LukeSkywalker

Made it 100 hours just now, super proud of myself. This is the longest I have gone without a drink in a loooong time. Some questions though...

I've been going to AA because the meetings make me feel better, the support is really helpful, and some of the stories are really profound.

HOWEVER=

My temp sponsor has me reading the Big Book and...I have reservations about the whole "surrendering to a higher power" thing. First of all, I feel like I have done an excellent job staying sober this far...no divine intervention, just stubbornness and a determination to make a better life. I've cut out negative friends, changed my daily routine, and lots of other things, but I attribute that to myself, the support of my family, and the support of people on SR and in AA. But I can't get myself to attribute it to an entity I don't necessarily believe in.

Secondly, I expected to get to the chapter for agnostics and find something along the lines of: "If you don't believe in God, thats fine, just utilize the group or the sky or life in general as your higher power." Instead, I am confronted with what was essentially an effort to convert me. The whole chapter basically says that if you don't believe in God you can't get sober. It literally ends with the sentence "When we drew near Him He disclosed Himself to us!" I practically puked at that many capitalized pronouns, and was about to swear off AA.

After thinking about it though, and after realizing how helpful the meetings have been in reminding me of my decision to be sober/giving me something to do when I would normally drink, I'm gonna stick with it at least for now. I'm not even through my first week and my sobriety is very delicate. Plan to talk with my sponsor about this on Saturday, but I feel like I'm trading one addiction for another?

Dee74

Hi Luke
I'm a Christian but I don't consider my beliefs to be an addiction

I'm not an AAer though...but I do know a lot of agnostics who exist quite happily in AA.
We have a forum here on Secular approaches to the 12 steps.

Secular 12 Step Recovery - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information

D

Soberwolf

Congrats on a 100 hours Luke

FreeOwl

My advice is "don't get too hung up on the words".

Recognize that AA has a lot stereotypically Christian words to it's foundational literature and practices.

Recognize that in AA you will find lots of Christians.

Recognize that if you stick around the rooms long enough, you will meet buddhists, atheists, scientologists, jews, sikhs, mormons, muslims, generalized spiritualists and a host of others where spirituality is concerned.

When any program is put to literature, it's got to choose some words. So, this one chose popular pronouns of the day. The 1930's were not big on eastern view of Spirit. And the program has remained largely unchanged because it does work.

Within the program, there is flexibility. When I read the Big Book, I simply mentally fill in my own understanding of Spirit when I see the word God or come across the phrases about Him and He and blah blahblah.

All the program really requires is a willingness to believe that there is something greater than ourselves, and a choice to believe that something greater can be of use in helping us in sobriety. That's IT.

I am not a Christian. My concept of "God" is broad and vague and best defined by a statement like "I believe that there is a force moving through, in and around everything in the universe and that I am both a part of that force and it is a force far greater than me".

Your name implies you may be a fan of The Force....

I like to tell people to go and do an experiment.... go to the seaside, a lake, a field or any wide open space at sunrise.

With ALL the power you have at your disposal, will the sun NOT to rise.

If you can stop the sun from rising... congratulations!!

If not... then you must - by your own experience - admit to yourself that there is at least SOME power greater than yourself.

Once you have personally experienced that... simply remind yourself of that force whenever you feel uncomfortable about "the God thing"

FreeOwl

also - way to go on 100 hours.

my experience was that I could go "without drinking" for quite some time....

but it wasn't until I became willing - through action and belief and choice - to start making real changes in my life, that I began to understand what it really meant to be sober.

Keep at it!!!

ScottFromWI

It is always possibe to find fault or disagreement in any area of our lives. With our recovery program, our doctor/therapist, the rules surrounding our workplace, our family, you name it. Focus on what IS working and discuss this with your sponsor as you plan to, that seems like a good next step.

LiveInPeace

Congrats on not drinking for 100 hours. :-)

I also found that the meetings are good for that. But just going to meetings didn't get me sober. It left me on a pink cloud only to relapse really bad.

I was a dry drunk and then relapsed worse during a 10 year stint of leaving AA because I didn't like the God stuff in it. I suggest you just not think too much about this and just do what your sponsor suggests, even if you don't understand it right now or your mind wants to analyze it. I also thought I could stop on my own willpower or by changing external stuff, but I could not.

It doesn't have to be God. It can be any "power" you believe in. Do you make the sun come up in the morning? Do other people make the sun come up in the morning? Whatever it is that you thinks makes the sun come up in the morning, that can be your higher power for now. It's your own concept. Then replace the word "God" with whatever words you use for your own concept.

