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Stupid, stupid mistake. Stupid, stupid repeated mistake.

Old 11-10-2015, 12:26 PM
  # 21 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by FreeOwl View Post
I don't think carl was trying to shame you....

I do see how you might interpret it that way.

But I think within his comments was a nugget worth considering... I don't think he was discrediting the changes you've made. I think he was emphasizing the degree of change that sobriety can take.

As I read your original post, I could see elements of my own journey to finally being in successful, happy sobriety. When I was making similar statements - I was still caught in old cycles. Still not ready to let go of some of the patterns trapping me in addiction. I had not yet totally embraced sobriety and become willing to step into a totally new paradigm of life to see how deep, rich and full it could be.

I can't say whether that's where you are - but your words seemed familiar.
I appreciate your response. But whether trying to or not trying the statement such as "you're not willing to make the changes......" is clearly shaming language. It's like when people test for boundaries.....most people are not conscious of the fact and will deny it even thought it's a perfectly normal thing......it would be giving a lot of credit if I thought he was consciously trying. I don't think he was, more coming from a conditioning. no big deal.

However in the case of shaming language when it comes to addiction...I don't find it very helpfull.

I'm not sure I fully followed the rest of your post...."when you were making similar statements" such as?

Look, I'll tell you were I'm at now.....fed up. Am I not willing to let go of these patterns or do I not know how to let go of them?

I'm making some bad decisions and I think my decisions are being based on emotion....not logic or reason. I'm struggling to live in this flat and I'm aware that I made a huge error and I've had to keep going to work while I've had really bad back pain. I don't work I'm not payed. Decisions stemming from emotions being up and down...

I'm trying to explore were that's coming from. Yes in the meantime maybe it's best for me to take the practical decision of not going to bars.......
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Old 11-10-2015, 12:31 PM
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Hi Rake!

I just wanted to give you a welcome to SoberRecovery!
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:11 PM
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Transparency....conversation with a friend

(I'll keep it in the one thread...)

so I've just had a whatsapp conversation with a friend...

It's the same friend that I had been writing my "friend" (ie so called, supposed to be) because a month ago when we went out and I was drinking sparkling water or soda he said "are you going to continue drinking those gay drinks?"

long story short I fell off the wagon and was annoyed at myself and annoyed at him for not just accepting that I didn't want drink....and I wanted to fade him to black...

tonight he sent me a message to say "I wanted to talk to you about something that happened the other day that I didn't like, but I prefer to say it in person"

my response was "no, you've opened the subject...say it now"

Apparently when we were going down the street Saturday night I start insulting a group of women and he said one of them was a girlfriend of a friend of his" he asked me had I taken anything as I was euphoric.

I thought to myself "ah you see you don't like my drunken behaviour but yet you cannot accept that I don't drink"

I said to him "there was something that happened a few weeks ago that I didn't like" and I explained the fact that I want to stop drinking that sometimes I have control and sometimes I have not control. that he knows I'm very direct but with alcohol that can turn out worse. it's a lottery. That want to stop and it's leaving me depressed. That I have no family here and it's not my country. the next day after drinking even the smallest hangover is leaving me with anxiety and depression. that I have a friend who it seems won't accept that I don't want to drink"

His answer: "I didn't know your circumstances. and

"I'll no longer let you drink whenever we go out"

It felt a little bit emotional but I think the transparency was good...

I think this could be what the problem has been; I "think" I'm accepting it but it's something I'm keeping bottled in and to my self. So it's like a secret brewing up inside.....

It's not that I don't drink and that's that. It's that bad things happen to me when I drink and maybe it's true the truth will set you free.....
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Old 11-10-2015, 03:33 PM
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Day 1 done

So day 1 complete and I'm wondering why I can't get into bed. I start at 8am tomorrow and I'm consistently not getting enough sleep. I'll get 6 hours tonight hopefully......but twice last week I got 4 hours sleep. It's why I was bothered by someone last wednesday....lacking sleep I let someone annoy me for something that I normally wouldn't get annoyed about...

