Devastated and NEED some kind words and advice!

Old 04-11-2019, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by trailmix View Post
So he called to complain about his current living arrangements. Just think about that for a moment. He took the money you gave him to go on a drug run with his using buddies at the roach motel, pops in to talk to you yesterday then zooms off with his Sister to get more drugs, then calls to COMPLAIN about the facilities provided.

omg

As Anvilhead mentioned, please look at his actions, not his words, they are speaking VERY clearly here.

He is taking absolutely zero responsibility for himself, none. That is his current "action". He just talks and talks and complains.

There really is only one solution here Katerina and I know you know what that is. No contact. Tell him if you like, tell him you are done and don't want to talk for now - then hang up.

Will that be painful? Yes, for a little while. Firstly you will have a lot of free time on your hands once you stop worrying about him, you are used to being in a tornado of drama, that's going to end. Secondly, you, right now, are automatically waiting for a text or a call or a visit or an update on him from a friend, that will stop.

You will have to summon your strength and work through that. With the support here, with Al-Anon or Nar-Anon (I really hope you can get to a meeting), with any friends or family you can trust to discuss this with.

Honestly, you aren't helping him, not in the true sense. Your help is enabling him to continue his addiction, nothing more. If your help could "save" him from addiction it already would have, it's not and it won't. If you needed any more proof of it, the call tonight should seal it.

You are distressed, hurt and upset. Did he call to apologize for being such an ass? For hurting you, for wasting your money etc etc. No he called to whine about not being warm enough. As with everything he CHOSE to go there and he is a grown man, he could walk out the door right this minute and go to a hotel but does he? No he calls you to complain, hoping you will pity him, maybe even ask him to come "home".

I think once you fully look at this realistically:

- He has zero to offer you in a relationship
- He has no clarity, he is never truly "sober" at this point
- You deserve someone in your life that loves and respects you
- You are not helping him and may well be harming him

This will get easier for you. It takes time, can you give yourself some space and time for this?

Here is another post you might find helpful:

https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...will-pass.html (This Will Pass)
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Old 04-11-2019, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Katerina1072 View Post
I have tried desperately not to take this personally, but I don't know how to do that. I KNOW I can't reason with an addict. I KNOW I am the enemy (to the addiction). It doesn't make it any easier, sadly.

I talked to him a little while ago, he called. Just to talk to me, not about our relationship or what he's doing, but about how his sister refuses to heat the trailer and how he can't sleep, blah blah. I pretty much (very calmly) told him that I know why he's not here, and with his sister. I know this wasn't "time away to think" and that it was only to get high. I know that he's not doing any time thinking about US or his future, and he admitted that he "can't" because of his anxiety because it gets him too depressed and agitated to think about what he's doing, so he has maybe given it a few minutes of thought a night as he wakes up alone on a cold floor. And I told him I know that I am a resource, and that once the money runs out (or he at least buys enough pills to last him another week) he will be begging to come back to me. I know he will "play nice" for a couple months, and that I know once his settlement comes in he will be right back out the door doing the same sh!t. He insists I am wrong about the money/settlement thing. I explained that I cannot and do not see it that way, especially with what he's doing now. I asked him when he's going to therapy, since he claims that's his plan. Of course he hasn't even looked up a therapist. He just kept repeating that he didn't want to "argue" and I gently explained there was no argument. No yelling, no fighting. Just talking. But again, I'm the enemy in his addicted mind (even though I still hear the words "I love you" 10 times a day) so he just kept trying to get me off the phone. This back and forth crap is making me lose my mind.

I just wish he'd stop claiming to care about me and calling to tell me I'm the love of his life, etc. I hate the mind games. I never know if it's a moment of clarity when he's speaking to me or what. And it's killing me.
I know it's hard not to take it personally because it is damn painful. Someone you love is making choices that hurts your heart and scares you and makes you angry.. those are some pretty personal feelings. But he isn't drugging at you. You are being affected by it, but he is so wrapped up in his addiction , even if he knows what he is causing you, he will keep doing it. This man fully admits to being a liar. He doesn't even hide the fact that he is manipulative and dishonest. Your brain knows these things... so you know that anything he says has the potential, and in this case, the likelihood of being pure bullcaca.

