thomas11

As some of you know, I left for a hunting trip to South Dakota on Thursday and I knew temptation would be everywhere. And it was. I did not get through it alcohol free, but I did get through it with minimal carnage. Had 2 drinks on 2 different nights. I ate well and went to bed at a decent hour. I believe that for anyone who has struggled with fairly severe alcohol issues, it was a moderate success. It would have been quite easy to go off the rails (as some did) and drink until sunrise each night. . I did not. The amount of physical exertion during the daytime (even with bad knees) is astounding. I am extremely sore and stiff, but actually took less pain medication than anticipated. Came home with pills leftover. I am glad that ( while in the minority) I was looking forward to coming home to my wife and dog. Too many guys in bad marriages that wanted nothing more than to escape and numb themselves with alcohol before going home to a miserable existence. Bottom line, I'm back to "normal" and will be here until the 22nd. Then I leave for the Holidays. I will be a regular here until then.

Anna

And, are you planning to drink again after the 22nd?

Trying to moderate drinking doesn't work for alcoholics.

JD

It's a slippery slope Jeff.

PurpleKnight

Glad you made it back Jeff!!

You already know what I'm going to say, but it's important not to get complacent, a few drinks here and there is not a validation that moderate drinking is possible, I could always manage a few days of no chaos drinking, but things would always spiral the more I fed my addiction, maybe not in the first week but within a month I'd be back to as bad as ever.

Be careful is all I would say Jeff . . . alcohol really is like playing with fire, you know the score!!

thomas11

I am not planning on it. And I do not have interest in moderation. If I drink, I do it to get drunk. That's the kind of drinker I am. I had 2 drinks on 2 different nights and while it was social, if I was by myself, I would have preferred not having any, or getting drunk. Just being honest.

doggonecarl

You called your previous relapse a "learning experience." And you drank after that. So what is it you are learning? New ways to talk yourself into drinking?

This dabbling with alcohol, though not as bad as it could have been, seems similar to dipping your toe in a pool before jumping in.

I hope you make it through the holidays unscathed.

dwtbd

Jeff, you should quit drinking , coz you suck at being drunk, at least what I've seen from you when posting when you were drinking. Alcohol is everywhere it would be easy to go off the rails for anyone at anytime, easier still if you (anyone) drinks.
I quit because I suck at being drunk too. Hope you see your way to a better solution, you deserve it, you sound like a real good guy.
Wish you well

Dee74

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ouncement.html

LBrain

I'm going on a hunting trip with 2 other guys. It's been a few years since I attended this trip. It used to be drink after dark.
Last week I visited one and he asked if I was still not drinking. He didn't want to drink in front of me. I'm sure they will drink during the trip. I am also sure they will respect me and not offer - or even deny me if I was stupid enough to ask.
They know my story and as with all of my friends they support me.
I'm coming up on two years. Last year I wouldn't have taken this trip - I didn't. It was still too soon for me even though I felt I could handle being in that environment.
My commitment to staying sober and never drinking again was solid. I still didn't wish to put it to the test. It's that important to me.
I will be sure to remind my friends of that fact.

ScottFromWI

I don't think you are being honest with yourself, even in this paragraph. You aren't interested in moderation, yet you drank twice "socially" this past weekend and also the weekend before that....and you supposedly "learned" from that experience. Go back and read your threads if it helps you see, you are purposefully and willingly drinking again. Maybe not every day or binging, but that is the next stop on the train if you don't make some serious changes.

Greenwood618

What's the big deal? He likes to drink and he likes to talk about drinking and he likes to run down those who drink more than he does. A sobriety and abstinence forum seems an odd place to keep reporting on how successful of a drinker he is, but hey, you aren't the moderator. As for learning experiences, he appears going for a PhD.

Dee74

I think 'the big deal' is some of us form relationships here over time, Greenwood.

We try to look out for each other, support each other, and give the advice out straight when needed, especially in this Newcomers forum.

I dunno about anyone else, but that kind of community support saved my life

D

EndGameNYC

I didn't want to be the one to say it; we've been down this road before about honesty. Scott did an admirable job of laying it on the line for you. Honesty isn't about what we say; it's about what we do.

