NJandy

"Dude" -- she's never met my kids. And as I said in the OP, I will be able to put the $$ back. I have not limited my kids options. They are both going to outstanding colleges that run about $60K/year each. I do put my kids first. Get to know other people a bit more before you judge them so harshly. Ok, "dude"?

waitingforhope

I really do get the need of some small expression of appreciation. I really do and sometimes I wonder if I just got some small acknowledgment that he knew I did my best to be a good wife and mom, if it would make me feel better or cope better. After all my girls and I have been through with him it would be nice to just hear "you were a great wife and thanks for putting us first".

jjj111

NJandy, your question was about how to deal with your resentment. I spent thousands of dollars on my AXBF and ended up feeling very resentful when he continued to treat me badly. But I eventually realized that I had put myself into a bad situation by spending money on someone who was very troubled and not capable of gratitude. By then it was too late, I had already spent the money and I felt like a sucker. All I could do was learn my lesson. I decided that in the future I would be more careful about giving away money so as to avoid getting into a similar situation again. I think that's what people are talking about when they say that "expectations are resentment waiting to happen." We can be generous, certainly, that's important for the human race, but if we attach expectations to that generosity (expectations for gratitude, or a happy and health partner, etc.) then we are really expecting a payoff for our generosity, which isn't really generosity when you think about it. So I would just suggest that in the future you only give as much as you feel comfortable giving without expectations.

jjj111

repeat post

NJandy

Furthermore, it is his girlfriend who should have shouldered the responsibility for paying for her treatment. What's going to happen in the event she picks up? Statistically speaking, there is a very strong chance that will happen. Who pays for her treatment then? Is the "moral" thing to do pay for her treatment a second time?

Unfortunately I know she can relapse again, and I get the statistics about how likely it is. She seems to be taking recovery (mostly) seriously at the moment, but "at the moment" is less than 60 days and still on vivitrol. The "fun" begins, I guess, when she stops the vivitrol shots and flies without a net. I think this is going to happen in January, although I guess they could extend it.

As I said in the OP, I totally get that some people would view paying for her treatment at all as a form of enabling. I made my decision at the time based primarily on fear. I believed (and still believe) she was at a high risk of dying, and would not get treatment any other way. She would not have gotten into the program without a funding source, and no once else was available to pay. Her family is totally ****** and dysfunctional, she has no friends (other than drug friends), and she has no money. I chose to pay for treatment.

I would highly recommend David Shiff's book "Clean". (He's also the author of "Beautiful Boy," about his son who is a meth addict.) Shiff makes what seems to me to be an entirely legitimate point -- sometimes if you let an addict "hit bottom," their "bottom" is actually dying. You can't bring people back to life. Sometimes when you pressure and/or make it possible for someone to get treatment more easily, they get treatment, stay in recovery (at least for a while) and thus stay alive. I didn't want her to die.

I've thought long and hard about what to do if she relapses again. I've decided to pay for it again if I have to. I'm just being honest with myself. This is her first time in recovery after 6 years of being a junkie. If she fails recovery, I won't give up on her that easily. Whether that's a wise decision or not I am not sure, but I know that that is what I will do, wisely or not.

ladyscribbler

I feel that there is a big difference between some of the rational recovery advocates who had many happy years with someone who developed an addiction later in the relationship and those of us (me, for example) who entered into a relationship with someone who already had substance abuse issues.
I appreciate that input, and have steered others to the secular recovery and rational recovery threads when their situation seemed to warrant it.
Andy, she was an addict when you met her. This is who she is. If you continue trying to have a relationship with her potential and change her into the woman you think she could or should be, then that is up to you. You're a good guy, I can tell. Take care of yourself.
Keep coming back. It works if you work it, etc.

BlueChair

Ive read the book Clean. I have read Beautiful boy, and the one his son wrote too. I liked Clean because you could see the progression in the dads thinking from the first book, and he had a lot of experince with his son in and out of rehabs. what he shares in there most of its evidence based stuff.

You should come and check out our book review on Beyond Addiction, how science and kindess help people change. http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...-families.html. Its evidence based too.