If you keep engaging with him you are going to keep feeling crazy. He's depending on it. He doesn't want you to change or become stronger...that threatens the status quo.

I know I've harped a lot about boundaries, and I'll try and make this the last time. I'll share with you what my first real boundary was with my AXH, " I will not engage with him when he has been drinking" For me that meant I would not argue, plead, scream, cry, joke, make small talk... it meant I would not interact with him at all if he was drunk. What was the point? When I had tried all those things a million times, he didn't change and I just got crazier. When I stopped engaging the tables turned... I became calm and removed from his chaos and it drove him nuts! He hated that I wouldn't get involved and when he'd keep pushing at me with different tactics, trying to get me to interact, I'd leave the premises. It was a life changer for me. That boundary gave me back my power... because I stopped allowing him to dictate how things would be.

I know this is hard Katerina, it sucks.
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Old 04-15-2019, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Katerina1072 View Post
This back and forth crap is making me lose my mind. I just wish he'd stop claiming to care about me and calling to tell me I'm the love of his life, etc. I hate the mind games. I never know if it's a moment of clarity when he's speaking to me or what. And it's killing me.
Originally Posted by Katerina1072 View Post
I just cannot believe that he cannot SEE why this has been so hard, especially with the mind games. He knows it's cruel and heartless and I although I understand addiction being a disease I guess I will never understand how an individual can see someone being so broken and just not care. It just really hurts.


I just read this in another thread and it fits with this discussion:

Originally Posted by Troubledone View Post
"Work your own recovery with as much dedication and commitment as you wish your addict would work theirs."
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Old 04-16-2019, 07:06 AM
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Katrina1072, I certainly also know what it’s like to know someone from a young age, and or/ before addiction took over, and how upsetting, and just outright weird it is to see how people can change.

One thing I wanted to say, though, is don’t ever underestimate the damage a victim/ nice/ “waif” type person can do. Not sure if the term is still used that often, but in the 90s, “waif” typically used for helpless women. And I’ve come to understand that certain behaviors are not gender specific. Just like some women have the potential to be, and are abusive/ violent, some men can be “victim waif” types too.

And it sounds like he’s figured out that playing it up hits the sympathy buttons and “works”, at least to a certain extent, on you. And even if he never steals from you, and figures out other ways to get money from you (ways that “work” on you), is that really any great boundary accomplishment, knowing he has stolen from others? Look at how he’s treated others. Would setting boundaries around that, knowing he treats other people like crap, really make you feel better? And then he plays “nice” victim guy and he coasts through consequences? These types of people do plenty of damage too.

We all have a story, whether it be child abuse or some other hardship, and it sounds like this in part has been his sympathy ticket. Just wanted to mention that, I know/ have known these type of people too, and a person has to be very careful not to let the victim/ nice guy stuff screw you out of your good judgment, what he’s doing is damaging too. Maybe there won’t be some great big blow up or violent incident, but he can easily nickel and dime, and apologize his way through ruining you life. Death by 1000 cuts, you know?
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Old 05-01-2019, 01:13 PM
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PDM: So very true about "death by a thousand cuts" ...I couldn't have said it better myself.

Just an update for everyone that has so kindly offered their thoughts and advice:

I did what I said I was going to do. I let him know my boundaries. He begged for another chance and promised me nothing like this would ever happen again. Guess what? He just left. Again. I know it was wrong to even give him another chance, but when you love someone who is sick, it's hard to let go. I went into it with my eyes wide open, though. I kept waiting to see remorse, empathy...SOMETHING these last few weeks but sadly I didn't see much of anything. Just empty words. I tried to explain that for me, him leaving again WAS goodbye. Yet in his addicted and clouded mind he still had the mindset that "this isn't forever, I just need to fix myself...." ...I told him I cannot see it that way. And I'm not sure how, but him leaving again has made this a million times harder than the last time. I really wanted to believe he meant it, I really did.

Everything is packed, he took what he could when his sister picked him up to move back into the roach motel (trailer). I tried so hard these last few days to beg him to get the help he promised he'd get, to really look at his love for me (which he still says repeatedly he loves me more than anything in this world) but in the end, none of it mattered. He still left while once again closing the door telling me he loved me. I hate myself right now for allowing this to happen, I know I did it all to myself by giving him another chance. I can honestly say however that I do not believe there will ever be another chance. This is the end. I can never put my feelings on the line like this again. I'm beyond destroyed.