You need to set yourself straight around where you stand with alcohol. You're either a drinker or a non-drinker. You can't be both.

Delfin

I'm sad to read that you drank, Jeff, but I'm even sadder to see that you're minimizing this episode, as you did the last one. As Dee said, we're a community, and we don't want to see anyone heading in the wrong direction. I hope you'll think about all of the advice and concern on this thread and do the work needed to keep this from happening again.

Delfin

Aellyce

I tried to keep myself from jumping into your thread again, Jeff... but then started thinking, why do I want to resist actually? And then realized that I am doing myself a disservice if I don't express what I think here. So, I agree with Dee and others that in part these responses that most typically get quite heated on your threads are driven by genuine concern and care, but I think there is more to it on a different level, why threads and experiences like yours tend to provoke intense responses from many people, I feel it's far from unselfish pure caring for you only, actually. In a way, I think you (and others who share similar experiences and thinking here) do good to a few of us who decided to commit to long-term sobriety -- I think these discussions and the act of responding strengthen our resolve. Well, maybe I should just speak for myself and say I find this helpful for me. So, how about you? Why do you keep reporting your experiences? Do you find the feedback useful? If so, in which way?

I liked some of the comments on your previous thread best with a few posters pointing out that there may be things that you are probably completely missing... why the pattern sustains itself. I am not going to speculate what some of those things might be because I don't know you (I think I did a bit on an earlier thread though), and others' dissecting whatever you do and report, pointing out inconsistencies etc, may not be what is likely to be most helpful for you right now. But we cannot do much more over the internet, unfortunately.

Will just make a similar suggestion to others: maybe try to look deeper, into the larger picture of yourself and your tendencies. Beyond drinking or not drinking. Beyond the social occasions and events you like to attend. Beyond an apparent wish to learn from your experiences. I'm not talking about why you drink when you do and how -- I feel that is only a small piece in the puzzle (albeit a quite significant one given its consequences). I agree with the suggestion that re-reading your old threads at different times (!!) might help with some realizations, because we are naturally more receptive to insight in some moments and less so in others.

What I can share in this context is that some of my interactions via SR in the first 1-1.5 year of sobriety had given me some of the best a-ha moments of my life, but it did not happen instantly, and I think I never even got the very direct responses you are getting, because I wasn't struggling with fluctuating resolve regarding abstinence from drinking per se. But in spite of being successful with sobriety, I still had the same core issues -- I just displaced them and found different outlets for the same driving forces. No longer drinking, but I was still quite similarly obsessive, impulsive, and erratic in many of my reactions and behaviors, and it was not easy to recognize and admit for a while. And still feeling uneasy, haunted, unstable up and down. Yeah part of it may be that the brain needs time to heal, but in my case I am convinced there was more: that I was still feeding into the same issues in a non-constructive manner. The way SR helped me most (now in retrospect) was not direct support or encouragement, but looking at my experience on SR in its totality, and also looking into the reactions of others and my own reactions hard and deep. I am glad that I shared so many aspects of myself, thoughts and feelings in the moment etc, because otherwise I would not have obtained the same benefit. But I had to seriously consider the (as I said, for me not so direct) feedback, following up even when I did not share it here -- sometimes instantly, other times with a delay... doing my own investigation based on all that and finding help IRL to do more. But no matter what and how happened, I think that stopping drinking for good was the first and absolutely essential step for me.

Something else I just thought of, and I apologize if it's off, but an idea anyway. Looking at your threads and progress as a whole... I share the view of others that you have made some great strides initially and your apparent strength is inspiring. However, I just feel that more recently, you may be using these posts to build something else here... sort of an image of a man who is able to handle what most of us never could. And you keep feeding it, seemingly quite confidently. This, again, makes me think what's there on a deeper level, those missing pieces of the puzzle that you may not be seeing right now...?

soberclover

For me, clearly being in any social situation where people are drinking is challenging although on different levels depending on the particular venue and the particular people. It has been key for me in my sobriety to stay sober strong in these situations. While it may be emotionally exhausting while in it, I think it is overall better for my inner sober self to get through this and not drink. It makes me more able to further participate in other social situations where alcohol is present should I need/choose to knowing I am sober strong. Drinking for me made me socially weaker.

