I am NOT an alcoholic what am I doing here
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 37
I am NOT an alcoholic what am I doing here
So this is my day 13....Sober... and what do we do now. Does this mean I can never have a drink again? Am I banned from Alcohol forever? What about my job? I am in sales I go out with clients all the time? What do I do? Quit? The weather is changing it is becoming summertime cant I go and sit outside and have a few beers? Whats up with that? Where is the fun in that. Why not just go out once a week and be home by 12... No hangover and nobody will be affected. Stop whining and go have a beer yr friends miss you. You know you need to relax after hards working days. Wouldnt it be nice just to have a couple of beers with yr friends. If you dont go out now you will be all stressed out and you will be unfriendly to yr wife and kids you know that.
This is my day 13... My mind is on a rollercoster ride through all the above mentioned arguments and its trying to convince me.....
Believe me when I say the danger of drinking again is not in the first 10 days it as after 10 days when you feel "normal" the more normal you feel the more normal it is to have a beer
Putting on the biggest fight yet I hope to get though tonight.
it is now 1600 and the alcohol is really pulling me
Ill let you know tomorrow who won (it better be me)
Doing the best I can
Vinnie
This is my day 13... My mind is on a rollercoster ride through all the above mentioned arguments and its trying to convince me.....
Believe me when I say the danger of drinking again is not in the first 10 days it as after 10 days when you feel "normal" the more normal you feel the more normal it is to have a beer
Putting on the biggest fight yet I hope to get though tonight.
it is now 1600 and the alcohol is really pulling me
Ill let you know tomorrow who won (it better be me)
Doing the best I can
Vinnie
Silly Rabbit
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 956
oh man. i've felt just like that so many times. when i get to feeling all itchy, i go to a meeting. i might go to 2. i hang out with folks who are going to eat or get coffee afterwards. i pray and pray that the universe relieves me of the obsession. i eat candy. 
but, i almost always go to a meeting. and i don't drink - no matter WHAT.
good luck.
but, i almost always go to a meeting. and i don't drink - no matter WHAT.
good luck.
where the light is
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 2,763
Hi Vinnie,
I am in a very similar situation as you re. clients, summer coming, wife & kids. A few things I tell myself:
Right now, don't worry too much about the future - eg. clients, better weather. You can build up your strength to deal with those days when they get here.
Don't buy into the illusion that a couple of beers with friends will be this great experience. It likely won't be a couple of beers anyway & even if it is, the obsession will be back and will lead to another major blowout.
Going to bed sober and waking up without a hangover or any guilt will be the great experience. Really think about this - how will you feel in in the morning if you drink compared to if you stay sober?
Being there for your wife & kids is your responsibility - it's okay to be cranky occasionally.
Keep busy - get through the day, work on your recovery, play with your kids, fitness, TV - anything but drink.
Wishing you the best. D
I am in a very similar situation as you re. clients, summer coming, wife & kids. A few things I tell myself:
Right now, don't worry too much about the future - eg. clients, better weather. You can build up your strength to deal with those days when they get here.
Don't buy into the illusion that a couple of beers with friends will be this great experience. It likely won't be a couple of beers anyway & even if it is, the obsession will be back and will lead to another major blowout.
Going to bed sober and waking up without a hangover or any guilt will be the great experience. Really think about this - how will you feel in in the morning if you drink compared to if you stay sober?
Being there for your wife & kids is your responsibility - it's okay to be cranky occasionally.
Keep busy - get through the day, work on your recovery, play with your kids, fitness, TV - anything but drink.
Wishing you the best. D
Guest
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Southern New Hampshire
Posts: 746
Maybe you are, maybe you are not
You say you are not alcoholic, do you know what it means to be alcoholic? Maybe I have missed some of your posts where you have said what you are doing here, and why you are currently not drinking. Find out your truth.
I would be happy to share with you why I am alcoholic, pm me if you want.