I plan on contacting a therapist tomorrow, I need real help. Probably medication. It's almost uncanny that the person I loved most in this world has driven me to needing to be medicated because of HIS addiction. I hate that he's sick, I hate that life has handed him any of this but I can no longer let him spread this contagious disease with me.
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Old 05-01-2019, 01:33 PM
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Hi Katerina, so sorry to hear that this has happened to you.

I really hope, for your sake, that you are done. I hope you will write a list our for yourself of why you want this relationship to be over. We can tend to gloss over things after a few days or a week. The brain isn't really happy dwelling on negative emotions, so reminding yourself is a real help. Keep the list really handy, on your phone or in hard copy so you can refer to it anytime you start to romanticize the relationship.

You have done all you can. You asked him to get help, you probably offered other help to get him there, he is not interested, he's not done drugging yet, may never be, that's up to him.

In other words, he doesn't have a problem with being an addict, you do.

Many people idealize the relationship and what it could be. It isn't and it may never be and that should be your focus. There is no magic wand. Let's pretend he was all in for treatment next week and went to rehab. It can then takes months and years for a person to work out all the issues that drove them to drug themselves in the first place and the person that shows up after that may not even be the person you know.

In fact, he started using 3 weeks after you got together, you don't even really know him as sober.

What you do know is that he hurts you, that this relationship is not good for you and that he is just a tornado of drama.

Going no-contact with him right away will allow you time to heal.

I'm glad to hear you are making a therapy appointment. Also, if you are feeling desperate remember there are always walk in clinics, your GP or even the ER.

You have a lot of support here too, of course.
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Old 05-02-2019, 02:11 PM
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Thanks, Trailmix. You're right about romanticizing the relationship and dreaming about what could be and should be. That's probably the hardest part about letting go. It also means letting go of all of those hopes and dreams we talked about and the future we once saw. What's left is the unknown. It's beyond sad to know that none of those things will ever come to pass, no matter how much we wanted them. I wanted them with all of my heart and soul, but sadly he wanted to hold on to his addiction instead of me.

He's coming by to get more things in a bit. I asked him to spend a few hours here Friday so that he can pack everything that's left and remove it. It's the only way I'm going to get closure. And I need to find a way to lovingly (and sternly) let him know this really is goodbye, regardless of his denial or what he would like to happen down the line. It's no longer about what he wants, and I need to find a way to break that to him tomorrow while letting him know that I still believe he can get help, and that I'll be here (as a friend) should he ever decide to get it.
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Old 05-02-2019, 02:15 PM
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i'm not sure you need to lovingly and sternly tell him "you really mean it, THIS time" do you?

he comes, he packs, he leaves. done!

here's the thing - he is free to TRY to come back at any time, regardless of what you say or how sternly you say it. you are not the boss of him. and he doesn't have to respect your boundaries or what you said on any given day.

The End is YOURS to uphold. if you are really done, then you are done. what he does won't matter. don't over complicate it.
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Old 05-02-2019, 02:18 PM
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You're right, he doesn't have to (and probably won't) respect my wishes or boundaries. It's taken me a long time and so many tears but I know now what's right and no, it doesn't matter what I really tell him. As long as I stick with my own promises to myself, then I know things will get better. It won't happen overnight, but I do believe that time heals all wounds.
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Old 05-02-2019, 03:22 PM
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I need to find a way to break that to him tomorrow while letting him know that I still believe he can get help, and that I'll be here (as a friend) should he ever decide to get it.
Speaking as someone who went through two broken engagements before getting married, (I broke up the first one and he ended the second), I can say the kindest thing you can do for him right now and for yourself is to go no contact. When you say, "I'll be your friend" all you're doing right now is letting him know that the door is still wide open, and he's just going to waste time and energy trying to get back together with you when he should be working on himself. Water can seep through the smallest crack - you've got to seal that right up.

