WakeUp

Moderation is important in every part of our lives. (This coming from the one meeting a week person, btw.)
Ok, for instance, I drink tea, I love it. Obviously, since I don't drink alcohol any more Drinking tea is a lot healthier and it's better than drinking booze, so why worry? Well, I'm working on a caffeine addiction, I bought some herbal teas so now I'm taking a look at my caffeine intake and moderating it.

Balance is the key.

Anna

I work on recovery every day, and it's just part of my life.

I am not involved in AA, but I definitely have a recovery mindset. It's a good way to live!

augustwest

each person works their program however they see fit. there isn't a singular formula, nor any benefit from judging or comparing mine to someone elses.

but, regular meeting attendance(as defined by the individual) is absolutely critical. if oldtimers quit going to meetings who would've been there to show the newcomer this new way of life?

Step 12: Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these Steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.

I'm eternally grateful that people were practicing step 12 when i showed up in the rooms and fully intend on doing the same. What that looks like in terms of number of meetings is up to me and certainly will fluctuate as my my life does.

But we can only keep what we have by giving it away. I firmly believe that.

milwaukeeguy85

I think she is using this gentleman at her meeting as an example of a fear that she has that she may have to go to these great lengths the rest of her life to remain sober. I would honestly say that every person is different in their recovery.

personally I get more out of coming on this website than I do out of going to AA meetings since this site is more so people that are serious about making a life change as opposed to beating a criminal charge. I also do not like the focus on God etc at those meetings, and i really hate praying.

Other people thrive on structure- needing meetings and scheduled times to keep their mind and time occupied, so maybe AA is a better choice for them.

At the end of the day the goal is to not only be sober, but be happy sober, regardless of if it takes 1000 meetings a year or 0 meetings your entire life. It appears you are doing well donna, so keep it up.

Eddiebuckle

Mama, the Big Book on page 59 says, "Here are the steps we took, which are suggested as a program of recovery:"

The steps are the very core of AA, and yet are only "suggested." There is no mention of how many meetings one should attend, in fact, meetings are not mentioned at all. Whatever works for the individuals you have encountered only reflects their situation - whether they recognize that fact or not. Those that dogmatically insist that you must follow their path are, in my opinion, acting with contempt prior to investigation.

This recovery thing is as unique as we are, and you will need to find what works for you. If you are rigorously honest in examining what underlies/drives your feelings and reactions, you will likely find your path.

SweetCityWoman

Mama - Thanks for starting exactly the thread I would have started. I too have had the exact same thought and questions - here at 6 weeks. I started going to 6 meetings a week and now am going to 1 or 2. My thoughts are that a recovery program typically helps a person stablize physically and then teaches them skills and tools with the goal of self-reliance and independence from whatever treatment or intervention or program they are in. In the meetings I began to feel like people were telling me not to worry, just let us fill you up and we will be here for you always. The people who were most successful where the ones who go frequently and kept coming back for the longest number of years - like 15 or 20! This seemed counter to my idea of what a recovery program should be and I too wondered why people seemed to have just traded an unhealthy addiction for another addiction - although not physically unhealthy. Sure, better the latter - but why does AA seem to foster dependence on the program? And yes, some do use it as an integral part of their lives and see no problem with it. So why should I question them if they are happy? I guess because in finding my own program I am being influenced by these people (and many say to come daily if you can so the influence is substantial). I was told the idea was to let the program influence my life.

This is powerful stuff and I'm not so sure I want to become dependent on meetings and I know, it is entirely up to me what I do with my program. Yet many tell me they were just like me to begin with and just give it a chance I will come around. I am not feeling totally comfortable with that either. And the usual thing is for people to tell you if you don't come or don't do the steps most likely you will drink again. But the only people we are hearing from is the people in those rooms for who this program has worked not the ones on the outside who have also been successful in recovery.

I know it is not fair to be critical of others and to each his own. Do what works for you. For me going to meetings has been helpful esp. at the beginning. But when someone at a meeting talks about needing something else people act like the choices are limited to AA and they say - try a new meeting! I am right now trying to reclaim my life and move ahead with things I left behind like hobbies and meeting new people etc. The only reason I wonder about others at my meetings is because when you join a club you are part of things and the people are the club. So it is natural to wonder and question the motivations of others and why some come in and never leave because that might be me!

