Sapling

Good stuff Craig!

2granddaughters

In AA I can have a GOD as I understand HIM and my understanding keeps changing over the years.

All the best to everyone.

Bob R

MalkavianEmily

Hmmm...
I'm not sure where I stand, religion wise. I've been to a few different AA meetings now, and not heard the Lord's prayer once. And yes, they've all ended with the serenity prayer, but it's using the term God 'as you understand it'.
Yes, I talk to my Higher Power regularly. I have no idea who it is, apart from the fact that I address him as 'Father'. I don't think it matters either. Whoever it is, is helping to keep me sober. That's what matters.

sugarbear1

Honestly, I didn't really have a god in my life, at least not a loving one. The one I had been "taught" about was punishing more often than loving, so I basically gave up on that concept.

Same with Bill W. He didn't have a loving god in his life, he had that old time religion shoved at him, he had a rough childhood, and when he and Dr. Bob were figuring out this whole AA thing, this is when a decision to have a god of one's understanding put in the big book.

After I was guided through the steps, something strange happened to me. My irrational fears, phobias (social and otherwise), and anxiety basically left me. I had no cravings nor real desire to drink.

My life changed direction. That is when I realized there IS a power greater than me at work in my life. It took fearless and thorough honesty to work through the steps.

After step 7, I changed. It was a miracle. That is when the Power of the Universe was real. I still have a hard time calling it god, but I will say A god of my understanding. I don't capitalize it, it's not from the bible.....it's just a power greater than I....

There have been books written about the 12 steps and AA, Buddism and the 12 steps, other ways of looking at the 12 steps. Even if you choose to use the steps as a power greater than you, something does happen when they are worked thoroughly, fearlessly, and honestly.

I wish you well,

Zencat

Hi Epskie. I hope the following will be something you can draw strength from. The saying; "if there is a will there is a way" and "to thine own self be true" has served me well when navigating through the multitude of recovery understandings.

As an implicit atheist I follow those that have recovered from alcoholism and happen to be agnostic/atheist.
Here's how they did it:Also there's Jimmy B, forth original AA member who argued to include "God as you understand Him" into the 12-steps was an atheist that went to his grave with 3 decades of sobriety in AA. He wrote:I'm an atheist like my mother and father were Christian. They would not under any circumstances abandon their faith. Nor would I do the same with my faithlessness. I am that atheist in the foxhole. My abandonment of supernatural beliefs and adopting an naturalistic spirituality has given me a higher quality of life.

I do go to open AA meetings, work a secular understanding of the 12-steps and have noticed an improvement in my life by doing so. I also have a recovery tool box that includes a variety of healthy living solutions from the wide array of ways to maintain wellness.

IndaMiricale

Well I think you got plenty of input to that question..

For me when I first surrendered and was looking for that HP I simply used the people in the rooms. For they were a blessing. Things change and you will grow in you spirituality as you remain teachable and open minded.

danielle0754

I'm glad I saw this thread. It's comforting to know there are others out there who are just as put off by religion as I am. I'm an atheist and I remember finding the whole "higher power" aspect of AA very distasteful. I know it works well for others but just not something I could get into.

2granddaughters

I have found that most "athiests" haven't had the crap kicked out of them quite enough yet by alcohol.

If someone mugs you and puts a gun to your head, most folks' instinctive reaction is "God help me". I know it was that way with me. There are no athiests in foxholes.
I believed in a Higher Power but I just didn't realize it until I was in over my head.

I had to get to the point where I had a gun to my own head to drop to my knees and say "God help me" ... then HE did.

Just my $0.02

I wish everyone a great day.

Bob R

Zencat

Rather than singling out atheist, a more balanced and fair statement would include people of all faiths and all spirituality's. Many may have not had 'the crap kicked out' of them by alcohol so as to cause them to quit for good.


Lets put that old rubbish to rest.

Just my .02 cents.
Everybody have a wonderful day.

danielle0754

I'm sorry but I completely disagree. After an attempted rape, I was stabbed over a dozen times in my head and neck and spent awhile in the ICU. Death was at my door and I never once asked god for help during or after the attack.

PaperDolls

First of all, I'm staying out of the religion/God/spirituality debate.

You say this is the only thing that ha worked for you in more than 10 years. Great! That's really all that matters. You're ready to work the steps .... even better!! That's what it's about. Stick with that stuff, don't over think it.

You're sponsor saying it "would help" .... I would take it as an experience thing, as in, it helped them and it might help you .... but it's up to you.

Fact is, and many don't like to acknowledge this, lots of atheists have successfully stayed sober using AA.

