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Before finishing the steps can you curb the urge?

Old 11-08-2009, 07:14 PM
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It is not that you cannot call anyone, but the two people whose numbers I got both said that there was nothing I could do about cravings without having done all the steps.

People here had told me that they felt I should call other addicts when I have cravings, but these guys felt differently---they felt that would not help.

Maybe I just need to work more. Writing here in response to Cubile gave me a twinge of craving, but I am going to work tomorrow, so I will not follow up on it. But if I had tomorrow off, I might be in trouble. I certainly would have to get offline.
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Old 11-08-2009, 07:26 PM
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You might get the best help with your cravings by stepping to you Doctor's office. Typically, one doesn't get a craving for alcohol till after they drink. There could be other things going on, anxiety, depression, life in general that you may have an obsession that a drink will make better. If you are like me you'll really know what craving is after you succumb. Exercise, a proper diet, and a relationship with a good doctor are probably three of the most important things you can do to help yourself.
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Old 11-08-2009, 07:27 PM
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OK... We are getting somewhere. You get feelng uncomfortable and that triggers you to use.... Basic stuff. How do you deal with those??

Since these uncomfortable feelings are preventing you from attending meetings, or if you do, you end up feeling worse... perhaps outside professional help? Then get to some meetings..

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Old 11-08-2009, 07:30 PM
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totfit--

I do not drink. In fact I have never liked alcohol. My DOC was crack.

I do have depression and ADHD. I am sure that plays into it. When I smoked crack more regularly, I did not enjoy the day I did it or the day after as much as the days following, when I found myself more able to concentrate and work.
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Old 11-08-2009, 07:33 PM
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Cubile--

I am not sure I completely understand your post.

I am in therapy.

You are right about meetings. I rarely have been to one where I have not felt lonely and stressed out during and depressed after. I go because I know it is supposed to be good for me, but it is pretty rare that I feel positive about the experience.
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Old 11-08-2009, 07:33 PM
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thanks for clarifying that for me, Miamifella.
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Old 11-08-2009, 07:38 PM
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So you've been self medicating with crack, your ADHD and depression. Perhaps you should work very closely with a physician and explore licit medications?

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Old 11-08-2009, 07:43 PM
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Cubile--

You misunderstood. It was 10 years ago that I self medicated. I think that what got me hooked, because I do not have the usual markers for predisposition toward addiction. But I went into rehab at the end of 2000 and have not used on an regular basis since.

But the irregular basis of my present drug use is not making me any happier. It may be better, but it is not good.

Now I am on an antidepressant. So that is not the issue.

Self medication may have driven me to the party, but I decided to stay on my own.
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Old 11-08-2009, 07:50 PM
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I guess I am just wondering if you'll get what you need in AA until you can attend meetings without having that cascade of thoughts that leads you to being triggered to use.

Keep working closely with your doctor... Does (s)he know what you have posted here?

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Old 11-08-2009, 07:56 PM
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The prescribing doctor knows about my drug history.

These days though you do not have a close relationship with a doctor. It is your therapist that you really share with. The psychopharmacologist is a guy you see for a few minutes every couple months. He just monitors side effects and the efficacy of the drug.
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Old 11-08-2009, 08:00 PM
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I can relate to your comment that going to meetings is supposed to make you feel better, but I go for different reasons now. I go now because I have faith that the 12 steps will help me learn to live my life better, not to help me feel better. My problem is I don't know how to live my life sober. Crack, booze, reefer, dope, it's all the same in my mind, some may disagree, but the problem I have is addiction, and the 12 steps are geared to help me overcome my addiction, so that's why I go to meetings, to learn how others use the 12 steps to change thier lives. Most of them seem happier than I am, so I'll keep going. Maybe it would help you to go and focus on the steps, and not so much on how you feel. It's worth a try.
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Old 11-08-2009, 08:04 PM
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firestorm--

I see something different. Everyone talks about how great their life is without ever describing any problems---but if their lives were so great why can they not put together a couple years of clean time.

They do not talk much about any practical application of the steps or how they get there. It is more a sales pitch for the program---no matter what kind of meeting it is supposed to be.

There are some good people...but over the years I see fewer and fewer.
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Old 11-08-2009, 08:13 PM
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Hey miami,

I get it, and I've been there. We look to others and we don't see that they have anything we want, so their message lacks merit in our minds. That's exactly why I had to stop looking to others for the help I need and start looking into the program of recovery that has helped thousands of people change their lives. It's the program that makes sense to me, but not always the messenger, lol. We get to take what we can use from the meetings and leave the rest, and the only reason I go is because if I don't find a way to change the way I live my life, then I know beyond any doubt that I'll end up drunk and dead, it's really that way with me. I don't go for the others, I go for me, I'm a selfish ahole sometimes, but it works in my favor for this life or death struggle. All you need is one example, then follow that one example. After that, I'm sure you'll begin to see others who are living the life you want and can show you more.
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Old 11-08-2009, 09:50 PM
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Originally Posted by miamifella View Post
firestorm--

I see something different. Everyone talks about how great their life is without ever describing any problems---but if their lives were so great why can they not put together a couple years of clean time.

They do not talk much about any practical application of the steps or how they get there. It is more a sales pitch for the program---no matter what kind of meeting it is supposed to be.

