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Old 07-22-2009, 08:15 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Hi Guys, Faerie checking in.

Still feeling really hurt and confused, this would be such an easy decision if I didn't love him so much and if the rest of our relationship wasn't so great. But what he has done cannot be excused so I agree with you all on that one.

Was very naughty yesterday and caved into the codeine cravings, I have been doing so well weaning myself off up until now. I'm ashamed to say I took 30 yesterday over the course of the day and had some wine on top of that. I'm a moderate drinker but know I have to be really careful that I don't start relying on alcohol and end up with a problem with that too.

He called me this morning to say sorry again. He actually said he realised he raped me and how wrong that was and that he had really f'ed up. He doesn't want to lose me over this. He also tried the 'I'll have nothing to live for if you leave me' line which I think is really manipulative. I told him I didn't want to hear him say that again as it was unfair pressure to put on me when all of this is his fault.

I realise none of what has happened to me in the past is my fault, nobody asks to be raped. The fact that he did it after knowing about my past attacks seems unforgivable.

As you know I saw my doctor yesterday and told him about everything, including the codeine abuse. To start with the codeine he said he already suspected I was abusing it again so he wasn't surprised. I suggested I go back on subs but when I reminded him they didn't work for me last time he suggested methadone. I've read some really bad stuff about coming off of methadone both on SR and online so I told him I wasn't prepared to take that route but would still be interested to hear if any of you have tried it.

He has agreed to help me wean myself off of the codeine at my own pace and will regularly give me blood tests to check my liver. I'm going to see him every month and he said he'll fit me in if I need to see him more often. Fortunately he specializes in drug use and is an expert.

As for his advice on the rape, he contridicted himself a few times and has made me even more confused. He made it clear he didn't want to give an 'opinion' and wanted to remain objective. First he said he was surprised as he knows my fiance and knows how much he loves me and how gentle he usually is. He confirmed that what happened can definately be classified as rape. He said that because of my low self esteem I have a pattern of getting into unhealthy relationships, he also said this is very common with people with BPD like me. He said that if my fiance was capable of doing it once he is capable of doing it again. I know this is something many of you have mentioned. Then [the confusing part] he went on to say that I wasn't physically harmed and that my fiance made a very big mistake and if I was able to find it within myself to forgive him there was no reason we couldn't start at the beginning again, build back the trust and stay together.
He's absolutely right that because you were raped in the past, you're going to attract men who feel they can take advantage of you. It's not your fault, this is just how the mind works in relation to abuse and violation of trust. Even if it wasn't in his conscious mind, it's likely your fiance raped you because he knew of your past, even on a primal level. You're going to continue to attract men like this until you get a better handle on your PTSD (look into EMDR and accupuncture) and until you can know better how to choose a mate that's healthy. You're doctor said the confusing part because he's a man and almost all cultures are dominated by men, so they will come up with excuses for rape (ie, you weren't physically harmed) because, in his mind, or in the back of his mind, he's thinking like a man and is siding with your fiance's urges. That's wrong and improper medical advice. Go ask a female doctor and see if she says the same thing. You can forgive him and let him back into your life, having heard his promises and he's 98% likely to do it again. You will need to forgive him at some point for yourself, but don't forget and allow him into your life again. I know that sucks to hear because there's so much love involved, but he has showed you in one night that he doesn't love you the same way as you love him because ultimately you're a piece of meat, and his mind, at least subconsciously, you're his property and a woman should always fulfill a man's/husband's needs. It goes back thousands of years and is still reinforced in most cultures today (ie, the blue ball excuse, rape porn). He is manipulating you by threatening suicide because this is what abusers do. They plead and cry and threaten their lives until you welcome them back in your life, you start to trust and forgive him because he's behaving himself, and he does it again, or he cheats on you. I would start to question what your love was really based on and if he's ever shown such traits, even subtle, in the past. Even if he was just horny, he could've masturbated, but he was likely seeing how far he could get and let his urges overpower his love and care for you. That's not a real man you should be spending the rest of your life with. You need to find a therapist, preferably female, that deals with sexual abuse and work through your emotions and love for him while cutting yourself off from him, and in finding healthier men, which means you may have to go for men you weren't immediately attracted to in the past. Maybe I sound a little militant because I'm kind of a feminist, but rape is never excusable, especially when you told him no and he knows your background. You were physically violated, even though there was no physical trauma or violence, but more importantly, emotionally and mentally violated. Would someone you are going to marry ever treat you that way, who truly loves you? No. So maybe he is a nice guy and he just messed up and let his hormones get the better of him--that would never hold up in most courts if he were tried. And it wasn't a mistake. He knew what he was doing, even if his mind was clouded by urges. I am a man and I know how we think. He let go, he gave up 10 years of history when he did this. I would also say try to rebuild the trust, but it's likely to be shattered again. If he can't handle going without sex because you're dealing with PTSD issues, which naturally make you not want to have sex, he's no the right match, because what else can't he handle?

