SoberComposer

Thanks Flynbuy, I appreciate your post. I will check out Even Hightower on YT tonight. I definitely do not want to fool myself and be stuck in that cycle and so many people here have found this very helpful. All this has been very helpful because that was a "hard sell" I experienced. It's apperently a thing. That is helpful to know. I will continue to go and socialize more (about 50 ppl go to this one and its mainly speakers only. I did find out that on Mondays it is more personal, so I will try that one. I will also either dig my old bluebook out of storage and start reading. Also, I will be the one who chooses my sponsor so I will try to express that to anyone who wants to proactively be my sponsor.

Thanks Everyone!!

SoberComposer

Thanks Soberlicious! It feels comforting to know I am not alone in my situation. I have been going on and off oover the last ten years. This last year has been me knowing im a fool everytime I drank. I actually regulated it pretty well the last few months but did benge once a week. I quit because regulating was less fun then quiting seemed and that friday benge ruined my only real day off. I am ready. Not to mention health issues, lack of real relationships, hangovers, knowing i was living weak with little to no willpower.... on and on

Thanks again everyone =)

bemyself

Welcome to the SR zoo, SC - and the AA zoo again! I mean this ('zoo') in the very practical sense that I've had to accept that the world of recovery is no less diverse, people-wise, than when I'm walking down a busy street. There are all kinds out there, everywhere I go.

Until recently, I spent the last 2 and a half years flipping myself in and out of AA and assorted relapse periods. With hindsight, what's the difference for me now? It's really seeing my own persistent intolerance (and I have a mountain of it!) and the equally persistent dose of my arrogance-borne-of-lifelong-fears.

Now, when I feel a return of the more negative or irritable thoughts about me and AA, I simply default to a simple pragmatism to get me through that day so I can let it go: I say to myself, 'lighten up, kiddo: AA is readily available, it's free (apart from a bit of small change for the pass-the-basket), it gets me out of my own tiny world and my big head :-)' Plus, I've realised - duh! - that it's perfectly reasonable for me to smartly walk away with a little polite 'no, thanks' from any member who cares to come over all bullying on me. Done it heaps of times now, and I can tell you, it's very freeing.

I have a sponsor now, and have done the formal part of working the Steps, despite all my past and even ongoing skepticism (also healthy IMO, whilst also looking to maintain a balance with some open-minded willingness). Seems to be working OK so far - I'll be six months sober in about 10 days, for the first time since Jan 2012.

whalebelow2

The "hard sell" is an interesting interpretation, none the less, I can see how many people arrive at it. I know I did.

The way I look at it now is simply this.

Some people in AA have moved beyond people pleasing & not wanting to hurt peoples "feelings"

Does it mean they are pushy, aggressive, overbearing "hard sellers" ??

It certainly can be interpreted that way.

Another way to interpret it is "they are more concerned about your LIFE, than your feelings"

Think about it .... ten years in & out of AA, drinking on & off ..... and now you're moving towards a conclusion that looks like, the best course of action is taking another run at it "YOUR way"

Maybe the reason the two guys looked at you a bit strange when you tried to tell them in a round about way "thanks but no thanks, I got this"
is that they would have been looking at you & thinking "oh you have ? OK, how's that working out for you ?"

I'll assume you've heard the quote from Albert Einstein that goes

"Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."

or another one that goes around AA

"If nothing changes, nothing changes"

C'mon Sobercomposer .... have a really good think about what you've asked the SR forum, then have a look at the answers that you have gravitated towards.

Best of luck with whatever you decide.

the last little quote I'm going to throw in here

"Feel the fear .... and do it anyway"

Soberpotamus

Hi SoberComposer, I've been reading your thread today and can't help but note some similarities in your described experience and my own.

I just wanted to reach out to you and let you know that you are definitely not alone in your feelings and thoughts here. When I went to AA meetings I'd already made up my mind I was finished with alcohol. I'd finally had enough. Many things contributed to my decision, and I'll spare you the details of my backstory Suffice to say, any sort of "miracle" spoken about in AA had already happened by the time I walked into the front door That is not to sound cocky or arrogant, because I've got lots of emotional, psychological, and "spiritual" growth left to be done I'm sure! But I knew walking in I'd triumphed already. So it was somewhat disconcerting, my experience with others there, with them assuming I was on the brink of relapse and such. I had several people "preach" at me during their "shares" and that was unnerving, and quite insulting. One man actually turned around in his seat and looked at me and said out loud something to the effect of: "If you don't need AA, you are free to leave." This really hurt my feelings. I had not even opened my mouth in a meeting, so there was no way they could know my situation or background. I felt judged. And it felt like a very toxic environment. It actually triggered some sort of PTSD or trauma reaction in me related to childhood (as I had attended meetings with my mom as a child).

I am actually jealous of those who live in other parts of the country where they offer Agnostic, Atheist, and Freethinker meetings. I'd like to go to them. All the good things I hear about AA meetings I heard online. My experience was horrid.

