Hello, negative, confused and need help
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 66
Hello, negative, confused and need help
I've just joined sober recovery, this is my 1st time on a forum. I've been sober for 15momths after completing 7 months in a 12 step rehab. I go to an AA meeting every month or so because I want and need support. I've struggled with drugs and alcohol for about 15 years. I was 1st introduced to NA years ago but I've never being able to subscribe to the 12 step belief. I think the combined support of everyone is fantastic and having worked the steps I can see how they can be beneficial to my life. The problem is I cringe every time I hear desease mentioned. I don't believe addiction is a desease, I do believe I'm responsible for my disease and recovery, and most importantly I don't believe I'm powerless.
I guess my questions are 1: can I still benefit from AA with my beliefs. 2: does anyone have other solutions apart from 12 step?
I guess my questions are 1: can I still benefit from AA with my beliefs. 2: does anyone have other solutions apart from 12 step?
Canine Welfare Advocate
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Norfolk, VA
Posts: 10,962
Welcome to Sober Recovery.
I don't know if the moderators like 12 step discussion in the newcomers forums, so they may move it to more appropriate forum. But since it's your first post, I'll respond.
Here my take from my NA days. Step one reads:
We admitted that we were powerless over our addiction, that our lives had
become unmanageable.
I'm powerless over my addiction. I have years and years of abuse as proof. I am not, however, powerless over my recovery. I have the power to get and stay clean, as long as I'm not actively using.
Disease...not a disease. That can turn into a debate that I don't want to engage in. What works for my recovery is the belief that I have a disease that is characterized by abnormalities in brain chemistry.
Find what works for you.
I don't know if the moderators like 12 step discussion in the newcomers forums, so they may move it to more appropriate forum. But since it's your first post, I'll respond.
Here my take from my NA days. Step one reads:
We admitted that we were powerless over our addiction, that our lives had
become unmanageable.
I'm powerless over my addiction. I have years and years of abuse as proof. I am not, however, powerless over my recovery. I have the power to get and stay clean, as long as I'm not actively using.
Disease...not a disease. That can turn into a debate that I don't want to engage in. What works for my recovery is the belief that I have a disease that is characterized by abnormalities in brain chemistry.
Find what works for you.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Dallas Texas
Posts: 579
I think "powerless" means after I take the first drink. This is TRUE for every addict. I have always had the Power to choose to drink or not. It has never poured itself down my throat.
" I don't believe addiction is a desease, I do believe I'm responsible for my disease" Not to get too hung up over words. Addiction, disease, mental disorder, problem, bad habit- whatever people want to call it. We are all talking about the same thing.
Most recovery programs have elements of AA. The root of the problem isn't drinking but Why we drink. Read through the first 160 pages of the AA Big Book-that's not too much reading. Pull out the parts that help you work on the Why. And the parts on How to stay sober. Put them in your own word and you have your recovery program.
" I don't believe addiction is a desease, I do believe I'm responsible for my disease" Not to get too hung up over words. Addiction, disease, mental disorder, problem, bad habit- whatever people want to call it. We are all talking about the same thing.
Most recovery programs have elements of AA. The root of the problem isn't drinking but Why we drink. Read through the first 160 pages of the AA Big Book-that's not too much reading. Pull out the parts that help you work on the Why. And the parts on How to stay sober. Put them in your own word and you have your recovery program.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 66
Thank you for the replies, I think I have found something worthwhile here. The rehab I was in preached the AA way and instilled fear in me that I would relapse if I didn't believe in what they were saying or didn't do what they said. I haven't got that from any of the replies here and I was half expecting too. It's a breath of fresh air. It seems like people here are concerned with recovery more than the a right or wrong way. Thank you for the welcome.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 4,251
You might be interested in this link, it explains avrt. Rational Recovery | The Crash Course On AVRT
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 66
I feel comfortable with the idea of finding my own path. That said I believe I need support and the experience of others and hopefully I will be able to offer help and support to someone else. I'm not against AA, I've met some really nice people there and have leaner things I've found helpful.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: America
Posts: 4,136
When I first came to this board it felt like a breath of fresh air to me too! I join in with others in welcoming you. I don't like to get too hung up on labels and words. We are here because we have problems. There is no rule saying you must look upon it as a disease.