The best thing you can do is get around friends who can help you through this. Then put down the alcohol. Then do what you can to get off the codeine. Start finding substitutes, things you enjoy to do, things that empower you. Go to a rape/sexual abuse survivors meeting so you can tools on how to regain the woman you are because since 15 I'm guessing you have never truly known that woman.
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Old 07-22-2009, 08:50 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Hi Faerie.....

I am praying for you because I have been there just like you and really don't talk about it much.... Two guys I knew used me like a doll and thought I was not going to say anything... But I was smart to talk to the cops and have both of them tracked down to face the fireworks . One got a restraining order slapped in his hands twice and that kept him away for a long time...

But I was still looking over my shoulder after that.... I worried that he was hunting me down like a Dog looking for food. Not a good thing for me even when I accidently walked against a red light in front of a cop car... I got stopped and the cop talked to me asking what I was thinking... I told him about being followed by this guy that had rapped me and so on.... I was scared big time....

Now that almost ll years have gone by I am now married with one kid and a husband that is pretty understanding. He knows about the past and what I went through... And YES... there are times when I think about the rapes myself....

Getting the help you need is a must right now no matter what the guy says he won't do anymore... For some reason that never holds up well when they know your weak points in life...

Hold strong and know that God is there helping you through all this with your therapist..... You need someone to talk to ..... and even the Rape Hot lines are good... I have called them many times just to try and understand why I felt it was all my fault this happened....

Know that I am really praying for you in a special way.... God is there if you need Him and listening to you.... even if you may not believe He is there ..

Hang in there just for today.....One day at a time...

Little Penguin
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Old 07-22-2009, 09:32 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Hi Little Penguin, nice to meet you, I'm so sorry that you also understand this particular trauma. Like you I do have my faith to help me through this, I'm a pagan and worship the Mother Goddess, she is holding me now. I don't believe any religion is wrong, we just worship the universe differently, that's whats so beautiful about all the different faiths.

Clay, You are a very sensitive, informed man, I appreciate your support and ongoing friendship. I will take your advice and consult a female doctor at my surgery and see what she has to say. I'm also gonna call one of those help lines Dee so kindly gave me earlier in the thread. It's great to have men like you and Dee contribute your advice as I know this subject may scare most men off.

I've only taken 8 codeine so far today and it's 1:30pm, I really want more but I'm gonna try hard not to take any more. It's so hard to resist your addiction when your in crisis as I'm sure you all understand but I also accept that I am responsible for my own usage and cannot blame him. Blaming others for your addiction gets you nowhere.

Love to you all, thanks for your support,
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Old 07-23-2009, 06:31 AM   #24 (permalink)
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I say you give me his address so I can go beat his [email protected]#. In all seriousness I am very sorry to hear what happened to you. I have to small daughters and one of my worst fears is something like this happening to them. I applaude your courage to come here and post. I wish I had better advice except you need to talk with the doc, get of the pills, and out of that realtionship immediately. I can't imagine someone doing what they did knowing your previous history. Your fiance should be someone you look to to protect you from the terrors in life, not be a facilitator of them. This is just my opinion, but i call them how I see them.

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Old 07-24-2009, 08:20 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Faerie....

Glad you are holding things together... Hang in there and know that you have lots of support around you as I still do..

Today I am thinking about you and all those that suffer from what "men" do to us and think they can get away with it.. For the moment I am loved and wish you the same.

I am glad you have a faith that keeps you strong and moving forward.... we all need some sort of faith and our recovery program to keep us going... I do ... and I am grateful for what I do have today.

Hugs coming to you from my house and my heart.....

