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Old 11-24-2009, 12:24 PM
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Amen to that.
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Old 11-24-2009, 12:24 PM
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Just a quick question....I'm do not use AA, but I thought I had read several posts before of people using either AA or NA and being welcomed. Is it the area or maybe the group that is meeting that is more apt to accept either an alcoholic or a drug addict? I would understand it more if there was NA available in this particular area, but since NA isn't you would think that they would be more accepting. Maybe it was because it was an "old timer" who is more for tradition. I don't know...I'm just trying to justify turning someone away who is trying to get help.
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Old 11-24-2009, 12:25 PM
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"If alcohol was so different than drugs I wouldn't have been in detox with both. They would have had seperate wings. It isn't that different, I relate a lot more with the AA'ers than with NA'ers. We are more alike than different".

You could make a good arguement based on oldtimer's experiences as well a hard demographic data that combining aa and na would not be a good thing in general. That being said I agree with you in principle. Part of recovery is meditating on the serenity prayer. Your are not going to chang oldtimer's minds nor the general demographic differences that separate the 2.":day6
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Old 11-24-2009, 12:27 PM
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I had a similar discussion with my drug worker....Drink and drugs are both addictions. They wanted me to see a drug counsellor and a drink counsellor...my concern was that the two would conflict, that I would get confused if one counsellor was saying one thing and the other something different.....My drug worker agreed, that both drugs and drink are addictions, and that people who help others with these addictions work in similar ways and seeing too many people, or going to, too many groups can end up confusing a person who is an addict to both.....

if you use and ppl at NA know you have a drink problem too, will they turn they back because its just for people with "drug issues" alone...if you go to AA, will they turn they back because "its just for people with "drink issues" alone....Alot of the time, it seems to me anyway, that alot of people (maybe its just my area) have both a problem with drink and drugs.....which is why now my drug worker has agreed that she will help me with both drink and drugs..

I guess if you have both, then from what I'm reading you can never become a member off AA, or of NA...because its not just one or the other you have an addiction with..Shouldn't it be if you are committed to getting off a "drug" (after all alochol is also a drug) then you are welcome at all meetings and have the same rights as someone whose has one or the other addiction?

I don't know...guess this is just another reason not to go, because of the conflict and confusing between groups.
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Old 11-24-2009, 12:30 PM
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Sounds to me like you're having a bit of trouble identifying in AA. If you could identify completely, then you wouldn't be questioning the necessity of AA's Traditions or wanting to change the primary purpose.

Why not start an NA meeting in your town? Surely there are as many addicts in your area who will not attend AA because they can't completely identify with our primary purpose and the description of the alcoholic.
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Old 11-24-2009, 12:30 PM
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Smacked I got the impression that this person walked into an AA meeting and mentioned he was a narcotic addict and then was told we cant help you here and was immediately asked to leave, but I've been known to be an assumer sometimes, but who knows as no one was actually there to witness what happened.
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Old 11-24-2009, 12:32 PM
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One point I was trying to get across ashlee.....we don't usually turn people away, but I can see how they'd feel that way or feel unwelcome because of AA's Traditions. What I was trying to say is that some of those addicts turn their backs on the program, or they're making excuses about meetings being too far away, too late, too early, etc.

Ashlee, when I need a meeting I'll walk 10 miles to get there, any time of day or night. There are no excuses for not getting my daily dose of recovery.

I also agree with you that we're all in the same boat. I'm an alcoholic, a codependent, and I've dabbled in marijuana, cocaine, overeating, etc. Those are my addictions. But I go to different meetings for them, I go to AA for my alcoholism.

I haven't been in recovery long ashlee, but I know that there are staunch Big Book thumping AA'ers, and there are people like me who believe in AA Lite, soft AA, whatever you wanna call it, and there are people that fall somewhere in the middle. It's been that way for 70 + years, I'm not gonna change it. I'm just going to take what I want, what I need to stay sober, alive, and incredibly happy, and I'll leave the rest.
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Old 11-24-2009, 12:33 PM
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In the one meeting the 'old timer' suggested to go to NA but in the other meeting he told the drug addict that he was not welcome to come here because it is AA and they can't relate therefore they couldn't help him.
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Old 11-24-2009, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by ashleek View Post
In the one meeting the 'old timer' suggested to go to NA but in the other meeting he told the drug addict that he was not welcome to come here because it is AA and they can't relate therefore they couldn't help him.
Hey, if you want to put the focus on someone else, that's your deal, but that person is not going to change for you and neither is AA. That person may not be the most articulate or graceful in his approach to upholding the traditions, but from the sounds of it, that is what he's trying to do.

AA members who uphold the traditions are usually not very popular, but they are necessary.
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Old 11-24-2009, 12:54 PM
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Don't get me wrong, I am not trying to change anything or anyone I just want people to think about it the next time they send someone back on the street, that's all. Like I said in my town there isn't NA. It's not like us addicts go in there and try to change anything we all respect the program for what it is. Turning someone away could really affect their life in a negative way. The person is not as important as the traditions? I'm just thinking about that person, how he must have felt, what he went and done because he was turned away. Being in the state that he was in at the time, what if he killed himself. I couldn't live with myself knowing I turned someone away because as they say 'some are sicker than others'.

