order to quit drinking, first you must quit drinking.
yoda_do_or_do_not.jpg
A wise old-timer I knew used to say, in order to quit drinking, first you must quit drinking.
yoda_do_or_do_not.jpg
Guest
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Botswana
Posts: 384
Hello Thismadameisdone,
Hmm...
You sought out this site and forum, created an account, and are asking for help to stop drinking - although though you are flirting with the notion that perhaps you are one of the 1 in 1000 or fewer who can go from out of control drinker to ' able to moderate' ( whatever that means ) - all of which requires significant investment of time and energy on your part.
The thing is, normal people - people who are not alcoholics like we are - are not obsessed about alcohol to anything like this extent.
Actually, it is quite simple. What it isn't is easy.
You sound like you are taking a logical approach to this issue and struggling with conflicting thoughts, which is exactly how I was when I was where you are now.
Have a look again at AVRT. It was a great help to me when battling through those early days ( and hours and sometimes minutes ) when the urge to drink started to nag at me.
I have made a decision that I do not want to drink. Therefore, any thought that comes into my mind suggesting otherwise, has to be an intrusive thought. However persuasive this thought is, it cannot actually force me to move my limbs such that I can ingest alcohol. I have made a decision that I do not want to drink. Therefore I will not do that.
Then breathe. It passes.
I wish you every success, you are already on your way to a happy sober life.
SR is a fantastic place, stick around and post often. You will always find someone willing to help.
Best wishes
Fradley
Hmm...
You sought out this site and forum, created an account, and are asking for help to stop drinking - although though you are flirting with the notion that perhaps you are one of the 1 in 1000 or fewer who can go from out of control drinker to ' able to moderate' ( whatever that means ) - all of which requires significant investment of time and energy on your part.
The thing is, normal people - people who are not alcoholics like we are - are not obsessed about alcohol to anything like this extent.
Of course it's simple-don't drink! But it isn't as simple as that at all
You sound like you are taking a logical approach to this issue and struggling with conflicting thoughts, which is exactly how I was when I was where you are now.
Have a look again at AVRT. It was a great help to me when battling through those early days ( and hours and sometimes minutes ) when the urge to drink started to nag at me.
I have made a decision that I do not want to drink. Therefore, any thought that comes into my mind suggesting otherwise, has to be an intrusive thought. However persuasive this thought is, it cannot actually force me to move my limbs such that I can ingest alcohol. I have made a decision that I do not want to drink. Therefore I will not do that.
Then breathe. It passes.
I wish you every success, you are already on your way to a happy sober life.
SR is a fantastic place, stick around and post often. You will always find someone willing to help.
Best wishes
Fradley
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2016
Location: No idea, Nowhere.
Posts: 16
[QUOTE=Andante;5977588]Ah, believe me, I suffered from the same dilemma. I wanted to want to quit, but the part of me that wanted to drink -- the addicted part -- always seemed to win out in the end.
Thank you! This is what I was trying (and failing miserably) to put across! I want to want to quit and haven't moved past that yet. Thank you for putting my thoughts in to words!
So what do I do? I guess I just keep on keeping on and don't give in.
Thank you! This is what I was trying (and failing miserably) to put across! I want to want to quit and haven't moved past that yet. Thank you for putting my thoughts in to words!
So what do I do? I guess I just keep on keeping on and don't give in.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Pacific Coast
Posts: 785
Originally Posted by Thismadamisdone 
Thank you! This is what I was trying (and failing miserably) to put across! I want to want to quit and haven't moved past that yet. Thank you for putting my thoughts in to words!
So what do I do? I guess I just keep on keeping on and don't give in.
So what do I do? I guess I just keep on keeping on and don't give in.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: US
Posts: 5,095
Well, I can only tell you my experience. Your questions are all good, but pretty hard to answer really.
So my AV, so to speak, is the voice of doubt, shame, judgement (of me and others), guilt, self hatred. Its the voice that tells me I'm not good enough, I can't do 'it' (whatever it is). It is the voice of self pity, that I'm a victim. It is the voice of resentment and blame. That voice lacks ownership and accountability. That voice breaks me down so that I don't love and respect myself. That voice screams to drink. But sometimes it is so quiet I can't hear it....so my behavior, my thinking and my actions show the 'higher' me that it is in control (or not).
Wanting to quit more than I want to drink. Yeah. Over used but very true. I don't think its anyone assessing blame. They are speaking of a very important 'mindset'. I am my thoughts. A huge part of recovery for me is completely changing how I view myself, the world and how I relate to everything. Nothing major!
I'll take it one step further. I had to drink myself into such despair, such a pit of soul killing hell that quitting is my only option.
