ashleek

Okay so now I am curious. I don't know much about kabbalah other than Madonna wore a red braclet on her hand for this religion and it is nothing new to the world just maybe to the USA's world. So, if you know anything or practice it or have any info I think I feel like with some more research this might be it, my spiritual connection. Not awakening just a connection. We will see. PM me if you would like anyone!!

ashleek

Why Kabbalah?

One who has a desire for spirituality differs from one seeking earthly and human fulfillments (i.e. the desire stages 1-to-4 outlined above). We already know how to fulfill our earthly and human needs, but when the desire for spirituality awakens, we no longer know how to soothe it.

Most people with a desire for spirituality today aren't even aware that they have it. Some of these people with a desire for spirituality might even be despising the very word "spirituality" thinking that it is something unrealistic and unrealizable. Such people feel their lives empty and purposeless, without knowing that it is due to this new, more evolved desire for spirituality awakening in them. They are unaware that this is the reason for their dissatisfaction and discontentment with life.

As children, many people ask themselves, "What am I living for?" But as the years go by, we are inundated by desires and temptations that divert us from this question, and the need to find a genuine answer withers away.

Nevertheless, at some point, the desire for spirituality awakens, and with it the questions. Those who insist on finding the answers come to Kabbalah, which was specifically designed to provide the way to their answers.

I found this and found it interesting! Who knows!!

socialismislost

You obviously are an AA type, and Im not. The BB and every meeting Ive ever attended started off and ended with prayer and spirituality was the foundation. In fact, its in most of the steps, and suggests strongly that alcoholism is a spiritual disease. The BB has several stories of being born with alcoholism, and the BB is the main book of AA, so Im sure youre familiar

If alcohol causes one to be alcoholic, then every person that has ever drank alcohol, would be an alcoholic. Are you asking for AA to be shot down? PM me if you ever want to talk.

socialismislost

I will give you my experience. Dont go into a meeting and say that you have decided that your higher power is going to be a glass of cold beer. That will make heads explode in unison from the cognitive dissonance.

socialismislost

something tells me that's exactly where you want to go.

Jomey

Another vote for you to read "The Shack"...changed my life....sorry I didn't mention it in my first post!

littlefish

Thanks ashleek for bringing up this topic: I just completed step 2 with my sponsor on thursday this week.
I didn't start going to AA until I'd been sober 2 months. I didn't find a sponsor until I'd been going to meetings for about 8 months. I didn't read the first part of the big book after I had purchased it....until 10 months later. It took me 7 months to complete step 2.

Alright, I think we have established I am a slow learner.....

It took me a long time to work my way through step 2 because I rejected organized religion at a very young age: while I was still in a Roman Catholic Parochial school.... that I can only describe as the school from HXXL. It was awful. If you want a good way to turn a child into a hater of organized religion, send them to the religious school I went to.
But I never rejected personal spirituality. I see a big difference between organized religion and personal spirituality. I found personal spirituality through step 2 and am very thankful for having the chance to do so and step 2 gave me the chance. I have lived most of my life without a moral compass and it feels very good to have one now. Of course, I forget to use it....eeeehhh...

Will I tell you to believe in a higher power as I percieve it? Of course not. Do I want you to accept my definition of spirituality? 'Course not.

It was a big job and rather expensive: lots of amazon books...lots of reading, learning.
My goal was to find a personal spirituality I could accept on my terms and yet still understand that my "terms" are probably somewhat superfluous in the grand scheme of things. I drew from Buddhist thought to a great extent. I read Thoreau. I read Plato. Plato didn't help, ha. But I have drawn my strength and spiritual direction from as many diverse sources as possible, and even good films were in my inventory.

but...the point is that I searched.
and, yes, I was angry the first few months of my sobriety. Very angry.

Aysha

I dont go to meetings or do 12 step programs. So I am not sure if I should even post. But I know how it feels to struggle with the whole spirituality thing. It just made my brain hurt trying to figure out just what that was.
When you go into treatment they ask you what does spirituality mean to you. I had nothing. I got totally stuck.
And I still cant expalin it. But at least I have a sense of it for myself now.
And that being more of a Karma type thing. What you put in is what you get back and so on. Sorta like getr said. The universe type a deal.
I am not too sure how much I believe in a 'God'. But past experience has def showed me that what goes around comes around. When your heart is in the right place, good things will happen. Even if they do take some time.
Well, Thats all I got.

ashleek

I have ordered a lot of amazon books myself!! That's so funny cause I am so interested in what other people have found. I thought about buddah. For some reason I am drawn to that and I know nothing about it!

All I know is the God I grew up with, I just don't like the thought of Hell and all that stuff. I don't believe in "living your life for a God" all that crazy Christian stuff. I know there is something out there and I just don't know what that is.

Penny gave me this website and it has a quiz on spirituality and it said I am 100% like reform Judaism. My husband laughed and said "you can't just be a Jew". I said I can believe what I want to believe and be what I want to be. It is whatever God I chose and whatever spirituality I chose.

So, thanks everyone and you can keep the posts coming if you want to.

Surlyredhead

You said it right!!!!! What you have in your heart is yours, and yours only.....whatever makes you feel "whole" is the right path to take...

Cathy

coming_clean

I never found the christian 'god'.....I did found life, the world and the universe...in my simple mind that is god...

edit:

not to forget buddha ofcourse...who inspired me to think and find out for myself...he is my best friend...

barb dwyer

Kaballah is more the Hebrew mysticism.

