chris11

Passages is selling a book on TV called The Alcoholism and Addiction Cure which they say is an effective alternative to 12 step programs. Does anybody know if their method works? I just entered recovery and was thinking of going the 12 step route, but I'm not sure if that's for me. Any other alternatives are welcomed too.

flutter

There was another thread about this a while back. I love this book. And yes, Prentiss does have a program in Cali that costs $60K to attend, however, his writing this offers some ideas on the program he's developed, the basic ideas that he has about dependency and recovery.. I read this and it wasn't like what I'd been reading before. It just MADE SENSE to me. It's not a *new* perspective really, just packaged differently in a new book, from a new contributor. It does not follow the disease model, or traditional 12 step program.. that in itself was of appeal to me. As with any approach, I'm sure it's peppered with flaws, etc.. Nothing works for anyone if they don't do most of the work, ya know?

I didn't order it on TV and haven't seen it sold that way, my therapist 'assigned' it as supplemental reading material.

Check it out, I'm sure you can find a cheap copy online somewhere, I think the full sticker price is like 15 bucks at most stores anyways. I really liked it.

chris11

Thanks for the tip. On TV and the Passages website it's about $25.

Sara9009

Other options are Smart, Rational Recovery, Life Ring...

Here is a link to some other programs. I think I am in Eclectics Anonymous.

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...-programs.html

HideorSeek

I like THAT: Eclectics Anonymous! Whatever works, work it, is my motto!

jsml1234

Hi Chris
I've suggested this book before. "The Alcoholism and Addition Cure" by Chris Prentiss. He wrote this book and started his own treatment center 'Passages Addiction Cure Center in Malibu, California' after his son became hooked on heroin and alcohol. (stealing from family, all the lies, relapses, beatings by dealers and mult treatment centers)
Big controversy surrounding one of this treatment centers core beliefs-alcoholism and addiction is not a disease. He makes good arguement against this in the first few chapters of the book. Not sure that really matters anyway, although it probably upsets a lot of established entities. Like most self-help books, I think you take what works for you and leave out what doesn't. And heck, for a $15 book it has been well worth it.
Without giving it a whole lot of credit to my short lived sobriety, it has helped to give me hope and insight into my dependency and tools to use. For example:
Ch 5 'The 4 Causes Of Dependency'
Cause 1: Chemical imbalance
Cause 2: Unresolved events from the past
Cause 3: Beliefs you hold that are inconsistent with what is true
Cause 4: Inability to cope with current conditions
Google it and you can read the entire first chapter online to see if it sparks your interest.

basIam

For a real alcoholic, what help is knowing 'the cause' ?
Here's the thing, there is a subset of problem drinkers/drug addicts for which self-knowledge is of absolutely no use


BB quotes...1st Edition

Dee74

Welcome to SR, basIam

D

CarolD

basIam.....
Thanks for sharing
Welcome to our recovery community

smacked

I absolutely loved some of the ideas laid out in this book.. it's not a new perspective, but really helped skyrocket my particular journey into recovery. Something that finally made sense, to me.

Whatever works, right?

basIam

I'm not saying it doesn't have interesting ideas regarding the causes and effects of drug/alcohol abuse or the benefits of recovery. Question though... does it offer a clear cut discription of actions taken by others that has led to 75% recovery?

Or is it written by someone who is on the outside looking in offering his opinion on what he belives will work in most cases?

I guess if you think it will work, by all means try it. If it doesn't? Try the 12 steps... if you survive

I would suggest try the 12 steps (as outlined in the basic text) under the guidance of another who has been through them. 12 steps have a proven track record. And alcoholism is a fatal condition.


By the way, bill wilson refused to call it a disease as well.
And this guy talks about freeing people of their dependence... well the last time I picked up, I wasn't dependent. I had been clean for 4 months. The though came to mind that beer was never a real problem. That night I nearly died of a heroin overdose. I completely forgot abou the last time I had a beer with no intention of smoking crack and shooting dope but ended up doing the same.


What mental exercise does "the cure" offer for that scenario?

Be careful of easier softer ways, they just might be fatal.
That is, for a real alcoholic.

Also, I understand this guy gives a money back guarantee if you relapse after attending his center? A lot of good that does if the relapse kills you. Huh?

