mamaof3boyz

I have been in counseling with him before. Each time in counseling for 6 months. I don't think I can nor do I want to do it again. We attended therapy our 2nd year in the relationship and then again 5 years later. I'm sick and tired...it's so much work. Can't do it again

mamaof3boyz

It is so draining Joie...one minute he is even keel, the next he is mad and placing blame for things, like the house is dirty bc the boys don't clean up, or he is mad because I texted my son's soccer coach about the game today. He was also mad because I told my 7 year old son it was OK to not go in the game today....he was scared and in tears...first game jitters. Husband got pissy with me then his mother jumped in to defend him. I lost my temper with his mother...not one of my finer moments but she should not have excused his bad behavior.

mamaof3boyz

He has had around 13 different jobs in the past 10 years. Says he hasn't found what he wants to do. He either quits, gets fired, laid off etc... at first I felt sorry for him because he was stuck and didn't know what would make him happy but now it's a pattern and always an excuse. He plays the victim. I told him he needs to figure it out and start being a consistent provider to our family. Told him to soul search, dig deep and make it happen and he said "it's hard for me" ugh

I need to leave him....I don't know what I'm waiting for.

ella213

I can't tell you how much I empathize. You say you know you should leave him, and you don't know what you're waiting for. Maybe you're like me, and you're waiting for a miracle.

It's so hard when the qualities/traits you fell in love with STILL appear now and then, like bright, familiar flowers in a field of mud.. He's compassionate, he's funny, he connects with and loves the kids, he cries a few genuine tears during the sermon at church.

But I was thinking today.. Am I really waiting for a miracle, or am I clinging to the tattered shreds of my perceived control?

Maybe the true miracle will be freedom and a future for you and your kids.

Ok that's all I've got, take care of yourself and those sweet boys!

Ann

It sounds like you have reached your "enough" point, we all do that sooner or later. Once you make the decision, it is easier to make a plan. It sounds like you are the financially responsible one so could support your child and yourself, maybe just plan for where you would go and how you would do this. If you need him to be the one to leave, perhaps engage the help of family to do this.

Keep in mind that leaving or making someone leave is the most dangerous time for domestic violence, please have protection around you during the process.

Keep yourself and your child safe. He has options, he can go to rehab or to a shelter or to meetings to find people who may have a sober living place for him...if and when he gets clean. Until then, he may live on the street for all it matters. My addicted son often told me that the street led him to rehabs faster than anything else.

WE are not the answer, WE cannot save them or stop them or make them listen to reason, you cannot reason with insanity.

But there are places who offer professional help, if he chooses not to go there that's on him, not you. Don't let the guilt ticket stop you in your tracks.

My prayers go out for you and your child.

Hugs

Ann

Ella, those are wise words so splendidly expressed.

JOIE12

Ann and Ella - both wise words, thank you

M3B - as Ann wrote - you are almost there. Realizing that there's a whole world out there waiting for you. You can make it what you wish for.

To me it's like being on a diet - you make the plan at night. Like when I wake in the morning and I'm going to eat this, this and this ... When morning comes you are in a rush and don't have time or desire to eat as planned. So you grab that bagel and latte and on to another day. But comes that one time when you stop, make something healthy - you are in control of your own life and your own decisions. It's YOU. and you feel like a new person for that day and so you do it the next .... fighting thru the negative emotions and fear.

We can hear it in your words. For we have been there.
Hugs for you during this time. Keep coming back and keep sharing - we're listening and we are here for you. Joie

Vale

What a common life mode. When everything is perfect, I'm really
'gonna kick ass!

Except life never is perfect. Sometimes we have to operate at night,
in ice and snow, with imperfect data and human foibles----and despite all of that we have to PULL IT OFF........because noone can cash in excuses at the bank.

Sorry for getting pissed off but you are being taken advantage
of BIG TIME. All this " woe is me ". Man up or accept the scraps-----

THAT is the lesson your SO needs to learn.

I once got a little big for my britches. I was aching
for a beat down. One day I got it. I complained to all around
me about how unfair it was for me to get this "correction".
A person I truly admired cared about me enough to tell me the truth.....

(You deserved it.....and are lucky the repercussions
were not worse)I thought about doing some more
squawking over the perceived injustice,

but something strange happened.

I realized I DID deserve it.

I'll put a smile on Ann's face when I impishly suggest that
accounts receivable is just a suggestion.......right!?!?!?

mamaof3boyz

Don't be sorry for getting pissed off...it's something I needed to hear and something I need to do more ...get pissed. When I express that he needs to "man up" and get going, somehow I feel like a bitch and I'm being too harsh....I've been told I'm an insensitive bitch at times. So thank you.

Here's the thing, I know I'm a nice person. I am in the industry of helping people....seniors specifically. I'm kind by nature and a lot of times I take responsibility for other people's emotions and I end up saying sorry. So I guess that makes me Co dependent. They say you teach people how to treat you. But I don't want to have to teach anyone....why can't I have a husband that just accepts me for who I am, kind, nice, loving etc....without taking advantage of that? Do these people actually exist????

Vale

I get it. You are in the industry of helping people.
That is good, noble, and appreciated by Karma more
than you know.

We need to move from indiscriminate caring to
professional/operational caring.

I've referenced professional rescuers before. Contrary
to popular opinion they are NOT the swashbucklers and
rogues that they are sometimes popularized as for dramatic
effect.

When a Coast Guard C-130 aircrew goes way out to sea to
find a lost boater---they do so under VERY, VERY rigid rules and
standard operating procedures. If any of those limits are
broken-----heads are going to roll. Hard to obtain qualifications
will be suspended and stern warnings issued. If a pattern of "hero"
moves become evident----careers are truncated.

