Class of December 2012 - Part 8
Administrator
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,424
It can take a while to forgive ourselves Alice...and sometimes those closest to us get caught up in the little ball of anger.
It took me a while, but I figured everything I went through bought me here to today - and that's no bad thing.
I lost two partners - if you have someone who's seen you at your worst, and who's still there and not resenting or judging you....I think you have a gift there, honestly.
D
It took me a while, but I figured everything I went through bought me here to today - and that's no bad thing.
I lost two partners - if you have someone who's seen you at your worst, and who's still there and not resenting or judging you....I think you have a gift there, honestly.
D
Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: BC
Posts: 410
if you have someone who's seen you at your worst, and who's still there and not resenting or judging you....I think you have a gift there, honestly.
Guest
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 7,097
Hope your colonoscopy prep went ok Tam
ALice- I agree with Dee and Gonzo-your partner sounds a great person who truly loves you,maybe you do need to forgive yourself and realize you are worthy of love
It's boiling here today. Junior RAL has been invited to a party which I'm so pleased about that he's integrating well. Mr RAL is working away. Feel much calmer today,thankfully
Thread seems quiet-hope everyone is ok and enjoyed their holiday -do you get the whole weekend as hols for July 4th?
As always,Happy Sober Saturday.x
ALice- I agree with Dee and Gonzo-your partner sounds a great person who truly loves you,maybe you do need to forgive yourself and realize you are worthy of love
It's boiling here today. Junior RAL has been invited to a party which I'm so pleased about that he's integrating well. Mr RAL is working away. Feel much calmer today,thankfully
Thread seems quiet-hope everyone is ok and enjoyed their holiday -do you get the whole weekend as hols for July 4th?
As always,Happy Sober Saturday.x
Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 320
Glad it helped RAL 
Thanks all for the comments... I think the biggest issue with me not being able to fully love my partner comes down to trust. Could I ask your opinions? There are few places where I can be honest, and this is something I've not shared with anyone, though I should maybe discuss it with my shrink since it bugs me so much.
He has done a few things which feel like a real betrayal of trust, to the point where I feel angry just thinking about them. Once he was planning a trip overseas and I found out about it because while cleaning I found he'd bought travel insurance for a trip to the UK (where his ex that he'd recently reconnected with on Facebook lives, none the less). I confronted him and he said he'd come home and I was passed out and he was angry so he figured if I was going to do whatever I wanted so would he. I let that pass.
More recently, we'd been together for 4 years I think? He must've accessed my computer to check his facebook and when I jumped on and opened FB I saw that "I" had a message. I opened it, and then realised I was in his account. Of course I should have closed it, but I was curious... He had written a message to a friend of his that basically said "Hi I'm drunk right now. I don't normally drink but my girlfriend is out of town. She's an alcoholic (seriously) so I thought why not." There was some more talk and then something like "She keeps looking at me with those "let's have a kid" eyes, so I'll probably have to give her the flick soon. But hey, what are you up to? I'm due a big payout at the end of the year so I'm thinking I'll probably walk across the globe. Literally, hike". And more chatter.
So I was pretty upset. I felt betrayed that he'd talk about me like that to one of his friends. The he'd so casually talk about "getting rid of me" (of 4 years) and then just flit onto some other topic like it was no big deal (and again his desire to go off and be alone to travel).
I've never asked him about it - I shouldn't have read his message (and how I wish I hadn't), but I can't stop thinking about it, like 2 and a half years later. Whenever I am around his friends I think "what has he said? Do they know about my drinking? Do they think he barely cares for me?"
I guess this is really why I can't commit to him fully. The guy he was messaging was someone he hadn't seen in a while, I gathered that they were old friends and only just reconnected on FB (so he's saying this about me to someone who isn't even in his life, what does he say to the people that are?). In his defence I think maybe he was trying to sound tough, like being in a relationship isn't important and he is such a manly man that he doesn't need a partner. He likes to be flippant. But there was a lot of truth and spite in it.
