The Big Caffeine Thread
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
I can attest first hand to some issues that I think are directly-related to that article;
the 'half life' thing. I usually start to get a headache about 24 hours after my last cup of coffee. This is consistent with the idea that it takes that long for my level of caffeine to drop low enough that I start having a withdrawal reaction.
the 'fight or flight' thing - I can say that in the past few years I have definitely noticed increased reaction to caffeiene. Elevated heart rate, sweats, anxiety.... all within minutes to an hour of having coffee. It's less marked on a weekend or when I am just relaxed - but on a weekday with added stress of basic everyday life responsibilities, very pronounced bodily reactions happen.
The constant elevated levels of adrenaline / cortisol seem to have begun having an effect on my adrenals and my hormones. I am experiencing a sense that my testosterone is down markedly. While this is normal for men in their 40s, at the same time I have begun to pay more attention and it does seem that when I am able to at least minimize caffeine, my energy and strength and other indicators of hormone levels are less impacted.
I think that basically I have been living life with a consistently-high level of caffeine constantly in my body. Between coffee and energy drinks and excedrin and chocolate and other sources, I would estimate that even when I wake up in the morning I probably have at least a hundred milligrams of the drug still coursing through me. I suspect it has had an aggregate effect and I've gotten to a point that it has permanently impacted my hormonal and adrenal systems.
I suspect that like alcohol - there are "normal" caffeine users and caffeine addicts. I think I am in the latter category. All of my behaviors toward caffeine are eerily simliar to my behaviors with alcohol. My body is way more physically addicted than I ever was to alcohol. I suspect that what I really need is a 30day detox from the stuff and perhaps to abstain entirely. I know it, but I have yet to pull it off.
I hope that I can, and soon... because it's definitely got me in a cycle that is less than optimal for my overall health and I think it's probably a step that will also ultimately help reinforce my sobriety. Being dependent on any substance cannot be a positive pillar in a strong sobriety foundation....
the 'half life' thing. I usually start to get a headache about 24 hours after my last cup of coffee. This is consistent with the idea that it takes that long for my level of caffeine to drop low enough that I start having a withdrawal reaction.
the 'fight or flight' thing - I can say that in the past few years I have definitely noticed increased reaction to caffeiene. Elevated heart rate, sweats, anxiety.... all within minutes to an hour of having coffee. It's less marked on a weekend or when I am just relaxed - but on a weekday with added stress of basic everyday life responsibilities, very pronounced bodily reactions happen.
The constant elevated levels of adrenaline / cortisol seem to have begun having an effect on my adrenals and my hormones. I am experiencing a sense that my testosterone is down markedly. While this is normal for men in their 40s, at the same time I have begun to pay more attention and it does seem that when I am able to at least minimize caffeine, my energy and strength and other indicators of hormone levels are less impacted.
I think that basically I have been living life with a consistently-high level of caffeine constantly in my body. Between coffee and energy drinks and excedrin and chocolate and other sources, I would estimate that even when I wake up in the morning I probably have at least a hundred milligrams of the drug still coursing through me. I suspect it has had an aggregate effect and I've gotten to a point that it has permanently impacted my hormonal and adrenal systems.
I suspect that like alcohol - there are "normal" caffeine users and caffeine addicts. I think I am in the latter category. All of my behaviors toward caffeine are eerily simliar to my behaviors with alcohol. My body is way more physically addicted than I ever was to alcohol. I suspect that what I really need is a 30day detox from the stuff and perhaps to abstain entirely. I know it, but I have yet to pull it off.
I hope that I can, and soon... because it's definitely got me in a cycle that is less than optimal for my overall health and I think it's probably a step that will also ultimately help reinforce my sobriety. Being dependent on any substance cannot be a positive pillar in a strong sobriety foundation....
Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Ojai, CA
Posts: 137
I gave up booze, drugs, cigs, sugar...I will NEVER give up coffee. It's the best, especially sober. One of my favorite things I have done sober was going on a coffee plantation tour in El Salvador, best coffee ever! I hear Turkey's coffee blows one socks off it so strong so would like to try that....After what I put my body through, coffee is the least of my concerns.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 638
Originally Posted by FreeOwl 
the 'half life' thing. I usually start to get a headache about 24 hours after my last cup of coffee. This is consistent with the idea that it takes that long for my level of caffeine to drop low enough that I start having a withdrawal reaction.
the 'fight or flight' thing - I can say that in the past few years I have definitely noticed increased reaction to caffeiene. Elevated heart rate, sweats, anxiety.... all within minutes to an hour of having coffee. It's less marked on a weekend or when I am just relaxed - but on a weekday with added stress of basic everyday life responsibilities, very pronounced bodily reactions happen.
The constant elevated levels of adrenaline / cortisol seem to have begun having an effect on my adrenals and my hormones. I am experiencing a sense that my testosterone is down markedly. While this is normal for men in their 40s, at the same time I have begun to pay more attention and it does seem that when I am able to at least minimize caffeine, my energy and strength and other indicators of hormone levels are less impacted.
the 'fight or flight' thing - I can say that in the past few years I have definitely noticed increased reaction to caffeiene. Elevated heart rate, sweats, anxiety.... all within minutes to an hour of having coffee. It's less marked on a weekend or when I am just relaxed - but on a weekday with added stress of basic everyday life responsibilities, very pronounced bodily reactions happen.
The constant elevated levels of adrenaline / cortisol seem to have begun having an effect on my adrenals and my hormones. I am experiencing a sense that my testosterone is down markedly. While this is normal for men in their 40s, at the same time I have begun to pay more attention and it does seem that when I am able to at least minimize caffeine, my energy and strength and other indicators of hormone levels are less impacted.
Still again about the health effects of caffeine. The psychological effects of caffeine can be pretty far-reaching. Withdrawal and the caffeine crash most get in the afternoon can induce depression and anxiety. And that depression can get REALLY powerful.
I recall as I was a student years back when I had no problem with alcohol. I drank lots of coffee at the time and then most afternoons I started getting anxious, tired and really depressed. I didn't know what was wrong with me. I just wanted to eat cookies. So most afternoons I just ate cookies and did nothing for school etc. And that's a pretty devastating effect the caffeine was having on me, the worst part being that I was not aware of what was wrong at the time. But chemistry is such. Actually I realized this only recently and it made me look at the whole caffeine-thing from a wider perspective. The effect it was having on me was debilitating, but I thought that I had some emotional problem or trauma or was somehow handicapped and it only know came up because I had left it unprocessed for years. Not true. It was the chemical effects of caffeine, actually the drop of caffeine content in the blood. It almost destroyed me mentally. I'm not even kidding.
Now for one thing, Coffee, or more precily caffeine has been found to help with asthma. Sure, theophyllin does make breathing a little easier for anyone for a short duration, but that is only a short-term solution and having that substance in your body is not actually healthy. Theophyllin of course is one of the main breakdown products of caffeine. There's about 25 of them or more to be exact. So... it's not a cure for asthma. Just mentioning. Thanks to everyone for the replies.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 349
I have been drinking no-sugar, iced tea since the age of 10 and I am 44 now. I drink about 2 pitchers of tea a day and sleep just fine.
I will never, ever give up my tea, unless I am forced (or have some health problem that makes me do it). You would have to pry my tea glass out of my cold, dead hands.
(On a side note, I hear tea helps prevent cancer).
I will never, ever give up my tea, unless I am forced (or have some health problem that makes me do it). You would have to pry my tea glass out of my cold, dead hands.
(On a side note, I hear tea helps prevent cancer).
Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
yep... that's one of the problems I have with stopping....
When I try to cut caffeine I find that my mood is impaired greatly. I get irritable and depressed and have glum thoughts.
