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Twofish:
I'm not sure I was able to see whether you are now attending Alanon meetings. Are you? Are they doing any good? It might help to deal with shame, guilt, etc. It's very natural for parents to feel this way but you must never forget how much things have changed from what they were when we were young. Now there are powerful forces out there that want to get kids addicted and stay addicted because it means something very simple- money, tons of money. The world has changed. The battles are now on every street corner, in every school. Alanon can help. This doesn't mean that you have to accept everything in the program or nothing at all. It means that the only requirement for membership is being sick at heart as to what's happened in your family. Go for the companionship and for any wisdom you can find. And you can find wisdom here on this SR website because there are folks who have been just where you are, and there are folks who have been just where your kids are and who have managed to get into recovery. There's no magic about it. It's hard work but it can be done.

W.

BabyJane

Wow sounds like things have been a roller coaster for you since I last replied to your original post.... I'm really glad you took the Alanon suggestion. My mother tried it once and didn't stick with it which was a bummer because it helps so much to have support! And YES people who are married to or living with addicts and alcoholics seem to be co-dependent more often than not. I wonder if the personalities just attract each other out of mutual "benefit" or what have you? I think you are doing right by cutting off the funds, the cars, taking phones away, not engaging in text wars or conversations, etc.

So sad for your son that he has to be caught up in this mess but you said it yourself; he's 14 and confused and he will have to go through his own process of feeling sad, angry and betrayed. Hopefully he comes out of this ok. As for your girls... What to say... They are going to be in for a rude awakening either way. Hopefully your mother doesn't enable them where you left off by buying into the lies. It's hard though. We all want to think the best of those we dearly love! I get that! I still put up with a lot of my dads alcoholic behaviors when I shouldn't (he is supposedly in recovery but not really working a solid program or getting professional help which he needs) but I'm getting better. As a former alcoholic / addict myself I have the edge on his manipulation. I can spot it. He did the suicude threats to me also and I called the police and sent them to his home! He never did it again!

Anyway, I wish you the best. This will be a long road. There is light at the end of the tunnel, one way or the other. The poster who shared about praying for her son and letting him live his own life is right on. We can only do so much. One of the best things I ever heard about this was :

"We must give those we love the dignity of making their own mistakes" ....

If you really think about this, it's quite profound. You can't live their lives for them. You can't just fix this and make it go away. You were not a bad mother though. I can see how much you love them. Keep loving them but don't love them to death, as it is said. Take care of you.

Hugs

Twofish

Babyjane, Wow, you summed it up perfectly when you said "keep loving them but don't love them to death". Maybe that's what I've been doing wrong plus the fact that I never wanted my kids to grow up, just stay little, because now that they're big, all grown up, they have very serious all grown up illnesses, like their addiction. I am going to hope that some day they will get better and return to the family.

Twofish

This is getting to sound like a soap opera, but it's my children, my girls that this is happening to, and its not funny at all, it's sad. Just an hour ago they texted that "someone" stole her purse, or clutch. Left it on the ped at the gas station, whilst she went in to pay for gas. She was crying and carrying on about it. She said her whole life was in there. She didn't ask me for anything, money-wise, just wanted some support and advice from "mom" on what to do. I feel for her and I believe her. I told her to call the police and cancel any credit/bank cards, etc, etc. How much can she take? How much more can I take? Just an FYI for those who follow this.

LuLu13

I have read this whole thread, didn't her clutch get stolen at a party not long ago? Seems strange to have two purses stolen so close together. Remember they know how to manipulate, maybe she is trying the old "I won't ask and maybe she will offer."

Twofish

Yes LuLu I was just thinking of that. However, it's both girls now, the younger one had it stolen from a bar (she's 19) and then today it's the older one. Who is a very smart independent girl. Seems uncharacteristic of her to "leave" her clutch laying out like that. Also red flags go up when they texted that the police couldn't do anything for them. And if she is sooo upset and crying, why not call me? Like verbally tell me? Texting, you never know for sure whom you are speaking to. LuLu I wish I could have the instinct you possess, to see things in between the lines, so to say. I do believe you might be right on this one. OMG, why am I so blind?

