unhappy
Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Dallas, Texas
Posts: 2,459
Have you ever heard of the terms "private logic" and "personal exceptionalism"?
Private logic refers to the internal conversations we have with ourselves and outline a preferred way of living. That includes many things including denial, rationalizations, justifications, bargaining, etc. You have by way of private logic created a framework for yourself that is less anxiety ridden than if you quit today. So, in the face of external, verifiable, valid evidence that alcohol is killing you physically and killing your spirit, you decide to continue drinking until Monday.
Personal exceptionalism is the defense mechanism that allows you to say to yourself, "that will never happen to me. I am different." People here who have been through this are telling you to quit drinking NOW, not Monday. But you are ignoring that because "you are different".
Both personal exceptionalism and private logic will damn you in the end. Just something to consider.
Private logic refers to the internal conversations we have with ourselves and outline a preferred way of living. That includes many things including denial, rationalizations, justifications, bargaining, etc. You have by way of private logic created a framework for yourself that is less anxiety ridden than if you quit today. So, in the face of external, verifiable, valid evidence that alcohol is killing you physically and killing your spirit, you decide to continue drinking until Monday.
Personal exceptionalism is the defense mechanism that allows you to say to yourself, "that will never happen to me. I am different." People here who have been through this are telling you to quit drinking NOW, not Monday. But you are ignoring that because "you are different".
Both personal exceptionalism and private logic will damn you in the end. Just something to consider.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 611
The morning after the night before
Obviously wasn't listening to good advice last night, I had been drinking heavily by the last posts so that's the reason no one could talk any sense into me.
I got up this morning and poured my beer away, i was shocked to find that even though I felt like **** and it was 6.30am the smell of the beer made we want to drink one, the thought to just chug one final beer came through my head.....what a mess.
I'm kind of in a pickle about what to do next though....I know everyone will say go to a meeting but I did that last time and did not enjoy it and if anything the thought of going and sitting through that a couple of times per week weakens my resolve rather than galvanises it.
I'm thinking about going to the doctors to see if I'm depressed but I'm worried he'll want to stick me on happy pills.....unfortunately I have a very addictive personality so feel this would be a dangerous road for me tread. I went through a faze of popping diazipam a few years ago and it's very easy to start to like the way they feel.
I got up this morning and poured my beer away, i was shocked to find that even though I felt like **** and it was 6.30am the smell of the beer made we want to drink one, the thought to just chug one final beer came through my head.....what a mess.
I'm kind of in a pickle about what to do next though....I know everyone will say go to a meeting but I did that last time and did not enjoy it and if anything the thought of going and sitting through that a couple of times per week weakens my resolve rather than galvanises it.
I'm thinking about going to the doctors to see if I'm depressed but I'm worried he'll want to stick me on happy pills.....unfortunately I have a very addictive personality so feel this would be a dangerous road for me tread. I went through a faze of popping diazipam a few years ago and it's very easy to start to like the way they feel.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: UK
Posts: 174
MM, you sound just like i did. I have done something about it and today is my fourth day sober. I didn't think I would be able to stop this time around, I just couldn't end the bender I was on but I have and I'll tell you it wasn't easy.
I had to reach a point again that I really needed a sober life. First day was tough but it had to be done,plenty of reading on here eating sweets and junkfood and praying.That continued into day 3 and here I am now at the start of day 4 and feeling lethargic but very positive.
Do whatever it takes mate to get through those first few days. Goodluck!
I had to reach a point again that I really needed a sober life. First day was tough but it had to be done,plenty of reading on here eating sweets and junkfood and praying.That continued into day 3 and here I am now at the start of day 4 and feeling lethargic but very positive.
Do whatever it takes mate to get through those first few days. Goodluck!
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,443
I'm kind of in a pickle about what to do next though
If you can do that by yourself, or with our help, great...
if you need face to face support then you're going to have to give AA or some other recovery group a second look, MM
As for happy pills....we have a real double standard as alcoholics - we'll happily get wasted with alcohol, one of the most pernicious drugs there is...
but give us a prescribed medication and we run for miles.
I don't know if you're depressed.
