You toss them out , now theyre OUR problem
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Join Date: Sep 2018
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You toss them out , now theyre OUR problem
Im posting this as someone who now has to deal with the unwelcome family members who have nowhere to go because everyone else is "done" with them.
i recently moved to Florida following my divorce to heal myself.
I purchased a tiny fixer upper on twenty acres to try and get myself together and most of my neighbors have 10 - 20 acre parcels
Well, I can tell you where many go.
Theyre on our property, in tents, leaving their garbage everywhere, walking the streets at all hours, robbing our sheds and generally making our lives miserable.
We've had community meetings about this and as soon as the police clear them out, theyre back with a bunch of newcomers.
There are young people. Floridas the go to place for these folks because of the warmer weather.
I get that you dont want them in your homes, but neither do we.
Please dont make your problem everyone elses problem.
Another solution is needed somehow, because Im getting tired of it.
i recently moved to Florida following my divorce to heal myself.
I purchased a tiny fixer upper on twenty acres to try and get myself together and most of my neighbors have 10 - 20 acre parcels
Well, I can tell you where many go.
Theyre on our property, in tents, leaving their garbage everywhere, walking the streets at all hours, robbing our sheds and generally making our lives miserable.
We've had community meetings about this and as soon as the police clear them out, theyre back with a bunch of newcomers.
There are young people. Floridas the go to place for these folks because of the warmer weather.
I get that you dont want them in your homes, but neither do we.
Please dont make your problem everyone elses problem.
Another solution is needed somehow, because Im getting tired of it.
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
I cannot even imagine the frustration. While I certainly don't think families have any sort of responsibility for keeping an adult addict in their home, I think it's terrible that you contend with this. I don't know the answer. How very horrible.
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Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 78
Unfortunately, after the age of 16 years of age in my jurisdiction, parents no longer have control or the responsibility of their children. We can't "force" them to obey the laws or the rules of the house, or force them into intervention strategies to address their problems.
If you take the time to read through the posts you will see the heartbreak and anguish of the parents here who tried so desperately to hang onto their children until they reached a point where there was nothing else left to do. Until you experience first hand the addiction of a child (adult or otherwise) that refuses to change, accept help or to live within some basic rules you have no appreciation what it does to everyone involved.
As adults they have the freedom to make choices no matter how bad they are, that is part of living in a democratic society. Choosing to become homeless rather than living within rules is again their choice, not ours. I don't possess the power or the ability to stop or change that, no matter how hard I try. They unfortunately then become the responsibility of law enforcement, and social programs that are paid for via taxes, and some areas of the Country such as yours and California become overwhelmed with the fallout of bad choices.
While I appreciate the frustration it's not quite as simple as locking them away in a room out of sight until they "snap" out of it. It's very complex and I wish I possessed the answer. It would save all of us so much heartache and grief.
If you take the time to read through the posts you will see the heartbreak and anguish of the parents here who tried so desperately to hang onto their children until they reached a point where there was nothing else left to do. Until you experience first hand the addiction of a child (adult or otherwise) that refuses to change, accept help or to live within some basic rules you have no appreciation what it does to everyone involved.
As adults they have the freedom to make choices no matter how bad they are, that is part of living in a democratic society. Choosing to become homeless rather than living within rules is again their choice, not ours. I don't possess the power or the ability to stop or change that, no matter how hard I try. They unfortunately then become the responsibility of law enforcement, and social programs that are paid for via taxes, and some areas of the Country such as yours and California become overwhelmed with the fallout of bad choices.
While I appreciate the frustration it's not quite as simple as locking them away in a room out of sight until they "snap" out of it. It's very complex and I wish I possessed the answer. It would save all of us so much heartache and grief.
Last edited by Jiggs; 04-24-2019 at 09:57 AM. Reason: Added some information
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Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 78
...I will also say this in relation to your post.
I am fairly new here and found this site after dealing with a loved ones addiction for the past several years.
From what I have read from the posts is that we are on this particular forum to share our stories, commonalities, seek support, guidance, ideas and other possible resources to assist us in our recovery and/ or that of our loved one.