Vale

Never did get my "thank you".

Her not cratering into an early paupers grave
would have been an acceptable substitute.

(didn't get that either)

......just an E ticket ride to nowhere, courtesy of that
devilishly handsome SOB I see in the mirror every
morning. I tried hating him for it.....

.....but who could stay mad at a mug like that for long?

Que Sera,sera

Twofish

For what it's worth...my 30yr marriage ended because my husband couldn't understand or handle the drama that addiction brought into the family. Our two daughters brought the addiction into our lives. They are sober now, that took a ton of hard work on their part as well as mine. (Codie forever )
He was not an addict/alcoholic when we met. But he did need to find someone to "blame" this addiction on...ME, I shoulda, woulda, coulda seen the warning bells and whistles, "that's what a Good Mother" is suppose to do...wrong, addiction hit hard...and I never saw it coming until it made itself right at home in our family.
IMO, Married or not, attending church or not, reading books or not, addiction is very powerful, more powerful than anything I could do. Only support helped me and realizing that I didn't cause it or I couldn't cure it. Addiction is a very serious disease. I realize that now.
And I also put my children ahead of ahead of anyone else, especially those who like to blame.
Tis will be my last post too.
TF

Twofish

For what it's worth...my 30yr marriage ended because my husband couldn't understand or handle the drama that addiction brought into the family. Our two daughters brought the addiction into our lives. They are sober now, that took a ton of hard work on their part as well as mine. (Codie forever )
He was not an addict/alcoholic when we met. But he did need to find someone to "blame" this addiction on...ME, I shoulda, woulda, coulda seen the warning bells and whistles, "that's what a Good Mother" is suppose to do...wrong, addiction hit hard...and I never saw it coming until it made itself right at home in our family.
IMO, Married or not, attending church or not, reading books or not, addiction is very powerful, more powerful than anything I could do. Only support helped me and realizing that I didn't cause it or I couldn't cure it. Addiction is a very serious disease. I realize that now.
And I also put my children ahead of ahead of anyone else, especially those who like to blame.
Tis will be my last post too.
TF

Sara21

NJandy,

Welcome to the board. As you can see, there are a wide range of opinions and experiences offered on this board, but please know that it's all being said with the best of intentions.
How long have you known your gf? You mentioned that this is the first time in 6 years that she's been sober, so I was just wondering how well you knew the real her. Addiction changes people so profoundly, it's like the real person disappears or goes into hiding. Be careful about loving the person you want them to become, because in reality, that may not be them at all.

As far as being resentful for her ingratitude, I find that when I am wanting acknowledgement or thanks for a gesture, it is more about ego than it is about generosity. The whole point of being generous is about giving things away, letting them go freely, with no strings attached. to me, gratitude is just the icing on the cake. If I receive thanks, that's great, but I don't expect it. In fact, I try to keep as many of my gifts/gestures anonymous because the whole point is to help others, not for me to receive some type of acknowledgment.

Whatever you decide to do, I hope things work out for you and that your gf maintains her sobriety and works on her recovery.

Hugs

incitingsilence

The Vivitrol isn’t stopping her from using, make no mistake there. She just can’t use opiates on it, and that is speculative as the time winds down and you are due for the next shot. If she wants to use, she will use. I give her a lot of credit for making it this far. I hope she can hang in minute to minute day to day and keep adding days and then learn counting days is way sick (especially so when family does it) and just goes about life and lives to her fullest … becomes who you need her to be, although frankly to be honest I don’t care about what you need. I want her to make it for her because that is what will give her, her only chance.

Fear … Bottom is used a lot as a fear tactic. The reality is anyone using drugs or alcohol even non-addicts/alcoholics are at risk of dying. And for addicts it is an acceptable risk. No one is unaware, although surely arrogance is milling about.

Statistics for heroin addiction are grim. It is something that you learn to accept real quick if you want any chance to have some semblance of normalcy in your life. I mourned my husband a long time ago and he is very much alive. I honestly don’t think I will be shocked if he went back there, or died because of heroin. I mourned him to get past the fear, the worry, the insanity that I LET run in my head because of heroin. We give so much power away to heroin, that is doesn’t need, but is counting on.

