13th Stepper?
Guest
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 3,452
What is the 13th Step?
Question: I have heard people refer to "The 13th Step" or "13th Stepping." What does it mean or refer to?
Answer: There are no dating rules in A.A. but within the fellowship there is a cultural resistance to dating newcomers. See this answer for more.
Typically "The 13th Step" is used as a derogatory term which loosely refers to "hitting on newcomers."
Most commonly it is used to refer to men who have several years of sobriety that make a habit of trying to date or take advantage of women new to A.A. (but is not always limited to men).
Referring to "13th-stepping" can be a way of describing predatory behavior which takes advantage of the emotional instability of newcomers to A.A. - those who are "pretty mangled" by emotional trauma before they get to the fellowship that they hope offers a safe harbor.
One definition of Step Thirteen is to say that it involves adding Step 1 to Step 12, ignoring the rest; "My life is unmanageable and I want to share it with you!"
The term is not always used with the negative connotations and sometimes used to simply add humor in describing the foibles and challenges encountered when dating in A.A.
~
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...13th-step.html
Question: I have heard people refer to "The 13th Step" or "13th Stepping." What does it mean or refer to?
Answer: There are no dating rules in A.A. but within the fellowship there is a cultural resistance to dating newcomers. See this answer for more.
Typically "The 13th Step" is used as a derogatory term which loosely refers to "hitting on newcomers."
Most commonly it is used to refer to men who have several years of sobriety that make a habit of trying to date or take advantage of women new to A.A. (but is not always limited to men).
Referring to "13th-stepping" can be a way of describing predatory behavior which takes advantage of the emotional instability of newcomers to A.A. - those who are "pretty mangled" by emotional trauma before they get to the fellowship that they hope offers a safe harbor.
One definition of Step Thirteen is to say that it involves adding Step 1 to Step 12, ignoring the rest; "My life is unmanageable and I want to share it with you!"
The term is not always used with the negative connotations and sometimes used to simply add humor in describing the foibles and challenges encountered when dating in A.A.
~
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...13th-step.html
Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 1,149
This is one of the things that turned me off AA in the past..... watching these guys it was so obvious what they were up to.
I found it even worse in a narconon meeting.
Ive gotten over it though. Seems like the good outweighs the bad and these goofs are certainly not confined to meetings,theyre everywhere, after all.
I found it even worse in a narconon meeting.
Ive gotten over it though. Seems like the good outweighs the bad and these goofs are certainly not confined to meetings,theyre everywhere, after all.
Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,649
Men have tried to pick me up everywhere: in the grocery store, in bars, in diners, so....if a man tries to pick me up in an AA room, it is really not that strange.
I am a little disappointed that they haven't tried to pick me up in AA.
heee!
I am a little disappointed that they haven't tried to pick me up in AA.
heee!
Member
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Merritt Island, Fl
Posts: 1,164
The rooms of AA/NA isnt exactly the most stable cross section of society. Manipulation was how most of us survived, and it takes time to learn that we dont have to live like that anymore.
Om, Aum, Ohm...
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Punxsutawney/Pittsburgh
Posts: 4,797
13th stepping, as I've witnessed it, is not just sexually predatory behavior. I've seen newcomers bullied into running errands, cleaning houses, doing yard work or repairs, free of charge, for "sponsors" who tell them, "This will humble you so you can stay sober."
It's why I suggest to any newcomer not to choose a sponsor based on the length of her or his sobriety or just on what she or he says in meetings. How does that person live outside of meetings? Does that person make suggestions based on experience or issue commands and make demands from some position of authority?
Those with long-term sobriety are often given respect, but if they're demanding it, or demanding some other benefit, directly or in a sly, manipulative way, because they see it as their "due," steer clear. I know a lot of oldtimers who are well respected because, after decades of sobriety, they still work tirelessly in carrying the message to the newcomer. They haven't forgotten where they come from, and they are in full awareness that they are just one alcoholic among many in the rooms, no better or higher on the AA ladder (fyi: there's no ladder) than anyone else. They aren't without fault, but they use that 10th step, so you'll soon enough know their faults.
Peace & Love,
Sugah (who now steps off the soap box)
It's why I suggest to any newcomer not to choose a sponsor based on the length of her or his sobriety or just on what she or he says in meetings. How does that person live outside of meetings? Does that person make suggestions based on experience or issue commands and make demands from some position of authority?
Those with long-term sobriety are often given respect, but if they're demanding it, or demanding some other benefit, directly or in a sly, manipulative way, because they see it as their "due," steer clear. I know a lot of oldtimers who are well respected because, after decades of sobriety, they still work tirelessly in carrying the message to the newcomer. They haven't forgotten where they come from, and they are in full awareness that they are just one alcoholic among many in the rooms, no better or higher on the AA ladder (fyi: there's no ladder) than anyone else. They aren't without fault, but they use that 10th step, so you'll soon enough know their faults.
