Frustrated and so very hopeless
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Frustrated and so very hopeless
Posted before . I am just getting really lost and frustrated. Three years sober . Never relapsed . Haven’t had any cravings. But I remain in a treatment resistant depression with horrible anxiety and ocd . Have attended a few AA meetings but I just feel like I can’t relate. What I really want is to know that by working the steps I will come out of this depression and I know that is not a guarantee . I don’t know if there is something else I could be doing . I try to walk and try not to spend all day in bed but I just feel hopeless most of the time .
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I'm not in AA and have never worked the steps, but know many people who have, and they say it's life-changing. The only way you'll know is to try it for yourself. 
I wish you the best.
I wish you the best. 
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Originally Posted by least 
I'm not in AA and have never worked the steps, but know many people who have, and they say it's life-changing. The only way you'll know is to try it for yourself. I wish you the best.
I wish you the best. Member
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Brain chemistry
I am also wondering . I have not had a drink in three years but have not found a medication in those three years to bring me above this depression . Could drinking and going through menopause that whole time messed up my brain chemistry to the point where I can’t respond to meds and could my brain chemistry still be messed up from drinking ? It’s been three years so I kind of doubt it ; but I just feel like I’m looking for answers .
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Hey, I really feel your frustration. My depression seems as though it's slightly lifting of late as I feel more settled on my meds and at my new (initially stress-inducing) halfway house. I am also ambivalent about the steps but even my doctor recommends I do them. It's hard to say how effective for anyone's depression they might be but the connection potential is certainly there. Are there other ways you can change up your life too? Is a change of scenery possible?
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I believe the Steps do work, read the Promises of AA, they have all come to realization for me. Does AA work for everyone? No, I can't honestly prove that and I know people that have struggled for years. You are correct in that there are no guarantees, my personal experience is that my results are dependent on my desire, I want a healthy and good life and I've received one by working a program of recovery.
I also keep in the back of my mind the mantra that "nothing changes if nothing changes". I've had to do the work in recovery and stay on that path for the rest of my life, and to get started I had to break free from the addictive thinking that kept me stuck by telling me that the only way I could cope with life was by using a substance. I'm still here, it's been almost 15 years, so I can say with conviction that it does work.
I also keep in the back of my mind the mantra that "nothing changes if nothing changes". I've had to do the work in recovery and stay on that path for the rest of my life, and to get started I had to break free from the addictive thinking that kept me stuck by telling me that the only way I could cope with life was by using a substance. I'm still here, it's been almost 15 years, so I can say with conviction that it does work.
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I have treatment resistant depression too Rharman, although it's not debilitating. I'm now coming up for 8 years sober without using AA. I didn't find sobriety helped my depression much, but I loved the boost in self esteem and the feeling of achievement. Waking up without hating myself was priceless.
The thing that helps me most is being with people, even though I'm quite an introvert. Is it the same with you? Because volunteering which involves working with other people might be a good fit for you. I can't comment on AA but why not give it a go? Have you discussed with your doctor or a counsellor and come up with a plan?
The thing that helps me most is being with people, even though I'm quite an introvert. Is it the same with you? Because volunteering which involves working with other people might be a good fit for you. I can't comment on AA but why not give it a go? Have you discussed with your doctor or a counsellor and come up with a plan?
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Originally Posted by Tetrax
Hey, I really feel your frustration. My depression seems as though it's slightly lifting of late as I feel more settled on my meds and at my new (initially stress-inducing) halfway house. I am also ambivalent about the steps but even my doctor recommends I do them. It's hard to say how effective for anyone's depression they might be but the connection potential is certainly there. Are there other ways you can change up your life too? Is a change of scenery possible?
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Originally Posted by rharman
Thank you for your reply . I know I should do the steps . A change of scenery really isn’t possible . I have a husband, autistic daughter and parents . Long story, but parents live with us , but husband and myself live at our business . Very strained relationship with parents right now, as they don’t really understand this .