Your "post" however does not accomplish any of this. Your post imho is unwarranted, unwanted, hurtful, insulting, ignorant, demeaning, shallow and appears to be some sort of perverted attempt at burdening those of us who are already in the throes of overwhelming pain and guilt, with even more of the same. Personally I found your post "triggering" to say the least.
I would suggest that if you have anything positive to pass along then by all means join in the discussions and perhaps we can learn something new, if not, then please don't bother.
I am fairly new here and found this site after dealing with a loved ones addiction for the past several years.
From what I have read from the posts is that we are on this particular forum to share our stories, commonalities, seek support, guidance, ideas and other possible resources to assist us in our recovery and/ or that of our loved one.
Your "post" however does not accomplish any of this. Your post imho is unwarranted, unwanted, hurtful, insulting, ignorant, demeaning, shallow and appears to be some sort of perverted attempt at burdening those of us who are already in the throes of overwhelming pain and guilt, with even more of the same. Personally I found your post "triggering" to say the least.
I would suggest that if you have anything positive to pass along then by all means join in the discussions and perhaps we can learn something new, if not, then please don't bother.
Last edited by Jiggs; 04-24-2019 at 12:40 PM. Reason: Spelling error
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
we may remove family members from our lives but we dont force them to put up tents on your property and leave garbage all over. you can blame me for my brothers actions but i wont accept responsibility for his actions-hes an adult.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Hauppauge, NY
Posts: 62
I could not have said it better. As the parent of an addict, we are so sorry to burden you with our problems. Do you think we want our children to be living in tents on your property? You have no idea what you are talking about. If you have nothing positive to say in regards to the problem of addiction and the fallout that causes, please keep your opinions to yourself. Thank you.
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Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 635
Dande, I'm sorry for your situation. I understand both sides- that there are those of us aching for our loved ones. We hate that this has happened to them, and would love nothing more to swoop in and rescue them, but know from experience that only makes things worse. I also see your side- you see that the current plan isn't working, and are frustrated by that.
Drug abuse really is destroying our nation. I often feel like not enough is being done about it. Not enough is being done to help people suffering from it, or the victims of crimes that so often come along with it. It's just really awful all around.
You sound like you are really hurting from this, and I hope you can find peace soon. Just try not to let your hurt turn to hatred. I know from experience that can be really, really hard sometimes.
Drug abuse really is destroying our nation. I often feel like not enough is being done about it. Not enough is being done to help people suffering from it, or the victims of crimes that so often come along with it. It's just really awful all around.
You sound like you are really hurting from this, and I hope you can find peace soon. Just try not to let your hurt turn to hatred. I know from experience that can be really, really hard sometimes.
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,944
My addict stepson occasionally sleeps in a tent in some random wooded area in the state in which he lives. He refers to it as "living feral".
I am not burdening anyone with my stepson. My stepson is an adult (30s) responsible for his own behavior and the consequences thereof. He is burdening people with his behavior.
I am not burdening anyone with my stepson. My stepson is an adult (30s) responsible for his own behavior and the consequences thereof. He is burdening people with his behavior.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
Posts: 11,589
every other human on the planet is someone's family member. that a very small subset of those humans found their way to your open land and pitched their tents and made a mess is NOT the fault of the family they came from. they didn't throw them out with a tent and a map to your property.
i a
people end up "homeless" for a lot of different reasons. i live in seattle, and we have a HUGE homeless problem. it's has doubled, tripled, quadrupled over the past few years. there are homeless encampments EVERYWHERE. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpAi70WWBlw
i am currently on a business trip to San Francisco, down near the Embarcadero, and guess what??? same problem, perhaps not to the same degree that i have seen near my hotel. the two "gentlemen" i passed who were locked in a very slow wrestling match on the sidewalk were not THERE because their mother told them they could not come home. the man with the shopping cart and a rather elaborate collection of, um, stuff, had not been driven there by his father and dumped off.
