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Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: TN
Posts: 263
Kabukicho - Good for you, man! Congratulations on six days! One day at a time, make it through in this manner and it will get easier and easier. You are stronger than you think and with each day your strength will grow. Don't give up or give in. You can do it. I'm glad you are here with us.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Texas
Posts: 478
Hi Kab! Glad to see you back! You already know how I feel about this-glad to see you are seeking another therapist. So many don't understand PTSD (or C-PTSD) does not have to be military related--although yours is very close to being in a warfare situation.
I was told you cannot do it on your own....it really warrants the right treatment.
Regardless, Anxiety stinks, the fact you had to go through that stinks, all of the above.
I have been seriously struggling lately myself. It's freaking hard-especially the intrusive thoughts. My doc had me on a very low dose benzo to stop the panic and ruminating (which I tried to do on my own for a VERY long time) I had only taken them a couple of months and left them home for that trip....so yes, I had altitude sickness, but in addition, withdrawal. Ugh. I ended up in the ER probably the same time YOU did last week.
I couldn't stop shaking, anxiety through the ROOF.
Didn't mean to make this about me, just wanted you to know I SO FEEL YOUR PAIN. Hope, friend, is what we need. Don't lose that. KNOW this WILL pass--it has for others, and it will for us.
I was told you cannot do it on your own....it really warrants the right treatment.
Regardless, Anxiety stinks, the fact you had to go through that stinks, all of the above.
I have been seriously struggling lately myself. It's freaking hard-especially the intrusive thoughts. My doc had me on a very low dose benzo to stop the panic and ruminating (which I tried to do on my own for a VERY long time) I had only taken them a couple of months and left them home for that trip....so yes, I had altitude sickness, but in addition, withdrawal. Ugh. I ended up in the ER probably the same time YOU did last week.
I couldn't stop shaking, anxiety through the ROOF.
Didn't mean to make this about me, just wanted you to know I SO FEEL YOUR PAIN. Hope, friend, is what we need. Don't lose that. KNOW this WILL pass--it has for others, and it will for us.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,359
I am a bit confused. While I understand the need to provide positive support here, what I read is: you have done a spin clean cycle, still active in drinking without a desire to stop and likely screaming right back to benzos despite your best intentions. You were forced into sobriety by the detox and have no intention of keeping it that way - did I misunderstand something?
The silver lining to me is now your family and doctor know of your sturggles so hopefully you will go lower on the elevator and they will help you get the treatment you desparately need when you are ready.
The best advice seems to be from EndGame an expert himself, that suggests getting into treatment for your PTSD. Why not kill two birds with one stone and get into long term in pateint rehab where you can get the treatment you need for PTSD and remain sober for a period of time. Otherwise seems like you are heading lower.
The silver lining to me is now your family and doctor know of your sturggles so hopefully you will go lower on the elevator and they will help you get the treatment you desparately need when you are ready.
The best advice seems to be from EndGame an expert himself, that suggests getting into treatment for your PTSD. Why not kill two birds with one stone and get into long term in pateint rehab where you can get the treatment you need for PTSD and remain sober for a period of time. Otherwise seems like you are heading lower.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 156
It was not a spin-clean cycle.
I am intent on getting and remaining sober.
Today is another day. I still have a lot of anxiety, and I think some depression. Going to try to treat those underlying issues via therapy and (hopefully) non-addictive medication...
Thank you all for your words of support.
I am intent on getting and remaining sober.
Today is another day. I still have a lot of anxiety, and I think some depression. Going to try to treat those underlying issues via therapy and (hopefully) non-addictive medication...
Thank you all for your words of support.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,359
[QUOTE=Kabukicho;4635457]Yup, you hit the nail on the head. "Up in the air" = using.QUOTE]
Sorry, guess I need some glasses...I interpreted this as moving to the drink - guess your definition of "=using" is different than mine.
In terms of spin cycle, well you went to an inpatient detox, got out and are going to drink, how should we interpret this?
However you want to rationalize your addiction is fine with me - I was just providing a perspective on what I read. Good luck.
Oh, I have PTSD, am an addict and an alcoholic - no judgement been in your shoes, jsut sharing my ESH.
Sorry, guess I need some glasses...I interpreted this as moving to the drink - guess your definition of "=using" is different than mine.
In terms of spin cycle, well you went to an inpatient detox, got out and are going to drink, how should we interpret this?
However you want to rationalize your addiction is fine with me - I was just providing a perspective on what I read. Good luck.
Oh, I have PTSD, am an addict and an alcoholic - no judgement been in your shoes, jsut sharing my ESH.
Guest
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 4,225
It's been said before. We all fight and kick and scream about getting sober in our own way. Some for much longer than others.
Boy, I denied I had a problem for years. I damaged myself the most because of that denial.
I know you want to get well, Kab. I do believe that.
Boy, I denied I had a problem for years. I damaged myself the most because of that denial.
I know you want to get well, Kab. I do believe that.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,126
Life post Klonopin and Xanax will not be easy. I found beta blockers helpful in quelling some of the physical aspects of anxiety post benzo detox.
