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"I can't drink" vs. "I don't drink"

Old 05-11-2016, 11:31 PM
  # 21 (permalink)  
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To come back to what to do in the moment to avoid feelings of deprivation... It is 100% about choice. The important thing in the moment is to remember what you're choosing between. For me, I'm choosing between having a good night with my friends (although I might get bored and leave earlier than some people depending on the conversation and how drunk people get)... or spending the rest of my night obsessively drinking as much as I can, probably hitting a liquor store on the way home, probably doing the same thing again tomorrow, probably not being sober again for a long time. In the moment it can feel like "get buzzed and have a silly night with my friends with no consequences" is one of the choices. But it's not. Once I reality check myself, I don't feel like I'm getting the bad end of the deal.

At the heart of this though is that I did have to grieve for that thing I'd lost. I'm probably still grieving it, although I feel it less now. I'm sad that I can't get the kind of good, no-consequences, socially acceptable drunk that I used to be able to. But I've come to terms that it's gone and there's nothing I can do to change that. My body doesn't work that way anymore. Just like calling my ex-boyfriend won't fix that messed up relationship into what I wanted it to be, putting alcohol into my body isn't going to make me that kind of drunk ever again. Sometimes things end and we have to move on. The choice happens within that framework.
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Old 05-12-2016, 05:02 AM
  # 22 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by NoelleR View Post
'One day at a time' is NOT a main theme of AA. There's nothing in AA literature that says anything close to that. It comes from the second verse of the Serenity Prayer................: Living one day at a time, Enjoying one moment at a time...

In other words, 'one day at a time' is how we live our life, not how we quit drinking, which we do as per the BB.....for good and all.

I'm sorry you don't hear 'recovered' in your AA rooms.............it's straight from the book.

(o:

P.S. and btw, I certainly 'can' drink; I choose not to.
Maybe this shows how AA is done a bit differently in different locations because in my area not drinking one day at a time is certainly a main theme in every meeting. I hear it said at least a dozen times a meeting from new folks to old time Big Book thumpers.

To me, if you are living life one day at a time then you are also not drinking one day at a time so I don't see the difference there.

We all perceive things differently but as long as we relate enough to help each other not drink and not be miserable is what matters.
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Old 05-12-2016, 07:56 AM
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Originally Posted by hellrzr View Post
1) Maybe this shows how AA is done a bit differently in different locations because in my area not drinking one day at a time is certainly a main theme in every meeting. I hear it said at least a dozen times a meeting from new folks to old time Big Book thumpers.

2) To me, if you are living life one day at a time then you are also not drinking one day at a time so I don't see the difference there.

3) We all perceive things differently but as long as we relate enough to help each other not drink and not be miserable is what matters.
1) I don't believe that AA should be different, anywhere; I believe it should follow the BB; which, as I said earlier, nowhere does it say anything like 'one day at a time;' it say we quit drinking for good.

2) I certainly greet each new day---one day at a time; if I thought I'd have to greet each day with something like 'I will not drink today,' or 'no xxxxxxxx today'.......my life would seem like a life sentence.

3) If I had to live my life not drinking 'one day at a time,' I would be miserable, but since I've recovered via the BB, there's not a chance with that.

(o:
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Old 05-12-2016, 08:53 AM
  # 24 (permalink)  
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Just wanted to say I got a lot out of this thread. Some great advice and bits of wisdom here.
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Old 05-12-2016, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by NoelleR View Post
1) I don't believe that AA should be different, anywhere; I believe it should follow the BB; which, as I said earlier, nowhere does it say anything like 'one day at a time;' it say we quit drinking for good.

2) I certainly greet each new day---one day at a time; if I thought I'd have to greet each day with something like 'I will not drink today,' or 'no xxxxxxxx today'.......my life would seem like a life sentence.

3) If I had to live my life not drinking 'one day at a time,' I would be miserable, but since I've recovered via the BB, there's not a chance with that.