the problem is bigger than you. bigger than me. there is an entire, growing subset of our population who are now marginalized - often due to their own choices - addiction is fueling this fire - unaffordable housing, low wage jobs that don't earn enough to the pay the rent. there is also a subset that has turned it's back on our society, our "norms", our rules and laws. and society has yet to figure out what to DO with all of these issues and problems. but i don't think rounding "them" up and driving them back to their PARENTS is the answer.
i a
people end up "homeless" for a lot of different reasons. i live in seattle, and we have a HUGE homeless problem. it's has doubled, tripled, quadrupled over the past few years. there are homeless encampments EVERYWHERE. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpAi70WWBlw
i am currently on a business trip to San Francisco, down near the Embarcadero, and guess what??? same problem, perhaps not to the same degree that i have seen near my hotel. the two "gentlemen" i passed who were locked in a very slow wrestling match on the sidewalk were not THERE because their mother told them they could not come home. the man with the shopping cart and a rather elaborate collection of, um, stuff, had not been driven there by his father and dumped off.
the problem is bigger than you. bigger than me. there is an entire, growing subset of our population who are now marginalized - often due to their own choices - addiction is fueling this fire - unaffordable housing, low wage jobs that don't earn enough to the pay the rent. there is also a subset that has turned it's back on our society, our "norms", our rules and laws. and society has yet to figure out what to DO with all of these issues and problems. but i don't think rounding "them" up and driving them back to their PARENTS is the answer.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 413
It's really bad in Seattle -- I had no idea. And I don't get how a problem like that is allowed to fester.
I live in Brooklyn, NY. The way it is dealt with here is that the city has an extensive shelter network. Huge civil war era armories that can hold thousands. They are not pleasant, but they are policed, there is food, people get a cot and bedding, there are plenty of social workers, and the doors are locked up by 10pm. You get mentally ill people and addicts, but you also get a lot of families with kids, as we have the same type of housing crisis as is occurring in Seattle. They try to keep the people with "issues" separate from those who are just homeless. People are put on a waiting list for housing in the city's housing projects, with families getting priority. People with "issues" are moved into group housing quickly where they are supervised. And the city aggressively deals with people living on the street, giving them the choice of a ride to a shelter, or a ride to a jail cell.
As you can imagine, this is a VERY expensive program, but we do not have a lot of homeless on the streets nor do we have threatening addicts roaming around, getting out of jail over and over. I heard the Seattle politicians on the video talk about it as a housing problem, but it is not just a housing problem. It is a crime / mental health / addiction problem too.
40 years ago during the crack epidemic, New York City was a crazy place. Today, the city is far safer than Seattle. It took the random violence of the crack crisis to wake people up. I remember in the 80s hearing gunshots almost every night, and seeing bloodied corpses on the sidewalks every month or two, and I lived in what was considered to be a good neighborhood. Things can get very very bad. I hope the people & government of Seattle wake up to what they are dealing with.
I will say that, when the temperatures go below 20, New York City lifts the restrictions on sleeping in the subways, and the whole subway system becomes like a homeless camp, mostly dirty single men who clearly have mental health issues. It makes for some interesting commutes to work in the Winter. But so even with all the work that the city does, there are still homeless people who keep themselves hidden most of the time.
I live in Brooklyn, NY. The way it is dealt with here is that the city has an extensive shelter network. Huge civil war era armories that can hold thousands. They are not pleasant, but they are policed, there is food, people get a cot and bedding, there are plenty of social workers, and the doors are locked up by 10pm. You get mentally ill people and addicts, but you also get a lot of families with kids, as we have the same type of housing crisis as is occurring in Seattle. They try to keep the people with "issues" separate from those who are just homeless. People are put on a waiting list for housing in the city's housing projects, with families getting priority. People with "issues" are moved into group housing quickly where they are supervised. And the city aggressively deals with people living on the street, giving them the choice of a ride to a shelter, or a ride to a jail cell.
As you can imagine, this is a VERY expensive program, but we do not have a lot of homeless on the streets nor do we have threatening addicts roaming around, getting out of jail over and over. I heard the Seattle politicians on the video talk about it as a housing problem, but it is not just a housing problem. It is a crime / mental health / addiction problem too.
