Jetzt makes an introduction
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: London
Posts: 36
So, I'm still awake at 4.23am after 20 drinks( but a few hour gap since the last one) and then severe muscle spasms, anxiety and an attempt at delirium tremens starts. 1 pint of white cider and 15 minutes later I'm fine, thought I'd post this here rather than somewhere else on the internet.
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Southern U.S.
Posts: 1,030
Jetzt, glad you posted on SR. It sounds like you're wreaking havoc on your body. I'm worried for you. Do you want to stop drinking and if yes, what are your plans for help with detox to get through this?
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Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: London
Posts: 36
I don't see an easy solution yet, severe withdrawal isn't supposed to start within a few hours and the alcohol place wouldn't give me a substitute. I'm hoping the psychiatrist can give me something to take the edge off while I cut down but willpower is the only current reliable plan.
Re-Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado
Posts: 7,583
Welcome to Sober Recovery. I don't think you will find sobriety by substituting another drug for alcohol. That would not work for me. At the end I was drinking more than 30 units a day and shaking when I woke up too. Smoked as excessively and would likely have died in the last year or so had I not quit. I qualified for an in hospital detox program and a follow up 28 day rehab. Don't they have those over there?
Are you willing to give up being high entirely? It sounds like you believe switching drugs will be some improvement, no?
Detox means no drugs except for medically necessary to avoid seizures. Sober means no consciousness altering substances. Your plans don't sound like sobriety. Perhaps I am reading you wrong?
Are you willing to detox medically and have no drugs of any type? That is kind of what it is all about. I really don't want to hear about what or how much you drink. But would love to help you get sober.
Are you willing to give up being high entirely? It sounds like you believe switching drugs will be some improvement, no?
Detox means no drugs except for medically necessary to avoid seizures. Sober means no consciousness altering substances. Your plans don't sound like sobriety. Perhaps I am reading you wrong?
Are you willing to detox medically and have no drugs of any type? That is kind of what it is all about. I really don't want to hear about what or how much you drink. But would love to help you get sober.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: London
Posts: 36
Itchy, I mostly just want something healthier that won't kill me. I don't think I'll ever have complete sobriety from all substances, I just want something moderated that can be a treat from time to time without killing me. I may take up cigarettes or something, the main fact is that what I'm doing now is not working. I can never be just completely normal and alone with my mood because I'll be in a mental asylum within 5 days but equally I cannot drink the huge amount that I am drinking.
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: North of England
Posts: 1,442
Your chances of ending up in a 'mental asylum' will, you might be surprised to know, much reduced, if you quit intoxicating yourself with whatever altogether.
Alcohol and drug abuse is a problem. It isn't one that can be fixed by simply switching to an alternative poison I'm afraid.
Alcohol and drug abuse is a problem. It isn't one that can be fixed by simply switching to an alternative poison I'm afraid.
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Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Nutmegger
Posts: 1,799
I spent decades trying to moderate, titrate, learn not to fixate to no avail. Benzos and alcohol were telescoping my world down. I learned I wasn't so smart after all. The "smartest" thing I ever did was ask for help.
There is a lot of wisdom here for newcomers like us....I hope you find the hope I did.
There is a lot of wisdom here for newcomers like us....I hope you find the hope I did.
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Southern U.S.
Posts: 1,030
Originally Posted by Jetzt 
I can never be just completely normal and alone with my mood because I'll be in a mental asylum within 5 days but equally I cannot drink the huge amount that I am drinking.
I finally just had to get sick of being hung over every morning, feeling gross and exhausted and sweaty and shaky and wasting the day in a fog. I mentioned earlier that I tried moderating at first...going for a few days here and there without drinking. My decision to quit wasn't instant, I had to build up to it. I'm on day 29 today and if you would have told me a couple months ago that I could come home and not drink, I wouldn't have believed it. I'm comfortable with it now. Some days are harder than others, but overall, I'm so grateful to be free from that prison.
You can do this. So many people have. There are loads and loads of stories from people here who never thought they could stop drinking. If you are depressed or have some other condition, you could consider anti-depressants.