So, Dear Abby, what do you guys think? I'd really appreciate your opinions. :S
(PS the kid thing is a whole other issue, if I do decide I want kids he won't stick around, so at 30 that's something I need to make a decision on before I can commit to him also. So much keeping me from being in this relationship 100%, and always the thought that "if I weren't such a drunk would I have looked for someone more in line with my future goals, someone more affectionate, able to love without fear of embarrassment" etc. Again, I know that he's had to suffer through a lot and this makes me sound horrible. Before him I was in an abusive relationship with a drug user and gambling addict, so I found his quiet, bookish manner and stability really appealing and often thought "yes he does this, but at least he doesn't do that" and let things slide so often. My self esteem was very low back then. One of my favourite quotes is:
And I wonder - did my low self esteem and my willingness to accept anything that wasn't violent and hateful mean I went into a relationship that didn't match my values? Have I compromised too much to the point where I am a different me when I'm with him?
Thanks all for the comments... I think the biggest issue with me not being able to fully love my partner comes down to trust. Could I ask your opinions? There are few places where I can be honest, and this is something I've not shared with anyone, though I should maybe discuss it with my shrink since it bugs me so much.
He has done a few things which feel like a real betrayal of trust, to the point where I feel angry just thinking about them. Once he was planning a trip overseas and I found out about it because while cleaning I found he'd bought travel insurance for a trip to the UK (where his ex that he'd recently reconnected with on Facebook lives, none the less). I confronted him and he said he'd come home and I was passed out and he was angry so he figured if I was going to do whatever I wanted so would he. I let that pass.
More recently, we'd been together for 4 years I think? He must've accessed my computer to check his facebook and when I jumped on and opened FB I saw that "I" had a message. I opened it, and then realised I was in his account. Of course I should have closed it, but I was curious... He had written a message to a friend of his that basically said "Hi I'm drunk right now. I don't normally drink but my girlfriend is out of town. She's an alcoholic (seriously) so I thought why not." There was some more talk and then something like "She keeps looking at me with those "let's have a kid" eyes, so I'll probably have to give her the flick soon. But hey, what are you up to? I'm due a big payout at the end of the year so I'm thinking I'll probably walk across the globe. Literally, hike". And more chatter.
So I was pretty upset. I felt betrayed that he'd talk about me like that to one of his friends. The he'd so casually talk about "getting rid of me" (of 4 years) and then just flit onto some other topic like it was no big deal (and again his desire to go off and be alone to travel).
I've never asked him about it - I shouldn't have read his message (and how I wish I hadn't), but I can't stop thinking about it, like 2 and a half years later. Whenever I am around his friends I think "what has he said? Do they know about my drinking? Do they think he barely cares for me?"
I guess this is really why I can't commit to him fully. The guy he was messaging was someone he hadn't seen in a while, I gathered that they were old friends and only just reconnected on FB (so he's saying this about me to someone who isn't even in his life, what does he say to the people that are?). In his defence I think maybe he was trying to sound tough, like being in a relationship isn't important and he is such a manly man that he doesn't need a partner. He likes to be flippant. But there was a lot of truth and spite in it.
So, Dear Abby, what do you guys think? I'd really appreciate your opinions. :S
(PS the kid thing is a whole other issue, if I do decide I want kids he won't stick around, so at 30 that's something I need to make a decision on before I can commit to him also. So much keeping me from being in this relationship 100%, and always the thought that "if I weren't such a drunk would I have looked for someone more in line with my future goals, someone more affectionate, able to love without fear of embarrassment" etc. Again, I know that he's had to suffer through a lot and this makes me sound horrible. Before him I was in an abusive relationship with a drug user and gambling addict, so I found his quiet, bookish manner and stability really appealing and often thought "yes he does this, but at least he doesn't do that" and let things slide so often. My self esteem was very low back then. One of my favourite quotes is:
We accept the love we think we deserve
Administrator
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,424
Obviously this is a pretty different picture to the one you painted before Alice.
This is a little out of my comfort zone to be honest...addiction or alcoholism advice I'm fine with, but relationship advice not so much
but I will say I don't think you can manufacture trust - it's got to be earned...and you either have it or you don't.
I think regardless of what you did as an active alcoholic it would be a mistake to settle because you feel guilty, or as some kind of penance.