What a trap!!! To use it is causing anxiety and panic and hormone imbalances and physical effects that are also leading to emotional and psychological issues for me - but to cut it out leads to depression and sadness and irritability and exhaustion.
CRAP!!! Can't live with it.... can't live without it....
uh.... sounds familiar doesnt it?
When I try to cut caffeine I find that my mood is impaired greatly. I get irritable and depressed and have glum thoughts.
What a trap!!! To use it is causing anxiety and panic and hormone imbalances and physical effects that are also leading to emotional and psychological issues for me - but to cut it out leads to depression and sadness and irritability and exhaustion.
CRAP!!! Can't live with it.... can't live without it....
uh.... sounds familiar doesnt it?
Guest
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: The Deep South
Posts: 14,636
I love my coffee too and have been drinking it consistently for about 8 to 10 years or so. Since getting sober I've noticed I can't drink as much without being adversely affected. And I mean, more than 2-3 cups! It has seriously cramped my coffee style lately. So I toyed with the idea of getting interested in tea... lol. Yeah, I have had to kind of push myself into learning about the different kinds of tea, best way to brew, etc. So I bought about six different higher quality teas to start with and I've been liking it I definitely don't knock coffee because I absolutely adore my French press coffee every morning, and it's strong. But I simply can't comfortably handle more than 1 or 2 cups per day.
I definitely don't knock coffee because I absolutely adore my French press coffee every morning, and it's strong. But I simply can't comfortably handle more than 1 or 2 cups per day.
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 444
Give up water, air, sex, sleeping, and waking up now- You are sober now, and all of those things are also physically addictive...
I will resist the urge to say 'gimme a break' since this is the newcomers section, so I will just say this-
If YOU can't/don't want to drink caffeine, don't.
Folks that say that the day they quit drinking/heroin/whatever, AND quit smoking, coffee, soda and tea the same day don't inspire me- They terrify me, because I think that they are making a ridiculously hard thing infinitely harder on themselves, and setting themselves up to fail.
I will resist the urge to say 'gimme a break' since this is the newcomers section, so I will just say this-
If YOU can't/don't want to drink caffeine, don't.
Folks that say that the day they quit drinking/heroin/whatever, AND quit smoking, coffee, soda and tea the same day don't inspire me- They terrify me, because I think that they are making a ridiculously hard thing infinitely harder on themselves, and setting themselves up to fail.
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
lol...
yeah I get ya.
I'm just here relating my experiences and observations. I don't want to have to let go of coffee... I love coffee....
but I have a strong suspicion that some physical and psychological challenges and frustrations I'm experiencing are tied to it.
And there are eerie parallels for me between the patterns of caffeine and those of alcohol and other drugs.
I hope that I can detox from it and then find a way to include it in my life in moderation.
I'm not sure though.... I generally don't seem to be very good at moderation where addictive substances are concerned....
yeah I get ya.
I'm just here relating my experiences and observations. I don't want to have to let go of coffee... I love coffee....
but I have a strong suspicion that some physical and psychological challenges and frustrations I'm experiencing are tied to it.
And there are eerie parallels for me between the patterns of caffeine and those of alcohol and other drugs.
I hope that I can detox from it and then find a way to include it in my life in moderation.
I'm not sure though.... I generally don't seem to be very good at moderation where addictive substances are concerned....
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 638
Originally Posted by Hobbers
Folks that say that the day they quit drinking/heroin/whatever, AND quit smoking, coffee, soda and tea the same day don't inspire me- They terrify me, because I think that they are making a ridiculously hard thing infinitely harder on themselves, and setting themselves up to fail.
The point is namely to arrive at a rational conclusion where everything is thought through. If caffeine was causing problems, it needs to go. I believe I've identified it as a major hindrance to my wellbeing from afar years ago. And this is basically just general discussion about. And I mean chemistry, not just beliefs or whims.