You don't have to wait to feel as bad as I did. The struggles you are having, the questions? Normal. See it as a learning opportunity. You don't have to learn through relapse like I did. You can learn through recovery...learn to deal with life on life's terms. Learn to tackle all that you experiencing without taking a drink. Simple. But not always easy. Its up to you.
So my AV, so to speak, is the voice of doubt, shame, judgement (of me and others), guilt, self hatred. Its the voice that tells me I'm not good enough, I can't do 'it' (whatever it is). It is the voice of self pity, that I'm a victim. It is the voice of resentment and blame. That voice lacks ownership and accountability. That voice breaks me down so that I don't love and respect myself. That voice screams to drink. But sometimes it is so quiet I can't hear it....so my behavior, my thinking and my actions show the 'higher' me that it is in control (or not).
Wanting to quit more than I want to drink. Yeah. Over used but very true. I don't think its anyone assessing blame. They are speaking of a very important 'mindset'. I am my thoughts. A huge part of recovery for me is completely changing how I view myself, the world and how I relate to everything. Nothing major!
I'll take it one step further. I had to drink myself into such despair, such a pit of soul killing hell that quitting is my only option. You don't have to wait to feel as bad as I did. The struggles you are having, the questions? Normal. See it as a learning opportunity. You don't have to learn through relapse like I did. You can learn through recovery...learn to deal with life on life's terms. Learn to tackle all that you experiencing without taking a drink. Simple. But not always easy. Its up to you.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2016
Location: No idea, Nowhere.
Posts: 16
Well, I would like to say a whole-hearted thank you to all who responded tonight, who answered my questions and questioned my 'plans'. I have learnt a lot and appreciate you all spending your precious time assisting me tonight. I can't thank you enough. This really has helped in various major ways, including me being made aware that my thoughts aren't always completely my thoughts as I think they are, helping me understand whereabouts I am in my recovery and pointing out some links I can occupy myself with tonight. So, again, thank you all so much.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 486
Listen. To. Carl.
None of us can control our drinking. Sobriety is WAY more than just not drinking. It is a plan to live again. Without alcohol. Completely. And to live a FREE life....
None of us can control our drinking. Sobriety is WAY more than just not drinking. It is a plan to live again. Without alcohol. Completely. And to live a FREE life....
Originally Posted by doggonecarl
In a previous post you wrote:
So any plan that supports this--drinking, getting drunk--is not a plan for sobriety. I don't know how much more specific to be.
Relapses happen. But they aren't part of recovery. Relapses are part of the addiction. So don't put anything in your plan that undermines recovery.
So any plan that supports this--drinking, getting drunk--is not a plan for sobriety. I don't know how much more specific to be.
Relapses happen. But they aren't part of recovery. Relapses are part of the addiction. So don't put anything in your plan that undermines recovery.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Strailya
Posts: 8,009
I would recommend not having a drinking plan. Dont plan the future. Rather, simply do not drink today. Then get busy and plan the rest of your day until bedtime. Wake up tomorrow. See how you feel, mentally and physically. Repeat. Do not drink for today. Just one rule.
Community Greeter
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Upstate New York
Posts: 51,526
I'm really glad you wanted to talk this over, thismadamisdone. I'm late to the thread, but want welcome you to a great place for encouragement & support.
When I first joined I was still desperate to hold on to drinking. Even though it was tearing my world apart - I was afraid to let go. I suggest you keep posting & reading here. It took me a few months to become convinced I could never be a social drinker. Every single one of my brilliant plans to moderate failed - with disastrous & dangerous results.
It feels so good to finally be free of it. You can do it.
When I first joined I was still desperate to hold on to drinking. Even though it was tearing my world apart - I was afraid to let go. I suggest you keep posting & reading here. It took me a few months to become convinced I could never be a social drinker. Every single one of my brilliant plans to moderate failed - with disastrous & dangerous results.
It feels so good to finally be free of it. You can do it.
A Day at a Time
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Grand Rapids MI
Posts: 6,435
There are thousands of posts on controlled drinking. There are an equal number of failures. Speaking for myself I was always looking for away to be a drunk without the consequences. Searched for 20 years and never found the magical solution.
As much as I disliked the idea the solution was to give up drinking
As much as I disliked the idea the solution was to give up drinking
Choosing Life
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Montana
Posts: 1,435
I am glad you posted this. I also had wrestling matches with my AV, which was constantly telling me that I could moderate, that I would be okay only drinking on certain days, and blah, blah, blah. All it was was an excuse to keep drinking because a part of me didn't want to let it go. I enjoyed the nice, warm buzz those first couple of drinks gave me, and that was what I didn't want to give up. I figured if I could just stop after I got my buzz on, I would be okay. It never turned out that way, of course. After the initial buzz wore off, I would just keep drinking to try to get it back, and I would just end up drunk yet again.
