thomas11

This is a pretty dry topic/post. Those who are familiar with my situation know that I'm getting back in the workforce.

I may have a great opportunity presented to me this week. Essentially two guys own 4 companies together. One fairly large one, three smaller ones. They have gotten to the point where they have the luxury of hiring someone to run the operations while they focus on growing the 3 smaller ones. I would essentially be offered a position of President of the 4 entities with primary responsibility being with the large company but also have responsibilities with the others.

So why did I post this, right? Because "entertainment" would be a part of the job. I would be expected to attend after hours events, weekend hunting trips, fancy-schmancy dinners with potential clients and so on. This might be a little tricky. When I owned my business, I always entertained with lunches, never after hours.

I am probably getting ahead of myself, but I like to mentally prepare for things long before they occur.

Obladi

Sounds like a great opportunity .
What would you see as tricky? I can think of some things but don't want to assume .

ScottFromWI

The owners of the consulting firm I worked for previously were wildly successful and neither of them drank alcohol as part of their religious beliefs. All of the consultants were also forbidden from drinking alcohol or purchasing it for customers on any sales calls, golf outings, etc. We sold a ton of services because we were good at what we did, alcohol was not a relevant topic.

Point being, you can do any job without drinking and succeed.

Dee74

Only you know what your commitment to your recovery is Jeff.

If it's unshakeably solid then, like Scott says, you can do this schmoozing without alcohol.

If you're unsure, maybe it's not the right job for you right now?

D

thomas11

I know there would be drinking/entertaining involved and I might feel uncomfortable sipping on a pepsi. Would I be expected to partake in a nice bottle of wine etc...?

thomas11

That sounds encouraging, and I would have to implement that rule in myself, not being the owner, I doubt I could implement the rule across the board. Who knows.

lovetolisten

Thomas, I have a similar job and understand the concerns. It is a big part of many business cultures. With a commitment to sobriety and mentally preparing yourself before you start the job, I absolutely think you can do both - work in the culture and stay sober. A frequent thread topic is how you say/explain you are not drinking. Personally, I am not strong enough yet to admit alcoholism, and also am afraid if I say "no thanks," there will be follow up questions (even though there probably wouldn't be; alcoholics care way more about drinking habits than anyone else does). For now, I blame medication. It is simple.

However you go about it: the benefit for you in a new job is that you can set the stage - go into the "entertainment" part of your job as a non-drinker and stay that way. It will keep you accountable and become a non-issue once the scene is set.

Obladi

If it's a matter of just feeling out of place,I can share with you that a company ideal with has a strict rule that their employees may not drink with customers. Punishable by termination.

I think it's a great rule for employees and customers alike. Employees are automatically protected from drunken buffoon - ery and can blame it on the company, customers are spared the embarrassment of having to deal with vendors who might get out of hand.

Since you'd be the boss, you could make the rule!

lovetolisten

Here's another way to think of it: if your commitment to sobriety is bigger than a job and you DON'T think you'd be able to do both, skip the job.

If you are feeling really firm in your sobriety, be honest with the people who offered it to you: "I can do the entertaining part of the job, and understand alcohol will be involved, but I don't partake." If they expect/require that you go in on the bottle of wine, it's simple - wait for the next job

ScottFromWI

You only need to enforce the rule for yourself. Remember...you only know the workplace as an alcoholic. The "everybody drinks" myth exists there too. No employer is going to force you to drink. Lots of business people do not mix work and drinking for many reasons, not just recovering alcoholics.

But as Dee says, if you think it will be too overwhelming it might not be the right job now.

Delilah1

Hi Jeff,

I am assuming the clients you would be entertaining would not know you, and you could simply say you don't drink. They don't need to know anything else. You need to do what you think is best, but I am confident you can entertain without partaking in drinking.

MythOfSisyphus

I think you can do it if you just present a rock-solid, confident front. Say you don't drink or you quit and don't apologize for it!

