Donnylutz

What does it mean to be powerless? I wanted to ask this at an AA group I went to this morning, but I didn't want to start a riot. My 2nd AA meeting in a row did not go well, but that's okay.

The first step says (which I'm sure you all know) "We admitted we were powerless over alcohol—that our lives had become unmanageable"

I completely 100% submit to the fact that I can't quit drinking on my own. But I will never admit to being powerless when I'm not. I have the power to go to an AA meeting if I feel the need or am just bored. I have the power to jump on this forum when/if I need to. I have the power to call a friend for support. I'm actually a very spiritual person but don't feel the need to give up my ability to fight for my recovery. My spiritual side is another tool that I can call upon when I need to (and I have quite a bit the last few days.)

I also won't admit to my life becoming unmanageable. In the past month (while drinking) I was able to go through a very difficult and lengthy interview process and get offered an incredible job! I immediately new that drinking had messed up passed opportunities and I refuse to let that happen again. I decided I would quit drinking on January 1st (my job doesn't start until January 14th), but decided to quit after I got the job offer. I then decided to reach out/go to AA only if I had a problem staying sober. That evening I went to my first AA meeting, not because I felt I needed to, but I felt it wouldn't hurt.

Do I need to work on myself? ABSOLUTELY. Do I need help to stay sober? ABSOLUTELY. And I powerless and unable to manage my life, no.

So today I've decided to take full control of my sobriety. I have tools in place and will continue to add more. I will go to AA when I need to and even if I don't agree with what I'm hearing, that doesn't matter. I'll get out of it what I need. I'll come to this forum (which frankly I've found MUCH more useful) to both vent and listen. I won't let anyone tell me what I must do, because though we all suffer from the same disease, what led us to the disease is different, and our paths to sobriety are different. I want to get support and give support in return, nothing more/nothing less.

I'm on day 4, and honestly the numbers don't really matter to me anymore. I simply don't drink alcohol. Could be day 4 or 400. I'm simply done, and I'm grateful for that, I'm grateful for this forum, I'm grateful for AA, I'm grateful for everyone else doing the work they need to do for themselves, and I'm grateful that I have the power (I know some people don't) to drive my sobriety. In the end we can't quit unless we actually/really want to right? That's a decision, that's a life changer, that's power.

I'm going figure skating now. It's like AA only it doesn't upset me LOL.

Have a great day!!!!!

Donny

ArtFriend

I am not in AA, but I know it has helped millions of people. I would not dwell too much on the literal interpretation of the 12 steps. Words can be meaningful to someone while those same words meaningless to another. You have to find your own path, interpretation and direction for you! And it sounds like you are doing that right now. Enjoy skating! I miss it.

cocokramer

Donny,

You should ask whatever questions you're are compelled to ask at AA. Every member there should be understanding and supportive and if they aren't then they are not practicing the steps very well themselves.

Have you read any of the literature?

Some of the stories may help you to understand what is meant by powerless over alcohol. I have been in and out of the rooms for about a year now and went to rehab this summer.

While in rehab we started the steps and I must tell you at first they seemed foreign and a little ridiculous. The wording that is used in the big book seems somewhat old fashioned.

We now 4 months out of rehab I thought that I was on step like 11..... I just realized that I'm coming to terms with the fact that I'm still on step one.

Admitting that I am powerless over alcohol and my life has become unmanageable.

Things had to get really bad in my life for me to see this.

Anyhow - I'm sorry that you have been having bad experiences at AA. Maybe you need to find another group.

I have found that many of the people are really wise and inspirational.

AND THEY SHOULD NOT JUDGE YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Good luck.

Coco

anattaboy

I think of gliders and Fred Flintstones' car when I hear that word.

Anna

There are many ways to recover and the important thing is that you find a way that works for you.

I have used SR for many years as my lifeline, as well as some great books.

Eddiebuckle

Donny - I am in AA and actually, "Powerlessness" is an excellent topic. You need not say your view on the subject, simply say something down the lines of "Hi I am Donny, I am new to sobriety and wanted to hear your experience on what exactly powerlessness means as it is used in the first step." I guarantee there will not be a riot - this is a really important concept to understand and you will likely hear a variety of answers.

The above excerpt from your post is a fine definition of powerlessness in my book. Not everyone ends up in AA because they are homeless or have cirrhosis; therefore, the obvious signs of powerlessness will vary from person to person. The heart of the problem is that we cannot do it on our own, otherwise we would have and there would be no need for AA in the first place.

Another word that trips up a lot of people is "will" - as used in step 3. In one of his essays, Bill W defined will as the ability to choose. Step 3 is about choosing differently than we have in the past. Most importantly is choosing to do the things that keep us sober. We always had the choice to not enter a bar or liquor store, but sometimes we didn't. We are turning over a new leaf.

Yes - some folks have very draconian views of powerlessness and what turning it over mean. Those views worked for them. What is problematic are those who are shortsighted enough to believe that their view and way are the ONLY view and way. You will meet these people in the rooms. You do not have to subscribe to their views, simply find others whose perspective more closely align with your own.

Good luck, and thanks for a great post.

Donnylutz

Thank you! I'm starting to wonder if the 2 AA meetings I went to (different groups in different cities) were just not a good fit for me. I didn't feel like I could say anything and it feels counter-productive to go to an AA meeting to leave crabby - I'm feeling that enough lately lol.

However, if I spoke up, someone may have said the words you just did, and I would've had a good AA experience. I guess as a newcomer it's hard to speak up in front of people that have been working the problem so long. I want their wisdom desperately, but as you said, powerlessness means different things to different people. I need to speak up a bit more and also not take everything so literally. You live, you learn, and

Thanks!