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Originally Posted by Astro
I believe the Steps do work, read the Promises of AA, they have all come to realization for me. Does AA work for everyone? No, I can't honestly prove that and I know people that have struggled for years. You are correct in that there are no guarantees, my personal experience is that my results are dependent on my desire, I want a healthy and good life and I've received one by working a program of recovery.
I also keep in the back of my mind the mantra that "nothing changes if nothing changes". I've had to do the work in recovery and stay on that path for the rest of my life, and to get started I had to break free from the addictive thinking that kept me stuck by telling me that the only way I could cope with life was by using a substance. I'm still here, it's been almost 15 years, so I can say with conviction that it does work.
I also keep in the back of my mind the mantra that "nothing changes if nothing changes". I've had to do the work in recovery and stay on that path for the rest of my life, and to get started I had to break free from the addictive thinking that kept me stuck by telling me that the only way I could cope with life was by using a substance. I'm still here, it's been almost 15 years, so I can say with conviction that it does work.
Thank you Astro . Your answers are so encouraging. I want what you have . I read somewhere where you stated you were no longer on meds . Did you take the meds after the drinking stopped ? I had episodes of depression before I started drinking heavily. So I guess my question is , did you battle with mental illness before your drinking, or did it come as a result of your drinking ?
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Originally Posted by FeelingGreat
I have treatment resistant depression too Rharman, although it's not debilitating. I'm now coming up for 8 years sober without using AA. I didn't find sobriety helped my depression much, but I loved the boost in self esteem and the feeling of achievement. Waking up without hating myself was priceless.
The thing that helps me most is being with people, even though I'm quite an introvert. Is it the same with you? Because volunteering which involves working with other people might be a good fit for you. I can't comment on AA but why not give it a go? Have you discussed with your doctor or a counsellor and come up with a plan?
The thing that helps me most is being with people, even though I'm quite an introvert. Is it the same with you? Because volunteering which involves working with other people might be a good fit for you. I can't comment on AA but why not give it a go? Have you discussed with your doctor or a counsellor and come up with a plan?
Thank you so much for your response . I never had a problem being around people but now I do . I am isolating so much and becoming agoraphobic. I am currently on a leave from work which is running out and I have to go back . I am happy that I stopped drinking, but the longer this depression goes on, the more I think, what was the point . I read so many comments on here about how amazing people feel when they stopped , physically and mentally. I felt much better when I was drinking . Quitting has totally upended my life and completely turned it upside down .
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I got sober with the help of this website and also my addiction counselor, whom I saw once a week for several years. I no longer see the counselor but still come here daily.
I have been on Zoloft for years but of course it didn't work when I was drinking. Now that I'm sober, it works well and keeps my depression at bay.
I stay sober by liking my sober life so much more than my drinking life. And waking up not hating myself is such a reward.
I have been on Zoloft for years but of course it didn't work when I was drinking. Now that I'm sober, it works well and keeps my depression at bay.
I stay sober by liking my sober life so much more than my drinking life. And waking up not hating myself is such a reward.
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I've taken the 12 steps and now live in Steps in 10, 11 & 12. It changed me for the better but it wasn't a magic pill for depression. I feel for you rharman as I too know what it's like to be sober from alcohol but to be bitterly depressed to the point of having to call in sick at work. To give you hope, I'll tell you that the last time I missed work due to depression was the summer of 2005.
I've had ups and downs since then and am currently in a low spot which I am slowly coming out of. For me depression includes self pity, selfishness and apathy for others. When my life is solely focused on me, depression often returns. But when my days are full of activities that involve other people such as going to the gym, AA meetings, OA also in my case, working with sponsees, volunteer work in my community, preparing a delicious healthy meal for my spouse, taking the dog for a walk, etc., I'm so happy that I don't even think of depression.
It takes a lot of work (and low dose mood meds) to keep me in good spirits. And I can't forget to mention the Higher Power for without the Sunlight of the Spirit, I'm lost.