(o:
I've also followed the Big Book and the advice of those with 30+ years of sobriety to stop drinking, or using any mind altering substances and to make my life better. I, like they, wake up each day and live life one day at a time. I can't live two days at a time so I do each one as it comes along and for close to 4 years the thought of drinking has not been involved with any of those days. My mindset is that I will never drink again but that still involves taking each day as it comes. The thought of drinking is just something I don't deal with, I don't think about because it's not an option for me but that is still taking things one day at a time just like everything in life. That all happened to me after I did a 4th and 5th step. The thought of drinking and that obsession completely left me. The most hard core Big Book folks I know always tell the newbies to take it one day at a time and it gets better. I see that work out in the meetings as people hang around and follow the program so I'm going to stick with that method of the Big Book.
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Old 05-12-2016, 09:21 AM
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I think the differentiation is an important one. I obviously can drink if I want to (unless I'm broke in Saudi Arabia or somewhere and even then I probably would have got one in my drinking days) so to say that you can't is making yourself unnecessarily vulnerable. To be able to say that you don't want to has to be an aspiration of an alcoholic, it is an empowerment that enables to you to fully appreciate sobriety rather than be a slave to it. As for people who pester you to have a drink tell them to **** off, there are few things more boring than a drunk.
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Old 05-12-2016, 10:34 AM
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Originally Posted by hellrzr View Post
I've also followed the Big Book and the advice of those with 30+ years of sobriety to stop drinking, or using any mind altering substances and to make my life better. I, like they, wake up each day and live life one day at a time.... I see that work out in the meetings as people hang around and follow the program so I'm going to stick with that method of the Big Book.
How can you say that you follow the BB, and then say you don't drink...'n btw all my recovered friends have at least 30 years, which I will have achieved next month. ...also, '...or using any mind altering substances...' is definitely NOT AA. I guess we know different BB folks, or our definitions of hardcore different. You say you're going to stick with that method of the Big Book, that is NOT the method of the BB.........go back and check; 'one day at a time' is NOT mentioned in the BB; '...if you want to want drinking for good' is.

I quit 'for good and all' (that's for good, or forever) in June of 1986; no thinking about drinking or not drinking (one day at a time); that would have been a miserable life......

(o:

P.S. "...The most hard core Big Book folks I know always tell the newbies to take it one day at a time and it gets better one day at a time?..." Yes, we tell newcomers this in the beginning to get through rough patches, but we never tell them they'll need to do this for the rest of their lives.
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Old 05-12-2016, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by NoelleR View Post
How can you say that you follow the BB, and then say you don't drink...'n btw all my recovered friends have at least 30 years, which I will have achieved next month. ...also, '...or using any mind altering substances...' is definitely NOT AA. I guess we know different BB folks, or our definitions of hardcore different. You say you're going to stick with that method of the Big Book, that is NOT the method of the BB.........go back and check; 'one day at a time' is NOT mentioned in the BB; '...if you want to want drinking for good' is.

I quit 'for good and all' (that's for good, or forever) in June of 1986; no thinking about drinking or not drinking (one day at a time); that would have been a miserable life......

(o:

P.S. "...The most hard core Big Book folks I know always tell the newbies to take it one day at a time and it gets better one day at a time?..." Yes, we tell newcomers this in the beginning to get through rough patches, but we never tell them they'll need to do this for the rest of their lives.
I don't know any successful members of AA telling people they can smoke dope for do any drugs to get high and call themselves sober. If I remember correctly, you think that behavior is acceptable to do and still consider yourself sober. That really tells me all I need to know right there. Have a great day NoelleR. I'm going to live this day like all the rest, without any mind altering substances like everyone else I know who follows the program of AA. : ).
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Old 05-12-2016, 10:56 AM
  # 29 (permalink)  
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I don't drink.
I CAN drink any time I want to. I just choose not to. The consequences of my drinking are unacceptable to me.
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Old 05-12-2016, 11:29 AM
  # 30 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by hellrzr View Post
I don't know any successful members of AA telling people they can smoke dope for do any drugs to get high and call themselves sober. If I remember correctly, you think that behavior is acceptable to do and still consider yourself sober. That really tells me all I need to know right there. Have a great day NoelleR. I'm going to live this day like all the rest, without any mind altering substances like everyone else I know who follows the program of AA. : ).
LOLOL........You do NOT remember correctly. In a previous thread you posted your opinions regarding abstinence from 'all mind altering substances' as being AA, and I posted what AA had to say (AA has to do with alcohol and nothing more)............BIG difference...

One of my first lessons in recovery was to try to validate whatever I heard in meetings, or from any other AAer's, with AA literature. I suggested this to you back in April; it would appear you haven't taken my suggestion.......I prefer recovery from the BB; you seem to want to go by what folks say, even if not validated by AA literature. Be very careful with that; there's a lot of crap being spewed as AA which isn't even close

(o:
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Old 05-12-2016, 11:31 AM
  # 31 (permalink)  
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Isn't there a separate forum for arguments about Big Book semantics?
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Old 05-12-2016, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by NoelleR View Post
LOLOL........You do NOT remember correctly. In a previous thread you posted your opinions regarding abstinence from 'all mind altering substances' as being AA, and I posted what AA had to say (AA has to do with alcohol and nothing more)............BIG difference...