40 years ago during the crack epidemic, New York City was a crazy place. Today, the city is far safer than Seattle. It took the random violence of the crack crisis to wake people up. I remember in the 80s hearing gunshots almost every night, and seeing bloodied corpses on the sidewalks every month or two, and I lived in what was considered to be a good neighborhood. Things can get very very bad. I hope the people & government of Seattle wake up to what they are dealing with.
I will say that, when the temperatures go below 20, New York City lifts the restrictions on sleeping in the subways, and the whole subway system becomes like a homeless camp, mostly dirty single men who clearly have mental health issues. It makes for some interesting commutes to work in the Winter. But so even with all the work that the city does, there are still homeless people who keep themselves hidden most of the time.
Sober since 10th April 2012
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 6,047
Looking from the outside (the US) in, I get the impression that the drive for small government and low taxes leaves many of these social problems to fix themselves.
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 10,944
Dandelion12, I see that you are fairly new to recovery yourself--since September of last year, is that correct? Congratulations on your sobriety if you have been able to maintain it!! That's wonderful!!
Over the years here at SR, I have noticed that some people when they are very new to sobriety read in the F&F forums and take everything that everyone says here personally--as if we are speaking of them and condemning all alcoholics and addicts. That just isn't so, but I can see how someone in a tenuous place in their recovery might think and feel that.
So, since you are a recovering alcoholic yourself, do you now resent anyone else with addiction problems? Were you rejected by your own family when you were actively drinking and now feel that you have to lash out at the family members of other alcoholics/addicts?
Sometimes, we family members of an addict have to cut ties or minimize contact for our own health and well-being. Sometimes our mental health is in danger. Sometimes our physical health is in danger. Sometimes we have been on the receiving end of abuse or even threats from our addicted loved ones. So, we have to protect ourselves. Sometimes we have spent years watching a loved one kill themselves slowly with drugs or alcohol, and we simply cannot take it any more. Where there is active addiction, there can also be profound chaos and drama--which is hard to live with. So...we often have to separate ourselves from it.
And I am sorry for the problem you are experiencing on your property. I hope that perhaps the local police can step up their patrols in your area. Maybe fencing your property would help? Wishing you the best of luck and congratulations on your sobriety!!
Over the years here at SR, I have noticed that some people when they are very new to sobriety read in the F&F forums and take everything that everyone says here personally--as if we are speaking of them and condemning all alcoholics and addicts. That just isn't so, but I can see how someone in a tenuous place in their recovery might think and feel that.
So, since you are a recovering alcoholic yourself, do you now resent anyone else with addiction problems? Were you rejected by your own family when you were actively drinking and now feel that you have to lash out at the family members of other alcoholics/addicts?
Sometimes, we family members of an addict have to cut ties or minimize contact for our own health and well-being. Sometimes our mental health is in danger. Sometimes our physical health is in danger. Sometimes we have been on the receiving end of abuse or even threats from our addicted loved ones. So, we have to protect ourselves. Sometimes we have spent years watching a loved one kill themselves slowly with drugs or alcohol, and we simply cannot take it any more. Where there is active addiction, there can also be profound chaos and drama--which is hard to live with. So...we often have to separate ourselves from it.
And I am sorry for the problem you are experiencing on your property. I hope that perhaps the local police can step up their patrols in your area. Maybe fencing your property would help? Wishing you the best of luck and congratulations on your sobriety!!
"O you must wear your rue with difference".
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,146
Originally Posted by Seren 
My addict stepson occasionally sleeps in a tent in some random wooded area in the state in which he lives. He refers to it as "living feral".
So that's one reason why a person may be out on the street pitching a tent.
There are many other reasons that this might happen. I know of a family whose mother had undiagnosed dementia that was progressing. She got on a plane one day and flew to another country. She was reported missing or dead. The family "found" her five years later when a stranger picked her up in the Philippines and took her to a hospital (fortunately she could still remember her name). She had been homeless, eating rubbish, and if she had not been hit by a car, she would never have been found.