I would be happy to share with you why I am alcoholic, pm me if you want.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: uk
Posts: 157
i know just how youre feeling vinnie,
I decided to *cut down* after drinking upwards of at least 1 bottle of wine a day for three years, loosing my license to drink driving charge, and then losing my job aswell, i tried , unsucessfully to cut down and so decided to quit completely *to prove to myself i could*
and i did quit for a few weeks , so i thought id proved my point . I THOUGHT after proving i could quit, that i could sit down and have a couple of glasses of wine..... and i did, succesfully, on a number of occasions.
This left me confused and REALLY hankering after *the good old days* when i could drink guilt free,
I told myself i wasnt really an alcoholic, after all hadnt i proved that? could i quit- yes for two weeks (wow) could i just have one or two glasses and leave it alone- yes , proved that too.
Last week i had a very very hard time within my relationship, i opened a can and i simply do not remember the rest.
I found myself right back where i started , apologising for the awful things i said to him (what did i say? i have NO idea) wondering where my bag had got to and why id packed a suitcase when i had absolutely no recollection of doing so.
So i guess i know what i am now and that for me, i cant do it anymore, i cant be trusted with that stuff inside my body, no matter how appealing it may seem to me, it is costing me far too much- obviously this is my own experience, and i dont know yours, but as youre posting on here im guessing some of the above may sound familiar?
Dont go back there mate, it really isnt worth the pain.
I decided to *cut down* after drinking upwards of at least 1 bottle of wine a day for three years, loosing my license to drink driving charge, and then losing my job aswell, i tried , unsucessfully to cut down and so decided to quit completely *to prove to myself i could*
and i did quit for a few weeks , so i thought id proved my point . I THOUGHT after proving i could quit, that i could sit down and have a couple of glasses of wine..... and i did, succesfully, on a number of occasions.
This left me confused and REALLY hankering after *the good old days* when i could drink guilt free,
I told myself i wasnt really an alcoholic, after all hadnt i proved that? could i quit- yes for two weeks (wow) could i just have one or two glasses and leave it alone- yes , proved that too.
Last week i had a very very hard time within my relationship, i opened a can and i simply do not remember the rest.
I found myself right back where i started , apologising for the awful things i said to him (what did i say? i have NO idea) wondering where my bag had got to and why id packed a suitcase when i had absolutely no recollection of doing so.
So i guess i know what i am now and that for me, i cant do it anymore, i cant be trusted with that stuff inside my body, no matter how appealing it may seem to me, it is costing me far too much- obviously this is my own experience, and i dont know yours, but as youre posting on here im guessing some of the above may sound familiar?
Dont go back there mate, it really isnt worth the pain.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: 49 degrees north
Posts: 1,036
Oh man, Vinnie-
You are suffering from what is commonly called "stinkin" thinkin'.
That sound simplistic and trite; another "slogan." It is.
But what I have been discovering recently, by reading some very heavy duty psychiatric and systems theory literature, is that this simplistic phrase sums up very complex behavior.
I used to dismiss The Big Book and AA as being useful, but very "common" stuff. No longer. Recent reading has taught me that it is cutting edge stuff. As complex as anything that exists. The theory underlying what Bill W came up with was way ahead of its time and is applicable to the entire world of epistemology, philosophy, spirituality, and understanding society as a whole. The brilliance lies in the fact that it has been made accessible to a bunch of drunks. No less a miracle than if quantum physics was suddenly understandable to the masses.
I'm serious here. Your symptoms are the result of complex thought processes that are predictable and inevitable. The simple act of "fighting" addiction ensures its victory over us. I am stunned by this revelation. Ironically, the higher our IQ, the more analytical we are, the more we are likely to fall prey to "stinkin' thinkin." My whole history and prior failures followed this unalterable script. The harder I fought, the more guaranteed the outcome.
I am working on surrender and not submission. There is a huge difference between the two. Only through surrender do I stand any chance with this stuff. And as a male, I am not built for surrender. If I do not change that I am doomed. Life crashing down causes the best of us to submit, but it guarantees that there will be another day. That we will test our strength when all the crap blows away. Which is why the unlikely advice of AA "If you think you are not an alcoholic, go out and test your theory." Why would they give such dangerous advice? Because the outcome is certain. Because, for some of us, only repeated 2x4's over the head will save our life. Beaten not into submission, but total surrender.