I just want people to think that they are people, with a heart, who are going through a terrible time. We have all been there in the beginning. Remember how hard it was to walk into one of those rooms, admitting you had a problem, loosing your pride because you have been defeated by a disease you want to recover from. That's all I am trying to say.
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Old 11-24-2009, 12:54 PM
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Originally Posted by parentrecovers View Post
please. play nice - we're all just hashing around this topic. and from the quick replies, it seems to be a HOT one

Understood, your response did make a bit "hot", a non alcoholic telling AA how we should run OUR meetings and OUR program does that to me on occasion, I had enough codependent non alcoholics tell me how to run my life before I got sober, so when you suggested how we could improve AA I got a little offended, as a matter of fact my response was along the lines of "How DARE you tell us how to run OUR program!!!! that has saved so many lives including possibly your daughters

I do now however understand where you are coming from and

when my daughter got out the first day from 90 days in rehab, she wanted to go to an aa meeting before we took her to her half-way house. and she wanted us (my hubby and i) to go with her - to an open meeting.

needless to say, we had all had a lot of stress and emotions that day. and when we got to what we thought was an open meeting - it started and it was actually a closed meeting. so we were introducing ourselves and my husband apoligized to the folks at the meeting for our mistake, told them what was going on that day, etc, and he and i offered to wait for our daughter at a coffee shop down the street.

the folks at that meeting refused to let us go, told us they understood what a tough day we were having, and focused the meeting discussion around families and alcoholism.

we needed those people that day.
I would have welcomed you and your family that day as well, and done everything in my power to help you good people.

AA is there PRECISELY because we have traditions and adhere to them, every single other program, or group in the past has failed and disappeared because they DIDN'T adhere to these principals. We HAVE to follow our traditions or we will fail, and if we fail many people will die, literally, it's that serious. AA is life and death to many of us so when non alcoholics come in start telling us how to run our program we get understandably angry and threatened, or I do I should say.

As far as "duel addictions" or whatever go, If you have a problem with alcohol, you are welcome at open or closed meetings

I was a "garbage can" alcoholic that smoked marijuana and would put any substance in my body to get loaded, so there are drugs in my story, that offends some purists, if people have a problem with drugs in my story, that's THEIR problem, Bill and Bob and many of the stories in The Big Book have drugs in their stories.

If you have a problem with alcohol, you are in the right place, it doesn't matter what what other problems you have as well, overeating, sex problems, drug problems etc. but if you have a problem with alcohol you are "qualified" to be a member.

I have said this earlier, but I have sponsored more then one Oxy addict/alcoholic and quite a few pothead/alcoholics, I will help anyone that asks for help within my limited means, but open meetings are for non alcoholics to come listen to how alcoholics got sober, and closed meetings are for alcoholics to come learn how to get sober.

I have never kicked anyone out of a meeting, however, as secretary, if I was at a closed meeting I would have to, because the "trusted servants" job is to "enforce" the group conscience, and if it's a closed meeting, that group has decided the meeting is for alcoholics only.

At an open meeting I would offer what support and help I could, and truthfully if I saw an addict at a closed meeting and I wasn't the secretary I would just tell them to keep their mouth shut in order from getting kicked out.

In AA we have sponsored many an addict, and many of them have gone on to found NA groups, this is an approach I agree with. I also have a few hundred friends that attend both fellowships, in AA they identify as alcoholics, and in NA they identify as addicts, because both are true.
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Old 11-24-2009, 01:09 PM
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ago -
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Old 11-24-2009, 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by thiskidknows View Post

if you use and ppl at NA know you have a drink problem too, will they turn they back because its just for people with "drug issues" alone...if you go to AA, will they turn they back because "its just for people with "drink issues" alone...

I guess if you have both, then from what I'm reading you can never become a member off AA, or of NA...because its not just one or the other you have an addiction with..Shouldn't it be if you are committed to getting off a "drug" (after all alochol is also a drug) then you are welcome at all meetings and have the same rights as someone whose has one or the other addiction?

I don't know...guess this is just another reason not to go, because of the conflict and confusing between groups.


At the start of every NA meeting in my area, we read from the literature, and one of the things we read is that Alcohol IS a drug, we must not be confused about it...

We have many people in our groups who have issues with both, and I've been at meeting where people identified as both an alcoholic and an addict and they were not called out on it.

I myself am not an alcoholic, and when reading AA literature, do not "find myself'" and identify the way I do with NA literature, even though both are addictions.

In NA we focus on the disease of addiction, and again, at every meeting, we read from our literature that what we are there for is recovery from the disease of addiction, we don't care what you used, how much etc...so, any addict who wants to recover is welcome, no matter the substance.

Having multiple or cross addictions is NOT a reason to stay away.
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Old 11-24-2009, 01:18 PM
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see, sounds like NA would be a perfect place for this guy! There's over 15 meetings within 15-20 miles of there. I hope he found them!
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Old 11-24-2009, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Threshold View Post

I myself am not an alcoholic, and when reading AA literature, do not "find myself'" and identify the way I do with NA literature, even though both are addictions.
my daughter is an alcoholic/addict. the drug use (coke) was limited to about the last year before she really hit bottom. she went/still goes some to aa meetings but she says she relates more to the na lit. she's younger, 23 when she went into rehab/recovery. she said it was more the "language" than the "message" she relates to. whatever works ...
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