LuLu13

You mean you want to be cynical and not trust anyone? Ha, it comes from years of dealing with addicts and manipulation. There is a long history in my family and my brother is one of the best. Took me years not to get sucked in by his bullcrap. It is hard to believe that those we love would try to manipulate us that way but, remember, the addiction has a greater hold than we do at the moment.

Twofish

Yes indeed I see. It's odd that they haven't contacted me since the "stolen purse" text. My son, who also was texted about the purse, is upset and wants to send them his savings so they can be comfortable. He invited them back home also asked me if he could go down to their apartment for a sleep over. Oh gosh. The love of a sibling. NOT a good idea. He sees with blinders on. This is just killing me, his innocent way of him, asking for this. I will be the bad mom again and say no. They will be homeless as of the 14th, so I will just say they are moving, everything's in boxes, this is not a good time. It IS the truth. Also, LuLu, one thing they said that doesn't ring right with me, I have the only "spare" ped key. They said the key was in the clutch and the clutch(purse) was stolen. They said they got a ride back to the apartment to get the spare key and then retrieve the ped from the gas station. Humm, those peds have special keys that can't be copied, so did they just lie to me? They have not texted me since the theft. So what is it? Was the clutch stolen or was that ANOTHER cruel joke? Oh man, not again ...

LuLu13

The whole story does not make sense, the police wouldn't help them??? Be careful with your son, the first time I tried both alcohol and drugs were with my brothers. One was 4 years older and the other 7 years older. I wanted to be like the big kids and see what the thrill was about. Being a parent is tough but you need to say no to him. Have the two of you gone to an Ala-anon meeting together yet?

Twofish

My point exactly, LuLu, or shall I say fear. He thinks the world of his beloved sisters. I can see him wanting to "experiment" or to see what the thrill is all about. He keeps pestering me to go there, when I talked to him about alcohol, he said what's the big deal, dad lets me have some (well, a sip), I can see where you are coming from LuLu. The girls may not think that a sip, than a glass finally a bottle won't hurt, they did it and in there eyes, they are just fine. He's not going down there, alone for a sleep over. For his own good, and protected sobriety, I must protect him. And yes, we have an appointment with our Pastor, on Sunday. My son likes him and this Pastor kinda stepped in as a father figure while my husband is away. My son just finished his confirmation classes, four years, with our Pastor. He trusts this kind man. It will be a private meeting, he will be giving my son some responsibility in the church, like videotaping the service. Give him some goals and jobs. Hopefully,,my son will open up to him, feel safe and just talk about stuff. The Pastor is aware of the entire situation. Also, I am looking at a pediatric psychologist, I just don't want him medicated. Why are so many Dr.'s pushing the meds? Everything from Antibiotics, analgesics, antidepressants, anxiety pills, ADHD pills and the many narcotics. Maybe the patient needs them or maybe the Dr. is overworked and it's an easy fixer upper. I'm ranting, sorry. So, that's the plan for now. Ah yes, 22, 19 and 14 yrs old. Not a lot of years different is there?

LuLu13

Sounds like you got it all under control. The first time my brothers got me drunk I was 11. We were on vacation on a houseboat in Kentucky. My parents were asleep. My brothers invited me to play poker for money, got me drunk and took all my money. Seems funny, now. I told on them the next morning since I was so hungover. I had slept on top of the houseboat in a sleeping bag, the Kentucky sun did not help my hangover nor did the obnoxious fisherman honking his horn yelling wake up sleepy head, LOL. I still remember my mom screaming at my brothers that I could have fallen off the ladder and drowned on my way to the top of the boat. I also vaguely remember laying down on the pull out sofa and telling my brothers the boat was spinning and they laughed. They did not think it was so funny when I said I was going to throw up and rushed me to the front of the boat. I was never very close with my middle brother but I worshiped the ground my oldest brother walked on, we were very close. Sadly, his life has spiraled out of control from his addictions so we have little if no contact now, unless he wants bail money.