Many people probably think that getting off caffeine will be a limitation or make life less worth living. That is not what one would usually desire. Not everyone wants to do one thing.
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,649
Medical studies have shown that too many cups of coffee in one day can increase your heart rate. But, you'd have to drink quit a few.
As I understand it, coffee is mildly addictive, but easily discontinued.
I have never run across any studies with clinical evidence that coffee is dangerous to my health.
I am a coffee lover and coffee played a special role in my recovery from alcohol. I looked forward to the coffee served at AA meetings. My first sober b-day present? I asked for a nespresso espresso machine.
Later I bought a coffee mill and enjoy grinding my own special blend of roasted beans.
I think a lot of other things are much more dangerous to my health: sugar. Now the WHO has recommended that we cut our sugar intake by half. Good advice! cholesterol. Fast carbs. transfats.
Those yucky fat-bleached fast food hamburgers. Bleeaaach.
The quality of the coffee I make is excellent: I think it's a neutral substance that is not particularly harmful. I like green tea, too.
As I understand it, coffee is mildly addictive, but easily discontinued.
I have never run across any studies with clinical evidence that coffee is dangerous to my health.
I am a coffee lover and coffee played a special role in my recovery from alcohol. I looked forward to the coffee served at AA meetings. My first sober b-day present? I asked for a nespresso espresso machine.
Later I bought a coffee mill and enjoy grinding my own special blend of roasted beans.
I think a lot of other things are much more dangerous to my health: sugar. Now the WHO has recommended that we cut our sugar intake by half. Good advice! cholesterol. Fast carbs. transfats.
Those yucky fat-bleached fast food hamburgers. Bleeaaach.
The quality of the coffee I make is excellent: I think it's a neutral substance that is not particularly harmful. I like green tea, too.
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
I don't need a medical study - I see it happen within a couple of hours every day. I had a RHR around 50 until a couple years ago.... now it's closer to 60 and when I've had a few cups of coffee it's around 75.
I can FEEL it too. When I'm running or working out I get short of breath and dizzy on days when I've had more than one cup.
I believe it is related to the chronic build-up of caffeine and the way that has effected my hormonal and adrenal balance.
What I need to do is break the cycle to test that belief. The ONE week I managed to make it 4 days without coffee and only minimal supplemental caffeine using Excedrin... I noticed my heart rate was back toward normal and I wasn't experiencing the shortness of breath. On the other hand, I was irritable, energy-less and exhausted. UGH.
I can FEEL it too. When I'm running or working out I get short of breath and dizzy on days when I've had more than one cup.
I believe it is related to the chronic build-up of caffeine and the way that has effected my hormonal and adrenal balance.
What I need to do is break the cycle to test that belief. The ONE week I managed to make it 4 days without coffee and only minimal supplemental caffeine using Excedrin... I noticed my heart rate was back toward normal and I wasn't experiencing the shortness of breath. On the other hand, I was irritable, energy-less and exhausted. UGH.
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: The Deep South
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Here's a good article about evidence based benefits of drinking coffee: Top 13 Evidence-Based Health Benefits of Coffee along with links (in blue) to the scientific peer reviewed studies.
Keep in mind though, there's a limit to the caffeine your body can handle without having negative or adverse side effects (such as adrenal fatigue).
Keep in mind though, there's a limit to the caffeine your body can handle without having negative or adverse side effects (such as adrenal fatigue).
voices ca**y
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: St. Paul Minnesota
Posts: 4,360
When I was drinking alcohol I would drink coffee all day long to keep me going. I quit the caffeine once before and started with one and it made it's way to all day long again. I am weaning down right now again. If I can keep it to one in the am that's fine. Decaf is pretty good for weaning down.
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Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: North Idaho
Posts: 508
Was my worst enemy first few days without alcohol. Triggered anxiety attacks and mood swings. But I keep it down after the withdrawls from alcohol are passed. I do guzzle a caffeinated drink before my workout though.