Future22

Where can I find this clear cut description? Because AA does not lead to a 75% recovery.


I thoroughly enjoyed the book also and took what I could out of it and applying it to my life today and it has greatly enhanced my life. The book has some sound reasons, however parts of the "cure" can be quite expensive (all the doctors).

Future22

Also, if you read the book, I do not see how it is an "easier, softer way" to recovery. Both AAs and Chris' program require a lot of work from the alcohol dependent person.

scoob

I bought the ebook of this on itunes. The philosphy is that you need to get down to the why, and he is a big advocate of therapy.

Now that i've been to AA meetings, really it's not that different, Prentiss doesn't believe in having to call yourself an addict, you are someone who used alcohol as a means to escape something, and you need to deal with those somethings.

smacked

By your questions I'm going to assume you haven't even read the book. I apologize in advance if you have, and have missed most of the major concepts of thought and treatment perspectives contained there.

We all find our own way, I think anything that people find helpful in their recovery is great! I think diversity of programs and treatment perspectives is critical for overall recovery from dependence on alcohol, drugs, or whatever it may be.

Maybe once we stop arguing about which program is better, what we feel people SHOULD do because THIER way isn't THE way, and encouraging recovery by whatever means works best for each individual, we can start looking at a much higher recovery rate from a torturous life dependent on, addicted to (insert your own recovery term here) alcohol, drugs, etc. and stop looking at program by program comparisons and 'my way is better than your way' narrow mindedness.

I don't make a practice of forming an opinion or judgement on things that I am uninformed about. That is just silly.

Ago

You Go Girl

It's funny, the very basis of AA is:

"There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which
cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance-- that principle is
contempt prior to investigation." - Herbert Spencer, British philosopher

and yet my AA brethren display that very contempt on a daily basis, it's quite sad, once again, I am a BB thumper, and approve of it heartily, however I wish if someone thumps the BB they read the damn thing first, where it says we don't have all the answers, and we have no axes to grind, that people have no lectures to endure from us, and we don't preach from moral and spiritual hilltops and love and tolerance of others is our code

and especially, contempt prior to investigation

unfortunately, everlasting ignorance seems to be the fate of many, although there is an easy fix.

I apologize on behalf of my more enthusiastic brethren on this day of thanks, and am here to say we aren't all this close minded.

laurie6781

I found recovery in AA many years ago when to be quite honest it WAS THE ONLY GAME IN TOWN. Over the years more methods of recovery have come to light and I see how they are working for people.

To me it does not matter the 'method' of recovery. All require INTENSE work by the individual themselves. What matters to me is that the individual is attempting to find a way to stay sober and clean. So be it.

To the OP I suggest you get the book, read it thoroughly, see if you can apply it to your life. Know that we are here for you no matter what method you use. We are all here for the same thing to GET sober and clean and then to STAY sober and clean.

Hope y'all have a sober and fun Thanksgiving!

Love and hugs,

basIam

I am not closed minded. but. . . Experience has taught me that when someone says, "I have a secret that will give you ABC, but it will cost you $€₱₤₣ to get a glimpse of it." it is usually followed by having to shell out more money.

I asked people to enlighten me as to what type of ACTION the book outlines.

As far as the 75% success rate, if you read the second forward it says half of those who came to AA, AND REALLY TRIED, half recoverED immediately, of the remaining. many of them came back and, perhaps after some relapses, half of them recoverED. Thats 75%.

My experience has been even better than that. I've never seen a 12 step program where ther person really tries. And I am not talking about meetings.

MEETINGS ARE NOT THE PROGRAM!!!! As a matter of fact, the basic text tells us that meetings are there to "provide the fellowship that the newcomer seeks." When working with my sponsor, at that point in the book, he asked me "so how much longer are you going to be a newcomer???" Meaning, "when are you going to begin working the steps?"

The clear cut description of how people like me recoverED is in the first 164 pages of the basic text of alcoholics anonymous.

