RobbyRobot

I know that feeling confused or unsure about whatever is not always indicative that something is wrong or about to go sideways. I've learned to have an abundance of cautious patience and time aside for honest reflection before passing judgements on myself. Or others. In overcoming fears we can sometimes passionately look deep into the eye of the beast and see the calm in the center of the chaos. Peacfulness is not always won on what we proactively do, sometimes it is won on what we simply won't do, don't do, refuse to do, has been my experience. I know for me, my journey started, one day, with just not drinking alcohol that day. And then again. And then one day I started to accomplish more than just not drink. And here I am.

FWIW, this thread is not confusing me in the sense that I don't appreciate the different ESH of the posters. As a matter of fact, it's all the different posts which enrich the thread, and therefore empower and support the OP's path to freedom from drinking, as well as other posters. It's a win/win.

Also from my experience is that my path to sober spiritual living has always been a winding journey and not a straight path from here to there, and I've noticed that others too go here and there as well themselves as they walk in there own shoes. We share the journey, and there is no destination charted that I'll ever find, or want to ever find. It's the journey is the thing.

Rob

suki44883

Having a positive attitude is always helpful; however, there is also a thing sometimes called the "pink cloud." Rather than try to explain it, I found this, which explains it pretty well:

The "pink cloud" is best described as a period of time where the addict or alcoholic experiences a reprieve from the struggles associated with early recovery. These struggles are generally associated with the feelings of depression, anger, resentment, self pity and the realization of where their drug addiction or alcoholism has taken them.

Upon experiencing this phenomenon for the first time, the addict or alcoholic is understandably excited. They begin to believe they now "hold the key" to their recovery. This is where the seed for relapse is planted. They begin to believe more in themselves than in the process they have been following. Without the pain as a daily reminder, they tend to forget about what it took for them to embrace recovery. Denial rears its ugly head and they minimize how devastating their drug addiction and alcoholism really was and that they have a disease of drug addiction and alcoholism that requires attention on a daily basis. Relapse prevention becomes an afterthought as the person becomes defiant and rebellious regarding suggestions contrary to their desires. Without resorting to drugs or alcohol, the individual in recovery is one step away from relapse. Remember, relapse is not an event, it is a process.

I would add that recovery, too, is not an event, but a process. I don't think anyone here is saying that you aren't sincere in your beliefs, but it is important to know the pitfalls. If you truly are an alcoholic (I know, you don't like labels), this false sense of security can vanish as quickly as it came. Good luck to you.

SSIL75

I had not heard that term before but I can relate! I experienced it a week into the last time I quit (time before this). I had spent a week thinking, crying, feeling very vulnerable. And then went and bought a box of wine because I had it all figured out!

It took a few months for me to come back.

eremc08

I believe in myself, and my own process. I'm not an AA follower or the Big Book fan. I'm a leader for myself. Some of you are seriously being close minded here. You say the ONLY way is by the AA standards and practices and to admit I'm an alcoholic. I've already done that, admitted I have a problem. My next step is to change the way I think and do things. Just because a lot of people who have done this failed doesn't mean everyone will fail; Doesn't mean that I will fail at it. They make a book, and they want to sell a book... I feel like I'm in that South Park episode where Stan's dad needs to cut down and everyone tells him he is powerless over his disease and can't do anything about it but admit he's an alcoholic and stop drinking. The best thing to do is stop drinking and admit you have a problem. But to accept that for the rest of your life, even if you know you won't drink again, is just not in my vocabulary.

Quote books all you want. Everyone is different and has different goals. The only one who sets me up to fail is myself. If I work at it each day that is all I can do. But I believe I'm strong enough to know what I'm capable of. I've given up cocaine on my own, heroin, smoking weed and cigs (quit all at age 18), and this is just another one that I know I can do on my own, without the preachings of AA members and fellow addicts. None of you know me. I find it extremely disturbing that most of you think there's only one way out of this. There are many ways to do something.

I am an alcoholic and have felt addicted to alcohol. Living each day is my goal right now. I do not feel the same EACH day. Today I feel NOT addicted. Tomorrow may be different but I will get through it knowing that I am better than the substance that will try and sneak up on me. I am holding myself accountable for every action, and that way I will try my best to make the right decisions.

Everyone's recovery process is different, as each person is different. When I discipline my children, I do not always use the same way to teach them right and wrong, or punish the same way. They are different kids with different personalities and cannot learn or live by only one way of teaching.