These crews care very much. It's why they got into the business.
They don't want to break off the search when fuel and/or weather
limits dictate an abort-----but they DO IT.....because their employer
will tolerate nothing less.

"Telling" you that you are an insensitive bitch is EASIER than MANNING
UP. If you accept this aggression and back off, then I would argue that the
aggression has served it's purpose and is an incredibly rational thing to do.

HMMMMM. Go out there in the world and do hard sh*t and risk rejection
time after time? Or just call your SO a 'bitch' and get fed and sheltered?

I know which one I'd pick.

Be kind. That is a good thing. But be kind with a hard edge. Ten dead
aircrew and a very expensive national asset at the bottom
of the sea is NOBODYS idea of a good outcome.

ShootingStar1

why can't I have a husband that just accepts me for who I am, kind, nice, loving etc....without taking advantage of that?

You can.

Just NOT this guy.

You are still operating on his terms, and by that I mean that you express what you want him to do - get a job, whatever - then you listen to his answer, stop, stay mad, watch him do nothing, then express what you want him to do again...

To get out of co-dependency, you have to focus first and only on what YOU and YOUR BOYS need to have a healthy life. Make a very specific list of what your life will include when it is healthy and happy.

People - like your husband - who behave outside those parameters are not creating a healthy life FOR you and your children, or WITH you and your children.

Boundaries are statements that you make for yourself, of what you will do, of how you want to live, of what behavior is acceptable in YOUR life. Boundaries are not demands of someone else to do something else.

When you make demands of an addict/alcoholic, you cede your own authority and autonomy to them. That is because you have to wait for THEM to choose to meet your demands, or not meet your demands. That gives them a huge amount of wiggle - read that manipulation - room and wastes a lot of your time and gets you more frustrated and angry because they are not behaving how you think they should.

It took me a long long time to learn, but I finally realized my former alcoholic husband was right: he did have the right to choose his own behavior, any behavior he wanted, whether or not I thought HIS choice was good or healthy or bad or anything at all. He is a separate individual, and his right to live as he wants is his and his alone.

What I learned was that I had the right to choose how I would live, and, since he chose not to change in the way I needed to have a healthy life for me with him, I left.

That was, for quite a while, a terribly hard lesson in humility for me. I had no right to demand him to lead a life I thought was better.

But it gave me freedom, and it let me really focus on my own behavior, and it let me finally understand what the issues were in my own behavior that I owned and contributed to the failure of our marriage. Because, like the shoreline and the sea, the partner's dysfunctional behavior parallels the addict's.

Now I try my best to live only my life and let others live theirs. That lets me identify and choose people to be in my life who are, for me and with me, healthier and happier.

Boundaries are much more than a description of what behavior we won't live with anymore. To me, they are a template for the healthy behavior that we want for us and for our partners.

To me, that is the way to freedom and joy.

Take care, take what you want and leave the rest,

ShootingStar1

Ann

Setting our boundaries is rarely met with joy and celebration by our addicted loved ones. What it means is all those buttons that used to work so well when pushed, just don't work anymore...the guilt button, the "you're crazy and a bitch too" button, the "I can't live without you" button, the "what kind of person are you that you won't help me?" button, the "if you don't give me money for drugs I will go out and steal" button...oh lordy, so many buttons, so little time.

Setting boundaries is about US, what we will and will not tolerate in life. It is not an ultimatum for our addicted loved one, it's self-care for us and how they react really doesn' mean diddly because taking care of ourselves is a necessary and healthy thing to do.

"I will not allow drugs or anyone abusing them live in the same house as me"

"If shouted at or bullied I will either call the police and charge the person or end the conversation then and there and walk out."

"I will not allow anyone to call me names, if they do the conversation is over right now."


"If anyone steals from me for any reason, I will call the police and charge them."

Those are a few of MY boundaries. They applied to my son when he was around but they apply to anyone in my life today.

I have learned some valuable lessons in life and in recovery and the necessity of self-care is one of the most important.

If you wouldn't let anyone else treat you the way he treats you, then you need to search within and try to figure out why you tolerate this...and I promise you that the answer isn't "love".

You are stronger than you think and wiser than you give yourself credit for. Use these gifts and find a better way to live your life.

Hugs

Vale

Like Ann said: So many keys (buttons) on the guilt machine to push.
And when pushing every one of them gets the response they want,
why WOULDN'T they play us like a Wurlitzer or an electric organ?

OUR job is kicking the plug out of the wall socket.

mamaof3boyz

I'm in awe of the insight I've been given from you all. I feel good that I'm learning more everyday but I also feel so stupid. What seems to be common sense, certainly isn't common sense for me.

I "knew" what boundaries were, but I didn't really know... what they were, if that makes sense. I was (am) so focused on what he is doing ... right, wrong or indifferent behaviors...I focused on those behaviors to give myself reason and justification to leave/stay with my husband. But it still doesn't matter what "bad" he is doing...it didn't make a bit of difference and it certainly hasn't made a difference in making a decision to leave or stay. Why? I've learned that I don't have my own boundaries, I lack personal direction, I don't know what I deserve in life....to be good to myself, to want the best for ME. To honor and respect myself. What do I want out of life? Who will I surround myself with? What are my own values and beliefs? So as the old saying goes..."if you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything". So true, in so many ways in my case....Now, here comes the hard work, the soul searching, the digging deep and finally making ME a priority. I'm excited for my journey...not sure where it will take me but its a step in the right direction.