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Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,254
Many reasons for homelessness AND the their particular choices. Might not all be ostracized or evicted addicts.
But I will say decades ago there were much more stringent anti loitering, tress passing and vagrancy laws. And they seemed to work better. Point is people are still making choices including that to camp put on someone else's property. If they've been given a warning or penalized and still comeback there's some defiance in there too.
In today's political climate I've seen cities where squatters are gaining rights and unoccupied buildings are being taxed/fined like Vancouver. Places like San Francisco have become a health hazard with public pooping and used needle litter.
The more addicts and alcoholics get away with the less chance of them becoming independent or self sufficient. By squatting or tress passing they are relying on somebody's else's work and/or good graces-the shear luck method and not self sufficiency.
All I can say keep calling the police, get video proof so there's less chance of conflicting stories and hopefully sooner or later they'll move or even better sober up. Could leave a list of AA meetings, free programs, help lines or even homeless shelters along with free legal advice for the next time you have them arrested and press charges. Law of averages says some will eventually back off.
But I will say decades ago there were much more stringent anti loitering, tress passing and vagrancy laws. And they seemed to work better. Point is people are still making choices including that to camp put on someone else's property. If they've been given a warning or penalized and still comeback there's some defiance in there too.
In today's political climate I've seen cities where squatters are gaining rights and unoccupied buildings are being taxed/fined like Vancouver. Places like San Francisco have become a health hazard with public pooping and used needle litter.
The more addicts and alcoholics get away with the less chance of them becoming independent or self sufficient. By squatting or tress passing they are relying on somebody's else's work and/or good graces-the shear luck method and not self sufficiency.
All I can say keep calling the police, get video proof so there's less chance of conflicting stories and hopefully sooner or later they'll move or even better sober up. Could leave a list of AA meetings, free programs, help lines or even homeless shelters along with free legal advice for the next time you have them arrested and press charges. Law of averages says some will eventually back off.
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Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
I have to say, I don't think that just because you own a vacant property that you should be forced to let squatters come there. Your property will be ruined.
There is a church here where I live that lets anyone come and stay there if it's below freezing outside, or nasty out. They provide meals, cots, showers, etc. They also provide transportation to obtain social services, meetings, etc.
However......they are also now seeing the property damage that goes along with that. The disrespect for their property, the stealing, etc. It's a sad thing that when you try to help someone they come and abuse it, then wonder why no one is willing to help. I realize this is not the case all the time, but it definitely happens more times than not.
I am just being honest. Now, I don't condone coming onto a friends and family forum and blaming the families. Like someone said above, we value our safety in our own homes. We are not making anyone do anything, these are grown adults.
There is a church here where I live that lets anyone come and stay there if it's below freezing outside, or nasty out. They provide meals, cots, showers, etc. They also provide transportation to obtain social services, meetings, etc.
However......they are also now seeing the property damage that goes along with that. The disrespect for their property, the stealing, etc. It's a sad thing that when you try to help someone they come and abuse it, then wonder why no one is willing to help. I realize this is not the case all the time, but it definitely happens more times than not.
I am just being honest. Now, I don't condone coming onto a friends and family forum and blaming the families. Like someone said above, we value our safety in our own homes. We are not making anyone do anything, these are grown adults.
Nature Girl
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: By The Lake
Posts: 60,328
I get that you dont want them in your homes, but neither do we.
Please dont make your problem everyone elses problem.
Another solution is needed somehow, because Im getting tired of it.
Please dont make your problem everyone elses problem.
Another solution is needed somehow, because Im getting tired of it.
I didn't send him anywhere, not to your place or anywhere else.
I had to choose to find my own recovery and leave my son's choices between him and God. I could not "make" him do anything, he makes his own choices, however poor they may be.
I am sorry you are experiencing squatters on your land and in your parks.
I pray that one day there will be no need for posts like this, that there will be help for all of them and addiction will be no more. I truly pray for that day, here where I live and where you live too.
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