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Heavy drinker or alcoholic ??

Old 12-13-2007, 08:36 AM
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Heavy drinker or alcoholic ??

Hello, and thanks for this great forum, it's been an invaluable source of inspiration for me.

I would like to hear your opinion about my situation : Heavy drinker
or Addict ?

Since i was 16 i loved to get drunk on parties and during weekends.
Now i'm 33 and i can hardly remember a sober friday or saturday night.

While i was studying and working full time i basically drank only
on weekends, and rarely had any beer or wine at home.

While in holidays i could get drunk almost every day or at least drink
a lot every night or every two nights.

2 months ago i traveled far away for a month, and i drank almost
every 2 days, from a minimum of 3-4 (66cc) beers to a maximum
of 15 beers, when drinking wine i could easily drink 3 bottles of red wine.

I never vomit or feel really sick.

Now, since 2 years i work as a freelance at home and this
greatly contributed to my self poisoning : as long as i worked
in offices i was forced to stay sober and then trash my mind in weekends.

But NOW with nobody controlling if i'm sober or drunk i keep drinking
more and more until 3 days ago i finally realized i'm POWERLESS and for
the first time in my life i prayed God.

I basically drink every 3 days.
I can't drink every 2 days or every day : the simple idea of drinking
while recovering from the previous binge makes me sick.
In this moment for instance i don't drink since 3 days and next to my desk
i've empty bottles of wine and 3 cans of beers, i feel no impulse to
drink the beers nor i feel sicks by any means, just as usual ashamed of
my lack of self-control and ashamed of ME.

Yes, it all starts with the infamous "i'll drink just ONE beer..."
and then i find myself going to a convenience store in the middle
of the night to buy more booze.

I drink "socially" in weekends, but now i really love to drink by
myself at home as well.

Often i go at supermarket buying food i don't need just to put
some bottles and packs of beer in the basket.

Moreover, i'm surrounded by small convenience stores open 24x7,
one even in the ground floor of my building so as long as i wanna
drink it takes me 2 minutes to come back home with some booze.

In the past i've quit drinking even for 2 months, recently for one or
two weeeks with NO physical or mental problems at all.

But all in all, i get drunk at least 2 times a week.

My job is a creative work, and of course i feel very inspired when
writing and designing while having a glass of wine on my desk.

So much that often i feel i can't focus well without some booze.
This is scaring the **** out of me.
But the inspiration i get from booze is why i like it so much.
If you're paid to be creative there's simply no denial booze
will give you weird ideas.

So this is my loop, i can always find a good reason to drink,
if i have good news i drink to party, if i have bad news i drink
to forget about it, if i'm bored i drink because of boredom, if
not i drink for inspiration or for relax etc

I just never plan to drink SO much but i simply can't stop
after the first glass.

If i finish the booze my brain invents a very good reason
to go outside and buy some more.

And probably i would do it even i lived far away from the stores,
i would probably plan buying huge amounts of booze instead of few
bottles at a time.

I know almost any convenience store and supermarket in my area.
To avoid looking like a regular drinker each time i rotate the store
where i buy booze.

Now, this really makes me think i DO have a problem !
I'm really going beyond social drinking.

But at the same time i don't have the withdrawal symptoms many
of you describe in this forum, nor i can remotely think about drinking
every day or even in the morning !

So, the big question is .. Am i just a heavy drinker or not ?
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Old 12-13-2007, 08:46 AM
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Only you can decide for sure whether you have an issue with alcoholism or not. There's a couple simple tests you can take at these sites:

http://www.aa.org/en_is_aa_for_you.cfm?PageID=71

http://www.alcoholscreening.org/

I've been sober for a couple years. I used to think I was just a heavy drinker and could control my drinking, but now I understand that I can never safely drink again.

Here's something to think about. You gave a mighty description of your drinking patterns and characteristics. To my knowledge, normal drinkers don't ever consider those things.
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Old 12-13-2007, 08:49 AM
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But NOW with nobody controlling if i'm sober or drunk i keep drinking more and more until 3 days ago i finally realized i'm POWERLESS and for the first time in my life i prayed God.
The feeling of powerlessness could be a strong clue.