I'm overall not a very social creature so this is a big deal for me in general to be social. And to be social sober strong is an incredible thing for me. Once you are able to tuck a few instances in your pocket where you have stayed sober strong you will feel amazing. I remember my first camping experience staying sober...wow it was awesome....and my first Christmas....and my first New Years....and my first.....you get the picture...there are a lot of firsts. It is challenging but worth it

OpenTuning

Hi,

I'm sorry to hear your hunting trip was such a complete and utter disaster for you.

"What?" I hear you say. "It wasn't a disaster, everyone around me was getting smashed, and I only drank in moderation. (Just had the two, officer). I stayed in control. I feel proud of myself. It went really well. Didn't you read my post?"

And that view is of course why it was a complete, unmitigated disaster for you. Your AV is smart. It isn't interested in winning a minor battle, it wants to win the war. And this makes its ultimate victory far, far more likely. You've now laid the groundwork for a few drinks over Christmas. Maybe 3 or 4, since having 2 was fine on the hunting trip. And New Years? You'll probably decide you can push that up to 5 or 6 since everyone else will be having loads more than that. You'll show how in control you are by not getting too drunk and waking up without a hangover. Or not much of one. That'll be something to be proud of. Etc, etc, etc, etc.

I've been trying to figure out why I care so much about your battle with alcoholism, when it so often feels like you don't particularly care. There's a few other people here I've had a similar reaction to. And I think it's because in a sense it's easy to try and help the people who know they have a problem, and are struggling to deal with it. Offering advice, encouragement, helping to pick them up when they fall down. Because you know how badly they want it, and when they finally find the right plan, you feel confident they'll be fine. And the fact is most people posting on a sobriety forum are aware they have a problem and are looking for help to deal with it.

But it's so much harder when you have someone who is as smart as you, as eloquent as you. Who is open and writes about their journey. Who so often says all the right things "I do not have interest in moderation. If I drink, I do it to get drunk. That's the kind of drinker I am" that shows they know they are an alcoholic and the only answer is sobriety. And then in literally the next sentence they can write "I had 2 drinks on 2 different nights and while it was social, if I was by myself, I would have preferred not having any, or getting drunk" showing a complete absence of a clue about their condition. How can you know moderation isn't an option for you while talking about how proud you are that you drank in moderation when you could have got hammered instead? I'm glad there isn't a brick wall next to me, because if there was I'd be banging my head against it.

There is hope for you. There's hope for everyone. And as others have said your situation has improved since those earlier posts when you didn't connect your terrible accident to your drinking, for example. And I want you to get sober as much now as I ever have.

But I'm at a complete loss, as so many others appear to be, about what it will take for you to understand, fully, deeply, completely, that drinking in moderation is not an option for you. Seriously, what will it take?

ccam1973

I've been away from the community for a while Jeff. Sorry to hear you slipped a couple of times.

Be careful. Your post sounds a lot like you are trying to justify your drinking. When I start doing that, it's game on for my AV. As soon as you start to negotiate, you've lost the battle. For guys like us, there is absolutely no room for just having a couple of drinks. That lays the groundwork for a couple more the next go around, then a couple more, then before you know it, you're right back where you started... Most of us here know that drill.

You've done a great job and worked hard on your sobriety. Just be true to yourself. Nothing good comes from us taking a drink. Don't negotiate drinking back into your life.

ubntubnt

If you know you are an alcoholic and alcohol causes problems in your life why not stop with all the posturing and just quit for good?

Surely, if you acknowledge that you have a problem with alcohol then the posturing is a show of weakness and not strength?

Dharma33

Coming up on 7 months, I'm hardly an expert at recovery. All I know is that I can never pick up a drink again.

My 2 cents, take it or leave it: Your journey as of late seems to be an exercise in Moderation Management, instead of a commitment to Recovery from Addiction.

I wish you well and that somehow you will come to realize complete abstinence is the only solution.