Not an alcoholic, but attending closed meetings?
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Originally Posted by ColetteTocca 
Perhaps there are 12 step programs that focus on anger management or battering/abuse? One of the fundamentals of any program is rigorous honesty that addresses your particular issue. I imagine that there is at least one person in the AA group you are attending that you can lead you in the right direction.
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Originally Posted by langkah
Dans, if you're there because you have emotional problems that lead you to abuse those you love it occurs to me you need help in considering the needs of others, somehow elevating their needs and your concern for their well being to a higher level of importance in your mind.
That you are putting your need to be understood ahead of the new alcoholic's need to hear as clearly as is possible about a way to live a life without continuing to kill themselves with drink is not showing a healthy level of concern for others. I'm not sure how AA members can fulfill your need to be understood since their experience with their problem matches yours tangetially at best.
That you are putting your need to be understood ahead of the new alcoholic's need to hear as clearly as is possible about a way to live a life without continuing to kill themselves with drink is not showing a healthy level of concern for others. I'm not sure how AA members can fulfill your need to be understood since their experience with their problem matches yours tangetially at best.
Originally Posted by langkah
Were you to not speak and only listen, passing when called on it would disrupt what is happening in the meeting to a lesser degree, but it's quite hard to measure or forsee the possible effects of having you there. Someone may just say hi to you instead of new person and a conversation that should have taken place will never then happen. Unintentionally you could provide a distraction that would prevent a new person from altering their downward course.
I would not care to be even partially responsible for that. Your effort to change your patterns to become more considerate of others needs would seem to require that you find another way to get the help you need.
I would not care to be even partially responsible for that. Your effort to change your patterns to become more considerate of others needs would seem to require that you find another way to get the help you need.
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Originally Posted by Sapling
This program is about fixing a spritual malady.....
Lack of power, that was our dilemma. We had to find a power by which we could live, and it had to be a Power greater than ourselves. Obviously. But where and how were we to find this Power?
Well, that's exactly what this book is about. Its main object is to enable you to find a Power greater than yourself which will solve your problem. Page 45 BB
Lack of power, that was our dilemma. We had to find a power by which we could live, and it had to be a Power greater than ourselves. Obviously. But where and how were we to find this Power?
Well, that's exactly what this book is about. Its main object is to enable you to find a Power greater than yourself which will solve your problem. Page 45 BB
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Originally Posted by Pigtails
I can see the arguments on both sides. But, Dan, I really don't understand how listening to alcoholics share their problems and solutions helps you solve yours? From what I've learned, AA is a program of recovery, of working steps, which include sharing with and helping other alcoholics. The Twelth Step is to carry the message to other alcoholics who are suffering. So how can you do the steps and how does the program help you?
How is this not great?
Originally Posted by Pigtails
In any event I really feel that the people who have the right to decide this issue are the alcoholics who attend the closed meetings you attend. I think you should speak up at a group conscience meeting and let them know your situation and see what they suggest you do. If it makes them uncomfortable to have you there because it is dishonest-- and, let's fact it, a non-alcoholic attending an alcoholics-only meeting is inherently dishonest-- then you should take the extra effort to attend the open meetings even if it means more inconvenience to you. I have no problem with you being in AA but it is the "closed" part that bothers me, and I think would bother most people and should bother you if you are being honest with yourself (which is perhaps why you came to post here about it?). If it helps you that much then it shouldn't be that much of a big deal to go to the open meetings over the closed meetings, and no one could say anything to you about being there.
Good luck.
Good luck.
Thanks.
Its_me_jen
Join Date: May 2004
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Originally Posted by dans
I could always rationalize whatever behavior by claiming to be misunderstood. I'm not asking anyone in AA to understand the particulars of my situation. I'm there to relate--to understand--how my thinking problems are like the thinking problems of an alcoholic.
How about therapy? Or as was suggested go to a group that addressed your problem, Emotional Anonymous.
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Originally Posted by Sapling
I think the whole thing is kind of pointless. There not gonna prove at the door if you are an alkie or not. I swear there are people that go to meetings simply because they are lonely. You can't ask to see their traffic history when they come through the door. I'm sure it happens...Two things....I'm not going to drink over it...And I'm not going to attend less meetings because of it. I guess if you wanted to be honest about it...You could force feed yourself a 12 pack and you would probably have a desire to quit drinking. You're in!
Originally Posted by Sapling
What about addicts?...My meetings are filled with them....We don't kick em out because it's not alcohol. They are there to better themselves and that's all that counts.
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Originally Posted by laurie6781
YES. Attend only "OPEN" AA meetings. Do not attempt to share and just sit and listen.
Open AA Meetings: Are open to the public but only Admitted Alcoholics share.
Closed AA Meetings: Closed to the public, only Admitted Alcoholics attend and share.
Love and hugs,
Open AA Meetings: Are open to the public but only Admitted Alcoholics share.
Closed AA Meetings: Closed to the public, only Admitted Alcoholics attend and share.
Love and hugs,
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Originally Posted by sugarbear1
I suggest letting the group know you. Get to open meetings and respect that which saved you. Just a suggestion. Of course, many of us work closely with our sponsors in an honest program of recovery. There is Emotional Anonymous. Maybe they would help you more.
Whatever works, though!
Whatever works, though!
Originally Posted by sugarbear1
I think your dishonesty is bothering you-which is why you hide behind a computer and mention it in here.
Best wishes to you,
Best wishes to you,
I sincerely believe that meetings are part of my "sobriety." I do not want to slip. I do not want to fail. I'm trying to figure out a way to do that without injuring others.