I know almost any convenience store and supermarket in my area.
To avoid looking like a regular drinker each time i rotate the store
where i buy booze.
If you don't have a problem, why would you even care what comparative strangers think?

You're the only one who can label yourself an alcoholic........but, you've certainly listed an awful lot of suspicious symptoms.......and, as we say in AA, "If it walks like a duck, if it quacks like a duck..."
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Old 12-13-2007, 08:59 AM
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nice to meet you! i am not an alcoholic, i am the mom of one. i consider myself a normal drinker (i actually hardly ever even have a drink. given what i've seen of this disease and it's consequences - no real interest.) i can tell you this, i never worry about or plan out alcohol. it is a non issue.

i hope this is helpful and that you will keep reaching out.

hugs, k
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Old 12-13-2007, 09:44 AM
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Hi telesius,
As others have said, it is only u who can really decide- and that is not aways easy when everything hasn't been lost etc. I know im an alcoholic, but cos im 20, never really drank in the morn (apart frm a few times) and didnt drink all day everyday i can get doubts. I also find it hard to accept - but many do. What it comes down to is the control. In the Big Book of A.A. it says something along the lines of, if when you start drinking you have little or no control you are probably alcoholic. Also if you find, when you want to stop, you cannot fully - you are probably alcoholic.

If i ever have doubts now and feel confused - i just remeber those very lines. It not about how much u drink- or when in the day u drink, how often u drink- NONE of that - it's what happens when u drink. Its feelings of guilyt, shame, remorse the next day after another binge. It's the hopelesness. I hope this helps u decide. I wish u well.
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Old 12-13-2007, 09:54 AM
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Thanks a lot for your replies !

Yes, i've indeed many symptoms, that's why i'm here
asking for a honest opinion.

I'll now check the tests you linked and see what comes
out.

Well, it may sound strange to hear someone is classifying
in lenght his symptoms but i'm a pretty technical guy keen
on keeping everything in order.

I keep a detailed list of my expenses, financial situation,
and more, so of course i started doing the same about drinking :
yes, i've an Excel file where i write anything i drink with
date, type of booze, brand, and quantity.

As a result i have a chart with my weekly and monthly booze
consumption.

I know it can sound crazy but i can tell you it's a good way
to keep track of how much you really drink.

Yes, asking myself if i'm a drunk or if i'm just drinking
a bit too much than usual is certainly a BAD symptom.

BUT.. i can still control my drinking if i'm invited to
dinner with customers, or if i go back home to my parents
or meet old friends : in these cases i do my best to drink
exactly as much as they do and more or less i can manage to
control my attitude.

Of course i feel the urge to drink more but after half an hour
or more i relax a bit and the urge almost goes away.

But all this needs planning, especially in case of important
meetings, it's not something natural but rather a "i can control
my drinking" but it's not a pleasure, it's like you really need
to concentrate to avoid drinking too much.

That's why i ask myself if i'm normal or not.
I just don't feel this is normal.

Heavy drinker or full addict, the point is : drinking IS badly
influencing my life, it's taking lot of time energy and dedication
from my life, all things i could spend in better sober ways.

So yes i don't think to be a normal social-drinker but
at the same time i don't show the typical symptoms
of an alcoholic.

MY big doubt is : will i finally get in control of my life,
or i'm doomed to go from one drinking loop to another
with few sober weeks or months in the middle until i finally
quit forever or switch to full alcoholism ?
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Old 12-13-2007, 10:05 AM
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If one falls off of a 10 story building is it the fall or the sudden stop that kills you?

Alcohol has control over your life. I don't know even a heavy drinker who charts their consumption, spends untold hours concerned with alcohol, or is obsessed with how much they drink and when.

My question, and it is very genuine, are you more concerned with what category you fall into, or if alcohol has taken over your life? If it is the later, then does it really matter what you decide to call yourself?