Dean62

Hi Ash.

I'm glad I didn't grow up in any particular religion based on what you and many others have said about religion in there childhood. AA was really the first place I started to see the need to take the God thing seriously in order to stay sober. "A God of your choosing" tweeked my interest and so I started looking. It has taken a few years for me, like you I wanted it now but that just didn't happen, it's been a process of spiritual growth for me. Spiritual growth is the journey for me now.

I have started calling myself a Christian now but that word means many different things to many different people. For me it's not about the religion you grew up with. AA taught me about spirituality not religion. The difference for me is Spirituality is a personal relationship with God (my higher power). Religion inserts itself between God and me as a middle man and tells me what God is....that sounds like your childhood experience and is not my definition of being a Christian today. Two more definitions for you that are mine that may help you.....may not.....Religion is about rules - Spirituality is about freedom from rules (Yes even my Christian based spirituality). I know many will disagree with that one.....the last one you may hear in AA. Religion is of man spirituality is of God.

I am not interested in religion myself but I do rely on God on a daily basis. Both AA and the church I go to are there to help me with my personal relationship with God. I don't need to go to either one to have a personal relationship with God or to grow spiritually but I enjoy the companionship of people on the same journey as I am so I go because I want to. The church I go to is very clear on this, they say themselves I don't ever need to go back to church again, they don't believe in being a middle man for me. As I said the same holds true with AA although you will find a lot of people who use the AA fellowship, the meetings, as their Higher power who will tell you continued meetings are essential.....I have seen that work for many so I'm not knocking it.

I hope that helps in some way Ash, whatever works for you is all that matters. Spiritual growth brings with it emotional growth and drinking/drugging fades away. Growth = change however you find it. Spiritual growth is a new and much better way of life for me. To live life on my own self propulsion is to put limits on what life is about.

ashleek

Thanks Dean!

I think I have found that I believe in God I just don't believe in some of the things in the bible or that I have been taught. The God I grew up with is the God you fear, that you have to watch every sin you make or you will go to hell, you have to live for that God.

I know there is a God, for me that is what i believe, it's just been so hard for me lately trying to figure everything out, spirituality, God, sobriety, changes. It's a lot all at once.I know this is going to be a long road for me to completely accept that there is a higher power and have faith. I have trust issues so that doesn't help. I know it will all come with time.

I dunno, who knows! HAHAHA

keithj

You don't have to figure any of it out. To whatever extent possible, set your ideas aside so that you can have an experience with a higher power. This is the open-minded part of it. Take the actions outlined and have an experience of your own.

I know a lot of devoutly religious people that can't stay sober. They know way more about God than I do. But they can't have that experience because all their SELF gets in the way. Their 'already having it figured out' blocks their own experience.

Tricky stuff. Take precise actions, get precise results.

ashleek

Keith you are right! I need to have a open mind but for some reason that is so hard for me to do. I guess cause I have that mind set of I want everything now or maybe it's because I am the type of person that likes proof of things. I don't want proof from God or anything, well I just don't know what I want. I'm just thankful for what I do have for now and my sobriety because life couldn't be much better!

ashleek

I went to my therapy session today and told him that I was pissed at God, or pissed that I couldn't find God, or that I didn't know what God meant to me. And then I had an ahh ha moment.

I was raised with a Baptist God, the God fearing Gods of all Gods (in my opinion). I now know that I don't have to believe in a religious God, the man made God but the God that I know is out there. The loving God.

Another thing, my childhood has a lot to do with me not being able to turn my will over to God. Because as a child I depended on my will, I was the one that got me through hard times, I am the one who taught me what I learned, I am the one who stood up for me and Mom. I was the mother and she was the child and my will is all I had and all I knew.

So now I am supposed to turn all that over to God? And trust that he will do good with it for me, for my life? That is going to be hard to do. How in the hell am I supposed to do that.

Well he says I need to pray a little prayer everyday, and I agree! Just a small prayer which goes a little like this.....God help me stay sober today. And then at night I pray....God thank you for keeping me sober today. I think if I do this it will eventually come, that connection with God that I am longing for.

I told him, I just want to feel something. He said.....you addict you. I laughed my ass off. How funny is it that me and addict would want instant gradification and feel something. Boy did that open my eyes.

Thank God for my counselor, this man knows what the hell he is talking about.

Astro

How about just trying it for awhile ashlee, turn your cares and worries over to God and see what He does with them? What I have trouble with sometimes is accepting the outcome, that's when I have to remember "Thy will, not mine, be done".

I think that prayer is a perfect one to start with. Nice and simple. Can't hurt to try that too for awhile, right?

NewMe11109

My first baby steps to turning my will over to God were just to look at what was causing me stress each day and to decide whether I legitimately had any control over it. If I didn't have any control, I turned it over to my Higher Power.

ashleek

me11109- that's a pretty good way of looking at it that I haven't thought about.

Astro-I think it is a good way to start it. I just had so many eye openings at this meeting today with my counselor. Things started coming together and I got this book today that is wonderful, funny, point blank called Finding God When you Don't Believe in God, Searching for a Higher Power Greater than Yourself. It's kinda like God put it right in my hands. Then my AA meeting was about this stuff some like God wanted me to really hear this. So, it is coming about and I need not rush it. Instant Gradification is what got me in this mess, so I need to have patience and wait for it to come. I know it will.