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Old 07-25-2009, 04:07 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Hi all, wrote a big post yesterday and lost it all, duh! and don't have time to rewrite this morning. I have had some interesting developments with the situation though, some good some bad. Will re-post the details tonight when I get home so you know what has happened.

Today however should be a good day. It's Sunday and I am taking a 16 yr old girl with dyspraxia out to the city. She's a family friend and really needs a lot of love and attention. Her mum says she doesn't have any friends without a disability so I've decided to start spending quality time with her. [I see her at parties and stuff and hang out but never one on one] I guess it will be like an unofficial 'big sister' program.

We both should get a lot out of it. I'm taking her to the museum then to lunch and then shopping. Yay! I spoke to her yesterday and she is so excited about spending time with me.

It makes me feel really good.

Will post again later,

Love to you all, xx
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Old 07-26-2009, 10:15 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Now for the update I promised.

Much has happened both good and bad.

I'm still using way too much codeine and have no-one to blame for it but myself. I do promise however I will call an ambalance if I od. Being very careful not to od though.

Yesterday was great, if you ever have a chance to spend time with a kid with a disability do it, it is a great way to give back and take your mind off of your own problems. She made me cry when she told me she loved me.

I've just had 2 English backpackers staying with us for 2 days. The girl is a distant relative. When I first heard they were coming I was really anxious as I thought 'this is the worst time to have someone new in my life' but it turned out to be one of the best experiences ever.

The girl and I really bonded, we are now best friends. She too is a rape survivor with depression and self harm issues. [I see my codeine use as both a coping mechanism and self harm] Her fiance was one of the most lovely and gentle men I have ever met.

I told them all about what had happened with 'J'. [I am now calling him 'J' as I refuse to refer to him as my fiance anymore] and they gave me great advice and support just like all of you have.

For their own reasons my new friends were unable to have sex for over 18 months and you know what, he 'handled it himself' and didn't hassle her or pressure her once. He told me that J is not a real man as he couldn't even last 6 weeks before raping me. I agree.

She made me feel really loved and special and made me realise I deserve better than J.

J called me on Saturday morning and I refused to take the call. We all went out for a few hours and when we got back there were roses on the back doorstep.

Knowing J and our past fights he would continue to 'phone-stalk' me until I spoke with him so I called him back. I was strong. I told him he was not respecting my boundaries by calling when I had expressly told him not to call me as I would call him, when I was ready to talk. His excuse was that he had been feeling like c**p and wanted to talk to me. I pointed out that that was selfish. I also told him roses don't make everything OK. He then went on to beg me not to break up with him and again threatened to kill himself if I did. I told him that that was emotional blackmail, manipulative and immature and that I didn't want to hear that BS again.

He said he had 60 paracetamol and would take them if I left him. I was careful NOT to tell him that 60 MAY not be enough and begged him to flush them or give them to his mum but he wouldn't. I also realise 60 MAY be enough and that scares the hell out of me.

I still love this man very much but I can't forgive him for what he did nor do I trust him anymore. He is the one that threw away 10 years of history and a really beautiful relationship. It is a tragedy. It's all his own fault.

From all of your advice and the advice from my parents and my new found friends I have decided to break up with him, even though I love him. I have to put myself and my recovery first.

I am seeing my therapist tomorrow and will seek his advice on how best to break up with J so he is less likely to hurt himself. I have a feeling J will still make a half-arsed attempt at killing himself in an attempt to get attention and sympathy from me. [don't get me wrong all attempts should be taken seriously but I don't think his will be genuine] However if I am right and he does do it I will not visit him in hospital as it will only validate his behavior and give him the outcome he desired. He is also depressed [but won't admit to it] and a pot addict so maybe if he does put himself in hospital it will be a blessing in disguise and he will have to talk to a professional about his problems.

I hope that last bit didn't sound cold as I am not a cold person, I'm just not gonna buy in to his guilt trip if he chooses to take that path and I hope to the Goddess he doesn't.

I'm also very scared he may od and actually kill himself but I'll cross that bridge if I have to and know that you'll all be here for me if I need you.

I'm going to break up with him on Wednesday at my place as my Mum will be home, just in case things get out of hand. I think that is the best course of action.

I'm just scared I'll chicken out or cave into his begging so any words of support and encouragement would be greatly appreciated.