Twofish

LuLu, Exactly why I don't want the boy going to their apartment for a sleepover. What if they decide to go out, leave him alone, and he gets frightened? Or worse yet, they allow him to have some alcohol? I can prevent these things from happening if I stop him from going down there. A temporary fix, I won't be able to prevent all temptation to alcohol. It's sad about your older brother, is he alone? I can foresee into the future ( well, predict anyway) that this could be my oldest daughter someday. If only we could stop what we predict...

noexcuse

A psychologist is a good place to start, Twofish. They don't prescribe meds. Beware of the psychiatrists, however. I had one that would prescribe me three months worth of Xanax at a time, three pills a day. At that quantity, it didn't take too long for me to start abusing those.

LuLu13

Keep vigilant with your son, it is important. No, my oldest brother is not alone. He has a wife he has been with for 30 years but, unfortunately, she is also a raging alcoholic. They are so codependent it is unbelievable. Neither has worked in years, they just drink and drink. Lots of domestic violence in that house. I also believe my brother has some serious mental health issues. Thanks God they could not have children. I finally gave up on him a few years ago but every now and again still get sucked in, we were so close when I was young. He called me on July 27 to wish me a happy birthday, my birthday was June 26th. I didn't answer. My daughter HATES him because he has made me cry so many times, she will have nothing to do with him, ever. She almost could not be a cop because of some of his past criminal activity that came out in the background investigations.

Twofish

Good morning SR, hoping your night was pleasant, peaceful and uneventful. Mine was not. The younger girl calls, panicking, the older girl is out of control. Fighting, yelling and hitting her. This was the first time she has reached out to me. She was also upset that the old roommate was trashing our "good name" in the city of drugs and dreams that we live by. I assured her that gossip was gossip. Please consider who the source was. Not to worry, this city, the people in it, will not judge, and if they do, let it go. Maybe this is a good time to stop the drugs? She got somewhat defensive but did agree. I suggested she separate herself from her sister, for her own safety. She thought maybe this was a good idea but her loyalty is very deep and feels she must take care of her. They are poor now, no food, transportation , clean clothes and will be homeless in 12 days. She asked for emotional support and love. I affirmed to her that I will always and forever, will love them. She simply said thanks mom. We said good bye and I hung up the phone. Then I cried or grieved. I want to rescue her, pull her out of that hellhole she finds herself in. I simply can't. As much as she's hurting and hurting me, to fix this will be a step backwards. She is almost ready to help herself. To clean herself up and leave the world she lives in and step into my world. Ya, my boring world where life is lived and memories are made and remembered, today and tomorrow are waiting for her. I am hoping that everyone has a peaceful Friday. Don't beat yourself up, think twice about your decisions and smile...

sugarbear1

Have you gone to Al Anon yet?

Twofish

No I have not. There are none close to my village. However, there is a SMART meeting on Wednesday that I plan on attending.

JettBoy

Hi two fish,speaking from an addicts point of view,I used and abused everyone and everything in my active addiction. Your girls are at the start of something that can be potentially fatal.id defiantly cut em off,but I'd also see if you can legally do something to have them put in a treatment facility . Look,I read this once,you save yourself or you remain unsaved,they haven't gone through enough to realize what they are doing to the selfs or you guys.it sucks because I've been doing this dance since I was 12 and I'm 51 ,several overdoses,treatment three times and about fourteen years behind bars all total. Love them,try n get them to see what's going on and where they are headed.its hard,I've been fighting along time and I'm recently ,finally having the sense to stay sober and on the the right road.good luck to you and your husband,I hope it all goes well for you,your in the right place ,keep asking for help,we r all he for you...

Twofish

Hi, I just wanted to let everyone know that I will be gone for awhile. My father, who is ill to begin with (diabetic, anxiety, hospice) was admitted to the hospital. Doesn't look real good, I'm just so upset and I don't want to blame anyone, but dang it, all this stress that I have caused, my girls have caused, might kill my dad. I am close to him. My mom just called me and told me he is in the hospital, he is pale, bed sores all over, you can imagine his condition. So I called my husband to come home. I have to go be with my mom. To be strong for her. I don't know how I'm gonna do this. Be strong SR, think good thoughts for me and for my dad. See you soon, Twofish

Dee74

best wishes to you and you family.

D