I got my life back after I stopped having to plan my every move based on how it related to alcohol. I sincerely hope that you find a path that will lead out of this forest of confusion. I do salute you for your recognition that SOMETHING IS SERIOUSLY WRONG.

Good luck,

Jon
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Old 12-13-2007, 10:09 AM
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Just be 100% honest with yourself and I'm sure you'll come to the right conclusion. Welcome!
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Old 12-13-2007, 10:24 AM
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I can't answer that only you can, I can suggest seeing your doctor though, in the end of my long love affair with alcohol I too couldn't drink for a day or so after a binge, for me there were two choices death or life I chose life and I am now living.
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Old 12-13-2007, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by mandi View Post
Hi telesius,
As others have said, it is only u who can really decide- and that is not aways easy when everything hasn't been lost etc. I know im an alcoholic, but cos im 20, never really drank in the morn (apart frm a few times) and didnt drink all day everyday i can get doubts. I also find it hard to accept - but many do. What it comes down to is the control. In the Big Book of A.A. it says something along the lines of, if when you start drinking you have little or no control you are probably alcoholic. Also if you find, when you want to stop, you cannot fully - you are probably alcoholic.

If i ever have doubts now and feel confused - i just remeber those very lines. It not about how much u drink- or when in the day u drink, how often u drink- NONE of that - it's what happens when u drink. Its feelings of guilyt, shame, remorse the next day after another binge. It's the hopelesness. I hope this helps u decide. I wish u well.
exactly.
i never ever drank in the morning.
nor i drank every day, in average from my statistics i drink every 3.5 days.

moreover, i rarely get really drunk as i've a strong tolerance to beer and wine, i just drink a lot and for many hours, but you'll never see me throw up or unable to talk or walking zig-zag, i mean i get hammered but not like during my youth.

in my early 20s when i was drunk i was reaaaally drunk, now i definetely im much more in control when i drink, i can easily pass for half-sober sometimes but i suppose this is a learned behaviour.

point is, i drink more than what's socially accepted for "normal".
i try to avoid buying big quantities of booze but then find myself
thinking for half an hour if i must go out buying some more or just go off to bed.

sometimes i go off to bed (if the next day i've urgent work to finish for instance), other times i rush out of the door and come back with more wine or beer and go sleep at 07.00am

and yes, the next day i feel like ****, guilty, and especially recenlty, completely powerless, frustrated.

and still i can tell you, this is much better than years ago.
years ago i had several violent outburst of drunkness, they were just limited to friday and saturday nights but i deeply regret those incidents, i lost the respects of almost all my friends, girlfriends, and co-workers.

i risked to do some serious damage to myself, i havent been in jail but i guess if i kept that lifestyle before or later i would either died or finished in serious troubles.

so in theory now i should be happy, my drinking after all is under control compared to my crazy days, but still, i feel there's a demon in me, screaming to go out, can control for a while but before or later i feel it can lead me to do things that will put me in serious ****.

said that, there's no way i can say my behaviour is normal, i never was a normal guy after all, i've always had this tendence to self-destruction.

that's why i ask myself, is my drinking led by biological predisposition or the issue is mainly my innate "not feeling in peace with myself" ?

3 days ago i prayed God.
i don't mean it was a liberation, but definetely i DO feel better.

i finally admitted to myself i need HELP and i don't want to ruin my life.
well, i already ruined my life years ago for many reasons, often because of booze but also when sober, the point is i don't wanna ruin even my actual and future life.

i mean, i'm sometimes just afraid of myself.
when sober i couldn't hurt a fly.
when drunk i can control myself now.
but when REALLY drunk, i'm a monster, i could do anything,
and if driving a car well i could kill somebody or kill myself thinking to
be in full control.

this is really scaring the **** out of me.

and i've even enough of social drinking if that matters.
i'm not so shy to need drinks to meet new people or talk with a girl.
problem is, i just can't feel at ease drinking orange juice in a pub where everybody is drinking and partying, as i tend to just see what the gathering really is : a pathetic room painted with crappy decorations selling overpriced booze whit some moron playing tracks calling himself "dj", with ugly ladies who spent 3 hours at the hair dresser to look younger, with guys who do
their best to look cool to impress girls who are there just to meet rich men
and getting laid.