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Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Staffordshire, UK
Posts: 712
Originally Posted by Meraviglioso
I only drink coffee, no sodas or caffeinated teas. I have noticed that now that I am not drinking I am more sensitive to the caffeine as I have less to balance out I would guess.
I drink about 2 cups of percolated Italian style coffee in the morning (I think it would be like ordering a cafe latte at starbucks). Very occasionally I will have an espresso after lunch, I'd say once every couple of weeks. Very, very rarely I have one after dinner. Generally I cannot drink any caffeine after 16:00 or I can't sleep, this was also when I was drinking heavily.
When I was drinking I drank much more coffee, probably 2-3 cups in the morning and maybe 1 or 2 more throughout the day.
I haven't thought too much of the negative aspects of caffeine, I suppose I should. I am more worried about sugar, which I eat little of but don't deny myself.
Several years ago I cut out the sugar in my coffee. The first day it was horrible. The very next day, it was ok. By the third day it was great and I could never go back to drinking coffee with sugar in it. I couldn't believe how easy it was to cut out those daily spoonfuls.
I drink about 2 cups of percolated Italian style coffee in the morning (I think it would be like ordering a cafe latte at starbucks). Very occasionally I will have an espresso after lunch, I'd say once every couple of weeks. Very, very rarely I have one after dinner. Generally I cannot drink any caffeine after 16:00 or I can't sleep, this was also when I was drinking heavily.
When I was drinking I drank much more coffee, probably 2-3 cups in the morning and maybe 1 or 2 more throughout the day.
I haven't thought too much of the negative aspects of caffeine, I suppose I should. I am more worried about sugar, which I eat little of but don't deny myself.
Several years ago I cut out the sugar in my coffee. The first day it was horrible. The very next day, it was ok. By the third day it was great and I could never go back to drinking coffee with sugar in it. I couldn't believe how easy it was to cut out those daily spoonfuls.
Blood Countess
Join Date: May 2014
Location: A castle
Posts: 340
Coffee is my anti-alcohol. I take comfort in knowing I have a rich, soothing beverage that is not alcohol. Then again, I don't get panic attacks from coffee and I (and others in my family) actually drink it before bed sometimes. So I guess it affects people differently.
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
I do that too... did for years... I think that's part of the problem.
I believe now that it is cumulative. Over the years it added up and having high levels of caffeine constantly in my bloodstream burned out my hormonal/adrenal systems.
Those of us who can drink coffee before bed probably have a higher tolerance to caffeine because we've had so much for so long it no longer keeps us awake. Yet, my sleep patterns have suffered too....
I don't know. Maybe it's all unrelated. I guess the only way I will ever know is if I can manage to quit and see what happens to my body and all these associated issues when I am off caffeine for a time.
I believe now that it is cumulative. Over the years it added up and having high levels of caffeine constantly in my bloodstream burned out my hormonal/adrenal systems.
Those of us who can drink coffee before bed probably have a higher tolerance to caffeine because we've had so much for so long it no longer keeps us awake. Yet, my sleep patterns have suffered too....
I don't know. Maybe it's all unrelated. I guess the only way I will ever know is if I can manage to quit and see what happens to my body and all these associated issues when I am off caffeine for a time.
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Mid-Atlantic USA
Posts: 2,441
As I understand it, there is a difference between being "addicted" to a substance, and being "physically dependent" on a substance.
Is there a difference between physical dependence and addiction? | National Institute on Drug Abuse (NIDA)
Personally, I drink coffee and tea; I enjoy it and I have no plans to stop. IMO, caffeine is a relatively benign substance. I do know one thing: I'll never get a DUI for drinking caffeinated coffee
Is there a difference between physical dependence and addiction? | National Institute on Drug Abuse (NIDA)
Personally, I drink coffee and tea; I enjoy it and I have no plans to stop. IMO, caffeine is a relatively benign substance. I do know one thing: I'll never get a DUI for drinking caffeinated coffee
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