~sb
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: MD
Posts: 15,964
I use the term "dis-ease" meaning I am at dis--ease with self and the world.
There are other methods other than AA. Rational Recovery, AVRT, SMART, Life Ring, SOS, Women for Sobriety. They all have their own websites, too!
There are other methods other than AA. Rational Recovery, AVRT, SMART, Life Ring, SOS, Women for Sobriety. They all have their own websites, too!
Member
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 425
I have to concur with what others have posted-- it's not entirely important how we classify it.
Regarding your specific beliefs, don't let them deter you from doing 12 step or any other form of recovery. I'm an atheist and I just started going to AA meetings. Seems to be helping , I've only had a handful of times where I've been 7 days sober in the last 5 years. But when people at the meetings say God, I just replace that word with "universe" and that works for me because the universe is a power greater than myself. It's huge and filled with energy-- it gave me life etc.... and each creature in this universe is also a power greater than me... we are all mini universes. That's one way you can customize a 12 step program to suit your needs.
When it comes to being powerless. I don't know of anyone who can take a drink and not continue drinking. I would argue that if someone can do that then they aren't suffering from the same thing. Doesn't mean that they don't need to get sober because alcohol can affect one's life without having the effect of making one powerless or crave more after the first drink.
I do remember a time when I wasn't powerless. I would tell myself that I was going out and I was only going to have 3 because I was driving. Or I was going to drink for a few hours and then stop. I did this a lot. Not everyone here can share the same experience, some people never could control it.
Now on the disease belief. It's not really something that can be debated. It's like saying that you know of something that isn't in the universe. Everything, by definition is part of the universe--even an imagined idea is part of the universe. It's a definition.
Addiction isn't an INFECTIOUS disease. That is what lay people tend to think of when they hear the word disease. I'm a neuroscientist and any disruption in normal physiology that then becomes pathological is by definition a disease. It doesn't matter if you don't believe it is or not. Science tells us that it is a disease. There is a lot known about the pathology of addiction. It's a pathological process that occurs in the brain and has physical manifestation in form of disrupted neurotransmission. Knowing this doesn't really solve the problem because we don't know enough about it yet to do so. If the NIH invested as much money in addiction as they did in cancer research, we probably would have a few more drugs out by now to help with addiction. Anyway, I hope that this was a bit helpful and if you want to engage a bit more in the realm of neuroscience I would be more than willing, but I think what is important is take what is useful to you from any recovery program you find and apply it to your life
Regarding your specific beliefs, don't let them deter you from doing 12 step or any other form of recovery. I'm an atheist and I just started going to AA meetings. Seems to be helping , I've only had a handful of times where I've been 7 days sober in the last 5 years. But when people at the meetings say God, I just replace that word with "universe" and that works for me because the universe is a power greater than myself. It's huge and filled with energy-- it gave me life etc.... and each creature in this universe is also a power greater than me... we are all mini universes. That's one way you can customize a 12 step program to suit your needs.
When it comes to being powerless. I don't know of anyone who can take a drink and not continue drinking. I would argue that if someone can do that then they aren't suffering from the same thing. Doesn't mean that they don't need to get sober because alcohol can affect one's life without having the effect of making one powerless or crave more after the first drink.
I do remember a time when I wasn't powerless. I would tell myself that I was going out and I was only going to have 3 because I was driving. Or I was going to drink for a few hours and then stop. I did this a lot. Not everyone here can share the same experience, some people never could control it.
Now on the disease belief. It's not really something that can be debated. It's like saying that you know of something that isn't in the universe. Everything, by definition is part of the universe--even an imagined idea is part of the universe. It's a definition.