But the goal is to remain sober and work on making one's life better - not suffering even if you are sober. And the paths are many. So we can only learn from those who have walked this path before us. As others have said, it is important to recognize there are many ways to be successful and happy in recovery and it is good to question and plan ahead - not just follow passively because others say it will work.

stugotz

I never went to jail for going to an AA meeting. Just sayin...

oak

SCW- I loved what you said. I also am worried about getting swept away by what others believe in AA. Humans are greatly influenced by other people. We're social animals; we survive by bonding with those around us. Humans are very suggestible which is why marketing and advertising works so well.
You make a great point that we don't hear from people who got what they needed from AA and don't attend meetings.

I get very uncomfortable with many ideas in AA, especially anything that seems like worshipping AA and the BB. Yet- there is a lot about AA that I like and find helpful. I love my 11th step meditation meetings. They feel so comfortable for me.

I think the dependence and rigidity that people have for AA makes it much harder for me to sort out what the right path is for me, because I keep hearing that there is only one way to recover. I get stuck with the idea that I have to work the 12 steps which I don't agree with and probably will skip. That feels blasphemous to say!

I know I am hesitant to voice my concerns out loud in meetings. But I may start doing so in a respectful way, to see if it helps me connect to more like-minded people. I did meet one very cool woman after a meeting and we have very similar beliefs. I wonder if there are more like-minded people in meetings who are also afraid to speak up.

I'm so glad that there have been a few threads lately about the disadvantages of AA. I was feeling very alone with my thoughts!

LexieCat

If you are going to criticize the program, PLEASE don't do it in meetings. The AA program IS the Twelve Steps. You can go there for the support, and skip the Steps--that is your prerogative (though I don't recommend it). But some people quite literally may die unless they work the program as it is set out in the BB. So out of consideration for them, save the doubts and criticisms for discussions outside the meetings.

Believe me, there are plenty of people out there who treat the Steps as optional. For some people they probably are, but for many people they are critical to recovery. A meeting isn't the proper place to debate the program.

SweetCityWoman

I got to know people in the meetings over a few weeks and then discussed my concerns with a couple of them outside of the meetings. In fact just last night I discussed it with someone who is 18 yrs. sober and throughout has gone to meetings. This is a process and I am learning that it takes awhile to work though concerns in order to make a decision how you as a person want to proceed. This can be a confusing time but also a time of great clarity.

I do think that threads like this are helpful because it does give people an opportunity to share concerns and thoughts and hear many different stories and experiences. To me it is very helpful to discuss issues about AA. Some say just not to worry and concentrate on staying sober, however, my mind just doesn't work that way. So once again, everyone approaches this in a different way - the tricky part is finding what will work best for you and knowing what is out there and hearing from others.

SweetCityWoman

Oak - I do find there is a rigidity about AA despite the fact they say that no one is pushing anyone into anything. The paradox is that if you do find some things helpful about going to meetings (which I do) most people then tell you that unless you follow the program fully (e.g., come frequently, do the steps and get a sponsor) you are at risk of drinking which is a scary thing to tell someone early in recovery. So most likely they comply and just believe and hope that simply by following what they are told they will be on the right path and remain sober. And many people do. And this works for many and also doesn't work for many.

People in meetings say you don't need to understand - just keep coming back. There really is not a place in the meetings to express concern - that is also rigid and feels more protective of the group and not helpful to someone with questions. The "helpful" response you get is just not to worry. This makes me worry!! So I do feel on my own to sculpt my own program to get the benefits of AA. But IMO any group where you are not allowed cross-talk or to question things openly is a group that does not want to change and creates an atmosphere where members feel safety within as long as you accept things the way they are.

But again, each person needs to find what is right for them.

mama36

I can see the positive in AA and I can see the questionable things. I am not trying to criticize the program. I just do not at all for one second believe that anyone should be allowed to tell another person that if they don't stick and stay they will not succeed. THEY may need the meetings for good, bad or ugly reasons but they have no place to tell the people that are new that without those meetings they are doomed to failure.

I don't think that everyone in the world believes that if you do not go to church every Sunday you are doomed to burn in the firey pit, do they? I am certain that many here don't believe that. Just the same is saying that if I don't go to a daily meeting I am doomed to burn in the firey pit of alcoholism. One man in my last meeting, and others in other meetings have called it a "congregation". That is BS in my opinion.

Catholics believe theirs is the way, JW believe the same about their beliefs, United the same...AA the same. I believe if it works for you go and go hard. If it is a negative and sad experience then there are MANY other ways.

SMART is great, AADAC is great for me so far, self control, exercise, praying, connecting with the family. These are all ways that different people stay sober.

D.

LexieCat

The difference is... nobody can ever KNOW if anyone is doomed to hell for eternity if they do not follow a particular religious belief, can they?