There may be a day when you can be friends - but honestly, I don't think _you're_ ready for that yet. And that's perfectly OK. He's been dictating every stage of your relationship so far - he should understand (not that he actually will) if you want to take the time to heal . Even in the most amicable breakups, both partners need to give each other some space. It just turns nasty when one tries to dictate the other's timeline.
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Old 05-02-2019, 03:26 PM
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Any partnership/relationship needs to be based on respect and trust. I think you kind of understand this. So what is will send- is my prayers and support. Stay safe.
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Old 05-02-2019, 08:54 PM
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Speaking from experience, you’re going to go through what you go through either now or after 10-1000 more times of him leaving, each time hardening yourself a little more and perhaps growing more and more bitter, as I did.
I don’t want to make any assumptions, but when I was where you are now, I still hoped that by my refusing to let my soon to be AXH come back into my house with our children, he’d magically wake up and realize the havoc and devastation he was wreaking and commit himself to recovery and rejoin our family. I hoped that for over a year. He was homeless, panhandling on the corner, then he’d be so low that he’d actually go to rehab. Then shortly after he got out, relapse. Rinse and repeat 4 times in that year. I’ll post my full story eventually, but my point is, I can sense that you are almost exactly where I was for a long time. Stuck between KNOWING in my gut, that this can’t work, and KNOWING how much we loved each other. But being stuck means you’re going nowhere. Stuck on this hamster wheel of being in love with an addict. He’s not going to change until/ if he’s ready. Maybe. Addiction is a beast and he may never be ready. YOU have to decide to if you want to change what you’re ready to accept in life. No ultimatums, no putting my foot down verbally, no stern talking tos changed anything he did. It just made me feel crazier that he would do the same things over and over and not learn and do differently for a better outcome. Then I realized I was doing the same thing for my own life. Just like his choice after choice kept him in that addict chaos, my choice after choice kept me in his addict chaos. When you’re ready to be done, you will be. Maybe not today or tomorrow, but you have walk through each day with that pain and be strong knowing it will get so much better. It’s still hard for me, we’ve technically been married for almost 9 years. 6 of them were happy, and I was BEYOND devastated, but I’m so much happier and at peace now than I was a year ago. It was the most difficult thing I’ve honestly ever done. But I lived through it, and you will too. And although I had to ask for a lot of help with my children and my life isn’t perfect, every day I wake up relieved that I’m away from that dark life. I still get panicky when I think about the times he just dropped off the face of the earth or the sentimental things he pawned or the look on my sons face when dad didn’t come home again, and it still hurts that he abandoned us, but at least I’m not letting him do it week after week anymore. Those wounds are slowly healing. But I had to be ready. I had to stop fooling myself that he couldn’t would just kick his addiction and other issues just because he just looooved us so much. And that readiness came with time and reading A LOT on this forum. I usually just read and have never posted myself, but checking in here every day showed me that I’m just another casualty straight from the addicts handbook. That all these other people’s stories and feelings were so similar to mine in different ways, and in most of those stories the addict hasn’t changed, the loved one of an addict does. I realized that we loved ones are a dime a dozen that all fell trap to the manipulation but somehow mustered the strength to throw in the towel and forfeit. Now I look back and read posts like yours that seem, and not trying to sound condescending because it’s not, but naive. I was naive for a long time but I’ve realized we’re all losers in this game of addiction, but I don’t want to waste my time continuing to play the 59th inning when when the score is 0 to -30, with me being in the negative.
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Old 05-02-2019, 09:28 PM
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Thank you ItsTime4Me. Your words really hit home. They described every thought and emotion I've been feeling and reading them meant a lot. It's hard to accept but yes, I too have been doing the same things over and over (forgiving, hoping, being let down) and it's always the same outcome. And yes, sadly, we are all losers in this game of addiction.

I know things will get better in time, things are just incredibly hard because (due to my enabling and his addiction) I have cut ties with everyone in my life. I have no one, my son is grown but states away. I've been slowly reaching out to old friends though, so that's good.

I'm dreading tomorrow when he comes to pack the last of his things. It's going to be a rough night for me, knowing it's finally over. I'll always miss what might have been, what could have been, and what should have been. Even though I know it never was....
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Old 05-03-2019, 07:04 AM
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Blunt and honest...get the heck away from him as quickly as possible. You deserve more, and a life with this person will bankrupt you both monetarily and emotionally.

That is just my two cents. I am sorry, I know you are hurting so I say this with kindness.
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Old 05-03-2019, 10:18 AM
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Hope things go better than you expect them to today.

Remember there is no reason to JADE - Justify, Argue, Defend or Explain. You have made your decision.