So, maybe you need to go and test your theory. I'm not being condescending. I'm still a neophyte here. I do know however, what the GUARANTEED result will be if I go "back out." And try "normal" drinking. I know what will happen if I merely "submit." It may take a year or ten years, but it will happen. All I need to do is think that I have a "choice," that my character and strength are enough, and my fate is sealed. Like I say, very complex stuff.
Only if I think that I am dealing with something far greater than I am I protected. Sounds weird but it is true. Believe me, nothing is more foreign to me than this realization. I have a bunch of degrees, achievements, my whole life has been about control. I eschew religion and anything that I cannot "comprehend" or manage. All that has changed in the past few weeks. At age 60, fer chrissake. Einstein spent decades trying to make the complex simple. Unification theory. The theory of everything. He didn't succeed and no one has. But there is a unification theory in addiction. And it has little to do with the physical. It is metaphysical. I haven't a clue what god is. Not a clue. I do know now that there are forces greater than I.
Many (most?) people go to church to find god. Perhaps some find it, I don't know. What I do know now is that every drunk will find what the sober desperately seek. The power greater than us. Whether we die or we survive, we find it. I find that all too weird...
warren
You are suffering from what is commonly called "stinkin" thinkin'.
That sound simplistic and trite; another "slogan." It is.
But what I have been discovering recently, by reading some very heavy duty psychiatric and systems theory literature, is that this simplistic phrase sums up very complex behavior.
I used to dismiss The Big Book and AA as being useful, but very "common" stuff. No longer. Recent reading has taught me that it is cutting edge stuff. As complex as anything that exists. The theory underlying what Bill W came up with was way ahead of its time and is applicable to the entire world of epistemology, philosophy, spirituality, and understanding society as a whole. The brilliance lies in the fact that it has been made accessible to a bunch of drunks. No less a miracle than if quantum physics was suddenly understandable to the masses.
I'm serious here. Your symptoms are the result of complex thought processes that are predictable and inevitable. The simple act of "fighting" addiction ensures its victory over us. I am stunned by this revelation. Ironically, the higher our IQ, the more analytical we are, the more we are likely to fall prey to "stinkin' thinkin." My whole history and prior failures followed this unalterable script. The harder I fought, the more guaranteed the outcome.
I am working on surrender and not submission. There is a huge difference between the two. Only through surrender do I stand any chance with this stuff. And as a male, I am not built for surrender. If I do not change that I am doomed. Life crashing down causes the best of us to submit, but it guarantees that there will be another day. That we will test our strength when all the crap blows away. Which is why the unlikely advice of AA "If you think you are not an alcoholic, go out and test your theory." Why would they give such dangerous advice? Because the outcome is certain. Because, for some of us, only repeated 2x4's over the head will save our life. Beaten not into submission, but total surrender.
So, maybe you need to go and test your theory. I'm not being condescending. I'm still a neophyte here. I do know however, what the GUARANTEED result will be if I go "back out." And try "normal" drinking. I know what will happen if I merely "submit." It may take a year or ten years, but it will happen. All I need to do is think that I have a "choice," that my character and strength are enough, and my fate is sealed. Like I say, very complex stuff.
Only if I think that I am dealing with something far greater than I am I protected. Sounds weird but it is true. Believe me, nothing is more foreign to me than this realization. I have a bunch of degrees, achievements, my whole life has been about control. I eschew religion and anything that I cannot "comprehend" or manage. All that has changed in the past few weeks. At age 60, fer chrissake. Einstein spent decades trying to make the complex simple. Unification theory. The theory of everything. He didn't succeed and no one has. But there is a unification theory in addiction. And it has little to do with the physical. It is metaphysical. I haven't a clue what god is. Not a clue. I do know now that there are forces greater than I.
Many (most?) people go to church to find god. Perhaps some find it, I don't know. What I do know now is that every drunk will find what the sober desperately seek. The power greater than us. Whether we die or we survive, we find it. I find that all too weird...
warren
One Day At A Time
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: U.K.
