LexieCat

See, I find it much easier to have none than just one or two.

One or two drinks? Pffft. What's the point?

stephnc

Settle down, Toronto...just because we take a topic that you've introduced and explore several aspects of it doesn't mean we're not on the same "wavelength" as you, or that we don't appreciate your point. Your use of a popular tv show to illustrate your observation about a misconception that exists in the culture at large is a valid one (although I do think you chose a particularly poor example...I've heard "Family Guy" described as "The Simpsons" for people with low IQs, so it's not hard for me to assume that any attempt they made at satire fell pretty flat.)

As for the "moderation" concept and the degree of damage it does or does not cause us. One of the first things that many of us in recovery learn (particularly if we are in AA) is that other people - those who do not suffer from the disease of alcoholism - find it nearly impossible to understand our predicament or to relate to its ideas of mental obsession and physical craving. I think a valid question to ask ourselves is, do we really have an urgent need to educate and convince others of what we know so surely? Does a certain degree of ignorance on the part of the general public truly harm us? I'd be interested in hearing about any concrete examples you can provide of how public opinions/policies/etc. on the topic of moderation as a "moral" or societal norm actually affect any of us in tangible ways.

Otherwise - as I said earlier and as many of us are used to hearing often - what other people think about me is none of my business.

Toronto68

"do we really have an urgent need to educate and convince others of what we know so surely?"

Earlier I said it would be nice if that kind of understanding were out there more, and that was in reaction to what someone else said. But I was more interested in people who think they might have a drinking problem or who are going through denial about it.

"Does a certain degree of ignorance on the part of the general public truly harm us?"

The general public (not people who recognize alcoholism in themselves) interact with newbies, the people that are coming to terms with alcoholism. The conversations they have with non-alcoholics and others who don't share the same views about alcoholism are part and parcel of what gets included in lots of posts here almost every day. On one end, someone has a spouse or a mother literally handing alcohol to the alcoholic; on the other end, we have people anxious about "too many questions" about why they don't want a drink. Putting aside the authorship of the harm, the harm exists for the alcoholic with something to gain by not drinking.

"any concrete examples you can provide of how public opinions/policies/etc. on the topic of moderation as a "moral" or societal norm actually affect any of us in tangible ways"

I'm not sure which form of opinion and policy you mean, so that holds me back on providing examples. You could mean legislative things or company culture. There are legal systems that allow consumption and tax the consumption but punish the outcomes of the consumption. Moderation is inherent in those structures, you could say. But when alcoholic people begin to take successful steps in understanding their addiction, they realize that the ability of others to apply moderation within consumption is not an ability owned by them. They accept the difference between what we call, for the sake of brevity, normal drinkers and themselves (alcoholics). Some people who are new to this site have already worked through this understanding; others start studying it after they join; still others wage a war within themselves for much longer, even after a period of sobriety or what was thought to be recovery. Moderation doesn't work for them because drinking doesn't work them, not the way it does for normal drinkers. Since I don't know of any policies that force an alcoholic to drink, I can't provide concrete examples that affect an alcoholic in tangible ways. I can only have the opinion that an alcoholic who knows he/she can't drink like a normal drinker should not see others as responsible for picking up a drink.

"Settle down, Toronto..."

You will not tell me what to do.

Danae

Hi Lexie,

I agree with you! I meant that in terms of not rocking the boat with family and "fitting in" it would have been easier to drink one or two before dinner. Not that it would have been easy/possible for me to do it in practice. It wasn't, and I couldn't and I don't.

Danae

Hi stephnc,

Not a direct answer to this question, but as a mom I wish that alcohol education were aimed at kids before they start drinking (whatever age that might be!). As part of this I'd like them to know that moderation does not work if one is an alcoholic or has alcoholic tendencies. As future drinkers, not knowing this may cause them harm.

Basic education about what alcoholism is and isn't for the general public would be great as well. Whether or not this ignorance about moderation harms me as an alcoholic or not, it is a public health issue, like proper nutrition or wearing seatbelts. General knowledge minus the misconceptions and stereotypes might benefit society as a whole. (ok, so that was a sweeping generalization--notice that I said "might")

Not sure whose role it is to provide that education--that's beyond my pay grade. I discussed it with my kid, and his school had an excellent drug/alcohol education program. In fact, I learned a lot about addiction at a parent meeting chaired by a very upscale, articulate former heroin addict. I learned that addicts and alcoholics are all around us, some recovering, and some not! Led me to realize...oops, I could be one too

So....from that point of view I would like to see more realistic and/or compassionate depictions of alcoholism in the media.


D