"Smack Happy" & "Slow Train"

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Old 03-16-2014, 06:15 PM
  # 41 (permalink)  
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Who says he can’t rebuild relationships? The main part of recovery is working on oneself, and then when you fix you, you are better equipped to work on the relationships that were damaged while in active addiction. Now he needs to work on just him, it will be vital to saving his life.

And who says he can’t or won’t save himself if you leave? There isn’t any damn guarantee that he will find recovery if you stay or leave. Neither of those things matter. This is his inside job, not at all dependent on anyone but him.

You can not make decision for you, looking though his eyes and how it will effect him. It doesn’t and won’t ever work that way.

Trust is tricky, and his actions will show if you can or can’t trust him, not his words. He has been proving now that he isn’t trustworthy. So that is where you need to be in today. And you really need to because all this time there you have taught him well in what he needs to say and do so that you will back off.

And relapse isn’t something you can hold against him anyway. Relapse can be part of his process of learning and doesn’t have a damn thing to do you will. I don’t know about giving anyone a free pass to relapse … as I read what you wrote it looks like as long as he doesn’t lie it will be ok…maybe rethink that?

The guilt is there, but while he may feel guilty it didn’t stop him from using. That is such a line he handed you. And being glad on your part that he is eaten by guilt and wanting him to suffer … well you will have to work your own insanity out there.

The pain, well let me enlightened you … He didn’t go through that much wd before he switched and the physical for the horror it may appear to be is way easier to get through then the mental. And he will have to wd from sub …. And wd, well it is always an incentive to use, not stop….

I always advise against any together therapy until each side has a chance to work their own **** out. Then at least when you try to work together out each are in a better state of mind and more in tune with their own wants and needs and MUSTS to have a peaceful life.

At this point if you decide not to live with him, but are unsure of divorce I would suggest legal separation to protect yourself.

And if you feel you need to divorce him, then you know what, that is ok, whether he wants to sign or not.

I think it was you who wrote that there was no naranon around, well alanon might be and you will be welcomed there as well.
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Old 03-16-2014, 11:16 PM
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Originally Posted by SadWife7 View Post
I saw him last night, and we talked for hours, and now I don't know what to do.
He said part of his treatment will be rebuilding relationships. If I remove him from my life while he goes through treatment, he can't do that.
It is so much harder than I thought it would be to look at the person I fell in love with 4 years ago & believe that I have to leave him, that he isn't going to save himself, that his past does equal his future.
He wants to know how he can start to show me I can trust him. After going around and around, I finally realized & managed to explain that it has been one week. I CAN NOT trust him & don't want to right now. I want to see him go through his treatment & remain sober for a period of time before I can even think about wanting to trust him again. Yes I still love him, but trust...How do you ever regain that?
He did tell me I'm the hardest person he has ever known to earn trust to. (did that sentence make sense) I can be proud of that, I feel like-No, screw me over, I won't trust you & it'll take a lifetime to fix it, and he knows that, and is still willing to try.
I did make it clear to him that if we can come through this...There is no way in hell I can do it again.
Right now I feel like if I can't get him to sign the divorce papers, I do at least want him to sign something that says that if he starts lying to me again, he will willingly sign the divorce papers. That way I at least have something to show him, that says -look, I tried to trust you again, you failed AGAIN, free me from you"
I won't hold a relapse against him-I know it is very likely to happen. But I won't forgive lying again.
I feel like to a point, our relationship is doomed & he could be driven away at some point? His process will be to move forward, do right, don't dwell on the past because you can't change it, etc....I can not and am not willing to forget the past. If we get in a fight, I don't know how I can keep from pulling something from this time if it seems relevant. And that won't help him any.
One thing he said, that made me feel better, is that not being able to sleep & not coming to bed was not because of the drug use, it was because of the guilt he was carrying-He couldn't lay next to his wife & son and sleep knowing what he was doing to us. Now, I know part of it was most likely the drug use that kept him from sleeping. But that mean part of me is GLAD he was eaten alive by guilt. That same part of me is HAPPY that he went through the withdrawals worse than he ever thought possible before getting in the suboxone treatment. I WANT him to suffer so that HE NEVER DOES THIS SH*T AGAIN. ( I know that I will need therapy to try to make our relationship work. And we will need family therapy as well.)
When reading your post I can feel how conflicted you are. None of this is easy for either of you, and right now the story has yet to be written in regards to his recovery, so it leaves a lot of unanswered questions.