I apologize if you are confused. I am not.

suki44883

I can't speak for anyone but myself, but I am not pushing AA at all. I have almost 2 1/2 years sober and I didn't use AA. Of course it's possible without AA. All I am suggesting is to be careful of a false sense of security. If you can handle that for the rest of your life, then great! I hope you can. As I said, I don't think anyone here is questioning your sincerity. Again, good luck to you.

eremc08

I know about the false sense of security and am acutely aware of it. I do feel secure right now and that's all that matters. I do still have my invisible wall up with a big door and lock. When alcohol enters my thoughts I will have to keep that door locked. For now, though, when I think about it, I'm still envisioning a tiny troll laughing.. and it makes me want to kick it in it's head.

RobbyRobot

Yup. I hear you.
Well said.

Robby

SSIL75

I agree with the PP. People are not pushing AA or its agenda. I am not in AA. Don't identify with it. In fact I find it a little creepy. I think maybe you're seeing what you want to see.

I sincerely wish you well on your journey. Do stick around and keep us posted!

Freedom1990

Could you point those posts out? I re-read this thread, and I didn't see anyone saying AA is the only way.

AA was the answer for me, but I don't pretend to think it's the only way for everyone, nor do I say it's the only way.

I can only share from my own experience what has worked for me.

Best of luck to you in your life, honestly.

jamdls

Erem, I say follow your heart and brain and you can win. I did not follow any formal program to stop drinking although I did read the AA book and took guidance from some of the steps and I've not had any desire (I'm actually repulsed by even the smell of alcohol) nor need for alcohol in over 3 yrs. I don't like the label 'alcoholic' either, initially I labeled myself alcoholic but I no longer feel that is appropriate, I had a drinking problem, and now I don't, as I no longer drink and I never want to drink again. I consider myself allergic to alcohol and like with any other allergy it is for life and there is no 'cure' except to avoid that which I am allergic to.
My father drank like an alcoholic (it's not my place to label him an alcoholic) for over 40 yrs then quit in his early 60s for health reasons, no formal program he just quit. He had no alcohol for 10 yrs or so but then found he could occassionally have just 1 guinness as that was a 'sipping' beer and for about 10 yrs that's all he did have was that 1 glass occassionally. He now doesn't even have that 1 beer as it no longer tastes good to him.
There is no 1 program that works for everyone, we are all different, as our drinking habits were all different. I hope whatever you do works for you.

eremc08

IMO drinking is not a disease. It can be terrible to some at times, when a person becomes addicted. When the addiction is released and said person is capable of living life differently, whether it's deciding to drink or not to drink, that is by their own free will and choice. The disease term is an AA term. I haven't seen any other recovery program other than 12 steps and AA define alcoholism that way. It's a choice. You are the one deciding to drink or be drunk. A disease is something like cancer. My mother has cancer and is an alcoholic. Drinking is her free will. She chooses to do so every day. Cancer was brought upon her by an uncontrollable growth of cells in her body that formed lumps and attacked other parts of her body. Addiction is in the brain, is controllable, and can be cured by your choice. I choose today not to drink. I'm not sick with alcohol. That doesn't make sense to me. My brain and body were run over by a pleasure-driven substance that I became addicted to. I am no longer bending my life to fit my drinking. I'm choosing to be different and make better decisions.

Each time someone drinks they make a conscious choice to do so. Nobody appears to be responsible for their actions any more, its either religious, the devil made me do it thinking or they have a chemical imbalance or disease etc. What ever happened to anyone taking responsbility for their actions or their lives? I can't be the only one in this world who doesn't see this trend, everybody seems to have an excuse for poor behaviour these days.

I can't forsee what I will do or think in the future, so I cannot answer your question. I know that right now I will not drink and I have faith in myself that I will not again. I can admit today that I have a problem. "Down the line" will come when it does. If I still have a problem then, I will admit it then but I can't admit something now about "down the line".

History of addiction? I said I gave up cocaine, heroin and weed on my own. I tried cocaine for about a month. Didn't like it much. Heroin, about a week or two. Didn't like throwing up and feeling like I was sinking into my own skin. Weed? Well, it made me feel stupid and I had a GPA to worry about.

eremc08

Jamdls - Thank you! I was starting to feel out of place here, like I had fallen in a hole. I know we all have our own beliefs, but I was beginning to feel pressure of AA and that everyone thinks I have to be an alcoholic for life and live with this "disease" .. etc.

So thank you.

Hollyanne

Erem,
Stop already. We get it.
Sorry to hear your mother has cancer. I hope she is not in too much pain and that there is hope for a treatment.
For the love of Mike, don't say anymore about alcohol and the "use" of.