It's very common to trade one addiction for another when the "ism" of alcoholism is not resolved. Remove the alcohol without the "ism" and you're still left with alcoholism, untreated alcoholism, or "dry drunk" syndrome. When I stopped drinking but didn't do the steps out of the big book, I transferred my addiction to other things/behaviors.

Good luck.

Saskia

Luke, I, too, had some difficulties with the higher power concept. Eventually I discovered that it can literally be whatever you want it to be. The idea is to be accountable to something - and that can be as simple as our own higher instincts. Most meetings I have been to end with the Lord's Prayer. If you listen carefully, you'll probably find that it's not unusual to hear people quietly substitute some other terms more relevant to them than the original. I've never heard anyone criticized for that! The steps are the same way - open to interpretation.

Congrats on 100 days!

sg1970

I had a real struggle with that as well. Doing my fourth and fifth step really helped see where that struggle was coming from and let go of some resentments I had toward religion.

I used the universe and nature as a higher power. Still don't have a traditional concept of a higher power but here I am, a year and a half later, with that peace and serenity they talk about. Never would have thought it.

It sounds like you have a good plan. Here's to another hundred hours.

PurpleKnight

The aim is to use what works, many get Sober without faith, many with faith, it's not a prerequisite, you need to find out what works for you, there's a whole range of options and resources out there.

Keep pushing through Luke, 100 Hours is fantastic!!

chrcarlson

Google "super ego" As an agnostic it would be your higher power. Freudian thing. AA can be very helpful if you work the steps. I've been sober since Dec 9 and it has been my Iron will that did it. For the first time I truly can to terms with Step 1. Some how it has made quitting much easier. It really help when that little voice says "just one beer".

tomsteve

".I have reservations about the whole "surrendering to a higher power" thing."

i would,too.
fortunately for us its not part of the aa program.

letitgo

I feel stupid. I thought AA was about surrendering to a power greater then ourselves. I must be misinterpreting this comment. Can someone please explain this?

Thank you

tabasco

A friend of mine has 28 years sobriety in AA. He told me a story, in his first meeting, hungover, he heard "There are no dues or fees" and being Jewish, thought he heard "no jews or fees" He tells it with a wonderful smile on his face. The spiritual aspect is the key, not the flavour of any man made religion. Keep with it, you make the best friends of your life.

MIRecovery

At 56318 hours and a 1000+ AA meetings I am amazed at how little I know about sobriety, a higher power, and AA in general.

In the beginning my way of staying sober had completely and utterly failed 100% of the time. I humbled myself and started doing what people with long term sobriety did whether I liked it or not.

Amazingly things started to get better and over time I realized why it was they did what they did.

One of my favorite lines, "Just when I had the answers they changed all the questions."

Today I'm confused on a higher level

Fly N Buy

Glad you're here posting - welcome!

100 hours is a great beginning. We all started where you are. AA is a program of faith, not religion - plenty of friends in our program who don't believe in the same God as do. Whatever makes sense. I'd encourage more time before trying to determine what's right or won't work. I had to past contempt prior to investigation in all thing when opening my body, mind and spirit to recovery.

The only place I recall the word surrender being used in the BB is personal stories. It's not in the steps/program. It is however in the long form if the serenity prayer - but the short form is common in the rooms.

I needed to simply be open minded, willing and honest regardless of recovery program - that gives me a chance today.

Keep coming back

Mountainmanbob

I wouldn't worry much about the God thing as shared in AA.
There are many gods there and I spell most with a little "g"

MB

LiveInPeace

.

tomsteve

the word surrender, when i hear it, refers to simple surrender that alcohol had us beat-we surrendered.
as for surrender to a HP, its not used in the big book or the program.
what the program does say is we came to believe in a power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
came to believe by working the remainder of the steps.

in the next step we turn our will and lives over to the care of our HP.

have ya read the bb,letitgo?

letitgo

Ok I see. It doesn't the word surrender. It basically semantics.
Made a decision to turn our will and our lives
over to the care of God as we understood Him.

Main Entry: surrender
Part of Speech: noun
Definition: giving up; resignation
Synonyms: abandonment, abdication, acquiescence, appeasement, capitulation, cessation, dedition, delivery, giving way, relenting, relinquishment, renunciation, submission, succumbing, white flag, yielding
Antonyms: fight, fighting, victory,