HopefulmomtoD

allforcnm- my 23 year old son is an alcoholic. I can count on one hand the times I've seen him drunk. And, he did 99% of his drinking in our home after we went to bed while he was alone in his room.

Also, pravchaw's son hasn't been back in the house for long- so those are new empties.

I feel pretty confident that pravchaw's son knew they didn't want him drinking alone in his room.

allforcnm

perhaps my post was misunderstood. I don't approve of his drinking. You can go back and look at other posts Ive written to Pravchaw and Ive informed him about how my husbands doctors suggested no drinking because there was a risk of transferring addictions especially in early recovery. But with that said, I also think Pravchaw is correct, he and his wife need to not react hastily and need to think this through. If you read more post Ive made to him you will see I have been behind rehab, because addiction is progressive & I think people need medical treatment ASAP. But again if we are talking about boundaries, I guess only Pravchaw can say if drinking in his room with whatever quantity he could put in a nightstand drawer is boundary breaking per their discussions. I just think it needs to be handled with a level head and some contemplation, not just immediate panic, or anger.

AnvilheadII

He is after all 21 yo and entitled to a degree of privacy inspite of his disease or disorder.

why is it regarding his PRIVACY in your home (ie holing up all weekend and drinking) you defend his right, but with everything else you seem unwilling to let him live his life as HE sees fit, even if that means dropping out of school, turning into a pothead and working a menial labor job??? why is the entitled 21 yr old back in your house again? with mom and dad willing to cough up big bucks again for rehab or whatever - and meanwhile he gets to skulk about like a petulant 12 year old?

he's either a big boy and has all the privileges and consequences of being an adult, or he does not. a few short days ago this boy was screaming in your face, wanting money....next thing ya know he's back in the old Ma and Pa B&B - even going to dinner at the finest restaurant in town, paid by mom and dad, drinking the finest wine, paid by mom and dad, and still sneaking Colt 45 in the house when nobody's looking.

LOT of mixed messages here.

pravchaw

Anvil: Its not as black and white as you put it but point is well taken.
Hopefulmom and allforcnm: Both of you are right. Drinking in early recovery is not right.
I think his drinking was spread out over the last week at least and I have not seen him drunk. But I would guess his tolerance for alcohol and mj has been increasing with addiction.

LoveMeNow

Are you familiar with spice aka K2? Most drug tests do not test for it so many MJ users switch to it for employee drug testing, court ordered drug testing, home drug tests etc.

IMO, it much more dangerous then MJ so you may want to rethink drug testing him.

Carrots

My daughter used things on top of MJ that were hard to detect. She also timed it based on when she knew I was busy, the drug testing place wasn't open, etc. She admits now that she used coke on occasion, ecstacy frequently, but was "barring" a lot (snorting crushed Xanax). I also know she smoked salvia because I found it in her purse.
But she only tested positive for marijuana even though she admits (now) she was using a lot more. I would have had no idea if I hadn't heard her making a drug deal on the phone at 2:00 in the morning.

Have you done drug tests yet? Because it is just about one of the worst experiences I've had. One time when we tried a home test, she hit me and then ran through the neighborhood, so hysterical that someone called the police. That's when I started taking her in to the laboratory- hair tests and urine tests on a random basis. Super expensive. And still not positive. We had the rule that she had to test clean or she was out....finally it caught up to her and we got her on the marijuana and she went to rehab.

And then you live on pins and needles with the anxiety that they aren't serious or they are playing us for cuckolds, or that any any point relapse will happen and hell will return. Never ending anxiety so more meetings and more step work.

It's a horrible, painful, gut wrenching experience watching your bright, wonderful, talented, sweet, child with oh so much potential go down this road. Nothing is black and white. And they find ways through or around your "boundaries" by twisting the words, or claiming they thought that the words meant "this" and not "that". It's insanity.
Back to step 1-2-3.

Feeling for you Prav. None of this is easy.