If the reality is not matching your idea or dreams of what a relationship should be then I think you have some thinking to do?
D
This is a little out of my comfort zone to be honest...addiction or alcoholism advice I'm fine with, but relationship advice not so much
but I will say I don't think you can manufacture trust - it's got to be earned...and you either have it or you don't.
I think regardless of what you did as an active alcoholic it would be a mistake to settle because you feel guilty, or as some kind of penance.
If the reality is not matching your idea or dreams of what a relationship should be then I think you have some thinking to do?
D
Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 320
Thanks Dee. I didn't meant to pour my heart out quite so much haha! He really is a nice guy, I think that was all part of what shocked me - the way he sounded was completely different to how I know him, and made me wonder if I knew him at all. But it was him talking to an old friend, and maybe that's the kind of image he wanted to show this guy, for whatever reason.
It's very confusing. He was drunk when he wrote that... I know the sort of stuff I've gone on about when drunk. The fact he was drinking was out of character completely (and when I got back into town I had no idea he had been, he never mentioned it). I don't know what "kind" of drunk he is, as I think I've only seen him drunk once.
I just don't know if it's a serious thing, or just something trivial that I should let go. Was it long enough in the past that I should 'build a bridge' and get over it? The way he is with me I think he loves me very much, and do believe that if we broke up he would be devastated. He makes a lot of sacrifices for me, and tries to do things to make me happy.
Urgh, so much easier to be single and a crazy cat lady.
It's very confusing. He was drunk when he wrote that... I know the sort of stuff I've gone on about when drunk. The fact he was drinking was out of character completely (and when I got back into town I had no idea he had been, he never mentioned it). I don't know what "kind" of drunk he is, as I think I've only seen him drunk once.
I just don't know if it's a serious thing, or just something trivial that I should let go. Was it long enough in the past that I should 'build a bridge' and get over it? The way he is with me I think he loves me very much, and do believe that if we broke up he would be devastated. He makes a lot of sacrifices for me, and tries to do things to make me happy.
Urgh, so much easier to be single and a crazy cat lady.
Guest
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 7,097
Alice, from my perspective it appears there are 2 separate issues 1- trust because of the message & 2-children
1-this could just be him drunk, messaging an old chum,talking to him,mantalk etc etc, on its own I wouldn't be overly concerned. However, as you mention the children thing is a non starter for him I would be concerned.It's a serious issue and one not to be ignored or left till it's too late
Ihope you don't think I'm being preachy but I'll tell you my story and that of a friend. I never wantedchildren and was more interested in my career,friends, travel,drinking etc. People said I'd get broody but I thought they were incredibly patronizing,even rude. I had a series of relationships in my 20s but never settled. At 30 I met a man I adored,loved,we had great fun,got on so well etc. He was divorced with 2 children and had had a vasectomy. He was adamant hewould not have it reversed and didn't want any more children.I was in a dilemma. After 2 years did I stay knowing I didn't really want childrenanyway so it didn't really matter or end it just in case I changed my mind? In the end I ended it for 2 reasons:
1- I didn't want to eliminate my chances of EVER having a child
2 - I knew deep down that if he really,truly loved me he would not deny me a child.Truth was he didn't really love me.
The next year Imet MrRAL andhave junior RAL whoI would never be without. I would NOT have married Mr RAL if he didn't want more children( I clarified this on date 2
)
My advice would be to think very long and hard before staying with a man who is adamant he never wants children. Many men do say this but often change their minds. IF you know he won't then please think long and hard before YOU give away YOUR chance to have a child. Time will run out.
My friend's husband was adamant he neverwanted children.She did but loved him more so stayed. When she was 43 he left her,got together with a younger woman and is now very happy with his 2 young children and new partner.Unforunately,it's too late for my friend.
Please don't thinkyou owe him and make sacrifices as he's stayed with you whilst drunk. Iagree with Dee-you portray a very different picture than in your earlier post.