i maybe think too much, i'm maybe probably a bit pessimistic, but i just
can't go in pubs and bars and have fun without a few drinks.

but what else could i do in weekends ? i don't have a girlfriend now, no kids,
no family to care.

if instead of bars i go to dinner people here can drink even more than at bars.

i just can't imagine a fully sober life.

i travel a lot and especially while travelling i drink much more and more often.
with all the people you meet around there's nothing better to share a beer.
ONE beer would be ok but you know, in the end it's 3-4 at least.

still, not enough to say i feel drunk, but neither to say i'm sober or in FULL control.

so that's my situation.
again thanks a lot for your time and suggestions !
i highly appreciate it !
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Old 12-13-2007, 10:59 AM
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When I got sober I didn't know if I was an alcoholic or not. I just knew my life was nuts, and most uncomfortable. So I went for 90 days without by going to as many meetings as I needed to go to, taking suggestions, etc., telling myself I would reevaluate after I had 90 days sober.

The fact that I went through withdrawals was a big clue. And things improved. But that's just a start.
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Old 12-13-2007, 11:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Telesius View Post
Heavy drinker or full addict, the point is : drinking IS badly
influencing my life, it's taking lot of time energy and dedication
from my life, all things i could spend in better sober ways.

So yes i don't think to be a normal social-drinker but
at the same time i don't show the typical symptoms
of an alcoholic.

MY big doubt is : will i finally get in control of my life,
or i'm doomed to go from one drinking loop to another
with few sober weeks or months in the middle until i finally
quit forever or switch to full alcoholism ?
Hi Telesius. Yeah, sounds like you are putting a lot of energy into controlling your drinking.

What are the "typical symptoms" of an alcoholic? What's "full alcoholism"? The only I know of is: can't live with drinking, can't live without it. From what you've written, you could very well be a full alcoholic right now and show many typical symptoms.

I knew I was "alcoholic" for a long time, but that didn't change my drinking. But then I got to the point where I truly wanted to quit drinking, and found I couldn't. That's when I admitted to myself that I simply wasn't able to control my drinking and needed help. And that's when I finally understood what it meant to be an alcoholic.

One thing a lot of us discovered is that just because we stopped drinking didn't mean we were "sober". I stopped drinking for over 3 years, but I wasn't a very happy person at all. So for many of us, "getting sober" means learning how to live -- new attitudes, new emotions, new ways of acting towards others -- that enable us to live productive and contented lives. That's sobriety.

In the end, you'll have to discover for yourself the nature of your relationship to alcohol. If you do realize you want to live a different kind of life than the one you've known, I hope you have an easier time with it than I did.
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Old 12-13-2007, 11:04 AM
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Be honest with yourself and look at these questions. Apply them to yourself and your experience with alcohol.

1. When you drink do find that you have little control over the amount you take?

2. When you honestly want to, do you find that you can't stay away from alcohol?

If the answer is yes to both, you may be an alcoholic.
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Old 12-13-2007, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Telesius View Post
i just can't imagine a fully sober life.
You don't have to be able to imagine it right now. But if you have a true desire to stop drinking, go to an AA meeting. You will see many, many people made miserable by alcohol. They, too, couldn't imagine a fully sober life. But they learned, and so can you.

Just so you know, living this "fully sober life" is SO MUCH BETTER than any life I could have imagined. If you think the high from getting drunk is a blast, the feelings and benefits of living a physically, mentally, emotionally, and spiritually healthy life will blow you away!

All I wanted to do when I was drinking was get comfortable in my own skin for a little while and forget about my problems and uncomfortable feelings. Now I have that most of the time, and I get it without poisoning myself.