I also found accepting that this was going to be a rough ride placed my head in a good place: This is going to suck, but every day it sucks leads me to a hopeful point, a day when the suck isn't too bad or at least somewhat noticeably better.
There is real good news here. That your parents and doctor intervened is nothing but a very positive first step.
I had to accept a lot of limitations in post benzo withdrawal, and finally just accepted that my brain and body needed to heal, that I was a patient, that I needed medical and psychological help, and that I would ride this out no matter what the cost.
And post benzo, booze ain't going to help at all. It will only skew what small progress in rewiring your brain is taking place.
And another valuable lesson here is that you have to give time a lot of time.
It can take months for your brain chemistry to readjust.
But I feel I can make a promise here. The longer you are benzo and booze free, your anxiety and depression will improve tenfold.
I also found accepting that this was going to be a rough ride placed my head in a good place: This is going to suck, but every day it sucks leads me to a hopeful point, a day when the suck isn't too bad or at least somewhat noticeably better.
There is real good news here. That your parents and doctor intervened is nothing but a very positive first step.
I had to accept a lot of limitations in post benzo withdrawal, and finally just accepted that my brain and body needed to heal, that I was a patient, that I needed medical and psychological help, and that I would ride this out no matter what the cost.
And post benzo, booze ain't going to help at all. It will only skew what small progress in rewiring your brain is taking place.
And another valuable lesson here is that you have to give time a lot of time.
It can take months for your brain chemistry to readjust.
But I feel I can make a promise here. The longer you are benzo and booze free, your anxiety and depression will improve tenfold.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,359
Originally Posted by Kabukicho 
I am NOT drinking. Full stop. I am NOT taking benzos. Full stop.
I may be entering a 30-day rehab program.
I may be entering a 30-day rehab program.
Good luck and keep at it.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,126
And you really need to lose the thought that benzos and booze helped your anxiety.
I get it. They seemed to work for me for a long time. I just couldn't wrap my head around what I now know to be a fact: Benzos and booze increase anxiety beyond the point that drove us to take benzos and drink booze in the first place.
That really is a well documented fact and I will gladly post links to literature that proves it.
USe Google scholar and you will land on several research papers telling the same story.
Think of benzos and booze like a wet band aide. They stick over the wound for a while, then peel off.
I get it. They seemed to work for me for a long time. I just couldn't wrap my head around what I now know to be a fact: Benzos and booze increase anxiety beyond the point that drove us to take benzos and drink booze in the first place.
That really is a well documented fact and I will gladly post links to literature that proves it.
USe Google scholar and you will land on several research papers telling the same story.
Think of benzos and booze like a wet band aide. They stick over the wound for a while, then peel off.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 156
Yeah. I am taking beta blockers and exercising and just doing holistic stuff. My parents are coming to visit me again.
I can't believe how hard I blew it with the benzos and the alcohol. At least SOME recovering alcoholics get a benzo...
I am slightly concerned about things like permanent brain damage. Any input?
Here are my stats: 26 y.o. physically healthy male. Alcohol has been a part of my life since around age 20. But things only progressed to full-blown alcoholism in the last year. Benzos daily since around November. But only an intense habit for the last four months or so. Took a B-vitamin supplement while drinking heavily. Exercised hard daily while drinking heavily. Law student.
ER ran a fairly intensive blood test and didn't turn up anything worrying...
I can't believe how hard I blew it with the benzos and the alcohol. At least SOME recovering alcoholics get a benzo...
I am slightly concerned about things like permanent brain damage. Any input?
Here are my stats: 26 y.o. physically healthy male. Alcohol has been a part of my life since around age 20. But things only progressed to full-blown alcoholism in the last year. Benzos daily since around November. But only an intense habit for the last four months or so. Took a B-vitamin supplement while drinking heavily. Exercised hard daily while drinking heavily. Law student.
ER ran a fairly intensive blood test and didn't turn up anything worrying...
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 156
I get it. They seemed to work for me for a long time. I just couldn't wrap my head around what I now know to be a fact: Benzos and booze increase anxiety beyond the point that drove us to take benzos and drink booze in the first place.
That really is a well documented fact and I will gladly post links to literature that proves it
Thank you for pointing that out. I fell into that trap big time.
That really is a well documented fact and I will gladly post links to literature that proves it
Thank you for pointing that out. I fell into that trap big time.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,126
Don't worry about brain damage. And your benzo run since November is small potatoes compared to folks like me who were on them for a decade. Some foggy thinking, restlessness, difficulty in falling to sleep are all normal at this time, but permanent brain damage isn't worth worrying about.
And your short benzo trip means you should recover quickly. But I do want to point out that for many of us, the worst post-benzo symptoms didn't kick in until a few weeks after our last pill.
From what I gather, the half life of Klonopin stays with us for several weeks after last ingestion. Since benzos replace GABA, basically smothering our neurons so that the neurons can't absorb the natural neurotransmitter, it's during the time as Klonopin slowly bleeds from our system, that period where neurons have to relearn how to absorb it, that things can get difficult. Remember, I was on a massive dose of Klonopin for years, so two weeks out from my last pill is when the Disney On Acid moves started. I'm real confident you won't experience anything like that, but you could find your anxiety and depression worsening within the next week or so.