MissPerfumado

I also work in a boozy culture and was worried about the impact of being the "only" non-drinker but it's really not as boozy as I thought. People don't really care, for a start. Being confident about not drinking instead of apologetic also helps. And really, how could boozing overall be any help to an alcoholic's career? If you're good at what you do, it'll speak for itself. And you only have a shot at being good at what you do if you stay sober.

The global CEO of the company I work for is a teetotaller. It has not hurt his career one bit.

Good luck with it. I've followed your story and appreciate it's been a tough road so wish you every success.

ALinNS

In the past I have filled roles of CEO/CFO/COO and entertainment was key to current and potential clients and I used to be of the mind one had to drink and offer drinks to stay on their good side however I discovered while at one firm for 8 years that I didn't have to drink, in fact in today's age, at least here, people respect you more when you do not drink during the day and I simply avoided evening outings citing family as I was a single parent.

I believe you can do it, just be mindful the AV will be at you from time to time, add to your plan a way to handle these situations and one can be fine.

Wishing you the best
Andrew

Soberwolf

A ton of good advice in here Jeff

Dee74

You wouldn't need to implement it in anyone but yourself Jeff.


I think this really is your bugbear.

The idea you have that other people expectations dictate your choices is something you come back to again and again.

You need to get comfortable with marching to the beat of your own drum, and you need to get comfortable with the idea that you are enough - it's not your drinking that's getting you these offers.

There are many successful teetotallers in the business world....including the infamous D Trump, IIRC.

Maybe it's time to research a couple, Jeff?

D

doggonecarl

Dee made the point I was going to make, but I'll reiterate...

As long as you equate "entertaining" with you having to drink, it will be tricky indeed.

dwtbd

Adopting a "No Matter What" principle (the Big Plan in AVRT) is essential to forming a proper mindset and being mentally prepared, which as you pointed out in the OP is important.
After making my BP( a commitment to permanent unconditional abstinence) my thinking began to shift (get better, at least as far as future alcohol consumption is concerned ) , I was more able to objectively 'see' my thoughts and attitudes toward drinking and recognize how skewed they are/were by my 'AV'.
NMW answers in advance, any questions or concerns that the AV throws up, and proactively guides my actions. It also , with time, helps to gain a more rational and objective assessment of my thoughts along with feelings and perceptions of those thoughts.
Some of those thoughts are about how Others perceive my actions and what if any importance I need to apply those perceptions and/or whether or not those perceptions actually exist.
The observation has been made that you tend to place a high regard on how you think you and your actions are perceived by others. I think this is natural and we all do it , to a degree and in various circumstances. It is necessary and helpful in order to be comfortable and accepted socially , eg the wearing of clothes in public or determining the proper attire for a given situation.
The NMW principle helps to focus thinking on whether or not to make a decision based on others' perception of our own alcohol use. It will help to answer questions and guide your actions in regards to the perceptions of drinking a pepsi or a glass of wine, ie it should rightly have none.
Adopting or making a Big Plan doesn't immediately cement a mindset that keeps those types of feelings or concerns from cropping up , but does give an answer to what should be done with them, that being: to recognize them and then dismiss any thought of acting on them by letting them be the 'reason' to have a glass of wine.
Starting with the foundation that the NMW principle is the default 'setting' will mean in time that our mindset will increasingly cement and that hunting trips, fancy dinners and after hours get- togethers will be just what they are, trips, meals and events without personal alcohol consumption no matter what, and the ancillary concerns will be dismissed and known for the hobgobblins they really are.
Make a Big Plan and don't let the AV try and stir you away from what sounds like an excellent opportunity. Good luck, wish you well

thomas11

Based on all of your input, the next job I step into, regardless of title or responsibilities, I will unabashedly pronounce myself as a non-drinker an leave it at that. I do not need to prove anything to anyone. I would assume they would hire me based on skill set and not my ability to hold my liquor.

ScottFromWI

You don't even need to "pronounce" it. Just don't do it. Some people don't eat meat, and they don't need to announce it to their employers. They simply order vegetarian meals when they go out to lunch for work. Same principle applies here in a professional setting.

Regarding your last statement - think of when you ran a business. Was "being able to hold your liquor" a factor you took into account when hiring subcontractors or employees?