Soberr

Yeah well I don't care if she comes around. Anyone who cares that little about our friendship to break it off because of one lie after 23 years of the truth isn't worth it in my book... And i didn't even lie to her... She just found out i lied to others and i think she feels she is owed an apology and well... I disagree.

EndGameNYC

Are you certain that this has been the only rupture in your relationship with her across twenty three years?

"The cruelest lies are often told in silence." -- From Robert Louis Stevenson's Treasure Island

ultradad

I guess in my opinion, lying is lying and honestly...who are you really protecting, yourself or your spouse? While I agree it's not really anyone else business, if it affects your sobriety and relationships (which it obviously did) it may be something to take a look at.

In AA we're taught to make amends when it want cause any more harm. I've heard people say that if you've cheated on your spouse that it's best not to say anything because it's just going to cause more harm, but I personally don't buy into that idea. If my spouse cheated on me, whether in active addiction or not, I would want to know. I think it boils down to respect and working an honest program of recovery. As long as we continue to lie we are opening ourselves up to relapse. Slip up's may and do happen, but if we hide them we are only fooling ourselves, in my opinion. I know for me personally that I am a master manipulator and if I let old defects of character creep in I'm setting myself up and I was an expert at creating scenarios in order for me to rationalize my drinking again!

I would suggest you make amends and just do the next right thing. I heard this at a speaker meeting the other night. A guys grandmother used to tell him, "Boy, if you do right, you want have to get right"

hopeful4

I am coming from the other side. I don't drink, but my X did. And I can only say that that he had "slips," a lot. It was not the slip itself, it was the lies that come with it. When someone lies to you point blank it makes you feel like you are crazy. It makes you question yourself and it loses all trust for that person to tell the truth about anything.

So I guess my question is, how many times have you lied in the past? How many slips have you had. I would say you are right, they confront you because they are your friends and are in fear of your going down the road to ruin. They realize that a "slip" many times leads to full relapse. They want you not to lie to yourself.

I am not trying to be critical, just explaining from the other side of the coin. If this has went on for a long time w/your friend, it could be they just cannot take it anymore and the stress of the relationship is too much at this point.

soberjuly

I had the exact same thought when I first read this post. She may just enjoy being mean and rejecting you. Maybe she enjoys having an excuse. Sometimes people you think are your friends really aren't. Any real friend would be on your side. There are also people that don't want you to get yourself together and be the best you can be.

Reminds me of Anna Nicole Smith. She had this TV show (on E! I think). I watched it once and it was disturbing how so many of her 'friends' seemed to enjoy her being a mess. I remember thinking a friend wouldn't be encouraging her alcoholism. E! could have promoted a show showing her recovery but instead it was too much fun filming this woman on a downward spiral.

soberjuly

I had a best friend from the age of 9. When I was a senior in HS, 17 years old, she made a pass at my boyfriend. My BF told me he told her he wasn't interested. Then he told me what happened.

I never mentioned it to her. I thought it was not very nice but I also knew she didn't feel good about herself. We'd been friends for so long, I had other friends, I just didn't think it needed to be brought up.

That's a big screw up. Making a pass at your friend's BF, but inside I forgave her and didn't feel bringing it up was important. It would just serve to embarrass her and I didn't want something to hang over her head. Rather just pretend my BF didn't tell me, which is what I did.

If she had a drinking problem and slipped, I wouldn't have deserted her. And alcoholics lie to drink, what is surprising about that? Nothing.

Lucie29

All great points here! thank-you for posting. I also have a friend, my old roommate actually, who doesn't really want to talk anymore because of my drinking. She is NOT an alcoholic, and doesn't have any in her family. I think it is very hard for people who don't have personal experience with this disease, to recognize it as one. They can't understand why we can't control it. To them, it's as simple as not drinking, or moderating. I would give her time, and yourself time, to heal. You are not a liar or a bad person, you have a disease. That is not an excuse to "slip", but we are human. It also probably scares her to watch you go through that again. My friend told me she won't stand by and watch me destroy my life anymore. I am working on me now, with aa among many other things, and hopefully someday she will recognize that and I can redeem myself. I lied to her many times when I came home drunk and said I hadn't drank. All we can do is concentrate on our sobriety. We cannot control how others feel or react to us. I hope this helps:/

Nowsthetime

From what I read I feel that you were trying to protect yourself. I think we also need to know more. Is it really the first time you lied? I had a friend that lied to me and I felt that it was better to end it at that. Time went by and now we are friends (great friends) again. Sometimes people just get sick of dealing with our lies and that just need a little time. I think that accepting that you did lie (even by omission) is the first step. You sound mad at her and hurt but try to put yourself in her shoes...

Give it time. If it is meant to be it will be.