Personally, I see some positives in your posts today: he is still enthused and engaged in treatment, you were able to have a long talk and it didn’t come to blows – either physical or emotional from what I can tell (yes – that’s big at this stage), he did make effort to remove drug items from the home, sounds like you both have family support, and your sounding very strong and focused.

I think your spot on about the trust. I really respect how honest your being with him regarding your feelings. Do you think he is hearing you at this point? Or sort of floating through? Trust can be rebuilt, even made stronger. Sometimes however it doesn't happen.... I also think a lot of it depends on how the relationship was before the addiction, or before it spiraled out of control.

I think I understand your feelings on relapse; they sound similar to mine. I have accepted my husband could relapse, but I hope and pray he is honest about it. If he cant get himself back on track within a reasonable amount of time, then I would want him to seek additional treatment. The tricky part from what Ive learned however is lying is an actual symptom of addiction. It can be very hard for a person to be honest with their wife when they are actually in denial and lying to themselves. So Ive had to reach a point where I know lying about using… wont really be personal against me, its more a part of the addictive pattern. I also think the better the communication between us, the more likely it is he will share information.

There is nothing wrong with working on your relationship during recovery from my experience. Im assuming at some point he will deal with his outstanding legal issues, go back to work.. these things require the same skills as work on a marriage IMO.... A marriage, children, and a home are key parts of life for most people. How can you ignore those things and truly find recovery. I think true recovery is when a person is re-integrated into life – family, work, society in all its forms. My husbands rehab started us in marriage counseling around week 6 & we continued for almost a year. I think the key is finding balance and taking things slowly. Obviously there has to be some emotional stability, rational thought, and ability to cope and reason… otherwise I don’t think much can be accomplished. I think knowing the timing of when to work on the relationship is mostly a personal matter between the both of you…

Its still very early in the process, and more will be revealed as time goes on. It sounds like a good solution -his staying with the brother for a while in a stable and supportive environment. Take good care of yourself, and do whatever you need to bring peace into your home. I found sharing with my family was very important, and although it took me a while I also expanded that to include a few close friends. (only the patient ones – LOL).
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Old 03-19-2014, 08:05 AM
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I never thought anything could be harder to go through than this whole thing with my husband, besides going through it with my kids.
Boy was I wrong.
After having time to calm down, and talk to him, and do more research, I did not want to go through with the divorce right now.
This has caused serious problems in my own family. One sister has been kicked out of the family for saying that she supported me in my decision. (Her relationship with my mother has never been good, to some degree I think this was just something my parents can use as a reason to be done with her.) We did talk for awhile yesterday, and the point of it all was that they accept that I have to make my own decisions, and it will take me 6 years to finally get sick of this & leave him.
Last night I got nosy & looked at my moms texts w/ a different sister. They think I am absolute scum. My mom has been avoiding me because she can't stand to look at me. They think I could start doing heroin. They think my husbands family got to me & now all I care about is what they say.
My mother has been my rock for so long. Now I have to find a new job, and I don't know how I'm going to do that at 6 months pregnant with the 2 year old. I feel like I'm being pushed back to my husband because I won't be able to make it financially as well. Esp because we owe my parents so much money. I'm going to have to look into getting $ back when we refinance our house, which now I would do sooner than later, because I would rather pay the interest to the bank than carry this guilt.
I've written my mom a long letter. I did admit in it that I saw the text msgs, even though being honest with them has screwed me over.
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Old 03-19-2014, 08:47 AM
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I haven't decided if I want to give it to her. If I do....we're done. I know it. If I pretend I don't know that they hate me & think I don't care about my kids...maybe time will help them realize otherwise? But how can I look at them everyday, be in their house, accept a paycheck from them, knowing how they feel about me right now?
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Old 03-19-2014, 10:52 AM
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Just want to throw something out there...