Fear also is a catalyst for resentment. The fear drives those reactions that lead to ...

NJandy

I know vivitrol is not a magic bullet. She actually CAN use opiates on it, and some junkies try to "break through," although there's a high risk of overdosing. I do think it's a disincentive to use. My main point is that whenever she goes off the vitirol, it's definitely going to be tense. She still talks longingly about how she wishes she could shoot up again.

Your mention about counting days is a good one. I'm not sure what to do. She religiously counts the days. At 30 days I asked if she wanted to do anything to celebrate, and she said definitely "yes." We went out to dinner, and I got her a card and flowers. She's approaching 60 days this Friday, and again I asked, and she said she definitely wants to celebrate again, but in a more low key way. For now I'm just following her lead on that, but I would like to stop counting the days too.

Txhelp

I wish you well on your journey. You sound like you are taking steps to work on you. This loving-an-addict-thing isn't for sissies!

Yes, it would have been the right thing to do....expressing gratitude when others help you out. I would have hoped for the same thing (expectations). Hey! That is MY expectation....THEY have their own.

I just know....if someone isn't meeting my expectations...then it's time for me to figure out what I will do about it? Confront? Build Resentment? Ignore? Let go? Disconnect?

incitingsilence

I wrote that because I would like her to get credit, not the viv because it is just a tool …

And how do you know it will be tense when she goes off? Why would it be? Sure she may be worried I guess, but she has the tools, the outside help and can set up new safety nets … and if you find you are tense that is on you, not her. And it would be a good place to seek out your own why’s. She already knows she can use if she wants, whenever she wants.

Junkie, nasty term … are they just pieces of junk?

Yes there is a lot to learn.


Counting days is just so odd to me now.

Her days are not yours to count. That is a lot of fixation in the wrong place. If she needs to count , then she needs to. But you counting them, isn’t healthy. If you read enough here you will see all the days counted out neat and pretty yet in reality all anyone has is today no matter who they are and NO ONE has a guarantee of tomorrow. This is way beyond addiction…

The numbers game can be a dangerous one for addicts. Start playing that wow I haven’t used in whatever the amount of time is … well then you start telling yourself lies about see I am ok, I got this, one time won’t …

NJandy

God, another lecturing post. Is the point of this board to post things that seem designed to put down the other person and make them feel crummy?

It is interesting to me that people in Nar-Anon and Al-Anon don't ever act this way. They don't put down or attack other people in the meeting. And they don't tell other people what to do. They share their own experiences, which others can take or leave. From going to open NA meetings with my girlfriend, those meetings work the same way.

I think the reason for the difference is pretty simple. People feel a lot more comfortable putting someone down when they can do so behind the anonymity and safety of a computer screen. I'm betting if you were at a Nar-Anon meeting you would not say anything like what is in your post -- to anyone. If you wouldn't feel comfortable saying it to someone's face, why do you think it's ok to say it on a forum like this?

To those who always feel compelled to respond to a post with a lecture, and usually one that involves the implication that the other person is naïve, stupid, arrogant, selfish etc etc, here's a short lecture of my own to you: You'll catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.

cynical one

NJandy,

Just wondering, do you call your girlfriend a junkie to her face?

GardenMama

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...-recovery.html

This is what has helped me, NJandy: taking my focus off of expectations of the beloved addict in my life, doing my own recovery work, and letting her be. Now when she says "thanks, mom" I know she really means it, and I really feel her gratitude. I am much more happy and relaxed as a result. I wish you all the best, truly.

Take what you like, and leave the rest.

incitingsilence

I would respond the same to what you wrote no matter where I was and it would be based on what I lived and learned not only from the watching side but the using side.

Please tell me you don’t need me to explain because I just don’t have the energy/need nor the desire to dredge up the sludge. Hell I can’t even imagine why I would want to when I did the work.

Chino

This isn't the 12 step forum.