Thank you.
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Originally Posted by langkah
That you are putting your need to be understood ahead of the new alcoholic's need to hear as clearly as is possible about a way to live a life without continuing to kill themselves with drink is not showing a healthy level of concern for others. I'm not sure how AA members can fulfill your need to be understood since their experience with their problem matches yours tangetially at best.
Were you to not speak and only listen, passing when called on it would disrupt what is happening in the meeting to a lesser degree, but it's quite hard to measure or forsee the possible effects of having you there. Someone may just say hi to you instead of new person and a conversation that should have taken place will never then happen. Unintentionally you could provide a distraction that would prevent a new person from altering their downward course.
I would not care to be even partially responsible for that. Your effort to change your patterns to become more considerate of others needs would seem to require that you find another way to get the help you need.
So well said.
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Originally Posted by PaperDolls
Sound to me like you're rationalizing this dishonest behavior to best suit you, therefore you have no regard for others in the group.
How about therapy? Or as was suggested go to a group that addressed your problem, Emotional Anonymous.
How about therapy? Or as was suggested go to a group that addressed your problem, Emotional Anonymous.
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But isn't there such a thing as a dry drunk? One that doesn't even have to drink to exhibit the same problems that are the root cause of alcoholism? It sounds to me like Dans has the same issues and behaviors, whether he drinks or never has. And people that do drugs,or have other addictions also attend AA meetings when they can't get to a meeting for their particular addiction, correct?
I wouldn't try to answer the question of whether it's okay for you to attend closed meetings or not, but maybe he could pose it to a member of that particular home group and see what others have to say.
I wouldn't try to answer the question of whether it's okay for you to attend closed meetings or not, but maybe he could pose it to a member of that particular home group and see what others have to say.
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Originally Posted by Hanna
But isn't there such a thing as a dry drunk? One that doesn't even have to drink to exhibit the same problems that are the root cause of alcoholism? It sounds to me like Dans has the same issues and behaviors, whether he drinks or never has. And people that do drugs,or have other addictions also attend AA meetings when they can't get to a meeting for their particular addiction, correct?
I wouldn't try to answer the question of whether it's okay for you to attend closed meetings or not, but maybe he could pose it to a member of that particular home group and see what others have to say.
I wouldn't try to answer the question of whether it's okay for you to attend closed meetings or not, but maybe he could pose it to a member of that particular home group and see what others have to say.
"Putting out of our minds the wrongs others had done, we resolutely looked for our own mistakes. Where had we been selfish, dishonest, self-seeking and frightened? Though a situation had not been entirely your fault, we tried to disregard the other person involved entirely. Where were we to blame? The inventory was ours, not the other man's. When we saw our faults we listed them. We placed them before us in black and white. We admitted our wrongs honestly and were willing to set these matters straight." ~Alcoholics Anonymous, 4th Edition, How It Works, pg. 67~
This is SO powerful for me. Not to seek to be understood, but to understand.
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Originally Posted by dans
In a lot of ways I feel that this is addressing my particular issue - that wrong thinking on my part leads to be behaviors that make myself and others miserable, and that by acknowledging that behavior to myself and to those I've hurt, and recognizing that I can't fix this without a HP, I'm taking actions that lead to serenity.
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Originally Posted by ColetteTocca
It's very simple: You need a program or therapist that deals directly with your abusive behavior. Right now it feels "good" to you but it's not DIRECTLY addressing issues that people who are battering need to face.
[And to be clear, re: "battering," I've never, ever hit or even hinted at hitting another person or harming them in any physical sense. Never. Period. Abuse takes many forms. I'd like to leave it at that.]
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I have to wonder too whether going to AA is really dealing with whatever problem you have, or whether it's simply satisfying you that it is?
You're gonna do what you're gonna do Dans - but yeah, it smacks of dishonesty and selfishness to me.
D
You're gonna do what you're gonna do Dans - but yeah, it smacks of dishonesty and selfishness to me.
D
Its_me_jen
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Originally Posted by dans
I feel that I'm honestly addressing these issues.
And my intent is not to take your inventory, I'm responding to your orginal question asking for opinions on this. I'm sorry you don't like my opinion.
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Originally Posted by dans
I'm not an alcoholic but I've been attending closed meetings for awhile now. I have emotional problems that make me abusive to the people I love.
That said, nowhere is it written nor it it any part of AA that one needs to be an alcoholic to attend closed meetings. Ok..? You do not have to be an alcoholic to attend OPEN OR CLOSED meetings.
There is ONE requirement to attend closed meetings of AA: "The only requirement for A.A. membership is a desire to stop drinking" Open meetings, as their name suggests, are open to everyone. If you want to attend closed meetings and you meet that one simple requirement, you're welcome.
As for sharing......understand this please: there are alcoholics there who absolutely NEED that program of recovery or they're going to drink again (because they can't keep themselves sober) and for them, their next relapse might be the last one they're alive to have. Now, the 12 steps will guarantee that person recovery IF they take them, if they work them and IF they incorporate them into their life. When it comes to your time to share, out of respect for the ppl who may die if they get an "alternate program," your version of the program, your personal program, etc.....basically, not the one the came to AA to get, I'd ask that you consider VERY carefully if you should be sharing at all. AA isn't group therapy.....they have group therapy just for ppl who want group therapy.
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Originally Posted by DayTrader
That said, nowhere is it written nor it it any part of AA that one needs to be an alcoholic to attend closed meetings. Ok..? You do not have to be an alcoholic to attend OPEN OR CLOSED meetings.
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