A truly sober life -- including emotional sobriety -- is the single best, most amazing, greatest, fantastic, incredible, wonderful, excellent, very cool thing that could happen to anyone. It takes time, work and patience, but if drinking is no longer an option for you (or you simply can't stand the way your life is anymore), then a whole new world is waiting for you.

Go to an AA meeting and ask people what they like about living sober. Then ask yourself if you want what they have.
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Old 12-13-2007, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Telesius View Post
: Heavy drinker
or Addict ?
I knew a of man that had One stiff drink every night at 7PM. After 30 years of doing that, when he was in the hospital for an operation, he started having signs of DTs/withdrawal. He was addicted to his habit of one stiff drink.

I know a man that can go months with no alcohol but if he has one beer, it can lead to two and once he has had two..he won't stop til the night is over or the beer is gone (that would be me) I would classify myself as an alcoholic because once alcohol is added to my system..I don't have any control to stop at just two beers for the night. I was never addicted to alcohol, I just couldn't control it once it was added to my system.

The best test I know... Do you control alcohol or does alcohol control you?
Middle of the night beer runs...Well I would say that alcohol was controling me.

Last edited by best; 12-13-2007 at 11:48 AM.
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Old 12-13-2007, 11:41 AM
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yep it's not about how much you drink or when you drink or how often....it's about what it does to you when you do.

D
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Old 12-13-2007, 11:54 AM
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i'm VERY grateful for your wise words !

yes, i do have a strong desire to quit drinking at all.
i basically surrendered myself and prayed for the FIRST time
in 33 years.

i'm a chistian but hardly went to church apart when kid.
i've also been a rabid atheist and critic of the church or rome
for my whole life.

only recently i got in touch with God and thank to few christian
friends (both ex-atheists as well) step by step i see things from
a different perspective.

i don't really think alcohol is my only problem, i basically drink
for many reasons but first and foremost because i'm NOT in peace
with myself, and as long as i don't fix the issue causing this
perpetual situation, i'll keep living this way and as you rightly
said, it can only get WORSE, being it with alcohol or drugs or
eating disorders or whatever other illness.

i just need to be man and re-learn to live.
i'm at the point of non return.
all i want is to take back my life.
i've nothing to lose at this point from quitting drinking.

perhaps i just don't know how to live sober.
but now i see this is an interesting task.

i can tell you, last time i've stopped drinking for 2 months
i felt very good from any point of view, mentally, physically,
much more focused, quick in reasoning, alert, etc

problem is, i still lived with my inner problems.

as long as i can't get rid of them, i guess there's no hope
i'll be ever a happy man.

yes, i can have financial success, good job, etc
but still sad, angry, and unsatisfied.


@Jim :

1. When you drink do find that you have little control over the amount you take?
2. When you honestly want to, do you find that you can't stay away from alcohol?

answers :

1) it depends : if i'm relaxed i can drink 1-2 beers and stop.
of course i feel the need to drink more but i can control it.
if i eat something (chips, sandwich, whatever) the urge to drink
instantly goes away and i forget about booze.
By opposite in a bar or a pub i just need for the whole time
i'm inside the pub, i just feel a fish out of water without
a drink in my hand.
i can obviously avoid to get drunk, i can drink slow, but
still i can drink the hell more than many others.
if i'm angry for any reasons i tend to drink much more.
still somewhat in control as long as i dont mix beer+wine+liquors,
but the conclusion is always feeling like **** the next day, guilty,
etc etc
and in general i really like to drink, being with friends or by
myself (very introspective), i can not say i don't like booze,
i just feel good, warm, inspired.
and what's worse, i see most of the people working in creative
fields tend to abuse booze or drugs or both.
this is scaring too, we must be somewhat genetically programmed
i guess !


2) when i HONESTLY want to, like now, and like many other times
in the past, YES i can stay away from booze, as long as i stay
away from bars and parties and dinners as well, but still YES
i can do it.
problem is, because i'm not a happy person, before or later
i'll go back drinking or replace booze with something else.


