alphaomega

Fascinating article that describes what going on in our brains.

The Lizard Brain Addiction Monster

LadyBlue0527

Great article! When my daughter was in IOP (I was still drinking at the time) I attended every family day that they had on Saturdays. There were great speakers and I remember a movie that was very much in alignment with this article.

I know that some people couldn't care less why they can't drink or what their brain is up to that led them to where they are. I, however, feed on things like this. Knowledge is power.

Thanks for sharing that!

DoubleDragons

Wow, Lady Blue, you are a fast reader!! You are a book club lady. Alpha, that article was very helpful. Thanks!

MIRecovery

I believe I was born a lizard. I was genetically predisposed to the disease of alcoholism. both of my parents died of alcoholism but were not alcoholic while I was going up so I cannot blame my problems on family of origin issues. Two of my grandparents were alcoholics and my brother is an alcoholic as well.

For whatever weird reasons my primitive brain is either over or under developed I guess it depends on how you look at it. From my first drink I started a long death spiral that lasted thirty nine years.

It was not until I I achieved total absence that the lizard brain was put back into its normal place functioning more or less in a normal way. The destructive brain pathways that had been reinforced for so many years are slowly but surely being replaced with normal ones.

the science of addiction is very interesting stuff

LadyBlue0527

I loooooooooooooooooove reading, have ever since I was a child. Unlike most other kids I couldn't wait for a rainy day to curl up in my bedroom under a warm blanket and dive into a good story! At the age of 4 I was reading at the 6th grade level as was my daughter after I taught her.

Reading is the ultimate escape, too bad I didn't remember that when I was introduced to alcohol.

ejackson

Oh, I just posted over in the weekend thread how I didn't have a plan yet to stay sober this evening. Then, I see this thread and the link to the article. I don't have time to read it now, but I liked what I skimmed.

I got my plan! Tonight, I'm going to come back to this thread with a cup of tea and read the whole article. I can't wait. That will be my focus today.

Thank you, Alpha, for giving me a plan today!

alphaomega

Me too E. I was desperately searching for an understanding as to why I wake up with 100% conviction not to drink and by 4:00 pm that's blown out of the water.

This is something that FINALLY answers that, for me.

I am also getting the Rational Recovery book this weekend.

I hear you LB - I'm a voracious reader. I adore it.

wiscsober

Is the one webpage the entire article? or are there a couple?

jkb

That was a great reminder for me this morning. Thanks....

Jess

misspond

I think that this article is someone's AV at work. Big Time.

There's no conclusion to the beginning and middle. It just wanders off at the end with some footnotes and No Conclusion. Be very careful, don't let reading this lead you into a bottle neck. x

misspond

The Rational Recovery book is a much better read and once you've read it you'll understand why I think that the article is an AV article. x

WhitePawn

misspond--thanks for the input.
I'm fairly new to SR and most of what I have learned about AVRT came from the link below. I have not read Rational Recovery yet but it is on my list--so I'm kind of missing the aspect of the article that might sound like was written by the AV?

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ined-long.html

misspond

I could be wrong, this article could conclude somewhere. But there's no obvious link to a conclusion and I would suggest that that means the writer thinks that they have this all covered, but they don't. A lot of the body text is suggestive and leads you to think about drinking. And the lists? Wow. Just lists of reasons to drink dressed up as arguments against it. The Beast and its associated AV will rage on until you listen.

I mean no disservice to anyone because this is a persuasive article but the bottom line is, (and this is me talking) "I drank because I liked to get drunk." There's no answer in this article, just reasons to drink/use dressed up as a discussion as to why you did/do so.

I should add that this is just my opinion as an alcoholic who does recognise that the AV is very very sneaky.

alphaomega

I disagree. For me, there is absolutely a conclusion which is the 400 million year old Lizard Brain drives the bus when it comes to addiction.

It thinks its in "survival" mode.

Can it be overrode ? Yes. With practice and .........

wait for it.......