Posts: 195
I have been through the same mental turmoil vinnie. If you're not an alcoholic you seem to be spending quite a lot of time thinking about booze for someone who isnt'. But maybe you are not- only you can decide, i suggest you look over some threads here- or check out the A.A. website - it has lots of info and maybe help you decide. I hope you get through and dont drink- as you say you dont want to. Keep posting and sharing how u feeling. Try to keep it into today and stay strong
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,697
Well
If you are truly an alcoholic like me and many others around here, you don't have to concern yourself with 'if' - rather 'when'.
You see the first step in admitting I was alcoholic was that nothing I can do with my mind is gonna keep me sober. I will drink again - that is what alcoholics do. It doesn't need to be a nice day, a pending sale, a rainy day, a day where everything falls apart.
To sum up my last drunk: It was a very nice day, I was walking down the street and it was sunny, my thoughts were pleasant. I didn't want to drink, nor was I even entertaining the thought of a drink.
I found myself drunk a couple of hours later (this was after 14 months sober) - with no explanation as to what happened.
This is the insanity of alcoholism, and the insanity of alcoholism proceeds the first drink - once I get a little (the first drink), there will be no stopping. The insane state I fell into (with no power to help me through those times), I had no choice but to drink - in fact there was not even a conscious choice. I was not in a black out- when I look back and try to remember what led up to the first drink that day, it seems like I am watching a movie with me as the star - walking down a sunny street, whistling a tune, walk into a liqour store, buy a bottle, go home and have a drink. Like a movie - I have no idea what was going on inside of my head at that time.
I am an alcoholic - this 'mental twist' that AA talks about is very real. I will drink again unless God intervenes. Today I put myself in God's hands to carry me through those times, because they are going to happen. Like the Christian story/poem called 'Footprints' - God will carry me through those times if I am just willing to put myself into his care.
The solution in the 12 steps led me here, they don't keep me sober, but they did put me into conscious contact with a power greater than me and my mind, which keep me sober and carry me through times where 'choice' is not available.
For me to drink is to die,and I am gonna drink again. That is the great fact that got me willing to do whatever it would take to stay sober. If I put myself into god's hands - I now have faith that I will be carried so I can be useful in whatever way I can. Drunk - I am not useful to anyone.
If you are truly an alcoholic like me and many others around here, you don't have to concern yourself with 'if' - rather 'when'.
You see the first step in admitting I was alcoholic was that nothing I can do with my mind is gonna keep me sober. I will drink again - that is what alcoholics do. It doesn't need to be a nice day, a pending sale, a rainy day, a day where everything falls apart.
To sum up my last drunk: It was a very nice day, I was walking down the street and it was sunny, my thoughts were pleasant. I didn't want to drink, nor was I even entertaining the thought of a drink.
I found myself drunk a couple of hours later (this was after 14 months sober) - with no explanation as to what happened.
This is the insanity of alcoholism, and the insanity of alcoholism proceeds the first drink - once I get a little (the first drink), there will be no stopping. The insane state I fell into (with no power to help me through those times), I had no choice but to drink - in fact there was not even a conscious choice. I was not in a black out- when I look back and try to remember what led up to the first drink that day, it seems like I am watching a movie with me as the star - walking down a sunny street, whistling a tune, walk into a liqour store, buy a bottle, go home and have a drink. Like a movie - I have no idea what was going on inside of my head at that time.
I am an alcoholic - this 'mental twist' that AA talks about is very real. I will drink again unless God intervenes. Today I put myself in God's hands to carry me through those times, because they are going to happen. Like the Christian story/poem called 'Footprints' - God will carry me through those times if I am just willing to put myself into his care.
The solution in the 12 steps led me here, they don't keep me sober, but they did put me into conscious contact with a power greater than me and my mind, which keep me sober and carry me through times where 'choice' is not available.
For me to drink is to die,and I am gonna drink again. That is the great fact that got me willing to do whatever it would take to stay sober. If I put myself into god's hands - I now have faith that I will be carried so I can be useful in whatever way I can. Drunk - I am not useful to anyone.
Don't get undies in a bunch
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: South Shore MA
Posts: 7,120
I am an alcoholic but I can drink if I want.
I am not banned from ever drinking again.
By choice I say no to picking up that first drink though.
If I drink, I return to my old ways.
The choice is mine...live the better life or return to my old ways.