One last thing that helped me greatly, I have abstained from sugar since Nov 28, 2005. I haven't done it on my own; the Higher Power takes that credit!
Peace be with you!
I've had ups and downs since then and am currently in a low spot which I am slowly coming out of. For me depression includes self pity, selfishness and apathy for others. When my life is solely focused on me, depression often returns. But when my days are full of activities that involve other people such as going to the gym, AA meetings, OA also in my case, working with sponsees, volunteer work in my community, preparing a delicious healthy meal for my spouse, taking the dog for a walk, etc., I'm so happy that I don't even think of depression.
It takes a lot of work (and low dose mood meds) to keep me in good spirits. And I can't forget to mention the Higher Power for without the Sunlight of the Spirit, I'm lost.
One last thing that helped me greatly, I have abstained from sugar since Nov 28, 2005. I haven't done it on my own; the Higher Power takes that credit!
Peace be with you!
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I've struggled with chronic depression and anxiety my entire life, my whole family did or has. I started the SSRI's after I got sober and stayed on them for a year. The best description I have of that experience is that it "smoothed life out for me". Nowadays I can cope better with the bumps and bruises that life dishes out occasionally without the meds.
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Originally Posted by least
I got sober with the help of this website and also my addiction counselor, whom I saw once a week for several years. I no longer see the counselor but still come here daily.
I have been on Zoloft for years but of course it didn't work when I was drinking. Now that I'm sober, it works well and keeps my depression at bay.
I stay sober by liking my sober life so much more than my drinking life. And waking up not hating myself is such a reward.
I have been on Zoloft for years but of course it didn't work when I was drinking. Now that I'm sober, it works well and keeps my depression at bay.
I stay sober by liking my sober life so much more than my drinking life. And waking up not hating myself is such a reward.
That’s just it, I have been sober for three years and none of the 24 meds I have tried has worked . The whole time I was drinking, I was on ad and it was working . It’s when i stopped drinking that they stopped working . I can’t say about all the benefits of not drinking because I have been in this depression the whole time and have actually felt much worse .
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Originally Posted by Ringo123
I've taken the 12 steps and now live in Steps in 10, 11 & 12. It changed me for the better but it wasn't a magic pill for depression. I feel for you rharman as I too know what it's like to be sober from alcohol but to be bitterly depressed to the point of having to call in sick at work. To give you hope, I'll tell you that the last time I missed work due to depression was the summer of 2005.
I've had ups and downs since then and am currently in a low spot which I am slowly coming out of. For me depression includes self pity, selfishness and apathy for others. When my life is solely focused on me, depression often returns. But when my days are full of activities that involve other people such as going to the gym, AA meetings, OA also in my case, working with sponsees, volunteer work in my community, preparing a delicious healthy meal for my spouse, taking the dog for a walk, etc., I'm so happy that I don't even think of depression.
It takes a lot of work (and low dose mood meds) to keep me in good spirits. And I can't forget to mention the Higher Power for without the Sunlight of the Spirit, I'm lost.
One last thing that helped me greatly, I have abstained from sugar since Nov 28, 2005. I haven't done it on my own; the Higher Power takes that credit!
Peace be with you!
I've had ups and downs since then and am currently in a low spot which I am slowly coming out of. For me depression includes self pity, selfishness and apathy for others. When my life is solely focused on me, depression often returns. But when my days are full of activities that involve other people such as going to the gym, AA meetings, OA also in my case, working with sponsees, volunteer work in my community, preparing a delicious healthy meal for my spouse, taking the dog for a walk, etc., I'm so happy that I don't even think of depression.
It takes a lot of work (and low dose mood meds) to keep me in good spirits. And I can't forget to mention the Higher Power for without the Sunlight of the Spirit, I'm lost.
One last thing that helped me greatly, I have abstained from sugar since Nov 28, 2005. I haven't done it on my own; the Higher Power takes that credit!
Peace be with you!