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Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Long Beach, CA
Posts: 705
Hi Jetzt...that was quite an introduction! Had a "Bohemian Rhapsody" quality 
Alcoholics come in all shapes, sizes, races, creeds, nationalities. It is an illness that doesn't discriminate. Once begun, the only direction is downhill, the only variable the speed we descend. You see yourself as an iconoclast, an outsider, an anarchist. We see you as one of us...a human being suffering the torment of alcoholism. All we want to do is support you in your quest to stop this substance from stealing your life. I've been there, almost lost everything dear to me, rode it right to the brink and almost...almost fell over. But then, I didn't.
For someone like you, with no tolerance for order, specific rules or instructions, some of the tools of recovery we have used with success will seem from improbable to impossible. The first step, or piece of advice, is to surrender your will to God, or your higher power as you see it. I'm sure this goes against every belief you hold dear, but what you are being asked to do is admit that you can no longer control your drinking. Alcohol is Muhammad Ali, and every time you've stepped in the ring with him lately, you've gotten the shi*t kicked out of you. It's time to throw in the towel. Admit to God or the universe or the Force that you give up. Next, start researching. There are many different types of recovery, AA, SMART, Celebrate Recovery, Rational Recovery. Start doing some reading and you will find a method that will fit your belief system.
Welcome Jetzt! You have found a safe place to come for help.
Alcoholics come in all shapes, sizes, races, creeds, nationalities. It is an illness that doesn't discriminate. Once begun, the only direction is downhill, the only variable the speed we descend. You see yourself as an iconoclast, an outsider, an anarchist. We see you as one of us...a human being suffering the torment of alcoholism. All we want to do is support you in your quest to stop this substance from stealing your life. I've been there, almost lost everything dear to me, rode it right to the brink and almost...almost fell over. But then, I didn't.
For someone like you, with no tolerance for order, specific rules or instructions, some of the tools of recovery we have used with success will seem from improbable to impossible. The first step, or piece of advice, is to surrender your will to God, or your higher power as you see it. I'm sure this goes against every belief you hold dear, but what you are being asked to do is admit that you can no longer control your drinking. Alcohol is Muhammad Ali, and every time you've stepped in the ring with him lately, you've gotten the shi*t kicked out of you. It's time to throw in the towel. Admit to God or the universe or the Force that you give up. Next, start researching. There are many different types of recovery, AA, SMART, Celebrate Recovery, Rational Recovery. Start doing some reading and you will find a method that will fit your belief system.
Welcome Jetzt! You have found a safe place to come for help.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: London
Posts: 36
longbeachone, do not ever preach to me about god ( specifically I said it without a capital G because it doesn't deserve it).
AA is a cult. I am Jetzt. I am not a slave to human rules or conventions or stupid forms of society and I never will be. MINE IS THE TRUE FACE OF VAMPIRES!!!!!!!
AA is a cult. I am Jetzt. I am not a slave to human rules or conventions or stupid forms of society and I never will be. MINE IS THE TRUE FACE OF VAMPIRES!!!!!!!
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: London
Posts: 36
Mentium, how do you think I have survived this long?
We all have our coping strategies and a cult isn't a good one.
I need to be physical and factual about the problem, I get down to brass tacks; despite the solipsism.
We all have our coping strategies and a cult isn't a good one.
I need to be physical and factual about the problem, I get down to brass tacks; despite the solipsism.
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Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Nutmegger
Posts: 1,799
People who are finding their way can help others. People who are drowning lash out as they violently flail their arms in a frantic effort to keep their heads above water.
There is plenty of help here because of the kindness of strangers. Those strangers form a community that feels like family to me. That family has proved invaluable to me during the last few months of sobriety.
When you ask for help it is going to come in a variety of forms. I don't attend AA but I have enormous respect for the wisdom and gentleness evidenced in longbeach's kind message. We all learn from each other. I am sorry you are hurting. If you want help, which I am assuming is the reason you are here, then I would encourage you to find a respectful way to convey your stance.