I think I am making the better choice by not picking up that first drink today.
I am not banned...I am making a better choice that gives better consequences.
This
vs this 
8
I am not banned from ever drinking again.
By choice I say no to picking up that first drink though.
If I drink, I return to my old ways.
The choice is mine...live the better life or return to my old ways.
I think I am making the better choice by not picking up that first drink today.
I am not banned...I am making a better choice that gives better consequences.
This
vs this 8
1 bite&all resistance crumbles
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: IRELAND
Posts: 2,208
Vinnie
Are you doing this on your own? Cause if you are, and you are an alcoholic you may as well go straight to the bar right now - cause alcohol is gonna win. It just does. It's inevitable. My advice - get into some - any - kind of recovery *program* cause just white knucking it IS doomed to failure. Fact.
Hope you find something that works for you, Vinnie.
Cathy31
x
Are you doing this on your own? Cause if you are, and you are an alcoholic you may as well go straight to the bar right now - cause alcohol is gonna win. It just does. It's inevitable. My advice - get into some - any - kind of recovery *program* cause just white knucking it IS doomed to failure. Fact.
Hope you find something that works for you, Vinnie.
Cathy31
x
garden variety alcoholic
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Tehachapi, CA
Posts: 85
They told me early on, that if I was having an intellectual conversation with myself, that I was talking to a fool. That it would be a good idea to bring someone else in to the conversation.
You've done that posting here, any one on one??
You've done that posting here, any one on one??
Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: California
Posts: 111
Ah yes, the dreaded "nevers" and "forevers". Don't even think about that. The only day you need to deal with is today. And that next sunny day? Go outside, relax and enjoy it. You may be surprised to find it's just as relaxing without a beer as it was with one. I did. I'm right behind you on day 11 - keep up the good work!
p.s. Lime flavored sparkling water with a splash of cranberry juice is a great substitute for beer.
p.s. Lime flavored sparkling water with a splash of cranberry juice is a great substitute for beer.
Practice Sobriety
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: KC missouri
Posts: 885
Do you want to quit or not. It sounds you are still waffling. I have been sober since march 17th I spend alot of time thinking about beers and just having a good time. I got chewed out when I posted a similar type thread awhile back. If you want quit and get serious about it then do it. If you are having these thoughts maybe you really don't want to quit. I am 27. Faced the fact that I am an alchololic, told everyone, told people the resources I use. Yesterday a friend of mine dried of drinking and drugs, i have actually had a couple friends die. What did the 30 of his friends do? Drink it up of course. I don't think it matters if you think you are an alcholic or not. You are on this site for a reason. These are just my opinions and take them with a grain of salt because I am always telling myself look at those guys they are having beers and have fun then I realize that i am not like those people I am an abuser. Hopefullly everything works out
Member
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 55
Just like most others in this forum are saying, I too have had this conversation with myself (It still amazes me how alike all our minds are!). The one thing that I keep telling myself that reminds that I am indeed an alcoholic, is the fact that I am even thinking about alcohol! Whether I'm on my way to the bar thinking, 'just a few. I'm only staying for an hour or 2. I am NOT getting plastered tonight. Nope, no, not gonna do it.' A normal person would not even have to be having this conversation with themselves. They wouldn't even have to think about it. They just do what they want, without letting alcohol change their mind. That alcohol has got a mind of it's own I think, and it clings to our brains...reminding us of the good times we've had with it. Telling us we're fine to keep on drinking. Yes, I've been there. I'm there all day every day. I made it 5 whole days without drinking, and I let alcohol tell my brain that I proved to myself that I'm fine. I deserve to have a few now. And I'm right back to where I was. Feeling guilty, regretful, ashamed. As long as we're still thinking about alcohol as much as we do, we can't drink. It sucks, but I know it's the truth.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: MA.
Posts: 1,719
Hi Vinnie,
Denial shows its' ugly face in many ways...
It will always be there to tempt you...
If you are indeed an alcoholic, acceptance of your disease is necessary...Once you are alcoholic, there is no turning back except to slow the progression of the disease, quit drinking before it kills you...
Thinking of you...
Denial shows its' ugly face in many ways...