KNOWLEDGE AND WILLPOWER.

WhitePawn

I get it now--I just kind of skimmed over most of the AV comments (lizard brain) , but you are right as they do sound very much like my own AV and then I have to be able to counter them.
Thanks for insight--I guess our AV's don't need even more ammo to use against us :-)

misspond

And this is where I think the dilemma lies - you understand this Alphaomega, but to anyone new to the concept it's harder to recognise. The answer is 1/3 of the way into the article. But people/brains remember what they heard/saw/read/experienced last. Personally I would prefer that that insight about AVRT was at the end, and not way before the lists.

Although I would argue that AVRT is not about willpower. It's about understanding and making a decision, the decision not to drink/use any more. Ever.

Grungehead

I lend credence to the lizard brain theory to a certain degree. I'm more at odds with how to handle the lizard brain. The article states that our higher brain is smarter than the lizard brain, so we should be able to overrule the lizard brain when it starts talking to us. But I believe that the answer isn't to just recognize that cravings are the lizard brain's way of trying to get us to drink again. IMO that means that the mental obsession to drink (constant chatter from lizard brain) will never stop, we will just learn to recognize it and not cave into it. One can stay sober this way, but since lizard brain wants what it wants and will not let up there is always the risk that he will "win" one day.

The lizard brain needs to be permanently quieted, or at least kept in chains where he can only complain from a distance and not from your shoulder. The author actually tells us fairly early in the article how to do that, and that is to replace the the negative good feeling from alcohol with a positive good feeling. For me that positive good feeling is living a spiritual life. If I am doing the things that lead to living a spiritual life I also get the benefit of keeping that good feeling throughout the entire day unlike some other forms of positive good feelings that may stop as soon as you stop doing that activity.

Anyway, I have found AVRT to be helpful as another tool to use in addition to AA, but for me personally I don't think I could stay sober AND happy using that method alone. I tried going to AA without taking the needed steps to live a spiritual life. I was able to stay sober for many years doing that purely from the fellowship and the constant reminder in meetings to stay vigilant. Eventually I stopped going to meetings and I started drinking again. The lizard brain is very patent, and when I let my guard down and became complacent it jumped on the opportunity. There are plenty of people in AA that have long-term sobriety by using the fellowship and not working the steps. Unless they have found other means of satisfying the need to feel good in a positive way, I do question how happy they can be (i.e. their quality of sobriety).

Finally a disclaimer. I don't purport that the program of AA (which IS the 12 steps) and living a spiritual life is the only way to successfully get and stay sober AND live a happy life doing so. I am just sharing my experience on what has and hasn't worked for me in keeping that "noise" (AV) from entering my head. Anything else I have stated regarding the article is solely my opinion

Threshold

My experience of addiction seems to be very inside out from what others experience.

I drank, drugged, etc to quiet my cerebral cortex. My lizard brain wants what's good for me. I was trying to numb my crazy brain. Lizard brain doesn't think, obsess, scheme, lie, rationalize. It wants me to survive, it was my cerebral cortex that was nuts and hell bent on killing me or trying to stone me into semi coma.

Lizard brain warned of the danger of what I was doing....killing myself and led me to stop pouring poison into me.

All my recovery work is about learning to address the thoughts of my cerebral cortex which would lead me right back to addiction.

Yes, lizard brain is the seat of feelings, but my feelings weren't hurting me. What my cerebral cortex chose to DO about my feelings is what got me into deep do do.

serious

i've been interested in AVRT for a while... to me this article was enjoyable because it went into interesting detail about base/higher brain interaction (conflict).

i do agree that the ending was kind of strange... just a bunch of reasons your base-brain can convince you to drink/use. certainly don't need to add to my list of excuses (and there were some new and "good" ones).

other than that i think the beginning and overall explanation was quite good.

freshstart57

If you want more information about AVRT, please visit the Rational Recovery website. I recommend the Crash Course for a very good introduction to this self empowered approach to ending your addiction to alcohol.