Nothing wrong with being single.Better being single than in an unhappy relationship and being free for new opportunities (men)
1-this could just be him drunk, messaging an old chum,talking to him,mantalk etc etc, on its own I wouldn't be overly concerned. However, as you mention the children thing is a non starter for him I would be concerned.It's a serious issue and one not to be ignored or left till it's too late
Ihope you don't think I'm being preachy but I'll tell you my story and that of a friend. I never wantedchildren and was more interested in my career,friends, travel,drinking etc. People said I'd get broody but I thought they were incredibly patronizing,even rude. I had a series of relationships in my 20s but never settled. At 30 I met a man I adored,loved,we had great fun,got on so well etc. He was divorced with 2 children and had had a vasectomy. He was adamant hewould not have it reversed and didn't want any more children.I was in a dilemma. After 2 years did I stay knowing I didn't really want childrenanyway so it didn't really matter or end it just in case I changed my mind? In the end I ended it for 2 reasons:
1- I didn't want to eliminate my chances of EVER having a child
2 - I knew deep down that if he really,truly loved me he would not deny me a child.Truth was he didn't really love me.
The next year Imet MrRAL andhave junior RAL whoI would never be without. I would NOT have married Mr RAL if he didn't want more children( I clarified this on date 2
)My advice would be to think very long and hard before staying with a man who is adamant he never wants children. Many men do say this but often change their minds. IF you know he won't then please think long and hard before YOU give away YOUR chance to have a child. Time will run out.
My friend's husband was adamant he neverwanted children.She did but loved him more so stayed. When she was 43 he left her,got together with a younger woman and is now very happy with his 2 young children and new partner.Unforunately,it's too late for my friend.
Please don't thinkyou owe him and make sacrifices as he's stayed with you whilst drunk. Iagree with Dee-you portray a very different picture than in your earlier post.
Nothing wrong with being single.Better being single than in an unhappy relationship and being free for new opportunities (men
)
Recovering ostrich
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Posts: 2,551
Hi all! Colonoscopy done, I have colitis. They took biopsies and are waiting for the results before prescribing the right meds. So that is that. At a Zumba bash right now, getting ready to dance for 2 hours. Wee!
Alice... I think you need to just talk to him. You could decide to talk about the message (he did leave it open on your laptop) or not. But it sounds like you all need to sit down and have a big kid talk. What are the plans for the future, yada yada. And discuss with your therapist. That's all this Abby has for you.
Everyone have a great weekend!
Lynn
Alice... I think you need to just talk to him. You could decide to talk about the message (he did leave it open on your laptop) or not. But it sounds like you all need to sit down and have a big kid talk. What are the plans for the future, yada yada. And discuss with your therapist. That's all this Abby has for you.
Everyone have a great weekend!
Lynn
Guest
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 7,097
At least you know what it is Lynn and your doc can look after you properly.How are you feeling? Is it aweight off your mind? You sound very upbeat which is great-must be all that zumba
I've eaten so much over the last 2 weeks with my mother here-out for tea and cakes every day,sometimes twice a day.put on at least half a stone
Zumba needed here methinks
I've eaten so much over the last 2 weeks with my mother here-out for tea and cakes every day,sometimes twice a day.put on at least half a stone
Zumba needed here methinks
Recovering ostrich
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Posts: 2,551
Ready, it is a weight off my shoulders. My stomach had been bad since at least November... I put off going to my doc because just didn't like her. So I switched docs. So glad I did! And you know. I have my times that I'm stressed, but for the most part, I've been upbeat since about 30 days in. I love it.. I love being sober.
Zumba would be great to get rid of that food, Ready! You can get it for the wii and junior ready can help! Lol
Zumba would be great to get rid of that food, Ready! You can get it for the wii and junior ready can help! Lol
Guest
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 7,097
Good on you for taking positive steps and changing your doc Lynn. Maybe you wouldn't have done that if you'd still been drinking
7 months -can't believe it really.I've been feeling sick this week,moody and tired.ALso more anxious than before.I'm thinkingthe anti-ds are becoming less effective-does that happen? If I go to doc she'll just increase the dose whereas I wouldlike to come off them really.
