glitterdeva

Hi, everyone. I have been thinking alot lately. AH, my life, all of it. Today I read this amazing article, it made me cry. Just wanted to share:

Phillip Seymour Hoffman did not have choice or free will and neither do you. – debbie bayer blog

LoveMeNow

This article (while I agree with most of it) is a Codie's nightmare. IMO

ETA - untreated codieness.

KeepinItReal

The problem that we still have.... if you bring a strung-out addicted person to the ER, most of the time they will deny any treatment. You have to be dying or suicidal to get any help.
What I took away from this article is that there is no way to help a struggling addict because there is NO GOOD WAY to help an addicted person.
The article also mentioned the actor being prescribed pain killers. ANY successful recovering addict will say this is a big NO NO.
The way that the medical community treats recovering addicts is dreadful!!!!! People do put shame and guilt on the suffering. Most addicts keep it hidden because they are smart enough to realize this. So, people don't speak up and tell their drs.
Also, some doctors are morons. Yes, I said, some doctors are morons. It's a practice, not perfection.
This article did not teach me anything I didn't know already... and basically states there is no HOPE. Well I call BS.
There is a higher power within everyone.. and at the time of being prescribed narcotics... the recovering addict NEEDED someone to help him say no.
It's tragic, but everyone needs to realize that this disease will kill their loved ones as soon as the addict starts to think that they can use opiates, or just use one more time... and sadly, the medical field gives ZERO help. The only help... NA, Church, or privately funded places. The medical field is a nightmare.

KeepinItReal

This is all from my experience. Being a recovering addict for 15 years... not heroin (thankfully) but vicodin, coke, alcohol, marijuana, Xtasy, and pretty much some stuff in between. I used everyday for years. I stopped, by separating myself from stressful situations, self reflections, daily mediation, self affirmations and not giving in.
Yes, I wanted to use... but it wasn't the answer before, and it wouldn't be the answer now.
My life has gotten better, not from a program, or counseling or anything else. It was because I wanted to change and committed myself to FULL sobriety. I cannot take one vicodin. I cannot do one line. I can't drink more than 1 drink (which I have once last year).... then craved for more months later.. and stopped myself.

I'm not saying this to be harsh, or mean, or righteous... but honestly, from someone who was addicted for years. Felt they NEEDED drugs... I wanted to stop. It took years to fully stop, to understand, I couldn't use anymore. But, it is possible.

This is basically giving people the idea that they have no control over their life. I call BS on that.

hopeful4

Bravo!!!

I too am not insensitive to the horrible addiction. I simply think if you put your mind to it you can beat it. You are the classic example. You wanted it for YOU. You know what you can and cannot do. You know if you took one more pill or one more line it would open up to relapse.

I commend you on your recovery and for being intune with your own recovery and your own limitations. You own it and should be so proud of yourself!

hopeful4

One other comment...so, where is the solution? Do we allow an addict to go on with their addiction and excuse all that happens as a result b/c their brain is wired differently? If that is the case I would say all addicts, especially hard drug users are destined to death.

KeepinItReal

I would also like to clarify - I don't have 15 years sober. I USED for almost 15 years. Starting when I was 13 years old. I have 4+ years sober from narcotics and cocaine. I will have 5 in August.

BlueChair

((Keepinitreal)) you always inspire me Thank You. Most people as I understand quit on their own and dont need any type of lifelong commitment to program of any kind. Isnt that only another addiction? All they need is a commitment to self, and new skills to help.

I also read Philip Hoffman had started going to AA after his 10 day detox a few months ago. How many bags of heroin were in his home?

My husband stopped for 8 years on his own. There were clear reasons why he started again but in truth it was taking one line of coke, then another and another. As I understand it, this is when all the brain changes happened, and he lost complete control. He couldnt stop and I see the article being mostly about those moments in time. When he needed help and couldnt do it for himself, those who loved him had to help. If we had stood back and said he is choosing to live like this, he'd be dead.

Now he is working on underlying issues, learning skills in counseling to help him recover again AND stay that way.

I know he will always be at risk for drug abuse and addiction now and acceptance is what Im working on.

hopeful4

BC...it is good that he is able to be in touch with his recovery and that he is working the underlying issues. However....so many never do. Those are the lost. What is does not address is how to get their mind to work in the way it should. How do you force that so they survive and what about the sanity of those around them?

I guess from the spouse's side I wonder where my responsibility to this disease ends?

Chino

I don't believe you intended to make a blanket statement but, if so, I respectfully disagree. There are times when opiates are imperative or the patient will go into shock and die. My daughter was one of those people that absolutely required opiates and of course she eventually relapsed.

I didn't come away from this blog with a sense of hopelessness. It reinforced what I've already learned: addicts will stop when the consequence is greater than the reward.

My prayer is that inpatient treatment becomes easily and readily available.

KeepinItReal

I have not been in recovery long enough to experience this. Thankfully nothing has happened to me personally to need opiates as a life saving device.

I will be first to admit i'm not expert!! I do agree with the article, but I don't like how it makes me feel. I am not going to admit that I have zero control over contacting a drug dealer or going to a dr. and getting opiates.

I hope that one of these celebrities deaths brings light to the fact that we need more treatment centers, and better access to treatment centers. Also, that the shame in the community of being an addict is brought to more light. I think more people would seek help (me, myself) sooner if there wasn't a shameful factor or a feeling of less-then. Maybe more people would be inclined to getting help, than trying to do it themselves and failing for years, before finding success.

BlueChair

I respect your opinion, but my husband almost died in a drug house still shooting up. He couldn't see the consequences because his brain was rewired to say keep using when you stop is when you feel bad. With his stomach bleeding, a perforation, infection spreading in his body, he still couldn't stop.