You know you're living in chaos. You accept that he can't think fully rationally right now. You might notice that's difficult for you too, with everything swirling and all of the emotions...and what appears to be your whole life hanging in the balance.

First- remember this. Any decision made now is today's decision. Not a life decision. I haven't yet heard anyone say that choosing space was detrimental. If he's gonna do this, he's gonna do this. And space won't hurt that. I hear from your posts that your brain could use that space to regroup and reassess slowly in a more rational light. If you choose not to do that, that's fine too, you know yourself best.

Rereading your posts on his family--they are doing their best, but they just want their son/brother back. They don't have your needs or your kids' needs at the forefront. They can't. I hear some very hopeful well-intentioned denial of the depth of what he's facing. But they're here for him.

You feel that your mom has always been your rock, and you are frustrated now with your family's behavior toward your choices. It sounds like they love you. They've been there for you, they've helped you financially. They are likely hurting very much and can't bear to watch what you're going through. Maybe they are angry. Maybe they are trying to force your behavior. Maybe they are drawing healthy boundaries for what they can handle. They will not be perfect. But...they are the only ones I've met so far in this saga who are "Team Sadwife" to the core. Their loyalties lie with you.

I'd be angry if I were you. But here from a safe view on the outside I can say... would it be worth a sit-down chat with your mom, gently telling her you wrote an angry letter, that you saw the text, that you're furious... but that you understand. You know they love you and can't bear to see you hurt, you are struggling daily with these decisions, and you just need to do things in your own timeframe. You know it kills her to watch you hurt when the solution might seem easy. Ask her what scares her the most. Talk about it. Tell her openly that you desperately need her and ask her if she can support you. Tell her you might make mistakes, but you promise you won't make them for too long. (If you mean it)

If she can't support you through this, and she's honest about it, that could be a clear sign of a healthy boundary she needs to set...which might help you see your situation more clearly.

This is not an easy task I know. But when you consider the compassion, support, and grace you are considering extending to your husband-- it doesn't seem rational to withhold it from people whose motives are likely more purely beneficial to you.

By all means, don't let them control you! But I wouldn't write them off yet either. I KNOW they ache for you. Just like his mom wants you to do things to help move HIS recovery along, your mom wants you to do things to move YOUR recovery along. It's a mom thing.

Sending huge hugs.
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Old 03-19-2014, 04:33 PM
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Sadwife, I get the same impression from your post as praying did. I think those texts you saw were anger and frustration on your mom and sister's part due to choices you've made in the past regarding your AH and concern and worry over the choice you are making at this moment. Of course I did not see the posts but like praying said if your mother was willing to help you so much in the past it means she loves and cares about you. I also, get the impression that they are worried about your children too. I think they are looking out for YOU and your children. Whereas, your in laws are looking out for HIM.

I pretty much agree with the advice given by praying too. Try to set up a time to meet and discuss your choices....why you feel they are the right choices at this time. Hopefully, she will understand and continue to be your rock.

It is tough for you right now. You have so many worries, fears, emotions going thru you at a time when your body is being flooded with all those extra hormones. If you can hold off on making any life changing decisions at this time, I really think that would be best for you and everyone else right now.

IMHO your AH should remain where he is right now....separate from you....until more is revealed. Give him a few months to work on his recovery while you continue doing what you need to do for you and your kids. I think later down the road, after the baby is born...you will know more and will be in a better place to make a decision.

Perhaps it's best if you can ask everyone to stop trying to pull you in different directions. Tell them for the sake of your unborn child you need peace.
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Old 03-19-2014, 04:46 PM
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it sounds like your family has bent over backwards to help and support you....loaning you and your AH tons of money, employing you, trying to help you have a good life. i'm sure they are "disappointed" that with the latest stunts by your AH and all you've been thru, especially now that you are pregnant, that you are still in some ways more concerned about him rather than what is best for you and the kids.