NoJimmy

Only you know the real history and dynamic of that friendship, but most of us have a long history of deception with regard to drinking. It seems fairly unlikely this is an isolated event in her mind.
A couple things I have learned is that it's important to forgive those who do us wrong, and make amends and forgive ourselves for our mistakes. Many have forgiven me, some have not, I had to accept that and move on. It's about letting go of shame, guilt and baggage and finding peace. None of this seems to happen over night.

mnh1982

i'm married to a recovering addict who also has problems with hiding his drinking. For me, I think the hardest part is that, when he hides it, it seems as though he believes I am the kind of person who will immediately judge him negatively, say something mean/condescending to him, or who will give him an ultimatum. I think perhaps friends can be the same way: for them, the hard part is not you, your situation, or your slip-up, it's the feeling that you are afraid to be yourself (mistakes & all) around them. Odds are, if they feel you're being honest from the outset, they'll do their best to be supportive. But when things are omitted or covered up, it's easy for loved ones/friends to start wondering if you really believe they are judgmental & don't want the best for you. I know that's how I feel when I discover my husband has been hiding his drinking-like he really thinks if I find out, all I'm capable of is freaking out on him or throwing it in his face. Try to work on taking a deep breath & "taking the plunge" when it comes to your actions. I think your friends & people in general will pleasantly surprise you.

ESD907

I'd like to point out, we all do this every day in some facet of life. I don't understand having friends like this actually. I have friends, but no one that really needs to be that much into my business. Not knowing the situation, I don't understand how your friends knew? Or why it would actually mean that much to them, unless you are somehow responsible for them, their children, something. IF my say, brother relapsed, I would not be hurt (even if he lied outright), I'd simply hope he stopped and sobered up. Now if my brother say was the person who picked up my children from school and he drank then, I'd have a real problem with it. SO? I guess IMO it depends on what/when/how, etc.

PurpleKnight

The ins and outs of what to call an omission aren't really all that important, this particular person has decided to break off the friendship regardless, so whatever the conclusion as to the definition of a lie, it won't make much difference until she decides, if she decides to give things another go.

The real issue is the relapse, alcohol has a habit of damaging relationships, when we were drinking we hid it, lied about it, ignored the warning signs and disregarded other people's opinions about it, and now in Sobriety this is one way that it can get it's claws into us once again.

If the slip hadn't of happened, there wouldn't be anything to discuss, we wouldn't be debating the definition of omission/lie, concentrating on your Sobriety will therefore solve all problems around this issue moving forward.

360shoes

This is a good thread. It makes me think. We all have opinions and they all count.

Just my opinion but I need to factor in intention many times. I've omitted things..if I want to be honest about it. But mostly it had to do with my intention.

If my intentions are pure...I don't need to be blatantly honest about something if it hurts someone and nothing good will come of it. Like my parents. It would hurt them to tell them every dirty detail of my drinking shenanigans so even if asked I would omit many details. It would be enough to say it wasn't good. I would omit many details. But I would own it.

So I guess if I drank and was seen drinking and my friends asked me about it, I would need to reflect before answering. If I omit is it because it lessens their pain or my own? I would have to say if I wasn't honest, it was the latter. Sure they wouldn't like it and some may dismiss me but I cannot not own my actions. They may not need to hear every dirty detail but I got to own it. All of life is fleeting and changes but I can never escape the consequence of my actions. Ever. They are really my only posessions.

Thank you for sharing. I didn't mean to address you personally and your circumstance. But I will on this point. We all do things and then need to reflect on them. If we learn something from it. It's not in vain. Thanks for the opportunity for me to learn. I had a craving hit today and these kind of things that make me think help me. Thanks!

Soberr

You guys are prob right... What happened has happened and i need to move forward... Better! I don't feel I have to apologize as I had to my other friends who actually confronted me and prompted me to lie straight to their faces. All I can do is the next right thing but I do have to work on the omitting thing. I am bad with that. The friend that ditched me was very much a follower of me for a long while...i could do no wrong and she did and agreed with every suggestion i made. She even stated she admired my success. Then she got in with some friends that dislike my cousin for cheating on her husband... And ever since she has been treating me poorly even though i live 2 states away from both. This is why I try to keep my friend groups separate which has gotten easier now that im in my 30s. Thanks for the replies.

OpioPhobe

Omission is absolutely a form of lying. For example, let's say my wife went out to lunch with a friend and slept with him later that afternoon. If she came home and told me about how great her lunch was without mentioning sleeping around I would consider it lying by omission. If she tried to say that I didn't ask about it so it wasn't technically lying that wouldn't fly.

As far as lying goes, I always had some great vision of why my lie was justified. If I told my wife that I had quit then I would lie if I actually had failed. My justification would be something like "Well, I already screwed up. Confessing will only cause my wife to worry about something that she cannot control. I am going to quit next week anyway and that is what I need to focus on. It will cause another blow out fight which will stress me out and make it more difficult to quit. Lying is clearly OK here because it benefits everyone involved."

I still far from perfect in this regard. If my wife asks me whether she looks fat in something the answer is ALWAYS 'no'. I don't have to lie about using though, because I don't do it.

EndGameNYC

Great post!

One way or another, we all pay for our indiscretions in life. Not owning up to them is among the most deadly forms of payment.