I'm going out to see one of my 'Aussie Aunties' this arvo. [all my blood family is in England where I'm from] So I'll talk to her about the situation.


Much love to you all, I'll try to look after myself for the rest of the day.
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Old 07-26-2009, 10:49 PM   #28 (permalink)
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Well it seems like you're on the right track. Your thinking is right. Just remember that when he tries to convince you or you want to cave in that he doesn't deserve you. He's shown that. Therefore he can longer have you. Tell him if he tries to kill himself, that is his own choice, and you and his loved ones would be devastated. However it won't garner sympathy from you, you won't feel guilty and that if he doesn't succeed, you will not visit him in the hospital because he's trying to manipulate you. Tell him that he needs to forgive himself for what he's done and take responsibility for his own actions. Tell him he will meet someone new, but he must first work on himself and examine what he's done. I'm not sure what Australia laws are, but if he calls you and threatens to kill himself, you can call the police and have him arrested/taken away.

Good luck and keep staying strong.

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Old 07-26-2009, 10:56 PM   #29 (permalink)
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I think getting advice from your therapist is a really good idea Faerie.
Professional guidance is needed here I think.

There's a lot in here about J - make sure you're taking care of yourself, ok?
I know it's hard right now, but pls try and stick to the codeine tapering schedule you devised with yr doctor.

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Old 07-26-2009, 11:02 PM   #30 (permalink)
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I am really concerned for you but I'm very glad you're going to see your therapist tomorrow.I'm a bit worried you're going to get a lot of armchair psychology replies here and it's simply not what's needed in a situation this serious.I don't think anyone at SR is equipped to professionally deal with the emotional/psychological minefield this has become and I am so very glad you're getting proper help. All we can really do is love and support you as you walk through it-and we do.

I'm thinking of you,
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Old 07-27-2009, 01:21 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Thanks Clay, Dee and Jules, and sfgirl, I know you guys are following my thread and you are all concerned and I appreciate it.

Clay, you have given me a great idea, if he does call me and say he's gonna do himself in I can call the police and they can detain him under the mental health act and keep him safe from himself. That will also force him to get professional help.

He is currently a danger to any woman that would get close to him in the future and I have told him he needs to talk to someone about his drug use and what he did to me. He said he was too ashamed and embarrassed. I hope he finds it in himself to get help as deep down he is a good person he just needs help. [But he still did a very bad thing]

After posting earlier I found the strength NOT to take more codeine, unloading on SR really helps. [Be proud Dee!]

Will post when I get back from therapy tomorrow morning and tell you what advice I receive.

Love to you all,
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Old 07-27-2009, 01:32 AM   #32 (permalink)
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You are doing great. Stay strong.
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Old 07-27-2009, 07:53 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Just got back from therapy, it was great.

My therapist confirmed that what J did was rape and that it was not a sign of a healthy and loving relationship that he couldn't even last 6 weeks without sex. J wouldn't even kiss and cuddle me [which I needed] because it would 'make him horny'. My therapist also said that the threats of suicide are also blackmail [as we know] and not a sign of a healthy relationship. Basically that J is demonstrating behavior that is not conducsive to a healthy ongoing relationship.

I asked him how I can best break up with him to minimalise the chance of him trying to hurt himself. He told me to be calm and firm and perhaps tell him I need a 3 month 'break' with no contact. [after which I can break up with him for good]. He also told me I can help J to get his act together by telling him the only chance he has of getting back with me is to get off of the pot, get a job and go to therapy. My therapist said that this is positive manipulation. Weird concept hey, but if it helps J I'll do it. I really want him to get therapy as I don't want him to be a danger to other women.

I'm gonna call him in a minute and see if he'll come over for a talk so I can break up with him. He has a lot of my stuff which I will have to get my Dad to pick up tonight.

Wish me luck and strength,

Much love,
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Old 07-27-2009, 08:05 PM   #34 (permalink)
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I usually don't go against professional advice but I'm not fussed on the positive manipulation idea myself - I'd just stick with the 3 month no contact rule, and then break it off.

It might be for J's good, but I'm not sure its to your good - if you make yourself the motivation and leave the idea of a reconcilliation open J might see that as a 'contract', and that's just not on IMO. Encourage him to do these things for sure - but for his own good - don't do any 'deals' - pretend or otherwise.