I need to address the sleep issue. Granted I'm sleeping on the floor now because the crap bed was killing my back. I was wondering was that repelling me from getting into bed.....

then I remembered something from last night. I think I was hallucinating. I was sleeping when suddenly I thought I saw a cat in the room. I have the bed on it's side and leaning against the wall while the mattress is on the floor. I thought I saw a cat looking at me through the bed frame. surely the light no? frightened the life out of me and I jumped up and didn't take my eyes off it while my hand searched for the lightswitch.....now the cat comes out from the bed and runs on to the mattress and looks like he want to run around me or jump on me.....I picked up some item of clothing ready to throw it over it and it's like he's shaping to leap up at me and I'm trying to hit it with the item of clothing......I eventually hit the light and there was nothing there....

Probably I good idea that I remember that.

flat is a dirtbox and I need to get out. a problem with mites or some tiny little flies that are driving me insanse, especially at night. Problem with humidity. Where the light switch is in the bedroom I put my hand just above it to lean on while putting my shoes on the other day and my hand went through the wall....wtf.com? so searching for the light switch while the cat was hovering my hand went into it again.....

am I beginning to see the light
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Old 11-10-2015, 05:36 PM
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Hi TheRake, everything has pretty much been said. The bottom line is that at least temporarily you need to set some boundaries. Not a line in the sand...a brick wall. Give yourself 90 days to see what a sober life really feels like. I'm guessing the loneliness and emotional part of you is looking for a relationship and you believe there's a chance it might happen in a bar. After all, that's where a lot of people hang out and be social. I understand that. Personally, I would put ALL OF IT on the back-burner for now. The drinking will only get worse and ultimately you will end up in the worse case scenario, alone and a drunk. Hang in there. Best wishes.
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Old 11-10-2015, 10:56 PM
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It sounds like you have a lot going on Rake. Maybe now would be a time to concentrate on that instead of your social life? I understand how lonely it can feel to be in a foreign country, far from family, friends and familiar customs. But why not take a while to get your living situation in order, concentrate on staying sober, work on smoothing out your sleep patterns and just generally try to stay healthy?
I am not sure what country you are in and how the laws work there. I know Italy is very heavy leaning towards the side of tenets. If your flat is making you miserable, start looking for a new one. What about putting an ad in a local paper or whatever online marketplace they use in your country for a sober roommate? You would have built in companionship and would probably be able to afford a nicer place if sharing the rent.
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Old 11-11-2015, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by teatreeoil007 View Post
I do not go out.... Have not for years... Has nothing to do with or without drinking... Just don't like the 'out' scene.. My idea of being out is outside in nature.. Alone with Creation and communing with nature and that Higher power...
Hey, I know I do love nature...

but are you married with a family?

I'm not...I'm single.....with a biological drive

the solution:
1) day game
2) social game

3) Internet game.....which is a bad market

4) Night game ....only sober. I game better sober....so this should be a positive....maybe I need to get some time under the belt first. I know my mistake Friday......stupid position to put myself in....it wasn't gaming. almost blind dating.....boring...boring....boring

gaming is not particularly for the outcome......it's fun....it's addictive...it's gives an ambient confidence....

writing that is actually motivating me to continue cultivating my sober personality.....it's much more rewarding, there is no doubt....

it's self-actualisation.