Chino

Whatever led to his stopping was a consequence of his using.

BlueChair

Absolutely right. His family and friends stepping in, locating him at the drug house, getting him medical care, picking out a rehab, and all of us telling him you have to do this we don’t care what you think WAS a consequence of his drug use, and it was necessary to save his life.

glitterdeva

I am in the same boat - was using substances for years, on and off, off, off and on since 13 years old. Not opiates though, I tried it and just really didn’t like it. I never went to any rehab, never attended a program, when things got very bad, I cut off bad influences, went back to school, put my life together. Not because I am a Dali Lama or anything, but , well, I can’t explain it other than that there is something inside me was just panicking, like stop, stop, stop. I don’t think I am an addict, I was more of a recreational user. But I have seen my friends go down because of their addictions. I couldn’t understand WHY can’t they just stop? Just don’t call the dealer anymore, just don’t do it!

I had a bi-polar ex who was very ashamed of his disorder. I couldn't understand why - there are so many wonderful/intelligent/famous people that live successful lives! I tried to help my relative, but he refused to agree with doctor’s diagnoses and pretty much self-medicated himself with drinking. He tried to commit suicide in front of our little children and was put in the psych ward. I took him there. I cannot tell you how horrible I felt when I saw how he was treated in ER. He is a wonderful man, very smart, very kind, great person. I stepped out to make a phone call and when I came back, he was walking around naked, with blood all over him and nobody was even watching him. The doctors treated him like he was the worst scam on earth  After years of suffering he finally accepted that he has a brain disorder, started taking meds and is doing much better.

I look at my AH and I don’t get it. I get it and I don’t. When not using, he is a wonderful person, kind, thoughtful, loving husband. When using, I don’t know who he is. Or maybe he is not all those things? He is different from me, I can stop and he can’t. I don’t think I am a better person, I think we are wired differently.

I do believe in a Power greater then myself, it saved my life so many times, I feel it and I know it. However, I also think that addicts do have different brains and I am coming to terms with it. I cannot control it because I did not cause it and I am not a doctor.

AH got diagnosed with Hep C yesterday, doc said if he keeps on going for another year with H, he will die. I hope he doesn’t, I hope he lives, but I cannot do anything. He has been clean since Christmas.

In short, for me, I think I accept that AH has a brain disorder and if he needs meds, I understand, but I also agree that spiritual aspect of recovery should not be ignored. I don’t think he will make it without his recovery program, the key though is for HIM to understand it. Sorry, guys, for a long read, just a lot on my mind..

hopeful4

BC...I totally agree with you here. However....what about the loss of ourselves in saving the addict?? I feel as though I am a shell of who I really want to be.

Chino

BC, it's a dangerous line you straddle - for yourself - when you identify as a consequence and or reward for someone's disease. I don't know if that's what you meant but that's how I'm reading it.

The way I see it, you've been a part of the solution. When we're not able to be a part of the solution, that's when we have to remove ourselves so we don't become part of the problem.

KeepinItReal

I hear you glitter diva. However, different drugs have different pulls on people. Where some people can smoke weed every other weekend and some have to spoke a pound a day.
However, if you have had to use a drug to not be sick on a daily basis for years and years.. then you don't know what it's like to be addicted. I HAD to get coke, I HAD to get weed, I had to get alcohol, I had to get vicodin. I didn't feel that there was a choice. I was ill, bad temepred and abnoxious and a slew of other horrible things.. when I didn't get what I felt I needed. Those things were me. I changed myself into someone I wanted to be, not someone I use to be. People can change. But they have to want to change for themselves. This is why NA, and being around other recovering addicts is necessary to keep us in check. We do have a choice. It's the choice to not use.
I don't believe everyone gets addicted, and they should count their lucky stars.

KeepinItReal

hopeful - being in love with a heroin addict ... well, it's scary. Anytime, could be the time. But, what helps me is that anything can happen to anyone at anytime... so I need to think positive. Not let the fear let me be angry.
A lot of recovery is changing the way we think about people and things.
I honestly can say I have spent many days mourning the "loss" of my husband. Even though he wasn't dead. He was a shell of a person I knew.
Someone wise told me. You can't hold hands with satan, and walk with God.
Not sure if that's too symbolic... but it spoke to me, to help me feel better about kicking my husband out, and calling the police on him for the safety of the public.

glitterdeva

I agree and that is what I am realizing. I had my share with crack and meth and it was pretty bad, BUT I kicked it myself. I THINK (and, of course, I don't know for 100%),I think I am not an addict (gosh, I hope I don't sound like an as* ). I mean, I didn't go through a spiritual transformation, no rehab, no program, I just honestly got sick of being sick all the time and was just scared for my life. I am counting my lucky stars for sure on this one and that is what I think this article helped me to realize - I am wired differently then AH. I have no right to judge him or ask him about his recovery or tell him what to do. Its a chemical dependency and I am not a doctor, nor am I some spiritual guru.

I will not be against him taking meds (sub, etc), that's between him and his doc. I will only be responsible for me and my choices. I want to work on that. I have a choice to be with this sick person or to not be with him. I guess I am going through some mental changes

I went to an addiction specialist with AH. I liked her alot. She basically said that addiction is a disease - if you put h in front of 100 people, 60% will walk away and 40% will try it. Out of these 40%, 10% will get addicted to it (sorry, don't remember numbers exactly). She said suboxone is just a tool, you still have to be in a program and work it for the rest of your life. You might stay on sub for a year, then tapper and never take it again. Or maybe you might need to take it again years down the road. Basically keep an open mind, we are here to help, etc.