One of my first lessons in recovery was to try to validate whatever I heard in meetings, or from any other AAer's, with AA literature. I suggested this to you back in April; it would appear you haven't taken my suggestion.......I prefer recovery from the BB; you seem to want to go by what folks say, even if not validated by AA literature. Be very careful with that; there's a lot of crap being spewed as AA which isn't even close

(o:
I hear ya on that! Lots of crazy talk in AA to watch out for. Like people who smoke dope or do other drugs and say it's ok because it doesn't specifically say you can't do those things in the Big Book, even though doing those things means you aren't sober. People use everything they can to justify their actions. It's a crazy disease to say the least.
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Old 05-12-2016, 01:01 PM
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Originally Posted by hellrzr View Post
I hear ya on that! Lots of crazy talk in AA to watch out for. Like people who smoke dope or do other drugs and say it's ok because it doesn't specifically say you can't do those things in the Big Book, even though doing those things means you aren't sober. People use everything they can to justify their actions. It's a crazy disease to say the least.
I don't do any of those things, but could you state where in AA (literature) it says you're not sober if you do?

You keep referring to abstinence from all mind altering substances; where exactly can this be found in AA literature (hint: it can't; it's NA)?

(o;
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Old 05-12-2016, 01:08 PM
  # 34 (permalink)  
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One of the nice things about getting older is that there is not much party scene where I would feel pressure to drink, and at my age, so many people are making healthier choices with their lives, a simple, no thanks, I'll have a water or coffee or whatever isnt even looked at oddly.
That being said, I don't hang around with a bunch of alcoholics, or sit in bars, mostly.
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Old 05-12-2016, 01:24 PM
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Of course I can drink ... I did it for decades. Now I just choose not to drink. It's pretty simple for me.
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Old 05-12-2016, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by NoelleR View Post
I don't do any of those things, but could you state where in AA (literature) it says you're not sober if you do?

You keep referring to abstinence from all mind altering substances; where exactly can this be found in AA literature (hint: it can't; it's NA)?

(o;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sobriety
"Sobriety is the condition of not having any measurable levels or effects from mood-altering drugs." Alcohol is a mood altering drug.

Pretty clear. This is how everyone I know in AA defines sobriety. Those who don't are not successful in staying sober.

I spoke with my sponsor about this concept of being able to call yourself sober if you are doing everything under the sun to get high but drinking alcohol. He told me to get off the computer and get to an AA meeting where I can be around those who live in the AA solution.
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Old 05-12-2016, 01:41 PM
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Many drugs alter mood. Caffeine does. Nicotine does. People choose to do those as they like the way they make them feel. Are you sober if you smoke?

To me my problem was alcohol. So I leave that alone. I drink the snot out of coffee though.
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Old 05-12-2016, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by hellrzr View Post
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sobriety
"Sobriety is the condition of not having any measurable levels or effects from mood-altering drugs." Alcohol is a mood altering drug.

Pretty clear. This is how everyone I know in AA defines sobriety. Those who don't are not successful in staying sober.

I spoke with my sponsor about this concept of being able to call yourself sober if you are doing everything under the sun to get high but drinking alcohol. He told me to get off the computer and get to an AA meeting where I can be around those who live in the AA solution.
You can't be serious! I asked you where in AA (literature), and you quote Wikipedia.......................?

I'm sorry your sponsor said that; she should have told you to check out AA (.org; intergroup; its literature).

I don't care what a person chooses to believe, but when they put forth their beliefs/opinions as AA fact (which they aren't), I take exception.

You believe the definition of sobriety is abstinence from all mind altering substances.

AA actually says.............: Sobriety--freedom from alcohol--is the sole purpose of an AA group.

You believe that taking it one day at a time and is a main theme in AA.

One day at a time is NOT a main theme of AA; AA does NOT say this.
AA does say.............: if you really and truly want to quit drinking
liquor for good and all...

I recovered by what the BB says, not someone's interpretation of it; to read the black on the white; BB in one hand and a dictionary in the other..............simple

(o:
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Old 05-12-2016, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by NoelleR View Post
You can't be serious! I asked you where in AA (literature), and you quote Wikipedia.......................?

I'm sorry your sponsor said that; she should have told you to check out AA (.org; intergroup; its literature).

I don't care what a person chooses to believe, but when they put forth their beliefs/opinions as AA fact (which they aren't), I take exception.

You believe the definition of sobriety is abstinence from all mind altering substances.

AA actually says.............: Sobriety--freedom from alcohol--is the sole purpose of an AA group.

You believe that taking it one day at a time and is a main theme in AA.

One day at a time is NOT a main theme of AA; AA does NOT say this.
AA does say.............: if you really and truly want to quit drinking
liquor for good and all...

I recovered by what the BB says, not someone's interpretation of it; to read the black on the white; BB in one hand and a dictionary in the other..............simple

(o:
I have also read the Big Book and follow it's principles. Helping another alcoholic is all I intended by posting a commit in the first place.

I always appreciate a good debate but this has clearly gotten way off track and is not going to go anywhere else. Noelle, I do appreciate many things you share on the board but I do strongly disagree telling people that they are sober and following the program of AA if they don't drink but do drugs.

Now, who wants to talk about politics!!! : )
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