Freedom1990

Actually alcoholism is recognized as a diagnosable disease by the American Medical Association.

I'm in my final year of college to become a RHIT (registered health information technician). Alcoholism is included in the ICD-9-CM coding book, and can be coded as "in remission" among several other 5th digit classifications.

yeahgr8

Yeah its defo recognised as a disease in the US...i am not sure where the disease part came from in AA though as far as i can see it is best described as an illness, a sickness of the body and mind and spirit...

Lets look at the facts...alcohol is broken down 1 unit an hour (well lets say about that anyway) so lets take into account years of drinking and someone just coming off a huge binge... a week before its out of their system sound about right?

One week later no more physical addiction or cravings as the alcohol is out of that persons system...ok lets say 3 months later...any medical professional would confirm with me that it would be impossible to have physical cravings 3 months after the person has stopped imbibing alcohol...thats a fact!

So what makes the person drink again knowing the harm it does and when they dont want to? Ok you have probably heard that it is also a spiritual sickness too but lets take that out of the equation and pretend that the person is in control of their own world and is just making bad choices...surely for that person to make a choice to drink again which is tantamount to putting their hand in an open fire again after beingburned on numerous occasions before must signify, at the very least, that this person is mentally ill...

So is the person mentally ill or suffering from an incurable disease that at best can be treated but never cured? Im going for mentally ill too i prefer it to disease...

Personally i was spiritually, physically and mentally ill/sick and it took willingness, surrender, trust, faith and work to recover...

One thing i know for sure that whether anyone prefers to call themselves mentally ill (remember we covered the choice bit) or suffering from a disease it needs action to change...along the way if the concept of disease is too much to bear, stand your ground and speak up...'I dont have a disease...tsssk...im mentally ill!'.

eremc08

Something I found about that true fact: (^)

The modern theory of alcoholism as a disease was first put forward by E. Morton Jellinek in his famous[13] book "The Disease Concept of Alcoholism".[14] The American Medical Association had declared that alcoholism was an illness in 1956.[15]

In 1980, the American Medical Association's Council on Scientific Affairs (now the Council on Science and Public Health) noted that "alcoholism is in and of itself a disabling and handicapping condition". Between 1980 and 1991, medical organizations, including the AMA, worked together to establish policies regarding their positions on the disease theory. These policies were developed in 1987 in part because third-party reimbursement for treatment was difficult or impossible unless alcoholism were categorized as a disease. The policies of the AMA, formed through consensus of the federation of state and specialty medical societies within their House of Delegates, state, in part:

"The AMA endorses the proposition that drug dependencies, including alcoholism, are diseases and that their treatment is a legitimate part of medical practice."

In 1991, The AMA further endorsed the dual classification of alcoholism by the International Classification of Diseases under both psychiatric and medical sections.

I do NOT need reimbursement for treatment since I'm not seeking medical help, therefore I will continue my belief.

There are a lot of contrasting opinions out there for the alcoholism disease concept. Some say alcoholism shows all the same characteristics as a disease and therefore alcoholics cannot be blamed for their addiction because it’s something they have no control over, much like you have no control over contracting cancer. Others feel that this is an easy way out, that it allows addicts to absolve their responsibility from their addictive behaviours, that addiction is more a state of mind than anything else and that it’s a matter of will in choosing to overcome an addiction. (I agree with the latter)

suki44883

There's really no need to be so defensive. No one here is attacking you, we're just concerned. If you believe in what you are doing, then keep on keeping on. As you said, what works for one might now work for another. If your method works for you, great, but that doesn't mean that it's the correct method for someone else. If you expect others to be open-minded, you need to be open-minded yourself.

Freedom1990

You are perfectly entitled to your belief, and I certainly wasn't trying to change it, dear. I was simply pointing out that it is recognized as a disease by the AMA.

I agree with yeahg8 that it is referred to as an illness in AA (and is mentioned in the Big Book as such), not a disease. Yes, there are many in AA who believe it's a disease, others don't.

My belief in the disease concept does not negate what I did to others during my active drinking days. That's why the steps are there for those of us in AA-to take responsibility for the damage we did indeed do, and make amends to the best of our ability.

Do some use the disease concept as an excuse? You bet. I'm not one of those however.

eremc08

No problem. I wasn't expecting anyone to choose my way of getting better. Just explaining why I think what I think. I don't think it's a disease and the only reason it's accepted that way in the US is because patients who need medical treatment wanted to be reimbursed and the medical community didn't feel the need to pay them back unless it was classified as such.

Fandy

tell me you are joking?