As a member of AA, I'm there to share my experience, strength, and hope. Not judge others and the path they choose to take.

hypochondriac

I am having the same problem as you epskie. I don't want to use an inanimate object as my higher power but I am naturally put on guard by the word God and even any mention of spirituality! The best substitute I have heard so far was 'Group Of Drunks'. Personally I couldn't have gotten sober or remained that way without the help of other alcoholics so that seems like a good option for me x

PaperDolls

I've been in the program for a little bit and sometimes still the word God makes me feel funny. In the past, I used to feel like it was being pushed onto me and I was being judged for my beliefs. Looking back, most of that was made up in my head. I won't say that you won't be judged by some people, but generally those aren't people that have anything I want so ... eh, they can shove it.

Today, I choose not to say the Lord's Prayer at the closing of meetings. In nearly 4 years, only one person has said a word about it. He said, "Do you know that prayer?", "Yes I do." I replied, and that was it. He even still smiles at me at meetings! I could use my imagination to figure out what he meant by it but more than likely, my imagination would be wrong, and ultimately, it doesn't matter anyway.



I'm not sure any of that made sense or even helped but .... that's all I got.

DisplacedGRITS

I don't believe in God but i do have a spiritual Higher Power. I'm a spiritual person and i do believe in karma and positive and negative energies and such so that's my kind of higher power. I believe that if i keep my life and the energies in and around me in balance, i'll be happy. That includes not holding in all my negative thoughts, not letting myself be surrounded my chaos. I believe that the energy you put out and surround yourself with is the most important thing in your life. It's what feeds you. That's why when i crave or am in crisis, i give my negative, self destructive energy away to my Higher Power to dispose of. It takes care of it for me and i no longer have to worry about it. Sometimes i get rid of it at meetings, sometimes on SR, talking, journaling, meditating, crying it out, whatever. The important thing is i give it away.

Db1105

I made the AA Fellowship and The 12 Steps a power greater than myself. It's worked for me for over 34 years. I've given the religious stuff a good try. It hasn't worked for me

Sapling

That's awesome...I didn't know you had that much time...Fantastic!!

Stevie1

Like many others in AA, I've waffled between aetheist and agnostic pretty much my whole life...but I DO believe that an outside power can help me (because nothing else did) and I do believe in...a collective unconsciousness, something that had a hand in designing the universe, or at least the power of a group to convey collective power to its members. Sort of like a union.

After all, alcohol was a power greater than I; it controlled me and without help, I couldn't quit drinking. Looking at it from that perspective it's not that hard to conceive of a benevolent Higher Power. I'm certainly not arrogant enough to claim that I am the highest power in my universe! Obviously there are forces that I can't overcome - storms, large crowds, whatever.

My sponsor is also agnostic (self-described) but she's made the program work for her for 17 years.

Forgot to add: Einstein's views on religion resonate a lot with me:
Religious views of Albert Einstein - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

onlythetruth

epskie,

Congratulations on your 3 months. That is an accomplishment!

After I decided to quit drinking, I joined AA and was a member for a number of years. Although I am not an atheist, I never believed that God, or any other power outside myself, was responsible for my recovery. For me, that made it extremely difficult to be an AA member. Because, although it's true that AA's principles don't demand that you believe that the Christian God gets you sober, they DO demand that you believe you're personally powerless over alcohol and that something else provides the power to quit. Well, I didn't believe that, and spend years trying to make sense of it all with acronyms (Group Of Drunks), inanimate objects (that never worked for a minute!) and references to "the universe" and "collective consciousness", but in the end it didn't fit me at all...which really put me in a bind. There was so much social pressure for me to declare my powerlessness, etc.....and I did it....even though I didn't believe it....and after a while I started feeling almost as bad about myself as I did when I was drinking. Because I was living a lie, declaring that I believed something that I did not in fact believe.

One thing AA did teach me that it is a very bad idea to try to live a lie in recovery. It was kind of ironic that this very teaching ultimately led me away from that program, but there it is. You can "fake it" for only so long. At least that was my experience.

I tell you this not to try to discourage you from going to AA. If you feel that AA is the right path for you, that's absolutely your choice. We all do what we have to do. But I will also say this: if you truly are not comfortable with the belief system, you might want to think about whether it makes sense for you to twist yourself into knots trying to fit yourself into it when there are so many other ways of approaching recovery.

CAGED04

you all have a god and he loves you ,if choose to ignore him he still will not leave you ,iv e seen things in my life i know there is a god

Dee74

Lets try and not drift too far off the original question, thanks guys

D