Anyway... I wanted to let you know that I felt just as you're describing, when I went to AA. And I've been sober now for 1.5 years, and productive and happy too! Everything is improving for me, and I've read a lot of recovery books, including the AA conference approved literature. I have gone to IOP after care meetings, and have been on SR reading and posting for support for a few years. SR has probably helped me more than anything. IOP first, and then SR. The recovery readings keep me grounded. I got two dogs recently to take care of and train. And now I'm learning meditation. I did vitamin therapy for the first six months, and I also started running and weightlifting. So I did a huge turnaround really. AA was, like you mentioned, something I saw as a recommendation, an insurance policy or "last resort" sort of thing.

I'd love to find a face to face fellowship to make friends and actually look forward to attending, but the AA meetings I've seen are definitely not what I want.

Good luck to you! SR is a great support for many of us. Find what ultimately is going to work for you, even if that means taking bits and pieces from many areas

soberlicious

A person I've never met in a meeting asking me for my phone number is aggressive. A person offering me their number is fine, but asking for mine is weird. I don't care how you slice it.

whalebelow2

Sorry to hear you had a bad experience.

There are a lot of toxic meetings around Jennie. God knows I sat in enough of them first time around in AA.

I actually had a member pronounce me "non alcoholic" after I shared that I could stop but never stay stopped.

His story was more like "drank, drank, drank, never wanted to stop (this made him a real alcoholic in his opinion) until one day, cops are looking for him, wife had packed her bags, kids all hated him. So he went to AA, hasn't had a drink since & life got better & better.

He'll tell anyone how good his life is, solicited or unsolicited, just ask him about his big house, sports cars, hot new younger wife.


I've found something that is now working brilliantly for me. It is no longer "Anything Goes" AA.

I intend on following the clear cut directions in the first 164 pages of the Big Book & using THE program, as left to me by the founders of AA.

I no longer wish to have MY program. I have MY own life. Given to me as a result of THE program.

I know all the above can be interpreted as arrogance & me thinking I have all the answers.

Paradoxically, it is in finally admitting I didn't know jack s**t, that I found some answers.

I know a lot of people can succesfully run their own sobriety. I admire them, I just realised I wasn't one of those who could.

whalebelow2

It is all in the interpretation.

I used to interpret it that way too.

Glass half empty thinking ... tinged with paranoia.

What do these people want ? Why can't they mind their own business? I just want to not drink for Christ's sake !!!! Stay away from me, I'm afraid you'll hurt me. You can't help me, you don't understand me .... I'M DIFFERENT !!!

whalebelow2

deleted

least

I'm going on five years sober and don't go to meetings and have never worked the steps.

SoberComposer

I am really blown away by all this support!

We are all diverse, think differently and at varying degrees of addiction. It feels good to hear that being recognized. Thank you Bemyself!

I understand what you are saying Whalebelow2. However, I feel that you may possibly be making some assumptions about me. It's not that I want to do it "my way" as much as I need my space respected. I am very wary of "sells pitches" because they are more about the sellers agenda or ego, most usually. I, as I assume most people in my situation feel, need my space respected as well as my journey respected. I also learned awhile back to have the courage to face my fears to evolve. Having the strength to face your own truth can be very difficult but I had begun that journey awhile back. It was probably living with knowing this and still choosing to drink that made me sick of my "old ways". I didn't feel I was being respected as I should have been with people in my lives. The reason why is because I was just maintaining and delt with the same problems over and over again.. I was defeated and that is easily recognized by others. I didn't give many reasons for others too respect me. I very much respect your honesty Whalebelow2 and thank you for your advise. I am going to the Monday meeting (smaller and more personal) and going to use Bemyself's advice to gracefully say "no, thank you", if I am feeling pressured. I have surrendered myself to the fact that I can not drink again if I want to have any real happiness. I am going to AA to reinforce this. I will venture into sponsorship and the steps too but in a respectful way. I don't need people assuming that I am on the verge of relapse or a blatant fool for not following the crowd. I understand how this can seem like I am diluted by my own ego and controlling issues so I can see how what I am saying is so easily misunderstood.

SoberJennie: Your post was also very helpful for me. I am not religious but do go to a Unitarian church for the fellowship of love. It would be great to have an agnostic-oriented meeting . I am not close on giving up on AA yet as I am only on day 42 so if this group doesn't work then I may try, again, to find a new one.

The main thing is that I will do whatever it takes to remain sober. Hopefully I can find a great sponsor I am comfortable with! I didn't post this thread to talk bad about AA but just to discover how others felt about my situation.

You all are so great!

Dee74

Just a reminder folks - this is the Newcomers forum

Dee
Moderator
SR

freshstart57

This sounds fabulous, SoberComposer. This is exactly how I see my sobriety too. I quit drinking over three years ago now, and feel the same now as I did when I quit - this soul-filling sense of achievement, relief, freedom and peace.

Heard about 'these people'? My heavens - most who were formerly addicted to alcohol quit drinking without a formal recovery program. You may not hear from them because they decided once and for all that their drinking was over and done, never to happen again. Then, they got on with everything a life free from addiction has to offer. Like me, they found themselves sober without AA involvement.