Alcohol sucks....it bloody sucks. stupid stupid mistake.
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Old 11-11-2015, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by thomas11 View Post
Hi TheRake, everything has pretty much been said. The bottom line is that at least temporarily you need to set some boundaries. Not a line in the sand...a brick wall. Give yourself 90 days to see what a sober life really feels like. I'm guessing the loneliness and emotional part of you is looking for a relationship and you believe there's a chance it might happen in a bar. After all, that's where a lot of people hang out and be social. I understand that. Personally, I would put ALL OF IT on the back-burner for now. The drinking will only get worse and ultimately you will end up in the worse case scenario, alone and a drunk. Hang in there. Best wishes.
Hey Thomas, it's funny you say that about the 90 days......I started an audio book this morning and one of the pieces of advice was to review it several times over 90 days....the audio book also references other books...and I said to myself....ok that's my first 90 day sober project.....90 days sober and get through the material in the book(s)........I kind of agree with concentrating on one day at a time....but the GhostFace fellow mentioned something usefull about goals......if you don't have an end date.....the goal ends up just becomeing a dream.....I think that works for me having an endgoal in mind......achieve the 90 days and then keep setting other periods of time markers......that been said I think if I get a good run at this......I can put it to bed for good......

No I don't think I'm looking for a relationship man. Probably the last thing that I need. I don't think it ever works, a man looking for a relationship....seems to repel them. But I do have a biological drive and need....and long dry periods can be hazardous to my health. I have tried to put it on the back burner....and then I start to ache and it consumes my thoughts and dreams.....

the loneliness is probably something that needs to be fixed from childhood. A relationship ain't going to fill that hole.
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Old 11-11-2015, 11:42 AM
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Best wishes Rake
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Old 11-12-2015, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by thomas11 View Post
Hi TheRake, everything has pretty much been said. The bottom line is that at least temporarily you need to set some boundaries. Not a line in the sand...a brick wall. Give yourself 90 days to see what a sober life really feels like. I'm guessing the loneliness and emotional part of you is looking for a relationship and you believe there's a chance it might happen in a bar. After all, that's where a lot of people hang out and be social. I understand that. Personally, I would put ALL OF IT on the back-burner for now. The drinking will only get worse and ultimately you will end up in the worse case scenario, alone and a drunk. Hang in there. Best wishes.
Dear Thomas, finally my good man....you're right: a brick wall.

Some things happened the last two days...maybe a test. I was going the way of the ego....

I was Jesus been tempted by Mary Magdalene and it turns out that yes my friend is Judas. My gut feeling to terminate this friendship was right. Time to go with the gut...

I'm Jesus in the garden of gethsemane and these snakes are trying to kill me. Forgive them father, for they know not....what they do.

A wall. The walls of Jericho. This is biblical.
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Old 11-12-2015, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Meraviglioso View Post
I have had the "just drink slower, have a glass of water between drinks, limit yourself to only 3 drinks a night" comments and you are right, they grate on the nerves.
I have only had one situation where someone was actually pushing a drink on me. This was during one of my former sobriety attempts a few years ago. We were at a restaurant and everyone was having wine. She made a comment that I looked so bored and miserable (I was, I was new to sobriety) and was really pushing me "come on, just have one, we won't let you have any more, just take it easy, it is fine" After more than enough "no thank you's" I had had enough of this bullish*t so I cleared my throat and calmly and clearly went on about a 5 minute spiel offering the most gory and horrendous examples of my over drinking. Explaining clearly and calmly that once the first sip of alcohol gets in my system I would rather rip her face off with my bare hands rather than stop. Telling the whole table about waking up in the morning and pouring a glass of wine just to get right enough to address the day then continuing to drink upwards of three bottles of wine throughout the day. The uncomfortable laughter stuttered into stunned silence. It was outrageously embarrassing. For her.
god I truly love alcoholics and so gravitate to those in recovery!!! HOF fame post........
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Old 11-12-2015, 04:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Fly N Buy View Post
god I truly love alcoholics and so gravitate to those in recovery!!! HOF fame post........
Ah you're adorable
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Old 11-14-2015, 01:41 AM
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Hey Rake, just wanted to share my experience from last night with you. Last night my boyfriend and I had planned a date night out to get sushi. When he came to pick me up he informed me that some of his colleagues and friends were also going to get sushi so he planned to meet them there. I was annoyed and nervous at first because I am really trying to buckle down and am just not in the most social mood right now. It would also be the first time socializing with these people although I have met them and know them.
Anyway, we went, there were 10 of us total. Very boisterous group, most quite a bit younger than me. When the waitress came and was taking our order someone said they wanted the japanese beer that came in a liter bottle. Then people said "make it two" " make it three" I had my head turned but I heard my boyfriend say "no she doesn't drink" so someone must have asked if I wanted one too. I ordered a bottle of sparkling water while everyone else at the table had a beer. When the waitress came and was handing out the bottles she held up the water (the only bottle different) and someone at the end of the table said "who has the water" and I indicated it was me.