AnvilheadII

LMN, I thought about spice/synthetic marijuana as well, on my drive home today. THAT could very much account for the erratic behavior, mood swing, days of w/d. at 53 I've known a lot of pot smokers in my day....and I have never known a single one to RAGE when they can't get pot...or STEAL and lie. THC just ain't like that.....but this synthetic crap? SCARY.

to me rules are rules. if there are exceptions to the rules, they aren't really rules. otherwise we end up in an Orwellian society where all pigs are equal some are just more equal than others.

LoveMeNow

I actually looked up withdrawals for MJ today because I, too, have never heard of rage being part of it and I have known my fair share of pot smokers too.

Carrots

Honestly though, raging at age 21 could just be a way of being angry you're not getting your way and trying to manipulate the situation. It's a pretty effective strategy for parents who don't like conflict, and/or like to be friends with their kids. My daughter raging at me usually worked pretty well (before, not as much now but I still hate it and I have to fight the urge to not jump up to "fix" whatever thing is making her unhappy. I know- pathetic. But there it is.)

pravchaw

What do you do with this synthetic stuff. Is it to be smoked? He is not smoking anything anymore. I told him that if I see him smoking anything he is out (in the past he told me he was smoking tobacco but it was actually mj). My wife is going to talk to him about his drinking and getting back into a program while we wait for a rehab bed to open up.

Carrots is right. The rage does not last long. It is a likely a manipulation strategy which used to work for him, but no longer. He has been relatively calm the last 2 days. So maybe the w/d is working itself out. I know mj w/d takes 3 -4 weeks because the drug is fat soluble and gets stored in your body. The hydroponics stuff they grow nowadays is very potent. Not like the grass from our student days.

crazybabie

I have been keeping up with your thread yet reluctant to post until now all I can do is share my experience I will start by saying I have 2 addicted son's and my husband is an addict he is no longer in recovery...


I have been with my husband since he was 16 he is now 49 I thought all he was doing was marijuana I was OK with that I thought that is a whole other story as a wife I spent time with my husband in many ways I never and I mean never thought he was past marijuana the signs you mentioned were not there I found out in 2009 that he was taking pain pills and xanax as well.

I am not saying your son is I am just sharing as for the synthetic it can kill very evil stuff.

Now as a parent I was confused I felt different feelings than I did with the man I married my original reason for joining SR was one of my son's.

I guess I am saying try and have an open mind and if you do find out there are more drugs do not be surprised many times I have heard that people smoking pot are taking methadone and putting it in the blunt wrappers before they place the pot in and also they sometimes lace the pot I wish you and your family the best I know how you feel and as you can see your not walking alone.

wicked

Thank you for sharing that Carrots, I am in the same boat, rowing in circles.
I have just starting to look to the shore and get my bearings.
I do not believe it is pathetic, just some bad advice we took one time,
(or grew up with no idea how to parent)
and do not know another way.

Yet.

I eventually called the cops on my daughter, and it started our journey to recovery.
Still working it.

Beth

Pravchaw,

this was my experience with my son too. It went on for about 8 months the first time, and less than 4 months the second time. No more living with me. His word to follow the rules lasted about as long as he could
get a couple of bottles of beer. I wanted so badly to believe him I became functionally blind!
Denial in NOT just a river in Egypt.

Pravchaw, how many people do you know who keep bottles of booze in the
nightstand drawer? How many have empties in their bedrooms at all?

I know what it is like where you are, you are right there pravchaw, right on
the edge.
It's okay to let go now, surrender to the idea you have no control.
Your son is an addict and you have no control.
You only control you and your boundaries.

Beth

LoveMeNow

Interesting thread about spice and withdrawals.

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...thdrawals.html

jerect

My ex was high on spice the day he physically assaulted me... Spice is a dangerous dangerous drug and its not easy to quit... It's illegal in most states but the manufactures keep adding new ingredients to make it legal to sell...

I remember that smell.. It's was this awful, rancid smell and my ex would just be waking around in a daze.. Makes me shudder when I think about it..

I have no idea if he is off of the stuff or not.. I doubt it because he never had success getting off anything else...

The statistics on this stuff are scary

HopefulmomtoD

Thinking of you, Pravchaw. Hope your experiencing some serenity. :-)

pravchaw

Thanks for your response. Our immediate goal is to get him to treatment (on the premise that some treatment is better than nothing).