Peace & Love,
Sugah (who now steps off the soap box)
Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 567
Found it in archives
Yes, doing someone else’s inventory is permitted, but it is also generally frowned upon.
Why? Well, it is understood among longer-lived members of this fellowship that true personal recovery does not come from doing another’s inventory, but from sticking to one’s own. Another thing that’s permitted but generally frowned upon is “Thirteenth Stepping”.
Just as AA is not a lending bank, an employment center, or a social club, AA is also not a dating service.
How did today’s concept of “Thirteenth Stepping” arise? Originally, Old-timers recognized that our 12 Step program was indeed a ‘one day at a time’ lifelong effort.
The original usage of “Thirteenth Step” was as a euphemism used by the first AA’s to signify one’s final step into the casket. After practicing the 12 Steps throughout a lifetime, it was said the deceased AA had made the “13th Step’ into the grave.”
Later, as the fellowship's experience grew, the term “13th Step” took on its contemporary usage.
The “Thirteenth Step” is commonly defined as the practice of dating a newcomer, or another AA member, with less than solid sobriety.
It is widely accepted that romantic relationships are never easy, even for non- alcoholics. Bearing in mind that alcohol and addiction is a very real potential death sentence for an alcoholic, if we choose to risk the very personal emotional trauma which may arise from an unsuccessful union, we then also risk the life of another out of our own self-will.
The admonition on pg. 119 of the “Twelve & Twelve” is an understatement of great magnitude.
Certainly the likelihood for newcomers, or those of questionably stable sobriety, who are pursued for
(or who do pursue) romantic relationships, is that emotional handicaps shall indeed rise up and cripple them, causing a significant number of them to relapse — a relapse which can become a “13th Step” death sentence.
Hence it’s easy to understand how the term “13th Stepping” came to mean what it does today.
That’s why “Thirteenth Stepping”, among informed members of the Fellowship, is viewed as the most self-seeking, willful, and inconsiderate behavior, and is understandably despised and discouraged.
Clearly, playing fast and loose with another person’s life is irresponsible and reprehensible. The old saying, “there’s a slip under every skirt”, in this day and age is so cute and coy that it fails to fully emphasize this most serious of problems.
“The problem being…?” you ask?
If you are actively practicing the “Thirteenth Step”, look no further than the closest mirror and you will see that perhaps the root of the problem is you.
From The Victor Valley May 2003 Newsletter.
http://www.soberplace.com/13thstep.html
THE ORIGIN OF THE 13th STEP
Yes, doing someone else’s inventory is permitted, but it is also generally frowned upon.
Why? Well, it is understood among longer-lived members of this fellowship that true personal recovery does not come from doing another’s inventory, but from sticking to one’s own. Another thing that’s permitted but generally frowned upon is “Thirteenth Stepping”.
Just as AA is not a lending bank, an employment center, or a social club, AA is also not a dating service.
How did today’s concept of “Thirteenth Stepping” arise? Originally, Old-timers recognized that our 12 Step program was indeed a ‘one day at a time’ lifelong effort.
The original usage of “Thirteenth Step” was as a euphemism used by the first AA’s to signify one’s final step into the casket. After practicing the 12 Steps throughout a lifetime, it was said the deceased AA had made the “13th Step’ into the grave.”
Later, as the fellowship's experience grew, the term “13th Step” took on its contemporary usage.
The “Thirteenth Step” is commonly defined as the practice of dating a newcomer, or another AA member, with less than solid sobriety.
It is widely accepted that romantic relationships are never easy, even for non- alcoholics. Bearing in mind that alcohol and addiction is a very real potential death sentence for an alcoholic, if we choose to risk the very personal emotional trauma which may arise from an unsuccessful union, we then also risk the life of another out of our own self-will.
The admonition on pg. 119 of the “Twelve & Twelve” is an understatement of great magnitude.
Certainly the likelihood for newcomers, or those of questionably stable sobriety, who are pursued for
(or who do pursue) romantic relationships, is that emotional handicaps shall indeed rise up and cripple them, causing a significant number of them to relapse — a relapse which can become a “13th Step” death sentence.
Hence it’s easy to understand how the term “13th Stepping” came to mean what it does today.
That’s why “Thirteenth Stepping”, among informed members of the Fellowship, is viewed as the most self-seeking, willful, and inconsiderate behavior, and is understandably despised and discouraged.
Clearly, playing fast and loose with another person’s life is irresponsible and reprehensible. The old saying, “there’s a slip under every skirt”, in this day and age is so cute and coy that it fails to fully emphasize this most serious of problems.
“The problem being…?” you ask?
If you are actively practicing the “Thirteenth Step”, look no further than the closest mirror and you will see that perhaps the root of the problem is you.
From The Victor Valley May 2003 Newsletter.
http://www.soberplace.com/13thstep.html
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