So it's this chemical rebalancing that creates some really whacky symptoms. I have also heard from people who were on benzos for a six months or so and had little problems other than a few days of discomfort.
If you could schedule some down time, stock up on healthy juices and sparkling water, get some good books to read, schedule some in-home binge movie festival time, reduce any outside stress, it could be beneficial.
Many have also said that hard exercise worsened symptoms during the first few weeks of post detox, so maybe long walks instead of hard runs might be wise.
And your short benzo trip means you should recover quickly. But I do want to point out that for many of us, the worst post-benzo symptoms didn't kick in until a few weeks after our last pill.
From what I gather, the half life of Klonopin stays with us for several weeks after last ingestion. Since benzos replace GABA, basically smothering our neurons so that the neurons can't absorb the natural neurotransmitter, it's during the time as Klonopin slowly bleeds from our system, that period where neurons have to relearn how to absorb it, that things can get difficult. Remember, I was on a massive dose of Klonopin for years, so two weeks out from my last pill is when the Disney On Acid moves started. I'm real confident you won't experience anything like that, but you could find your anxiety and depression worsening within the next week or so.
So it's this chemical rebalancing that creates some really whacky symptoms. I have also heard from people who were on benzos for a six months or so and had little problems other than a few days of discomfort.
If you could schedule some down time, stock up on healthy juices and sparkling water, get some good books to read, schedule some in-home binge movie festival time, reduce any outside stress, it could be beneficial.
Many have also said that hard exercise worsened symptoms during the first few weeks of post detox, so maybe long walks instead of hard runs might be wise.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 156
I was actually on Xanax until basically mid-April. And then I was on Klonopin for, like, eight days. It was during that eight day period that, for whatever reason, I just went ballistic. Blame it on a bad reaction to the Klonopin and addictive tendencies, I guess.
Drinking very heavily, binging on the Klonopin. Eventually going to detox at the end of that horrific ride.
I really don't know what happened.
My point is, I hope my Klonopin "bleed" isn't too extended.
Drinking very heavily, binging on the Klonopin. Eventually going to detox at the end of that horrific ride.
I really don't know what happened.
My point is, I hope my Klonopin "bleed" isn't too extended.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Midwest
Posts: 4,860
Originally Posted by Kabukicho
Yeah. I am taking beta blockers and exercising and just doing holistic stuff. My parents are coming to visit me again.
I can't believe how hard I blew it with the benzos and the alcohol. At least SOME recovering alcoholics get a benzo...
I am slightly concerned about things like permanent brain damage. Any input?
Here are my stats: 26 y.o. physically healthy male. Alcohol has been a part of my life since around age 20. But things only progressed to full-blown alcoholism in the last year. Benzos daily since around November. But only an intense habit for the last four months or so. Took a B-vitamin supplement while drinking heavily. Exercised hard daily while drinking heavily. Law student.
ER ran a fairly intensive blood test and didn't turn up anything worrying...
I can't believe how hard I blew it with the benzos and the alcohol. At least SOME recovering alcoholics get a benzo...
I am slightly concerned about things like permanent brain damage. Any input?
Here are my stats: 26 y.o. physically healthy male. Alcohol has been a part of my life since around age 20. But things only progressed to full-blown alcoholism in the last year. Benzos daily since around November. But only an intense habit for the last four months or so. Took a B-vitamin supplement while drinking heavily. Exercised hard daily while drinking heavily. Law student.
ER ran a fairly intensive blood test and didn't turn up anything worrying...
I hope this isn't a joke.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 156
First of all, I was insanely twisted on Klonopin and alcohol when I wrote some of those things.
Second of all, it's all essentially true.
I have lived in Tokyo. I now live in Boston.
I am a law student, but I am in the process of dropping out to work at an advertising agency from which I received a promising job offer. I currently am already working for them via e-mail.
That was the plan. Until this drug-fueled nervous breakdown.
Second of all, it's all essentially true.
I have lived in Tokyo. I now live in Boston.
I am a law student, but I am in the process of dropping out to work at an advertising agency from which I received a promising job offer. I currently am already working for them via e-mail.
That was the plan. Until this drug-fueled nervous breakdown.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,359
Kabukicho - I don't think anyone wants to call you out. Instead my guess is readers want to believe the best and make sure your intentions are true for your own sake. I cannot speak for others but I called out your misrepresentations in this OP bc in one post you said your going to use alcohol again but later you redacted and stated "you are Not drinking, full stop I believe.
I think many, including myself just want to support your efforts but not let you lie to yourself in the process. I lied to everyone around me including myself when active. So part of getting better is a change in mindset. It starts with putting down the bottle and pills but progresses throughout the threads of our being including being honest with ourselves and others.
I think many, including myself just want to support your efforts but not let you lie to yourself in the process. I lied to everyone around me including myself when active. So part of getting better is a change in mindset. It starts with putting down the bottle and pills but progresses throughout the threads of our being including being honest with ourselves and others.
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