There are some good people...but over the years I see fewer and fewer.
i wandered in and out of AA for a good while thinking exactly what your thinking.
i be honest..most of the time my thoughts were.. im surround by a bunch of smug bas...rds that bounce of each other with storys of glee and merryment..

vague talk of the steps....vague talk of higher power....lots of talk about recovery and not recovered.....and guys getting drunk all over.
Until i met a guy that that talked of "a solution"....o yeah right.
but he told me he could show me exactly how to recover.

now this surprised me a bit.....he sat at the back alot.....said little.
and he was boring because he didnt share any war stories...lol
he talk alot about god and alot about the big book.

i thought he was a relative newcomer.......i later find he was 22 years sober.
we worked through the 12 steps together.......and read the book together.
i then saw the difference between people that talk recovery and people that have recovered......and the message they share.

i urge anyone that is struggling with meetings and steps to look for that quiet man/woman.......that has recovered.....and can show you exactly how they did/do it..........following pricise direction from the big book.

Then go back to those weak meetings and share what you have found and how you did it......
personally i think most can recover from alcoholism.......as long as we are directed to the oringnal instruction manual that tells us pricisely how too.

the big book of alcoholics anonymous.

if i can be of any help to anyone please pm me......or take a trip over to twelve step support.
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Old 11-08-2009, 10:04 PM
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firestorm--

I am where you are. I go to meetings because they are good for me in some vague way.

But people here are making me change my view of this. They are nudging me to include other people in my recovery. It makes sense to me that being able to share with others would help. It makes me angry that I cannot share the real experience I have at meetings and that the people there are so lost.

I am trying to find people who can help me. I am having more luck online than in person. I am avoiding those meetings I have been to in the past because they have nothing for me.

As Joan said in Mad Men (quoting McLuhan) "The medium is the message." If you have no respect for the messenger, how can you accept the message?
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Old 11-09-2009, 05:34 AM
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Originally Posted by miamifella View Post

As Joan said in Mad Men (quoting McLuhan) "The medium is the message." If you have no respect for the messenger, how can you accept the message?
Maybe, your problem with meetings and getting started with the program is wrapped up in that quote, somehow....

I just gotta believe that there is a decent 12 step meeting you can get to.

I had a WWII vet tell me a story about an experience here in the US after the war. He was a sergeant. He was transferred to another base. When he was looking for a house to rent he had some concerns about how the people were going to be in this new community. He talked to the CO about his worries. His CO asked him how'd he get on with his neighbors at his previous post.... The sergeant said "just fine", the CO told him not to worry, he'd get on "just fine" here too... True story. One I wanted to tell a month or two ago in one of your threads.

There is a line in the Big Book which I'll (try to) paraphrase...

"Our problems, we think, are of our own making."

I hope you can work through your own issues so you can have an awesome experience in AA or NA.... But they are your own, miami, be they ADHD, depression, sexual, whatever.

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Old 11-09-2009, 05:51 AM
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One of the reasons I put my city in my name is in the hopes of finding local people "who have what I want."

I came into recovery in another town and there were people I respected and admired at meetings. So I know they are out there. But at that time it did not occur to me that I needed to develop personal relationships within the program. I was very poor--I did not even have a telephone for most of that period. I remember once I did go out with people after a meeting and sat watching them all eat. It was hard to watch that when I was so hungry, so I avoided doing it ever again.

Looking back, I wish instead of the pressure to get a sponsor who would take me through the steps, there had been pressure to get someone who would guide me through other aspects of the program--someone who would go through how it all worked. Coming here I have learned a lot about 12-step programs that I did not learn in 8 years of meetings. If I had known all of this at the start things might have been different sooner.
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Old 11-09-2009, 05:07 PM
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Originally Posted by miamifella View Post
Sailorjohn--

I am surprised that you say what you do.
Well, here's something that may or may not surprise you. Nothing you've written here surprises me at all.

You talk like every addict/alcoholic in denial I've ever encountered.

You might appreciate this-or not-but I recently ended a relationship with a non-recovering crack addict that talked just like you.

And she's still out there......just like you.
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Old 11-09-2009, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by barb dwyer View Post
miamifella-

Some of what you posted had me going


becuse here - you come to a meeting you get a list of phone numbers and you USE them. Got nothing to do with steps gotr everything to do with not picking up the first drink between meetings.

So I don't know anything about having to complete the 12 steps before you can call someone for help and support when that need hits.
That was my experience too. Thirteen women all said, "Here's my number. Call me anytime. Call me at 3 am if you have to." I was given a small BB, but nobody suggested I had to start the steps immediately or rejected me if I hadn't. There was time to acclimate.
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Old 11-09-2009, 05:29 PM
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Sailorjohn--

What is the point of your post? How is it supposed to help? If you have insight to share, then offer it.

If you have help to offer that is great. But if you are using me as an occasion to boost your own ego or convince yourself that somehow you are safe because you are "better" than those who still struggle, it does not help.

I am sorry about your girlfriend and everything that is wrong in your life. I could tell from your posts that there were things bothering you that were not being said explicitly.

I have no insight into myself. But I have been in the rooms for a long time and have seen a lot of behavior. I have observed enough to see where certain behaviors go in others.

I am still working things through. Talking about addiction is very new to me. Getting response about addiction is new to me. It is hard to be going along for years doing what you think is the right thing, and suddenly encountering a bunch of people who have an entirely different view.

So my progress is not moving on the schedule you want and I remind you of your exgirlfriend. Those are your issues, not mine.

There are so many people here who help me. Cubile and Ago are top of the list but there are alot of others. I need what they have, so you have to get used to my denial, stupidity, etc because it ain't going to leave.
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