Donny

doggonecarl

Don't confuse being powerless over alcohol with being powerless over our recovery. We have the power to recover. But when we drink, power shifts back to alcohol.

Donnylutz

Good point. And beautiful dog!!!!!!!!!!!

Notmyrealname

I think the point of "powerless" is it's not you controlling your drinking -- it's the other way around.

SoberLife90

Being powerless over alcohol just means that once I drink alcohol I can't stop at 1 drink. Of course you can go to AA and call your friends...that's not alcohol. When it comes to alcohol I can not control how much I drink. The unmanagibility of our drinking is what causes us to drink alcohol in the first place. Myself I was selfish and just wanted to make myself feel good and didn't care about hurting others. I have a few DUIs but that is not the unmanagiblity. Goodluck keep it up.

Fly N Buy

Powerless over alcohol....-
For me, the jury had voted. Guilty! I'll be right home, only having one or two, got drunk when I only intended to relax/unwind. The essence of powerless for me when I drank was simply like the Let's make a (drunk) Deal TV show.

What's behind door 1, 2 or 3?? Will I yell and scream at others telling them what to do, or will I glowingly want to hug everyone? Perhaps I will simply drink until I pass out and then say - Sorry I went to bed so early I was really, really tired.

Unmanageable for me wasn't the lack of paying bills, unemployed etc. It was the relationships in my life becoming destroyed - EVERY THING/person I engaged with drunk or hung-over had become an obscene, macabre play....... I had the midas touch in reverse.

It is a great topic to bring up at an AA meeting. I believe you may gain additional insight.



Keep coming back!
It hurts, then it works.......

keithj

Carl made a good distinction; powerless over alcohol, not powerless over actions you can take.

In AA terms, powerless is very specific. The physical part (when I drink, I have little control over the amount I drink) and the mental part (when not drinking, I don't have an effective defense against picking up that first drink).

It took me forever to accept that second part. But the evidence was clear. In spite of my swearing I would never drink again, I kept picking up the first one after a day, a week, a few months, whatever. In spite of the consequences and the problems I knew it would cause, I kept picking up the first drink. I spent years coming to terms with my lack of power in picking up a drink. But there was years of evidence pointing to the fact that I was going to pick it up eventually.

I was encouraged to look at the evidence concerning whether or not I had sufficient power to avoid the first drink. Some do. In my case, I absolutely did not. It was that Step 1 acceptance that led to Step 2, and so forth.

keithj

Another way of thinking about the 'unmanageability' part is whether or not I could 'manage' my decision to not drink. When I decided to not drink, I couldn't make it stick.

GracieLou

I had doubts that I was “powerless over alcohol”. It beat me every time. Early on when I was able to control my drinking, I was still obsessed about it. Sitting at a party sipping a drink and knowing that is the only one I can have or maybe one more without looking like a drunk, was torture. I wanted to be home with my ½ gallon drinking in a comfortable manner!

And it eventually got there, there were no more bars or parties, it was just straight up drunk.

I put alcohol in me and it takes me, I cannot control it. The allergy followed by the mental obsession wins every time. I am powerless over alcohol. The first drink gets me drunk!

My problem was with the second half of step one “your life has become unmanageable”.

I felt I was managing fine. I had a job, a car, a home. I had food and the bills were paid.

What I did not see until after I stopped was that obsession. How every thing and every one in my life revolved around the bottle. I did not go somewhere if I thought it would take to long because I had to drink. I didn’t work OT at work because I had to get home to drink. I didn’t pay the entire electric bill because I needed money to drink. I did not mail letters for days because the post office was another two minutes up the road but I needed to get home, my anxiety was screaming, I needed a drink. I sat on the couch for two days straight on the weekends doing almost nothing but drinking. If anyone called in the evening for anything I could not talk to them because I was drunk. It went on and on and on.

All the lying, the hiding and the pretending was all to maintain the illusion I was normal and everything was fine. I maintained the unmanageability for most of my life and I could not do it any more. I could no longer function that way and I did not see any of that, until I stopped drinking.

Now I look back and I can understand why I was so tired all the time. All that spinning in my head to keep all of that in check just to drink, I have no idea how I was able to do it for so long. Cunning, baffling and powerful.

Donnylutz

Thanks for the input everyone. I feel like this is what I would've gotten had I opened up my mouth at AA. I still don't feel my drinking is unmanageable, though I could definitely be wrong. This is certainly not the first time I've tried to quit, but this IS the first time I really want to quit. If I relapse then yes, I'll admit the my drinking is unmanageable as it will then be obvious. However, if I'm able to never drink again, then it is manageable. Only time will tell. I've accepted I'm an alcoholic, I've accepted that I can't stay sober alone, I guess what I'm able or not able to do now will dictate what else I learn. I think that's the beauty in this. It's only been 4 days but actually, truly wanting to stop, is making me very reflective and I find myself really thinking about things and it's scary and fabulous and emotional - and since I'm sober I can actually feel all of this, it's amazing (even the crappy parts lol), and I'm grateful to feel them all!!

I'm actually going to skate now lol, have a great day!

Donny

Nowsthetime

Hi:

Have you researched AVRT? It might give you more tools for your arsenal.

It really has helped me.

keithj

Absolutely. The question or problem of controlling the amount you drink becomes moot if you can avoid picking up the first drink. It's a great way to see if you can manage your decision. AA's Big Book mentions this same thing, 'If, when you honestly want to, you find you can not quit entirely,..." Best of luck to you!

Tonks

I don't know Donny. The thought of even attempting to manage alcohol again absolutely terrifies me... I'm more comfortable just not touching it ever again and I freely admit that. Why even put myself in that position?

I'm not sure that's in the best interest of anyone.

Ruby2

Amen to everything GracieLou said.