Anna

I think there's a very fine balance between sharing what works for you and not looking down at others who are recovering differently.

We are not all the same and we do not have the same needs and we do not all recover the same way.

13unluckyforsom

I think there is too but no one here is looking down on anyone I don't think? Or maybe I'm missing something? Or we are getting lost in translation or something lol

heath480

I hope I will always treat the still suffering Alcoholic with love and compassion.

We are hard enough on ourselves,we don't need others being hard on us as
well.

13unluckyforsom

Anyway I'm glad I posted what's working for me and I'm just blown away by the support shown to me in my recovery lol and as none of us recover quite the same then comparing recovery methods isn't even on the table. I don't even understand why it would be mentioned. However 11.31pm in the uk and I'm up early so I will say goodnight. Love this forum.

13unluckyforsom

Exactly what I said Heath couldn't agree more.

lorelei

if im responding to someone who has had a slip, or relapse, I always try and think of how I felt the last time I slipped up, and how I'd like someome to respond to me, its not my business why they slipped but if I can let them know they arent alone, and they just need to pick themselves up, then I will.

you should never look down on someone, unless you're helping them up.

drunkyjules

I think one of the worst parts about a relapse is the shame involved in it. Unfortunately that shame keeps a lot of drunk for far too long. To me the shame is a useless emotion because it never helped me stay sober, it just made me want to drown it more.

I do agree personal responsibility is a huge deal with sobriety and I have had to talk myself out of a drink many times by telling myself "this is your choice to pick up, your choice to use, you are signing up for all the pain and misery and self-hate that comes with it".

Its a big difference when you can cross the line from victim to victor.

jazzfish

Yes. Sometimes the internet just doesn't work for communication.

MemphisBlues

For sure, we have to take responsibility for our addictions. But I think there is a big, black thick line between taking responsibility and being an alcoholic. Drinking wasn't a choice for me for a long time.

I drank until I couldn't. I think there are a lot of folks like me out there. What separates me from other drinkers who come here is many have decided to stop before they end up at my bottom. Those are folks with real courage, and failing at stopping is something to be expected. So they get compassion, support, advice from my experience, anything I can think of to make them keep coming back.

The last thing I am going to tell them is to take responsibility for pouring that first drink down their throat. I am just going to talk about my identification with the inability to not pour that drink down my throat. Maybe that's what separates hard drinkers from alcoholics? I don't know.

If this was all about just making a decision to not drink and then growing the testicular (or ovarian) fortitude to follow that plan, many of us wouldn't be here, no?

AlefVavResh

My two cents.

I haven't done exact math on this, but it seems to me that for about every 5 people that show up and post a brand new thread, four slip away into the night and one stays. And those who stay and post their mistakes are courageous. They really want sobriety. They come here because a commitment to SR is part of their recovery process. Those who disappear may have decided to hell with it - I'm going to drink.

I get what you mean, 13. Sometimes a little tough love may be necessary. And I see people applying tough love when they feel it is warranted.

Again, just mho.

Eleni58

13, I totally get what you are saying! Sometimes, when I see people relapse over and over in a short period of time, I feel little sympathy. I feel like they either 1) don't really WANT to stop drinking or 2) don't have a solid plan or support network in place to keep them sober. In other words, they are not taking the necessary steps to stay sober (i.e. placing themselves in situations where there are known triggers or continuing to keep alcohol in the house (just in case).

I have yet to relapse since I quit 49 days ago and everyone thinks it's because I'm so strong, but I know it's because it's more like I have a solid plan and try to avoid triggers.

freshstart57

I have no idea what separates hard drinkers from alcoholics, and I wouldn't presume to know about the nature of someone's addiction. But I think that some addicts, alcoholics, dependent people, certainly have done as you said. They did make a decision not to drink, and then found a way to do that. People have been becoming alcoholics for thousands of years, and they have been making that plan to quit drinking and doing that plan, for thousands of years too.

I had no idea if I would ever do it, but I decided that I would do it even if nobody ever in the history of the world had done it. I was going to succeed and nothing would stop me. Nothing was ever going to make me take a drink again, no sadness or anger or pain or celebration or memory or grief. Or temptation. Nothing. My life depends on this, and I will survive.

It indeed took fortitude, and belief in myself to do it, because it was scary as hell. Quitting drinking was the single scariest bravest thing I have ever done. It was a dark lonely road, but I chose it, knowing that it was the only way to head towards daylight again. Continuing to drink was going to kill me, and I refused to die that way.

So, I can term this 'growing a pair' or 'putting on some big boy/girl pants', or making a life-saving life-preserving solemn vow, that is my choice how I call it. In this contest against my addiction, I get to make all the rules, and I get to call it what I want, whatever will make it easiest for me. I called it making a Big Plan to never drink again and to never change my mind.

13unluckyforsom

I dunno - I think everyone here wants to stop drinking forever? I don't think anyone who comes to a recovery forum comes because their enjoying their current life or wants to keep living like they have been...

If I say to myself 'I'm never drinking again and I'm never changing my mind ever no matter what' my brain goes crazy with laughing - agitated thoughts - excuses as to why that's not possible. I get anxious i have all sorts of thoughts. That's my alcoholic voice speaking. Because I have already decided that I don't drink and ill never ever drink again no matter what. So I seperate me - the rational me - from these thoughts - their not me. Their my alcoholic voice and it only wants one thing. I've already decided I don't drink. So I'm in charge. My thoughts aren't able to act without me! My thoughts can't go to a shop and but alcohol can they?

Bunion

I agree! I am "forgiving" myself at the moment.

13unluckyforsom

I want to help - I only found out about RR and avrt because someone was kind enough to tell me. And I'm so greatful because for me it works. It's a different way of recovery that's not so widely spoke about. I joined this site and had never heard of it.

I'm not comparing anything and I'm certainly not looking down on anyone for anything. I don't know why that's even been mentioned here. I'm giving a different point of view and a different suggestion for newcomers or people who are struggling to stay stopped. It's coming from a good place.

ando68

I was really struggling to stop with drink & drugs up until 3 months ago,, could not grip clean time, tossing & turning, stumbling and falling. I can't stop, I said to a good friend of mine. " well "" he said " you do know that no one can save you from yourself ". That was it, I knew the game was up & I had to take responsibility for it myself. He wasn't harsh or lacking compassion, if anything I think he took a real risk with me and decided to be honest. I have not taken a drink or drug since.
That's just my experience though.

13unluckyforsom

That's exactly where I'm coming from. There's nothing worse than self destruction. And no one can stop it only you. You have to want it 110% and make not drinking/drugging ever again your focus.

Well done ando for taking your life back. Power to you

jkb

Ok, I love this thread's basic premise and hate to see it turn into a "my program is better than yours" thread

So, RR says "Big Plan"...

However when I was in AA my sponsor said to me (after many relapses) "Jess I can only help you if you don't drink NO MATTER WHAT". That really stuck with me.

So, in my opinion, the type of program is not the issue it is the commitment to the program. The commitment to sobriety.

Relapse is a choice for me no matter what. If I go to 50 meetings a week or none the idea is the same. Make sense?

pinkdog

Hi 13, I agree is it completely about personal responsibility. However when someone is down, why kick them? It is empathy. Because we do know how bad the hangovers and guilt are. Beating ourselves up is a waste of energy. Accepting that we cannot drink is the answer. No alcohol ever for me. Best wishes to you.

Anna

I agree that relapse is a choice and it's also dangerous.

One thing I have learned at SR is that each of us is on this recovery journey together, but at different places, and that's how it's meant to be. We're all where we should be.

Let's please not get into a discussion about programs because, if we do, the thread will close.