I don't know what, if anything, your Dr will prescribe or suggest...
but it's got to be better than the disastrous self medication you've been doing, MM?
D
Try and keep an open mind. And listen to Dee... please don't drink.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 611
I wont drink....... poured the rest of my beer away. 1 day at a time this time.
Also not sure about doctors because if I admit alcoholism it will invalidate my life insurance which ive paid into for the last 8 years. From what I read alcohol issues go on your permanent record.
Also not sure about doctors because if I admit alcoholism it will invalidate my life insurance which ive paid into for the last 8 years. From what I read alcohol issues go on your permanent record.
Guest
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: The Deep South
Posts: 14,636
About the insurance, not really sure how that works. But I've heard similar. I started a thread on here about seeing a doctor and there was a lot of great info mentioned. Do a search on here. And I'm sure others have discussed the same.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
Originally Posted by MarathonMan 
I had over two years sober at one point, I remember quitting as easy that time, the odd craving but resolve of steel.
Yeah, that's how I felt when I went back out after a period of sobriety and got myself firmly stuck into the routine and the mad cycle of drinking again....
It was so hard to dig back out. Somehow, it seemed like that period of sobriety had given my alcoholic self a tremendous energy and motivation to really go like hell to ensure I'd never play that ridiculous SOBRIETY game again.
It had to get pretty bad for me before it was bad enough for me to finally get back to AA and back to sobriety. It was tough going the first few months.... but I am so glad I got back on the sober path.
You're stuck in that dark cycle again.... I understand. I hope that you can summon the motivation to take ACTIONS to get yourself out. When you begin action in the direction of sobriety, then motivation will awaken and you will strengthen that part of you who knows it is the better option... you will add fuel and momentum and action will beget action. I hope you can find your way to that action sooner than later and stop this madness before it really gets bad.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
IF you want advice... here is mine.
JUST GO TO THE MEETINGS next week. Get to the meetings, get the Big Book. Read it.
Get started actually working the steps.
Inspiration? Stop looking at meetings and expecting them to GIVE you something. YOU need to give, not the meetings. The meetings are there to support your process.
YOU need to take the actions.
Google "Step One worksheets". There are tons out there. Get a notebook, start the work.
GO RUNNING.
Pull yourself up and GET TO WORK.
JUST GO TO THE MEETINGS next week. Get to the meetings, get the Big Book. Read it.
Get started actually working the steps.
Inspiration? Stop looking at meetings and expecting them to GIVE you something. YOU need to give, not the meetings. The meetings are there to support your process.
YOU need to take the actions.
Google "Step One worksheets". There are tons out there. Get a notebook, start the work.
GO RUNNING.
Pull yourself up and GET TO WORK.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: milwaukee wi
Posts: 3,574
ArtFriend I really love this today.. for some reason.. thanks kiddo..ardy
Originally Posted by ArtFriend
I remember reading somewhere that the plight of the addict is that is one of the many curious paradoxes of addiction and recovery that genuine and sincere motivation for recovery is a result of and not a prerequisite for recovery.
In other words, begin recovery first and ask questions afterwards. You cannot wait until you "feel" like quitting or "understand intellectually" you need to quit. Because that is not enough to sustain you beyond a certain point in the recovery. You must almost blindly do the work first and stay at it and then the true feelings of recovery will result.
It seems like the horse before the cart, but that is the way it is with addicts.
In other words, begin recovery first and ask questions afterwards. You cannot wait until you "feel" like quitting or "understand intellectually" you need to quit. Because that is not enough to sustain you beyond a certain point in the recovery. You must almost blindly do the work first and stay at it and then the true feelings of recovery will result.
It seems like the horse before the cart, but that is the way it is with addicts.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 10,912
I am sorry that you are struggling, MM. Good to hear you are not drinking today. So these negative, depressive moods... When you stopped drinking previously, did your mood improve? If so, maybe wait a little.
As for the doctors and diagnoses, I know a few mental health professionals who treat addictions and related problems, and are usually willing to discuss and negotiate with the patient these kinds of practical issues. They don't necessarily put down a substance abuse-related diagnosis on the official paperwork. This is something you might want to discuss in your initial consultation.