Heres the trick to reading the book -

1. Remember this book is not to tell me what to do, but describe what others did to recover.
2. Because of this, it is written in the "First Person-plural, Past Tense", i.e. "we did, we found, we asked, we had to, with us, for us, in us"
3. This means that first word of the first step, "we," describes a group of men and women who took a certain set of actions and as a result recoverED from alcoholism. Until I take the same actions, I am not one of the "We."
4. Therefore, when reading the book, I must change it into the "First Person-singular" and turn every statement into a question, i.e. "Have I? Do I? With Me?. . .etc"
5. If I can answer every question and take the same actions, I am GUARANTEED to have a "profound alteration in my reaction to life" as well as a "personality change sufficient to bring about recovery" als known as a "spiritual experience"

I have never seen anyone who REALLY TRIED the 12 steps, as described in the basic text, fail. I know over 200 people who have recoverED Thats my experience.

I have seen countless people come to AA and treat it as a social organization/support group/self help program (which it definitely is not a self help program) fail. I have also seen many people die. As a matter of fact, I am going to a funeral tomorrow.

She came to AA many times, but never really tried

Pinkcuda

Keep in mind that any 75% success rate that AA boasts was a figure from the days when we separated the wheat from the chaff. Not just anybody could waltz into AA for any reason at any time like they do now. Also today there is a misconception that AA is all about meetings and nothing but meetings because any step is a "Suggestion" which means thay're optional and we an slogan each other into sobriety and our "inner child" plays a big role in our drinking.
Just because the 12 steps are somewhere on the wall and it's on the schedule doesn't mean there's any "AA" actually going on. It's "AA" in name only. It's just like last year when Lynard Skynard came to town.

Back to the subject at hand. If anybody can show me a "Cure" like the title claims, I'll kiss their a$$ on Main Street. "Cure" means to make a normal drinker out of an alcoholic and it can't be done.
As far as quitting? Anyone can quit at any time. "Program" or not!

Ago

200?

really?

Gosh, that's a lot

I have probably met over 20,000 alcoholics that have recovered in the last 20 years, I've met them all over the world, and I suspect Laurie has met even more since 1981.

I personally have never seen AA's 12 steps fail either, as in the people who work them all seem to get and stay sober, that's not the point.

We (AA) are here when all other methods fail, that is unless we have so alienated alcoholics that they would rather die then come to AA, The BB says we must be careful to never show intolerance for alcohol as an institution, that drinkers won't stand for such stupidity, I will take that one step further, and say we shouldn't show intolerance for ANYTHING including other treatment programs, that drinkers won't stand for such stupidity.

I have watched countless alcoholics turn away from AA after just a short time here seeing the "know it all" shove it down your throat online AAers seem to have online. Don't get me wrong, I'm as hardcore as they come, I just happen to know I am not God, and I happened to read the whole book, the book that tells me it's not my job to play God, the book that tells me my job is to be of service, not shove my views down peoples throats and make them "endure lectures", the book I read tells me to be helpful to others, how helpful is it to alienate everyone to AA?

One of the spiritual tenets of AA is attraction not promotion, and running around shoving AA's views down peoples throats just isn't very attractive, nor is preaching from moral and spiritual hilltops, I see alcoholics here every single day get turned away from AA by our rigid and intolerant attitude, I have come to believe that countless alcoholics that could have gotten help from us would rather die then come to us because of our shoving AA down peoples throats.

I know AA works, I know the 12 steps work, but it doesn't work for people that will rather die then come to a meeting because of the harm done by AA'ers shooting their mouths off here and elsewhere online.

So just keep preaching to the choir, teaching people who have been around the rooms for decades the "proper" way to read the book and alienating those not in AA, ignoring: "love and tolerance of others is our code" and "We don't claim to have all the answers, just something that worked for us" and "attraction not promotion" and doing irreparable harm shoving AA down peoples throats where it's not wanted.

This thread didn't ask about AA it asked about a different book.

Lets keep doing what we're doing and lets make those other programs look more attractive every day, then when we are busy patting ourselves on the back for how pow'ful our online message and preaching was, we don't have to listen to the countless alcoholics still suffering that will never come to AA because of some intolerant numbnuts that shoved AA down their throat online when it wasn't asked for.

The responsibility statement says I am responsible, anytime, anywhere, anyone reaches out for the hand of AA I am responsible, not I'm onna slap these fools down and show how cool I am and how much I know, we are supposed to help people up.

I guess I just don't understand what AA is supposed to be, maybe I missed the point.