I strongly urge you NOT to do the refi right now....that obligates you and your AH to the mortgage when right now you are not even certain if staying together is the right thing to do. a refi can be one way to get his name OFF the loan. and that is an option you should keep at your disposal.

talk to your mom. be honest. let them help you. this isn't the time to race out and get a new job. you need to breathe and consider what is the next WISE thing to do. what is best for the children. and for you. your husband is capable of taking care of himself. he has his family's support. don't cut off your own support!
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Old 03-19-2014, 05:06 PM
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It must have hurt to hear her talking about you like that, cutting off your sister for supporting you. It sounds like fear coming out as anger.Or maybe she is the controlling type? But its SO HURTFUL the way she is handling it. You've been honest with them, and your being honest with your own feelings and that is all you can do. I cant suggest what you should say to her because only you know the best way to handle it, can predict her reactions. I can only say, wait until you gather your emotions if you can. I think I told you my MIL had some not so nice things to say about me. For the most part I took it from her without arguing back because I knew how upset she was, and I needed her during the crisis. I felt like there was no way we could start fighting among ourselves. Some of it we never talked about, and a few things I have since told her really hurt me. I got some apology but Im not sure she even realized all the things she said at the time. Maybe your mom is like that? Maybe she will calm down if you give her a little space and then you can talk?

((Sadwife))
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Old 03-19-2014, 09:44 PM
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Thank you all. It's so hard to deal with the guilt part of it. I feel so guilty that they have helped me so much, and I keep letting them down, and I know they don't respect me at all & it is painful. I am going to try to get at least my mom & prob sisters on a rotating basis to go to some kind of therapy with me so that an unbiased person can help. I thought about telling my mom the other day, I need to not be pregnant to figure this all out. I know it makes it harder.
I'm def not going to give her the letter. I am going to give them some time. I do hate pretending like everything is okay. I agree though, if I'm going to give hubby a chance, my family absolutely deserves one (or thousands)-I'm just scared that they would rather write me off than try to find some understanding.
Good news...Just checked my bank account and taxes are in!! Yay!! I can get some big bills paid & some worries relieved. Also checked the mail, had a birthday card for my son & I from hubbys grandma, with a check for enough to get the stove that we need. Searched craigslist and I think I found one near me that will leave me with some money left over.
It might be hard to get out of the habit of spending every dime on bills/debt before the money disappears, but I can handle that.
I am in a much better frame of mind than I was this morning.
And my son helped me put pillowcases on pillows. It was adorable.
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Old 03-19-2014, 10:51 PM
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Im glad you had Good Things happen today... it sounds like the day actually made a pretty good turn-around. I can just picture your son.. my son loves to "help" too.. it is so adorable, and always makes me just stop and be grateful for just having him in my life

I think trying to get some of your family involved in therapy with you is a great idea. My parents were just done with my husband by the time he went into treatment because so many things had happened in the past, and they were tired of seeing me hurt, and didn't want my son hurt. Then... they became sort of "neutral" as they learned about addiction through the rehab and we kept communication open. And finally... as they saw him embracing recovery they began to forgive and accept him again. If he hadn't worked so hard on his recovery, then my choice to stay with him probably would have been different... and I know they would have been there to support me in that decision.

Since you posted earlier about your mom being your rock.. I really think she has your best interest at heart. I feel from all Ive read that you are very rational in how your dealing with all this... I hope soon your mom can see how strong and responsible your being, she can give you a big hug and just grant you the time needed to see how this plays out.

Once you get the stove.. I suggest trying some "baking" therapy also.
I was talking about this site called Freecycle with someone here recently. I don't know if you have that in your area, but I find a lot of kids things on there, and I also offer things when I need to part with them. You never know what you will find; pretty neat
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Old 03-20-2014, 12:28 AM
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Sadwife,

I'm glad things turned around for you today! Boy did you need some good news and happiness your way didn't ya? Sheesh! I'm glad you're holding off on giving the letter, because I just think you've been through way too much in a short period of time to see things completely clear. Do you see what I'm saying here?

I love allfor's baking therapy suggestion! (The family therapy one is good too) You even said you needed to put on a little wieght. Just don't go overboard like I always did while pregnant. Ha!

I really hope you are able to set up some boundaries for yourself because it looks like you need everyone to step back and let you breath...relax and take care of you.

You are such a resilient woman it really shines through in your posts.
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