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Alcohol and Substance Abuse Deaths of Younger Persons

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Old 11-06-2015, 06:59 AM
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It's Violet: Odd that you say that you've embarked on your own healing journey without their blessing. Seems strange that they would object that you might be healed,particularly if you are having issues such as others (me included) tend to have on this website. Do keep in touch and thanks for posting. Good luck.

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Old 11-06-2015, 07:24 AM
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Originally Posted by ItsViolet View Post
@ Kallisistia....I don't intend to minimize what you're saying in any way, but I have to caution against thinking that the "perfectly adapted" seeming child is free and clear of issues...I learned from my own experience that the effects of abandonment, alcoholism, violence, abuse, etc. sometimes don't come out until later, in unexpected ways. a child could become perfectionistic and/or become master of burying his or her feelings, hiding personal problems and subverting his or her emotional needs and those things can carry into adulthood until they reach a kind of boiling point, if they do. Personally when I reached my boiling point and came out of the closet about many of these things, my family reacted by rejecting me instead of hearing what I was saying. They wanted me to continue being the "easy" one, the "good" one who does what they're supposed to do and makes things look good and doesn't "complain" about the past. Due to their own beliefs about who they think I should be and whatever else they project onto me, I've embarked on my own healing journey without their blessing. So this gigantic gap in understanding was created that drew us even further apart, and I doubt that my family is unique on this point.
ItsViolet, I want to thank you for this post. This is what happened to me as well.

Many people don't realize or understand how this kind of thing can happen.
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Old 11-06-2015, 01:40 PM
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@wpainterw: i don't know if they necessarily object to my healing process...their intentions aren't that bad. it seems more to me that the truth coming out makes them uncomfortable since it reflects badly on THEM. so they'd rather everybody just stay stuck in denial.
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Old 11-06-2015, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by ItsViolet View Post
@wpainterw: i don't know if they necessarily object to my healing process...their intentions aren't that bad. it seems more to me that the truth coming out makes them uncomfortable since it reflects badly on THEM. so they'd rather everybody just stay stuck in denial.
Well, good luck to you. For forty years, through lots of ineffective counseling I was saying "I drank because of my sister's suicide, because of my mother's often hostile behavior, because of the way she treated my dad, because, because...." What I was hiding from myself was that I was using "because" to cover up my shame, my guilty feeling, my resentments when the truth of the matter was that I had become an alcoholic, for many reasons, some genetic, some cultural (the college drinking culture), some voluntary (wanting to fit in with the crowd because I was unsure of myself). What I should have been focussing on was "What now?" "How do I get well and stay well? "Because" just prevented me from getting out of the box. There are lots of ways to do "How". AA, Rational Recovery, Smart Recovery, this website- SoberRecovery. A lot of experience right here to help and support you. Do it for yourself. Not for them. They'll probably give you more support and understanding later but it they don't then it's your life, not theirs.

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Old 11-06-2015, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by wpainterw View Post
I have seen statistics indicating that the suicide rate of adolescents on Native American reservations is about 18-20 percent. About one fifth of the adolescents killing themselves! Shocking! Historically unprecedented I would think. These kids need to be given an opportunity to get off the reservation and get back on track. A matter of life or death for them.
On a broader perspective, I venture to say that the whole culture has turned to a "me" oriented one: "career", money, prestige, power, possessions, "selfies", etc. May it not be that wisdom and happiness may best be found in helping others, not thinking about oneself or emphasizing "recreation", "partying".

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I certainly agree (Bill, correct?), our youth are entitled, self centered and materialistic. Its unfortunate. I will also add that in addition to the native american population being at high risk of suicide, I have read dreadful statistics on our veterans coming home from the middle east. I don't recall the numbers, but they are unsettling. I told my father not long ago that I think things are going to unravel over the course of the next 50 years and I am somewhat thankful I won't be around to see it. I hope I'm wrong.
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Old 11-06-2015, 05:14 PM
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Originally Posted by thomas11 View Post
I certainly agree (Bill, correct?), our youth are entitled, self centered and materialistic. Its unfortunate. I will also add that in addition to the native american population being at high risk of suicide, I have read dreadful statistics on our veterans coming home from the middle east. I don't recall the numbers, but they are unsettling. I told my father not long ago that I think things are going to unravel over the course of the next 50 years and I am somewhat thankful I won't be around to see it. I hope I'm wrong.
Agreed: I won't be around either. Few of the younger folk know much about the French Revolution, or the Russian Revolution, or Hitler's enormous popularity with the unemployed in a time of rampant inflation. He gave them jobs, making tanks, submarines, gave them military displays. In those tumultuous times it was the rich, the so called "aristocrats" who died. The megabillionares don't seem to worry much about that.

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Old 11-06-2015, 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by wpainterw View Post
Agreed: I won't be around either. Few of the younger folk know much about the French Revolution, or the Russian Revolution, or Hitler's enormous popularity with the unemployed in a time of rampant inflation. He gave them jobs, making tanks, submarines, gave them military displays. In those tumultuous times it was the rich, the so called "aristocrats" who died. The megabillionares don't seem to worry much about that.

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Bill, it is my understanding that the aristocrats came out unscathed. If that is not the case, can you direct me towards information to the contrary? My thirst for historical knowledge is endless. The wheels on this cuckoo clock need to keep moving or i will drink to quit thinking. Hope you are doing well.
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Old 11-06-2015, 07:42 PM
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My recollection may be faulty but certainly Czar Nicholas and his wife, Alexandra and their children were killed in the Russian Revolution. A number of aristocrats were able to flee to France but arrived penniless and many of them had to take menial jobs, such as waiters, etc. I suspect that the ones who were not able to leave Russia were eventually killed. As for the French Revolution, those who first were sent to the guillotine were members of the Court and the King and Queen. As for Hitler, those who ended up in concentration camps were mostly Jewish, including many very wealthy Jews in the banking business. I doubt that a Hitler would take kindly to many of those who work in today's financial industry and are heavily compensated, who work in Wall St. or uptown N.Y.C.
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Old 11-06-2015, 11:10 PM
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P.S. Hitler may have used Willie Sutton as a role model.Willie always followed the money. When asked why he robbed banks he is reported to have said, "Because that's where the money is."

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Old 11-06-2015, 11:52 PM
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The man was...I don't even know what to say. Who just decides to kill people because they exist?

Granted in his mind his racism was logical and founded - I have a copy of Mein Kampf hidden away because I do not want it in plain view on my bookshelf that I purchased solely to expand my own knowledge of the era and the powers of the time. So much embellishment and straight fiction. I can honestly say if you have not read it, it's certainly not worth the time needed to do so to get through hundreds of pages of drivel.
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Old 11-07-2015, 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by wpainterw View Post
My recollection may be faulty but certainly Czar Nicholas and his wife, Alexandra and their children were killed in the Russian Revolution. A number of aristocrats were able to flee to France but arrived penniless and many of them had to take menial jobs, such as waiters, etc. I suspect that the ones who were not able to leave Russia were eventually killed. As for the French Revolution, those who first were sent to the guillotine were members of the Court and the King and Queen. As for Hitler, those who ended up in concentration camps were mostly Jewish, including many very wealthy Jews in the banking business. I doubt that a Hitler would take kindly to many of those who work in today's financial industry and are heavily compensated, who work in Wall St. or uptown N.Y.C.
Thanks Bill, love your posts. Sadly, I sort of wish that the general population could deal with the oligarchy in the same way. The guillotine. Because they are crushing the souls' of the "workin folk".
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