AA meetings : i don't think i could do it now.
but... i'm thinking about it.
the main issue would be admitting i'm an alcoholic.
i don't really feel to be one, i feel to be someone
who drinks too much and too often, but still i can say
i'm light years distant from some reports i've read in this forum.

i'm more and more accepting alcohol abuse is mainly
a reaction to my feeling of not being happy and in peace
with myself.

i abuse of alcohol but i could abuse of drugs or anything
else.

is alcohol really my problem or is ME the problem ?

i will let you know how it goes.
my actual goal is staying sober at least until chrismas.
at christmas we'll have a big dinner and of course i'll be
forced to drink a bit but i'll manage to drink like the others.

then new years eve, same as above.

if i can do it, it's a good start, and i'll do january completely
sober, no pubs, no bars, no drinking events.

time will tell.
i'll be glad to share with you my progress.

Thanks again for the support !
Telesius
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Old 12-13-2007, 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Telesius View Post
i will let you know how it goes.
my actual goal is staying sober at least until chrismas.
at christmas we'll have a big dinner and of course i'll be
forced to drink a bit but i'll manage to drink like the others.

then new years eve, same as above.
hey tellesius, no one can force you to drink. unless it's a gunpoint or knifepoint or something, then you might have to ...

it's great that you are reaching out! support, k
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Old 12-13-2007, 12:00 PM
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I can't tell you if you are an alcoholic, but you may be able to look at some things and figure it out for yourself. I suggest you get the Big Bood of Alcoholics Anonymous, and read it beginning with the Doctor's Opinion all the way through to pg 44. You should surely learn some more about what it truely means to be an alcoholic.

I feel you on being able to circumstanually controll your drinking. There were times in my life too where due to the company or the nature of me drinking I wasn't able to get totally **** canned. But, I wasn't enjoying that. I couldn't wait most of the time to geo do some enjoyable drinking, and that meant I wasn't watching or keeping track of how many I was drinking.

On pg 44 in the first paragraph it asks a two part question to qualify yourself, but it is definatly more benificial to ask yourself that question after reading the preceeding chapters.

Let me know if I can help you with any questions you might have as you try to figure this deal out for yourself.
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Old 12-13-2007, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by best View Post
I knew a of man that had One stiff drink every night at 7PM. After 30 years of doing that, when he was in the hospital for an operation, he started having signs of DTs/withdrawal. He was addicted to his habit of one stiff drink.

I know a man that can go months with no alcohol but if he has one beer, it can lead to two and once he has had two..he won't stop til the night is over or the beer is gone (that would be me) I would classify myself as an alcoholic because once alcohol is added to my system..I don't have any control to stop at just two beers for the night. I was never addicted to alcohol, I just couldn't control it once it was added to my system.

The best test I know... Do you control alcohol or does alcohol control you?
Middle of the night beer runs...Well I would say that alcohol was controling me.

again, it depends, and that's the main reason
i'm not sure if i'm alcoholic or not.

i tend to plan everything.
if i plan to go out and get drunk with my friends,
then i'll indeed get drunk as planned and when the bar closes
i'll certainly seek other places to get the so called "last beer(s)".

by opposite, if i plan to drink just the minimum acceptable like
at dinners or work meeting, i'll just drink slowly and control myself.

moreover, as said already, if after 2-3 beers i eat something i
instantly loose the desire to drink more.

middle of the night beer runs, yes, that's what worries me,
that's not normal.

i start drawing, drinking a beer, then feeling inspired, drawing
and writing etc, then switching to music, and no matter what time
is it, i feel fully awake and in need of more booze, even if it's 08.30
in the morning and i'm drinking since 12 hours (i'm a slow drinker).

all in all when in pubs i drink just for fun.

when alone i use alcohol like a sort of introspective drug, sort
of psycadelic and indeed the mix of music and booze can be a sort
of "trip" in some cases.

so i don't know what to answer, alcohol controlling me ?
sometimes yes, sometimes no.
it's still unclear.

i'm sure if a go back to a 9-to-5 job i would only drink in weekends,
but still i would get wasted during holidays when i'm free to drink
the whole night, being with friends or alone.
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