I found generous and very kind people in AA, and I recommend it to you if you feel an interest in it and its fellowship and spiritual aspects. We each find our own way out of addiction, and I wish you the best in finding yours.

Soberpotamus

I apologize if my post came across as bad-mouthing AA. I don't intend to do that. I actually would like to attend meetings if I could stomach them.

SoberComposer

I greatly respect your help and perspective Whalebelow2.

We are all different and at different stages. It is the diversity among us that invokes scientific discoveries and adaptation. When someone walks up to me and creeps me out it makes me nervous. If it was a physician it may be different but I don't know these people. I don't know what they have done, capable of, or what is going on. I know on a whole most people there are great survivors that have volumes to teach me but there are also psychos out there and potentially dangerous people. If I gave my number away he could look up where I work, where I live and other things I don't want to disclose to an unknown. What if he thought I was on the verge of relapse while I switch groups or quit going to AA and then called my job to save me before I killed myself with booze. I know this sounds far-fetched but there are some crazy people out there that make crazy decisions. That is why I want to know well who I am sharing my personal information with.

Much Respect!

SoberComposer

Thanks Freshstart!! That is assuring to know others have done it without dependence on the program.

I have not made any decisions and will try the Monday meeting but I do enjoy freedom and don't want to be defined by the past. I'd rather focus on the future and plan goals! I see things in my life that I could seriously excel at but know that I am discarding all of that if I drink, not to mention the hordes of other bad things it brings.

Thank you Everyone!!

Anna

Please focus on responding to the OP who asked a question, and keep personal comments to other people to PM.

SoberComposer, as you are seeing, we are a diverse group. I have often said that motivation to recover is more important than which program you choose. I have not used AA, but have done what worked for me. I have used books and SR for many years and my recovery journey continues to be wonderful.

SoberComposer

Thank you Anna! Honestly, this diversity to sobriety is one of the things that made SR my home. I certainly appreciate AA for what it does but there are also some things I disagree with. That is why I felt so relieved to find this place

After my last meeting, which invoked this post, I was suddenly scared that I may be following a delusion despite how I felt inside about my sobriety. It just feels good that, like most thinks in life, there are different paths to the same goal.

As I said though.. I may need to go full-on AA.. since I am only day 42 I am aware that I am only in the beginning. I may discover than I must have a sponsor and do the steps, I may discover that I may not.. either way my focus on sobriety and a real life will remain unchanged.

Thanks to EVERYONE for all their wonderful help!

whalebelow2

Last post here Sobercomposer & after this, I'm bowing out.

Hypothetically .... Lets say you desperately desperately wanted to get from where you live to where there was an event that you felt certain was going to change your life for the better.

But you have no means of transport to get there. No public transport is available either.

So you plead your case to someone & explain how much this means to you, they kindly offer to lend you their car.

The car is perfectly in order, safe, registered, warranted etc

Would you then say "I so appreciate the offer of your car, but you see, your car is red & I don't like red cars. It is also a 4 cylinder car & really, I prefer V8 cars. I'm not sure those seats look comfortable either, the gear stick is in a funny position, the wheels on it aren't mag wheels, I love cars with mag wheels & lastly .... it runs on petrol & I abhor petrol powered cars ...... thanks but no thanks, by the way, I'm really desperate to get to this event, so if you have any friends with non red, V8 diesel powered cars, with luxury leather seats & the gear stick sits nice & close to the coffee cup holders .... please let them know I'm desperate"

jaynie04

SoberComposer..I have not struggled much either. I am in my second year of sobriety and found the invariable assumption that I was on the verge of relapsing very frustrating as well. I had an addiction specialist who consistently attempted to poke holes in my sobriety because I was not doing it her way. There wasn't enough room in her office for me, her and her ego…so I left them alone.

What you are expressing is having boundaries. In my opinion that is exceedingly important to any healthy psyche. You are listening to you gut, you are committed and you are willing to explore different avenues to aid your sobriety. The key word is "your" sobriety.

We don't abandon ourselves simply because we get sober. And just because I suffer from a similar affliction as others does not make it safe or okay for me to forego the same precautions I would take in any social situation. Just because I happen to be eating in the same restaurant or in the same theatre as others doesn't mean other patrons have carte blanche to invade my life.

I bristled when I was told I would fail. And then when I succeeded I was told I was doing it "the hard way". The only time it felt hard, was when I was doing something that felt like it was taking me out of who I am. When I was doing it someone else's way and not mine.

A lot of alcoholics drink because they are uncomfortable in social situations. It makes sense therefore that even though sober often some of the emotional intelligence that one would normally expect might be wanting. I have always resented being pressured by others. I don't pressure people, I feel it is respectful to let them find their way. I expect the same in turn.

I came to SR and asked for support when I felt railroaded by a therapist, psychiatrist, and sober coach working in tandem (on my wallet). They were the authorities and I was not entitled to an opinion, and when I disagreed I was met with raised eyebrows and knowing looks. Thank god I listened when every part of me was screaming "this is so wrong".

This is a marathon, not a sprint. It doesn't sound like you are on tenterhooks..which gives you the luxury to find your way. Keep asking questions and continue to honor your boundaries.