Also go with your original idea of having someone else at home with you when you talk with J, Faerie.

wish you well
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Old 07-27-2009, 09:52 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Just got back from therapy, it was great.

My therapist confirmed that what J did was rape and that it was not a sign of a healthy and loving relationship that he couldn't even last 6 weeks without sex. J wouldn't even kiss and cuddle me [which I needed] because it would 'make him horny'. My therapist also said that the threats of suicide are also blackmail [as we know] and not a sign of a healthy relationship. Basically that J is demonstrating behavior that is not conducsive to a healthy ongoing relationship.

I asked him how I can best break up with him to minimalise the chance of him trying to hurt himself. He told me to be calm and firm and perhaps tell him I need a 3 month 'break' with no contact. [after which I can break up with him for good]. He also told me I can help J to get his act together by telling him the only chance he has of getting back with me is to get off of the pot, get a job and go to therapy. My therapist said that this is positive manipulation. Weird concept hey, but if it helps J I'll do it. I really want him to get therapy as I don't want him to be a danger to other women.

I'm gonna call him in a minute and see if he'll come over for a talk so I can break up with him. He has a lot of my stuff which I will have to get my Dad to pick up tonight.

Wish me luck and strength,

Much love,
I have to strongly agree with Dee74 on the positive manipulation deal. That won't work how you expect it will. If you're the motivation, he will sure as $hit go off the pot, get a job and go to therapy. But once he's there, and you turn him down, you're going back on what he might see as a promise. And since he's revealed himself as an abuser, he's going to be very angry, maybe blinded by anger, and try to forcefully get what's rightfully his. I know this is sick but us men can be disturbed creatures and I know how these type of guys think. Just tell him you need a three-month separation and time to think AND that you're not promising anything at the end of three months. That's very important. He should not get false hopes. When you finally do break up with him, tell him that he caused you great pain at a time when you were vulnerable and dealing with trauma, but more importantly, he broke your trust, and the trust you both solidified by getting engaged, and that you can't risk that happening again. Tell him he has to move on and he will be happy again with someone else, but that it's important to focus on himself, why he did what he did, and the more than likely abuse he's experienced in the past. Recommend he go into detox for the marijuana use (despite popular belief, marijuana withdrawal can be extremely unpleasant) and that while his trust can never be earned again, you still care for him and want him to get better. If he does kill himself, that'll be traumatic, but that's not your fault, that's all on him. It was his choice and his addiction that led him down that path. More than likely, and hopefully, he's using the suicide thing as a way to manipulate you and he himself doesn't realize what he's doing. I mean for God's sake, he thinks flowers are an adequate way to apologize for raping someone. Not a very sensitive man apparently. Did you ever ask him if he was abused when he was younger?

You sound strong. Stay strong and don't let his emotions get to you. Remind yourself that you deserve better, even if you can't love yourself.

:ghug3
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Old 07-27-2009, 10:35 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Thanks Clay and Dee, J is on his way now will take your advice and not dangle myself like a carrot, I'm not a prize.

Will update when he leaves,
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Old 07-28-2009, 12:10 AM   #37 (permalink)
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Are there any rape crisis centers in your area? It is very good that you are seeing a therapist, but you may find more qualified help at a center that is primarily oriented to helping rape victims.
Rape is a crime. I am surprised that both your therapist and your doctor treated it as a relationship episode. You may obtain different advice from a rape crisis center. And, it may help you regarding your earlier history.
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Old 07-28-2009, 04:27 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Rape is a crime. I am surprised that both your therapist and your doctor treated it as a relationship episode. You may obtain different advice from a rape crisis center.
It might be good to go to a rape crisis center because they are specially trained in these things. However, I do want to say that while this certainly was a crime I don't think that necessarily means that you need to involve the criminal justice system. I think that is a decision that needs to be fully contemplated before going full speed ahead. It seems like so far you are doing all the right things. I am amazed how strong you are through all of this! Amazing!!
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Old 07-28-2009, 04:46 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Hi Faerie,

I am also wondering if you have reported this as a crime?

It is not a relationship issue. It's against the law.

I am so glad that you are getting professional help and distancing yourself from J.
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Old 07-28-2009, 09:12 PM   #40 (permalink)
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How did it go with J? Let us know when you're up to it.
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