There is plenty of help here because of the kindness of strangers. Those strangers form a community that feels like family to me. That family has proved invaluable to me during the last few months of sobriety.
When you ask for help it is going to come in a variety of forms. I don't attend AA but I have enormous respect for the wisdom and gentleness evidenced in longbeach's kind message. We all learn from each other. I am sorry you are hurting. If you want help, which I am assuming is the reason you are here, then I would encourage you to find a respectful way to convey your stance.
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: North of England
Posts: 1,442
I was an AA sceptic for many years. AA isn't a cult. It has some cult like qualities but it isn't a cult. I have read widely about recovery methods. In fact as a practising alcoholic off and on for 30 years I am a bit of an expert.
I go to AA meetings to meet fellow struggling drinkers - many of whom no longer have to struggle. I share and tell the other group members I am an atheist and that much of the Big Book makes no real sense to me. They don't insist that I follow a specific method. But AA keeps me sober because I meet people face to face and I listen hard and carefully to their experiences and share mine. I have also made two AA friends and went on a sober healthy hike with one of them on Sunday.
I am not forced to believe anything I don't want to and I don't say anything I don't want to. I don't use the word 'god' at all.
I don't think I would have made it this far (three weeks so far) without AA frankly. It is the longest I have been sober for ten years.
I suggest careful study rather than knee-jerk reaction. It is your health and well-being that is at stake at the end of the day. If you are as much a rugged independent thinker as you seem to like to make out you will have no difficulty on fending off any of the supernatural woo you come across there.
I go to AA meetings to meet fellow struggling drinkers - many of whom no longer have to struggle. I share and tell the other group members I am an atheist and that much of the Big Book makes no real sense to me. They don't insist that I follow a specific method. But AA keeps me sober because I meet people face to face and I listen hard and carefully to their experiences and share mine. I have also made two AA friends and went on a sober healthy hike with one of them on Sunday.
I am not forced to believe anything I don't want to and I don't say anything I don't want to. I don't use the word 'god' at all.
I don't think I would have made it this far (three weeks so far) without AA frankly. It is the longest I have been sober for ten years.
I suggest careful study rather than knee-jerk reaction. It is your health and well-being that is at stake at the end of the day. If you are as much a rugged independent thinker as you seem to like to make out you will have no difficulty on fending off any of the supernatural woo you come across there.
EndGame
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 4,677
Originally Posted by Jetzt
longbeachone, do not ever preach to me about god ( specifically I said it without a capital G because it doesn't deserve it).
AA is a cult. I am Jetzt. I am not a slave to human rules or conventions or stupid forms of society and I never will be. MINE IS THE TRUE FACE OF VAMPIRES!!!!!!!
AA is a cult. I am Jetzt. I am not a slave to human rules or conventions or stupid forms of society and I never will be. MINE IS THE TRUE FACE OF VAMPIRES!!!!!!!
AA has weaknesses you despise, so why not describe it as a "cult?" You seem satisfied in using the very labels you loathe and making sweeping judgments based on your prejudices, rather than finding a way to get the help you seem to need. You victimize yourself in precisely the same way that you claim others are attempting to do. If you're not in need of help, then why are you here? If it's to "bring anarchy" to this site, as you proudly announced in your OP, then you're just wasting more of your time. People are here to support each other; not to engage in trivial, gratuitous debates.
Most of us have to do things we don't want to do, and face consequences we'd rather not deal with, but we deal with them in the service of survival, not because we're endorsing societal norms. The real heroes are those who both thrive and survive, regardless of what society tells them they should be doing.
Being different and condemning what you view as mindless conformity has little intrinsic value, either for survival or for living a good life. It's a temporary curiosity for most people since you objectify yourself in the same way you accuse society of doing. Referring to yourself in the third person further objectifies who and what you are. (Jetzt makes an introduction.") One gets the feeling that the real you is buried under all your bluster. Your uniqueness and all your best efforts to be different have landed you on a recovery site, demonstrating that your way is not working.
If you are incapable of abandoning your self-described "grandiose, narcissistic self-righteousness," to be open to alternative ways to get help, then there's little hope that you'll find a solution.
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