With alcoholics, some people ARE doomed unless they recover by following a path akin to what AA teaches. That is experience, not blind faith. It may not apply to everyone in the room, but it applies to certain alcoholics, who are unable to recover in any other way. There are plenty of people who were, quite literally, a short way from death, insanity, or an institution until they followed the instructions in the BB.

I would never tell someone that the Steps are optional. Everyone is free to make that choice for themselves, but I'm not going to recommend it. I'm also not going to condemn anyone who chooses not to work them. Alcoholism will do that, or not, depending on what kind of alcoholic they are. No one was ever harmed by working the Steps. They might be harmed by not working them.

But if you are in an AA meeting, you have to accept that the program, as laid out, is the only way for some people to recover. It isn't AA that condemns anyone to alcoholic hell, it is the disease that does that.

Squizz

You ever think that maybe some people just like to go to AA meetings? Often times they are the highlight of my day. And I've also found, that the people who go to meetings with greater frequency tend to stay sober longer, and have better quality sobriety. Should you depend entirely on meetings for your sobriety? No, I don't think so. Often times I can't make it to AA meetings, or there are in fact days where it would seem wise to just stay home and sleep as opposed to pushing myself. But I think a good general rule of thumb is to go to a solid 3-4 meetings a week. Any less than that, and I start to feel dry as a bone. Sometimes, I simply cannot make that many meetings. It just won't fit into my schedule. And on those days, I pick up some literature, call my sponsor, call a fellow drunk, or something to that effect. You don't have to go to a meeting EVERY SINGLE DAY. Of course not. But I've heard it put like this before, and it made a lot of sense to me: "You should go to AA meetings as often as you drank." So if you drank everyday, go to a meeting everyday. (Assuming you can do so of course.) No need to over-analyze this.

LawMama

I think that the people who make AA their life probably lost most of their life to drinking, or alternatively, their life was based around drinking and the people in their life had to go when they got sober. Thus AA becomes not just a program of recovery but a lifestyle and a group of friends. I see nothing wrong with that unless it is causing family problems, marital problems, whatever. I think that statistics would probably show that people who continue to go to AA meetings are more likely to get and stay sober. I KNOW that before AA people rarely recovered from addiction and that research has shown that the 12 steps work better than any other program of recovery.

I have never gotten the message that I need to go to meetings every day to stay sober. In fact, many weeks I can only make one meeting and one separate meeting with my sponsor, and neither my sponsor nor anyone else gives me a hard time for that. Personally I don't think I will HAVE to go to meetings for the rest of my life, but I will probably choose to and will probably be happier because of it. The 12 steps are a very positive way of life for anyone, in my opinion. Not just people who are addicted to something.

As far as AA and the BB being treated like a religion....well, that is probably because for lots of us it is the first thing we could ever really believe in. The "Higher Power" of AA is accessible to everyone, not just those who put their faith into an entire dogma. For many of us, an AA meeting was the first place we ever felt understood and amongst "our people." For many of us, AA saved our lives, physically, spirtitually, emotionally etc.

To each their own. I wish everyone could get what I get out of the program (even going once a week!) but if it doesn't work for you, so be it. I will also echo those who have said it would be inappropriate to criticize the program in a meeting....honestly, what would the point be? Unlikely you are going to change anyone's mind. The program works really well for a long of people.

SweetCityWoman

Just as some people need to follow the AA program strictly, some might do well by taking parts of the program - but to do that they might have questions and need help sculpting their program. So if someone gives-up totally on AA because there is no place to ask questions they might be just as much at risk or threat to life as the person who must follow everything about AA or they are at risk or threat to life. So aren't both of these people just as important? Shouldn't we be looking out for everyone not just "protecting" vulnerable people from someone (who might be just as vulnernable) who needs to ask questions in order to get help forumlating a program that works for them?

LawMama

It is one thing to ask questions about the program, and another to criticize the program in a meeting.

If it is a matter of "well, I don't think I need to have a higher power to stay sober" then maybe talk to someone after the meeting....but it really doesn't seem fair to bring that up in the meeting unless it has to do with the topic that is being discussed.

SweetCityWoman

LawMama -I am not suggesting that anyone criticize or express concerns in the meeting - I would never do that. I actually did talk to people after the meeting about my concerns and that is what I recommend. I was only saying that all people are equal and any person might be at the same risk if they drop out for whatever reason and that is what is most important - people getting the help they need.

Freedom1990

The door swings both ways at AA.

AA offers a solution, and if I don't want that solution, I am free to look in another direction for recovery.

I no longer attend AA because I have to. I attend AA because I want to, and that's usually 1-2 meetings a week, max.

bellakeller

If you have questions or issues about the program, take it to your sponsor. That's what a sponsor is for (among other things).