Not one single person looked twice, asked why I ordered water, asked about my drinking or non-drinking habits or made any comment whatsoever about my beverage choice.
With the exception of the example I posted previously, I have found this to be the norm. In the right company, people don't really care about what you are drinking, they just care that you are there.
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Old 11-14-2015, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by TheRake View Post
Dear Thomas, finally my good man....you're right: a brick wall.

Some things happened the last two days...maybe a test. I was going the way of the ego....

I was Jesus been tempted by Mary Magdalene and it turns out that yes my friend is Judas. My gut feeling to terminate this friendship was right. Time to go with the gut...

I'm Jesus in the garden of gethsemane and these snakes are trying to kill me. Forgive them father, for they know not....what they do.

A wall. The walls of Jericho. This is biblical.
You'll have to forgive me Rake as I am not a religious person, but I trust what you posted was positive. Some 15-20 years ago I listened to a program regularly called Loveline that was hosted by Dr. Drew Pinsky and Adam Corolla. I was at a personally very challenging period in my life, they talked a lot about structure and boundaries for both the individual person and relationships. I listened intently and took it to heart. It helped turn my life around. My wife and I have very strict boundaries and structure, and we do not push them or cross them and I believe our relationship now is stronger than ever.
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Old 11-14-2015, 11:08 AM
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I'd suggest going to BOTH the meeting regularly for a while and getting to know some of the people there - you may well end up making some friends there who you can meet up with for coffee. (When they suggest trying another meeting, they don't mean INSTEAD of the other one - they mean as well as).

And I'd definitely stay away from the pressures of dating until I had some serious sobriety-confidence built up. Addicts do have a tendency to replace one form of instant gratification (eg. booze) with other forms of instant gratification (compulsive sex; gambling; compulsive shopping; overeating - all different forms of acting out). Please don't try to patch a problem with a person.

What hobbies do you have that could be openings for going to clubs of societies. Have you considered volunteering? (Even if only for one off things for a local group like marshalling at sports events or similar if you don't feel up to committing to anything more regular at the moment). Even if you don't expect to enjoy it, chances are you'll get more out of it than you would out of isolating or by revisiting slippery places and people and risking another relapse.

I really don't think Carl was trying to shame you (unfortunately with social media it can be very easy for things to be typed in a way that it then misinterpreted. I'm surprised it doesn't happen on here more often, especially when we consider just how many different countries; languages and cultures of people nestle together on this forum trying to help each other.) Anyway - I know that I definitely tried to keep some slippery old friends and slippery old haunts as places to go to have fun in sobriety (as have many of my AA friends in the first year or so). And it made recovery much more uncomfortable for me than I found I could be when I had (reluctantly) replaced some more of my old habits with new ones. But that did take time for me. And I certainly don't envy you doing it on your own abroad with no family or long-term friends to give some moral support and a hug now and then.

I do wondered what you mean by 'solving it once and for all'. I find that if I want to maintain a good quality sobriety I have to keep working on it daily. It takes maintenance. Just like building up to being a good runner - once someone gets there they still have to train just to maintain that level of fitness. There isn't any workout; exercise; or supplement they can take that will give them that level of fitness 'once and for all'.
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