I had to accept the fact that even though I enjoyed that buzz, I didn't enjoy what came after it at ALL. I used to think that I would be okay if I didn't have more than 3 or 4 ... turns out it wasn't the 4th or the 5th or the 10th drink that did me in ... it was the first. I fought for a long time learning to accept that I couldn't even have just one, but that acceptance was the key to my finally getting sober. My mantra then became, "Not. Even. One."
I personally couldn't abstain all week and then allow myself to drink on the weekends. Why bother? If you can abstain Monday through Friday, then why not keep going? Seems to me that not drinking all week and then cutting loose on the weekend just keeps perpetuating the cycle. You drink all weekend, then spend the first couple days of the week going through withdrawals, recovering, and finally getting the booze out of your system by the end of the week, only to start all over again on the weekend. That would make me insane. And I would spend the entire week obsessing over the weekend arriving so that I could drink. Ugh. No thanks.
You've gotten a lot of great advice here, and I'm so glad you're listening! We've all been where you are, and we all have tried moderation in many, many forms. It just doesn't work. If you really, truly want to be sober, the only way to do it is to just stop, period. It's not easy, but pretty simple.
I had to accept the fact that even though I enjoyed that buzz, I didn't enjoy what came after it at ALL. I used to think that I would be okay if I didn't have more than 3 or 4 ... turns out it wasn't the 4th or the 5th or the 10th drink that did me in ... it was the first. I fought for a long time learning to accept that I couldn't even have just one, but that acceptance was the key to my finally getting sober. My mantra then became, "Not. Even. One."
I personally couldn't abstain all week and then allow myself to drink on the weekends. Why bother? If you can abstain Monday through Friday, then why not keep going? Seems to me that not drinking all week and then cutting loose on the weekend just keeps perpetuating the cycle. You drink all weekend, then spend the first couple days of the week going through withdrawals, recovering, and finally getting the booze out of your system by the end of the week, only to start all over again on the weekend. That would make me insane. And I would spend the entire week obsessing over the weekend arriving so that I could drink. Ugh. No thanks.
You've gotten a lot of great advice here, and I'm so glad you're listening! We've all been where you are, and we all have tried moderation in many, many forms. It just doesn't work. If you really, truly want to be sober, the only way to do it is to just stop, period. It's not easy, but pretty simple.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 1,518
Originally Posted by Vegit8
It's not to put you down we say these things, I wish someone would have told me flat out that controlled drinking is never going to be in the cards for me. I'm all or (hopefully) nothing, and that is how it will always be. It sucks, I know it, that was my evil best friend for 20 years, and I tried everything to keep it, but it destroyed me before I realized.
This is me being nice to you " please don't waste your life with such plans " they will never work believe me . I do hope you are getting the message by now .
Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 937
Seriously the cool part appears to be this - the longer you accumulate sober time, the quieter the "voice" gets.
Still I come to this site every day and am building a "toolbox" mentally to exercise my sober muscles - but the raw obsession diminishes the longer I keep saying "nope" every time a craving appears.
Still I come to this site every day and am building a "toolbox" mentally to exercise my sober muscles - but the raw obsession diminishes the longer I keep saying "nope" every time a craving appears.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Gulf Coast, USA
Posts: 2,229
Sounds like you are learning and adapting, thismadamisdone. That is what it takes, learn from your past mistakes, learn from mistakes of others. Most of us here have tried moderation, that's why you got the responses you did. I did everything in my power to moderate, it only led to me drinking more and more.
What helped me is coming up with a list of why I didn't want to drink any more, why I couldn't drink anymore. I would add to that list any time a new reason came to mind. You always need to remind yourself of why you won't drink today. It is as simple as not putting alcohol into your body, and as complex as not putting alcohol into your body.
The more effort you put into being sober, the better your chances of breaking the cycle. It will get easier the longer you stay sober, but you always need to remind yourself of why you won't drink today. It took me 20 years to realize this, and i still remind myself each day why I won't drink; and i'm going on 2 years since my last drink.
You can do this. Lean on us as much as you need and reach out to us before you drink, reach out as soon as you are feeling weak.
You're not alone.
What helped me is coming up with a list of why I didn't want to drink any more, why I couldn't drink anymore. I would add to that list any time a new reason came to mind. You always need to remind yourself of why you won't drink today. It is as simple as not putting alcohol into your body, and as complex as not putting alcohol into your body.
The more effort you put into being sober, the better your chances of breaking the cycle. It will get easier the longer you stay sober, but you always need to remind yourself of why you won't drink today. It took me 20 years to realize this, and i still remind myself each day why I won't drink; and i'm going on 2 years since my last drink.
You can do this. Lean on us as much as you need and reach out to us before you drink, reach out as soon as you are feeling weak.
You're not alone.
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