Addiction isn't an INFECTIOUS disease. That is what lay people tend to think of when they hear the word disease. I'm a neuroscientist and any disruption in normal physiology that then becomes pathological is by definition a disease. It doesn't matter if you don't believe it is or not. Science tells us that it is a disease. There is a lot known about the pathology of addiction. It's a pathological process that occurs in the brain and has physical manifestation in form of disrupted neurotransmission. Knowing this doesn't really solve the problem because we don't know enough about it yet to do so. If the NIH invested as much money in addiction as they did in cancer research, we probably would have a few more drugs out by now to help with addiction. Anyway, I hope that this was a bit helpful and if you want to engage a bit more in the realm of neuroscience I would be more than willing, but I think what is important is take what is useful to you from any recovery program you find and apply it to your life
Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Georgia
Posts: 576
Hey RMZ..I ride a KLR250 myself...Used to race a KX250...
Anyways , lots of support here...In fact , they are so nice around here , they let me back in after my midyear "relapse".
Hang on , hang out and have fun the best ya can...Like the rest of us...
Anyways , lots of support here...In fact , they are so nice around here , they let me back in after my midyear "relapse".
Hang on , hang out and have fun the best ya can...Like the rest of us...
Community Greeter
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Upstate New York
Posts: 51,560
I'm very glad you're with us, RMZ. The encouragement you'll receive here is wonderful. SR helped me find the strength to get - and stay - sober for good. Congrats on your 15 months of hard-earned sobriety. 
Reality...what a concept!
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: CT, USA
Posts: 1,232
Sorry you had such a bizarre AA experience! As others have said, there are many other programs available. Personally I am following Rational Recovery principles, but I do find the fellowship at AA to be comforting and encouraging (at least the meetings I attended - no public speaking required). Other programs don't really offer those types of meetings in as many places and frequently, so research some methods, try a different AA meeting, then put together what works for you. But definitely keep logging on here and posting - it's helped me more than anything else!
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,429
Hi RMZ
There are secularly minded meeting based groups around - I'm on my laptop right now so I have no links - but Google SMART Recovery and LifeRing.
no, AA, NA/12 step discussion is welcome here.
It's just the kinds of threads where people argue over whats the best/worst methods of recovery which are not
D
There are secularly minded meeting based groups around - I'm on my laptop right now so I have no links - but Google SMART Recovery and LifeRing.
Originally Posted by doggonecarl 
Welcome to Sober Recovery.
I don't know if the moderators like 12 step discussion in the newcomers forums, so they may move it to more appropriate forum. But since it's your first post, I'll respond.
I don't know if the moderators like 12 step discussion in the newcomers forums, so they may move it to more appropriate forum. But since it's your first post, I'll respond.
It's just the kinds of threads where people argue over whats the best/worst methods of recovery which are not
D
Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Oakland
Posts: 561
Originally Posted by Rmz250
Thank you for the replies, I think I have found something worthwhile here. The rehab I was in preached the AA way and instilled fear in me that I would relapse if I didn't believe in what they were saying or didn't do what they said. I haven't got that from any of the replies here and I was half expecting too. It's a breath of fresh air. It seems like people here are concerned with recovery more than the a right or wrong way. Thank you for the welcome.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 4,251
Hi there, I though of another link to share with you.
This link is a series of excerpts from the book Under the Influence which looks at alcoholism as a disease. I do believe addiction is a disease. The great thing about SR is that we can both hang around here even if we have different views on that.
I am sharing this not to try and change your mind, but just as food for thought. There is some scientific evidence that alcoholics process alcohol differently than non alcoholics.
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...influence.html
This link is a series of excerpts from the book Under the Influence which looks at alcoholism as a disease. I do believe addiction is a disease. The great thing about SR is that we can both hang around here even if we have different views on that.
I am sharing this not to try and change your mind, but just as food for thought. There is some scientific evidence that alcoholics process alcohol differently than non alcoholics.
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...influence.html
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