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Originally Posted by Astro
I've struggled with chronic depression and anxiety my entire life, my whole family did or has. I started the SSRI's after I got sober and stayed on them for a year. The best description I have of that experience is that it "smoothed life out for me". Nowadays I can cope better with the bumps and bruises that life dishes out occasionally without the meds.
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Originally Posted by rharman
Thank you for your reply . This is my second medical leave from work during this three year depression . I don’t want to be self focused or have apathy towards others . I don’t want to isolate, but this depression is so bad , all those things are just there . I feel like if I could just find a med to get my head above water , it would ease up enough to work on things . As it is, I am trying to force myself out , try not to isolate , but it is so very difficult . Thank you so much for your input . It means so much .
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Hi rharman!
I was just reading your other long thread in the Newcomers forum and I was wondering how you were doing. One comment you made is the difficulty in trying to make other people understand what we are going through. How can we make them understand that there are levels to depression, measurable on scales such as the Hamilton Depression Rating Scale (HAM-D) , and our depression levels are among the worst? How do we explain to close friends and family how bad this is?
You said you have gone through menopause. It's not unheard of for people who have had mental health issues in the past to have those conditions worsen with age. (I am a 61 yo male by the way). It's also not unheard of for people who have not had mental health issues to develop them with age. To answer your question about the effect of alcohol on all of this: yes, menopause and drinking could have affected what has happened with both of our brains. Scientific evidence seems to support that. By the way, congratulations on not drinking !!! That is an achievement of epic proportions.
Don't feel bad about the medical leave. Self care is important. Go to AA. It gets you out of the house. I believe you said you were in therapy, so that is good. Eat well and exercise. (I'm almost embarrassed to say that one because I know all to well how it works when you are severely depressed).
Agoraphobia and withdrawing from people is common with severe depression. That's why I think AA would be good for you. I wish I could make people understand that "treatment resistant depression" means we have tried most of the meds out there and they didn't work. Keep trying. There are around 30 total meds they use for depression.
I already told you what happened to me with Ritalin. This was highly unusual and it is thought Ritalin somehow reset my brain. This was a week before ECT. Almost instantly, absolutely no depression. Now I have to learn how to live life again. Apparently this is common, and my psychiatrist wants me to see a psychologist that specializes in that.
Type II bipolar depression is awful. It has been documented that it can shorten a person's life, including causing early onset dementia. I had all the well known symptoms. I couldn't read. I occasionally had cognitive problems, including the inability to process information. I had major memory loss. There were times I was scared to drive. Was I self focused? You are damn right I was. It was the only way I could survive day to day. However, I never had apathy towards anyone else and I had no self pity.
Depression can go away on its own because it is cyclical. However, it cannot be predicted when depression will go away and as we get older depression may not end. Continue on with the meds and see what happens.
I am going to be brutally honest. Your choices after meds are ECT, TMS, and Ketamine. This is what your psychiatrist told you. When you get tired of the depression, consider one. There are reasons ECT exists in every large city around the world.
I wish you the best. My relief from depression is bittersweet because I know so many others suffer from this.
I was just reading your other long thread in the Newcomers forum and I was wondering how you were doing. One comment you made is the difficulty in trying to make other people understand what we are going through. How can we make them understand that there are levels to depression, measurable on scales such as the Hamilton Depression Rating Scale (HAM-D) , and our depression levels are among the worst? How do we explain to close friends and family how bad this is?
You said you have gone through menopause. It's not unheard of for people who have had mental health issues in the past to have those conditions worsen with age. (I am a 61 yo male by the way). It's also not unheard of for people who have not had mental health issues to develop them with age. To answer your question about the effect of alcohol on all of this: yes, menopause and drinking could have affected what has happened with both of our brains. Scientific evidence seems to support that. By the way, congratulations on not drinking !!! That is an achievement of epic proportions.