As for "what's wrong with you" - I really think it's best to give yourself a bit of sober time before trying to determine anything. Alcohol abuse both masks and mimics many mental health issues, so it's hard to treat them effectively while still drinking or in the very early days.
Try to do something new or a new version of an older successful method this time around!
As for the doctors and diagnoses, I know a few mental health professionals who treat addictions and related problems, and are usually willing to discuss and negotiate with the patient these kinds of practical issues. They don't necessarily put down a substance abuse-related diagnosis on the official paperwork. This is something you might want to discuss in your initial consultation.
As for "what's wrong with you" - I really think it's best to give yourself a bit of sober time before trying to determine anything. Alcohol abuse both masks and mimics many mental health issues, so it's hard to treat them effectively while still drinking or in the very early days.
Try to do something new or a new version of an older successful method this time around!
Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Eastern Us
Posts: 1,366
Great about pouring out the remaining beer. The only decision you need to make at this present moment is not to drink. Keep it simple. I wouldn't rush seeing a dr at the moment (unless you are having serious withdrawal symptoms ). It may take a while for you to know how you truly feel as your body and mind detoxify.
If you don't find meetings useful, don't go! Post here. Respond to a newcomer and let him/her know that someone cares enough to pay attention to their plight. Post often... Even if it is just to complain. We get it.
The first week sucks. It just does. But it gets better. I really hold dear the fact that I can get into my car and drive anywhere at anytime and not worry about drunk driving. Another freedom.
If you don't find meetings useful, don't go! Post here. Respond to a newcomer and let him/her know that someone cares enough to pay attention to their plight. Post often... Even if it is just to complain. We get it.
The first week sucks. It just does. But it gets better. I really hold dear the fact that I can get into my car and drive anywhere at anytime and not worry about drunk driving. Another freedom.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 611
Hey everyone, thanks for all the support it means a lot. I dont know if this is the bottom but ive had enough and dont want to go any lower.
Just back from our midwife appointment and me and my wife devised a plan for today which consists of a pizza menu, a selection box ( it was only £2.50), a back rub (for her, not me) and the new transformers films.
As for doctors, meetings and insurance i'll worry about them another time, going to try and simply be for the weekend and focus purely on today.
Just back from our midwife appointment and me and my wife devised a plan for today which consists of a pizza menu, a selection box ( it was only £2.50), a back rub (for her, not me) and the new transformers films.
As for doctors, meetings and insurance i'll worry about them another time, going to try and simply be for the weekend and focus purely on today.
Gl@ss Artist & Cat Lady
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Posts: 880
Originally Posted by ArtFriend
I remember reading somewhere that the plight of the addict is that is one of the many curious paradoxes of addiction and recovery that genuine and sincere motivation for recovery is a result of and not a prerequisite for recovery.
In other words, begin recovery first and ask questions afterwards. You cannot wait until you "feel" like quitting or "understand intellectually" you need to quit. Because that is not enough to sustain you beyond a certain point in the recovery. You must almost blindly do the work first and stay at it and then the true feelings of recovery will result.
It seems like the horse before the cart, but that is the way it is with addicts.
In other words, begin recovery first and ask questions afterwards. You cannot wait until you "feel" like quitting or "understand intellectually" you need to quit. Because that is not enough to sustain you beyond a certain point in the recovery. You must almost blindly do the work first and stay at it and then the true feelings of recovery will result.
It seems like the horse before the cart, but that is the way it is with addicts.
Guest
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 1,305
Hi marathonman, I was happy to see you in the November thread. Rest assured that we all have our ups and downs!
A word about life insurance: The last time I made a serious attempt at sobriety was about 6 years ago. I voluntarily entered an outpatient program, which was group meetings twice a week. When I tried to buy additional life insurance shortly after, I was DENIED because I'd sought treatment for alcohol. I believe they said it would stay on my "record" (whatever record that is) for 3 years.