Wimbledon final today.Go Murray
Have a great day everyone.xx
7 months -can't believe it really.I've been feeling sick this week,moody and tired.ALso more anxious than before.I'm thinkingthe anti-ds are becoming less effective-does that happen? If I go to doc she'll just increase the dose whereas I wouldlike to come off them really.
Wimbledon final today.Go Murray
Have a great day everyone.xx
Recovering ostrich
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Tampa Bay, Florida
Posts: 2,551
Ready, they can become less effective. Are these something that you needed while you we're still drinking? Just tell your doc you would like to come off them... She will k ow why to do. Of course if you need them, take them!
Howdy gonzo!
Courage, thinking if you. And you too Alice, not sure what you are going to do about your SO.
Hi fallow, Marria, 2inconsolable, grandma, napster, tazzle, Dee and anyone I missed. Have a good Sunday!
Howdy gonzo!
Courage, thinking if you. And you too Alice, not sure what you are going to do about your SO.
Hi fallow, Marria, 2inconsolable, grandma, napster, tazzle, Dee and anyone I missed. Have a good Sunday!
Guest
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 7,097
Thanks Lynn.I started on them about 4months ago as felt numb/depressed. I felt better after a week or 2 but now don't feel any benefit and only side effects-sleep loss,weight gain,increased diet,memory loss. I do feel I'd be better without them and going to give it a go,especially with moving etc,everything seems to be better.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 569
Evening all, it has been a very very busy week and this is the first chance I have had to sit down and post. Checked in a few times tho SS and wife are doing better after the miscarriage, all went well and the dr said they can try again in a few months, they have a great support system with friends and family so are going through the grieving process.
Our craziness started last Saturday, we had to remove the toilet because of leak, removed the linoleum, and replaced with tile. We had never done that before and will NOT be doing that again, wow so much work. Hubby left Friday to get the hay done on the farm (will be back this Friday) with the toilet still not set well, and I just finished sealing it today. My SAR team was helping with the local rodeo, so I wasn't getting home till midnight on Thursday and Friday, was scheduled for Saturday night, but we were called out for a mission on Saturday, that involved a very daunting uphill climb in one of our canyons, (someone said a 40 degree pitch) I just know it was hot, steep and am not ashamed to say that yes I did the hands and knees shuffle on occasion. Going down was much easier, we had ropes to belay down with and gravity was working with us not against us. The truly difficult part was that our subject had commited suicide 5 days earlier and was just found that am by the helicopter. His car had been spotted and called in.
So ya'll can guess I would love nothing better than to be sitting on the patio with a glass of wine, but there's none in the house and I am to tired to pour it if there was. So that must be a good sign! take care all, and I will catch up on posts tomorrow.
SS and wife are doing better after the miscarriage, all went well and the dr said they can try again in a few months, they have a great support system with friends and family so are going through the grieving process.Our craziness started last Saturday, we had to remove the toilet because of leak, removed the linoleum, and replaced with tile. We had never done that before and will NOT be doing that again, wow so much work. Hubby left Friday to get the hay done on the farm (will be back this Friday) with the toilet still not set well, and I just finished sealing it today. My SAR team was helping with the local rodeo, so I wasn't getting home till midnight on Thursday and Friday, was scheduled for Saturday night, but we were called out for a mission on Saturday, that involved a very daunting uphill climb in one of our canyons, (someone said a 40 degree pitch) I just know it was hot, steep and am not ashamed to say that yes I did the hands and knees shuffle on occasion. Going down was much easier, we had ropes to belay down with and gravity was working with us not against us. The truly difficult part was that our subject had commited suicide 5 days earlier and was just found that am by the helicopter. His car had been spotted and called in.
So ya'll can guess I would love nothing better than to be sitting on the patio with a glass of wine, but there's none in the house and I am to tired to pour it if there was. So that must be a good sign! take care all, and I will catch up on posts tomorrow.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Olde England
Posts: 528
Hi All, hope you're all well, sorry I've not popped in - spent the last two weeks riding though Europe, bike blew up 100 miles into France sadly so did the rest of the (2,000 mile) trip on the back of a mate's bike, not how I'd planned it but hey. Will catch up on posts as soon as I can, just wanted to let you all know I'm still breathing :O)
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