Don't feel bad about the medical leave. Self care is important. Go to AA. It gets you out of the house. I believe you said you were in therapy, so that is good. Eat well and exercise. (I'm almost embarrassed to say that one because I know all to well how it works when you are severely depressed).
Agoraphobia and withdrawing from people is common with severe depression. That's why I think AA would be good for you. I wish I could make people understand that "treatment resistant depression" means we have tried most of the meds out there and they didn't work. Keep trying. There are around 30 total meds they use for depression.
I already told you what happened to me with Ritalin. This was highly unusual and it is thought Ritalin somehow reset my brain. This was a week before ECT. Almost instantly, absolutely no depression. Now I have to learn how to live life again. Apparently this is common, and my psychiatrist wants me to see a psychologist that specializes in that.
Type II bipolar depression is awful. It has been documented that it can shorten a person's life, including causing early onset dementia. I had all the well known symptoms. I couldn't read. I occasionally had cognitive problems, including the inability to process information. I had major memory loss. There were times I was scared to drive. Was I self focused? You are damn right I was. It was the only way I could survive day to day. However, I never had apathy towards anyone else and I had no self pity.
Depression can go away on its own because it is cyclical. However, it cannot be predicted when depression will go away and as we get older depression may not end. Continue on with the meds and see what happens.
I am going to be brutally honest. Your choices after meds are ECT, TMS, and Ketamine. This is what your psychiatrist told you. When you get tired of the depression, consider one. There are reasons ECT exists in every large city around the world.
I wish you the best. My relief from depression is bittersweet because I know so many others suffer from this.
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rharman, I've read through this and while I can't comment on the AA / addiction things, I can definitely comment on your depression and hopefully provide some food for thoughts about it...
One thing I've found in my life to be true where depression is concerned is that half the battle in fighting it is about identifying the cause, which sounds obvious at first until you're thrust into an actual situation where you realize that it isn't. This deserves emphasis because it's almost a mental-emotional form of agnosia where the person in question sees the item in front of their face but their mind doesn't know how to recognize the shape, color, assign meaning, etc. As such, the brain can't process it, thereby creating a psychological context where the person basically can't "see" the thing responsible for it. It's a very odd phenomenon and I've always believed that this same conceptual framework can be said to apply to many depression situations that people experience. The funny thing is that once the person can identify the depression (or the things causing it, I mean), a certain level of enlightened perspective is achieved whereby the rest of the scientific process kicks-in to find the inevitable solution for the circumstances.
With you, I think it's especially applicable from the standpoint of recognizing everything you've been going through better than your awareness appears to be showing. Hopefully what I'm about to type out here next results in your penny-drop moment:
You mentioned above that you experienced menopause during your addiction. Given our lack of completely understanding brain chemistry, yes, it's very possible that it could've caused imbalances in various brain chemistry levels with you (something that is definitely worth bringing up to your doctor). But adding to this, you're also married (which is a massive responsibility in and of itself to deal with), you have an autistic daughter, and you're currently dealing with a living situation where a set of parents is living in your house while you and your husband are living at your place of work... To make matters more tense, you've mentioned that your leave is almost expired (thereby creating anxiety from the standpoint of knowing you'll have to return to work soon while simultaneously struggling to find solutions for the depression you're facing). Needless to say, these things would be enough to make anyone undergo various stages of mental health "turbulence" but understanding this and better appreciating the enormity of it might result in giving you a certain sense of security or compartmentalization necessary to begin enacting efforts to fix or deal with these things. Most importantly, it's worth realizing that you should be EXTREMELY proud of dealing with all these things as well as you have! Not everyone can overcome or just manage to deal with these things and to see you on here, asking others for their insights about addiction, about the steps, and to just talk through the stuff you're experiencing says so much about your character. Give yourself a pat on the back for that because not everyone is that enlightened.
This is just my opinion but given everything you've described up to this point, it doesn't sound like the stress you're going through is addiction-related but with that being said, it's worth following the steps because it won't hurt any. So yes, it's worth doing and yes, it's been worth doing (so don't let yourself fall into that pit where you begin to question all the effort you've put into getting to where you are today).