A word about life insurance: The last time I made a serious attempt at sobriety was about 6 years ago. I voluntarily entered an outpatient program, which was group meetings twice a week. When I tried to buy additional life insurance shortly after, I was DENIED because I'd sought treatment for alcohol. I believe they said it would stay on my "record" (whatever record that is) for 3 years.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: New Orleans, LA
Posts: 985
MM - Yaaay for you!!
Pizza, a loving woman, and some action movies - perfect recovery plan!
Yes, we all perceive that recovery is about "difficult inner work" blah, blah, blah... While I value all the "difficult inner work" I've done over the years - through AA or therapy - the most essential part of my sobriety is just the DAILY EXPERIENCE of sober living.
Right now, my sobriety is largely supported by my new puppy! Because I am happy sober while playing with my puppy. Because a big part of this is just to get out of the pattern of drinking each day after work to relax and finding other things that soothe us or make us laugh out loud.
Maybe, since you did an AA based recovery last time, try doing a family activity/happiness plan/SR type recovery this time. Some people do fitness/health based recovery. AA fills up all that space and intention for many, for many it is not an environment which makes them happy. What if you just nurture yourself and your wife, focused on food and entertainment and closeness?
I don't think that would be enough if you were brand new to recovery, but right now you're trying to reconnect with your recovery after a relapse, and that is a different and distinct experience. You already have the knowledge and self-awareness, you need to put sobriety back into action. Feel the relief and safety of it. Feel the softness and gentleness of life without alcohol for yourself.
PS. I remember the thread about the life insurance and alcoholic diagnosis. It was by JDooner, and was one of his last before he quit posting on SR.
For myself, I've chosen to be honest with my doctor about my history, have no choice really as I'm dealing with alcohol related health issues.
Consider some alternative therapies, outside the health system - like acupuncture, etc. I find that alternative practitioners really listen to you, work towards healing the whole system, and function as connective medical providers without entering any info into your "permanent record." Don't use health insurance for them though, or they'll have to enter a diagnosis code...
pps. I don't know what a selection box is. That must be something UK-ish... Curious.
Pizza, a loving woman, and some action movies - perfect recovery plan!
Yes, we all perceive that recovery is about "difficult inner work" blah, blah, blah... While I value all the "difficult inner work" I've done over the years - through AA or therapy - the most essential part of my sobriety is just the DAILY EXPERIENCE of sober living.
Right now, my sobriety is largely supported by my new puppy! Because I am happy sober while playing with my puppy. Because a big part of this is just to get out of the pattern of drinking each day after work to relax and finding other things that soothe us or make us laugh out loud.
Maybe, since you did an AA based recovery last time, try doing a family activity/happiness plan/SR type recovery this time. Some people do fitness/health based recovery. AA fills up all that space and intention for many, for many it is not an environment which makes them happy. What if you just nurture yourself and your wife, focused on food and entertainment and closeness?
I don't think that would be enough if you were brand new to recovery, but right now you're trying to reconnect with your recovery after a relapse, and that is a different and distinct experience. You already have the knowledge and self-awareness, you need to put sobriety back into action. Feel the relief and safety of it. Feel the softness and gentleness of life without alcohol for yourself.
PS. I remember the thread about the life insurance and alcoholic diagnosis. It was by JDooner, and was one of his last before he quit posting on SR.
For myself, I've chosen to be honest with my doctor about my history, have no choice really as I'm dealing with alcohol related health issues.
Consider some alternative therapies, outside the health system - like acupuncture, etc. I find that alternative practitioners really listen to you, work towards healing the whole system, and function as connective medical providers without entering any info into your "permanent record." Don't use health insurance for them though, or they'll have to enter a diagnosis code...
pps. I don't know what a selection box is. That must be something UK-ish... Curious.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 611
Heartcore- a selection box is a box with all different chocolate bars in that we give at xmas to kids.....im obviously feeling festive in mid november...either that or I like chocolate. I like the sounds of your plan, one of the main things ive got to work on is being happy with recovery so maybe linking sobriety to enjoyable family time might work for me.
SB - yes a fan of the series, kept meaning to go and see it in 3D at the cinema but for one reason or another never got around to it.
SB - yes a fan of the series, kept meaning to go and see it in 3D at the cinema but for one reason or another never got around to it.
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