You know, it's sometimes helpful to not look at someone in such a "kind" way. This person has done a lot of damage. Perhaps, when you see him, think about that a bit, it may help you to steel yourself.
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Old 05-03-2019, 01:08 PM
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He just left. I'm a wreck. Things were civil, he calmly said he understood. No emotion at all, and I know that's the drugs but it still kills me. I think he honestly believes that there's still a chance, and I guess the only thing to let him see how much he's hurt me will be when that time never comes. I don't pretend to know what the Lord has in store, who knows. Maybe a decade from now if he's clean and we cross paths....all I know is I cannot deal with this pain he's causing any longer. I may always have hope, but I know in time my mind won't be as weak as it is right now, and my heart won't hurt so badly.
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Old 05-03-2019, 07:00 PM
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Just an update, I broke down and called him earlier. I was so angry as I sat here alone that I had to. I found myself yelling at him for the first time since he's left. I was in tears asking "how could you do this to me?! you threw me away like a piece of trash!" ...of course all he could say was "I'm sorry". I wished it helped but that's all he's ever said...sorry, sorry, sorry.

I know I'm looking for answers I will never get and it just kills me. I'm praying tomorrow will bring me more strength.
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Old 05-10-2019, 01:00 PM
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Sending big hugs!
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Old 05-11-2019, 09:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Katerina1072 View Post
Just an update, I broke down and called him earlier. I was so angry as I sat here alone that I had to. I found myself yelling at him for the first time since he's left. I was in tears asking "how could you do this to me?! you threw me away like a piece of trash!" ...of course all he could say was "I'm sorry". I wished it helped but that's all he's ever said...sorry, sorry, sorry.

I know I'm looking for answers I will never get and it just kills me. I'm praying tomorrow will bring me more strength.

You WILL make it through this. I, too, am going through a similar situation and I completely understand your anger, your sadness, your unanswered questions, the confusion, the resentment... it’s all perfectly normal. Eventually, you’ll start to see good days creeping in between the bad ones.. and I’m sure eventually, the more you stay away from him, the more you’ll start to smile and see those good days more often. Please remember to be kind to yourself. This is a tough road for all of us - loving and leaving and addict. It’s insanely tough. Keep your head up, get into therapy, ride the wave of emotions - it will get easier and life will go on without him.
Much love..
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Old 05-12-2019, 05:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Katerina1072 View Post
His ex-wife did this in the past, and he admitted it resulted in drastic measures. He would steal everything in the house to sell, her jewelry, her credit cards, you name it. Sometimes the only reason I suspect he has not done those things to me is because I have been an enabler. But he knows I will not tolerate that kind of BS. He may have done a lot over these years but stealing isn't something I could ever permit. I'd have him out of the house without a cent that day, and that's a promise I know I will never back down from.
You are not an idiot, you are just new to this. Because of my bad decisions, I am not new to this. I thought I would say that before commenting as I tend to be rather terse these days because of lack of time.

My exAH knew that I would not tolerate stealing (who would?) and I also inadvertently (because of ignorance) enabled him. BUT despite the fact that I gave so much to him, my life revolved around him, it was never enough. He found a way to hack my bank accounts and empty out our joint retirement savings without me knowing. I wondered why my accounts were down to zero so often. Each time the entire sum would disappear and I would have literally zero in the account. I had the bank investigate it. They said that I had used my bank card to withdraw the money or someone had access to my card number. I NEVER suspected my then-AH. By the time I did, it was too late for me in many, many ways. I had become pretty much destitute, had terrible mental and physical health, and was living with a very dishonest, dangerous person who knew how to break into the house even if he did not have keys.

So I don't know the addict in your life. But I will say this: never in a million years did I think exAH would ever do the things he did (not stealing, not lying, nothing like that). But I always had doubts about his maturity. When I allowed my exAH to determine the continuation of our engagement, it was because I didn't love myself enough to think I had other options.

ALWAYS look at the way a person treated their ex. The story of their past can tell you a lot about the story of your future with them if you decide to have one. Unless you do a lot of work on yourself, you are doomed to repeat things until you learn (this is true for addicts as much as it is for codependents).

Edit: Just read that he broke up with you. I'm sorry. It's not because of you, honestly. He's in no position to be in a relationship.
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