It will always be there to tempt you...
If you are indeed an alcoholic, acceptance of your disease is necessary...Once you are alcoholic, there is no turning back except to slow the progression of the disease, quit drinking before it kills you...
Thinking of you...
Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 59
hey vinnie...I am a "vinnie" as well...go figure.
I remember this feeling... like I may never have fun again...and that it was'nt fair that " OTHERS got to use and why shouldn't I "
honestly...it was a heaviness...but it went away...it passed...but I augmented everything with drinking...a good day was better with booze...a bad day was less bad with booze...sex was better loaded...holidays were not the holidays without it... I wouldn't be able to laugh or be as funny without it...fun was MORE fun if I was high !
it will pass...it will feel like forever...but it may pass in a matter of minutes...maybe hours...maybe days...but it WILL PASS ! and over time...you can LOSE the obsession completely...it just does not enter my mind anymore to use...or perhaps I should say...very rarely...and it's seconds before its gone. never more than a few seconds now.
I remember an excersise I used to do with myself... I had this great memory of being around 9 or 10 yrs old...we had a city public swimming pool we kids used to walk to and swim and play...after I got home this one warm summer day...I got dressed... I ate...and was sitting outside in the sun ...on the curb in my Mom and Dad's driveway...alone...quiet...warmed through by that sunshine...clean jeans , warm against my skin...bare feet...the moment was sublime...no worries no cares...a full belly...the pureness of youth...I was perfect in that moment...and I realized it...right then...right there.
I thought at that moment... "I may never feel this happy and content again... I should really remember this " ...even at 10 years old...I really felt like I needed to sock this memory away in my heart so I could look back someday and remember what it was like to be TRULY happy...
here comes the part where some may roll there eyes...but its true.
I feel like that kid a lot of the time in sobriety...like Im warmed in the sun...happy ...content...like there could not possibly be anything better than this in Heaven or Earth.
Its there for you man...it may take some time...and its not always like that...but its worth it...it really is.
what worked for me was NOT making any big decisions during this early stage ( IE" should I quit my Job ! yikes !)
I like to keep it simple...get to meeting ...and don't drink.
peace and respect,
miavin2 ( vinnie )
I remember this feeling... like I may never have fun again...and that it was'nt fair that " OTHERS got to use and why shouldn't I "
honestly...it was a heaviness...but it went away...it passed...but I augmented everything with drinking...a good day was better with booze...a bad day was less bad with booze...sex was better loaded...holidays were not the holidays without it... I wouldn't be able to laugh or be as funny without it...fun was MORE fun if I was high !
it will pass...it will feel like forever...but it may pass in a matter of minutes...maybe hours...maybe days...but it WILL PASS ! and over time...you can LOSE the obsession completely...it just does not enter my mind anymore to use...or perhaps I should say...very rarely...and it's seconds before its gone. never more than a few seconds now.
I remember an excersise I used to do with myself... I had this great memory of being around 9 or 10 yrs old...we had a city public swimming pool we kids used to walk to and swim and play...after I got home this one warm summer day...I got dressed... I ate...and was sitting outside in the sun ...on the curb in my Mom and Dad's driveway...alone...quiet...warmed through by that sunshine...clean jeans , warm against my skin...bare feet...the moment was sublime...no worries no cares...a full belly...the pureness of youth...I was perfect in that moment...and I realized it...right then...right there.
I thought at that moment... "I may never feel this happy and content again... I should really remember this " ...even at 10 years old...I really felt like I needed to sock this memory away in my heart so I could look back someday and remember what it was like to be TRULY happy...
here comes the part where some may roll there eyes...but its true.
I feel like that kid a lot of the time in sobriety...like Im warmed in the sun...happy ...content...like there could not possibly be anything better than this in Heaven or Earth.
Its there for you man...it may take some time...and its not always like that...but its worth it...it really is.
what worked for me was NOT making any big decisions during this early stage ( IE" should I quit my Job ! yikes !)
I like to keep it simple...get to meeting ...and don't drink.
peace and respect,
miavin2 ( vinnie )
Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 59
Originally Posted by timeforchange 
...reminding us of the good times we've had with it.
miavin2
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