I could go on about finding things to assist you with your life, ranging from trying to find different living solutions for the parents to perhaps figuring out a way to get help with the daughter but I'm sure you're already doing that or have done that. Is it possible to get with the husband and put into your guys' schedules a "date night" once per-week? Marriage is something that takes effort but it's also one of the most important things to care for and having a date night not only fosters harmony between the partners but it also gives you something to look forward to. Moreover, it might be worth considering something like a gym membership for both of you, too--something else to look forward to and something that results in the good brain chemicals being produced more often at higher amounts.
I hope all this helps in some way. I know it's kind of a thought dump of sorts but it's meant to provide different angles of thought about your situation and to spark ideas about things you can do to assist. Hang in there.
One thing I've found in my life to be true where depression is concerned is that half the battle in fighting it is about identifying the cause, which sounds obvious at first until you're thrust into an actual situation where you realize that it isn't. This deserves emphasis because it's almost a mental-emotional form of agnosia where the person in question sees the item in front of their face but their mind doesn't know how to recognize the shape, color, assign meaning, etc. As such, the brain can't process it, thereby creating a psychological context where the person basically can't "see" the thing responsible for it. It's a very odd phenomenon and I've always believed that this same conceptual framework can be said to apply to many depression situations that people experience. The funny thing is that once the person can identify the depression (or the things causing it, I mean), a certain level of enlightened perspective is achieved whereby the rest of the scientific process kicks-in to find the inevitable solution for the circumstances.
With you, I think it's especially applicable from the standpoint of recognizing everything you've been going through better than your awareness appears to be showing. Hopefully what I'm about to type out here next results in your penny-drop moment:
You mentioned above that you experienced menopause during your addiction. Given our lack of completely understanding brain chemistry, yes, it's very possible that it could've caused imbalances in various brain chemistry levels with you (something that is definitely worth bringing up to your doctor). But adding to this, you're also married (which is a massive responsibility in and of itself to deal with), you have an autistic daughter, and you're currently dealing with a living situation where a set of parents is living in your house while you and your husband are living at your place of work... To make matters more tense, you've mentioned that your leave is almost expired (thereby creating anxiety from the standpoint of knowing you'll have to return to work soon while simultaneously struggling to find solutions for the depression you're facing). Needless to say, these things would be enough to make anyone undergo various stages of mental health "turbulence" but understanding this and better appreciating the enormity of it might result in giving you a certain sense of security or compartmentalization necessary to begin enacting efforts to fix or deal with these things. Most importantly, it's worth realizing that you should be EXTREMELY proud of dealing with all these things as well as you have! Not everyone can overcome or just manage to deal with these things and to see you on here, asking others for their insights about addiction, about the steps, and to just talk through the stuff you're experiencing says so much about your character. Give yourself a pat on the back for that because not everyone is that enlightened.
This is just my opinion but given everything you've described up to this point, it doesn't sound like the stress you're going through is addiction-related but with that being said, it's worth following the steps because it won't hurt any. So yes, it's worth doing and yes, it's been worth doing (so don't let yourself fall into that pit where you begin to question all the effort you've put into getting to where you are today).
I could go on about finding things to assist you with your life, ranging from trying to find different living solutions for the parents to perhaps figuring out a way to get help with the daughter but I'm sure you're already doing that or have done that. Is it possible to get with the husband and put into your guys' schedules a "date night" once per-week? Marriage is something that takes effort but it's also one of the most important things to care for and having a date night not only fosters harmony between the partners but it also gives you something to look forward to. Moreover, it might be worth considering something like a gym membership for both of you, too--something else to look forward to and something that results in the good brain chemicals being produced more often at higher amounts.
I hope all this helps in some way. I know it's kind of a thought dump of sorts but it's meant to provide different angles of thought about your situation and to spark ideas about things you can do to assist. Hang in there.
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