Stuck between a rock and a hard place.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2013
Location: California
Posts: 44
Stuck between a rock and a hard place.
For those who haven't read my recent story, my husband is a heroin addict. Thanks for all the good advice and support I've gotten here over the last week or so I finally got the courage to tell him he won't be allowed to see me or my kids until he decides to get help.
I told him You are not in your right mind. Until you get yourself under control I can't have anything to do with you. I can't expose the girls to it anymore. I love you and I hope you can make the right decision for yourself but I've learned there is nothing I can do. I didn't cause it, I can't control it, I can't cure it. So it's time to let go and let God. I love you and wish you all the blessings possible. Good luck. XOXO
Well, he is refusing to go to rehab, still, but is still making demands at me to let him see the baby. He said, You need to set 4 times a week for me to see her until we figure something out.
I refused.
He threatened me earlier saying So this is how you want it? Even though your words aren't hateful and horrible your actions are and...and if you want to be ugly, well save your tears it's coming.
Then followed with I'm hurting I miss my baby I just want to hold and kiss and love on her so badly...so please find it in your heart to let me hold my baby please T please
So...basically I went from being so confident in my decision to cut contact completely until he makes a life changing decision for himself to feeling awful about "keeping our baby from him" and thinking maybe he's right, maybe I should allow him to see her in a public place for a little bit or something.
I want to stay strong...I just don't want to do the wrong thing. I couldn't imagine the feeling of not being able to see my children. It breaks my heart. I know he's doing it to himself..but is it really going to hurt if I let him see her for a few? I guess if it won't hurt for him to see her it could possibly ruin what I am trying to do here and that is partly to make him see that I am serious this time and he needs to change if he wants to be a family. I also am scared that if I see him it will start this vicious cycle over again. I see his face and I just want to hold him..and be with him.
Now I'm babbling and trying to answer my own questions...when I clearly am not confident on which way I should go with this.
I told him You are not in your right mind. Until you get yourself under control I can't have anything to do with you. I can't expose the girls to it anymore. I love you and I hope you can make the right decision for yourself but I've learned there is nothing I can do. I didn't cause it, I can't control it, I can't cure it. So it's time to let go and let God. I love you and wish you all the blessings possible. Good luck. XOXO
Well, he is refusing to go to rehab, still, but is still making demands at me to let him see the baby. He said, You need to set 4 times a week for me to see her until we figure something out.
I refused.
He threatened me earlier saying So this is how you want it? Even though your words aren't hateful and horrible your actions are and...and if you want to be ugly, well save your tears it's coming.
Then followed with I'm hurting I miss my baby I just want to hold and kiss and love on her so badly...so please find it in your heart to let me hold my baby please T please
So...basically I went from being so confident in my decision to cut contact completely until he makes a life changing decision for himself to feeling awful about "keeping our baby from him" and thinking maybe he's right, maybe I should allow him to see her in a public place for a little bit or something.
I want to stay strong...I just don't want to do the wrong thing. I couldn't imagine the feeling of not being able to see my children. It breaks my heart. I know he's doing it to himself..but is it really going to hurt if I let him see her for a few? I guess if it won't hurt for him to see her it could possibly ruin what I am trying to do here and that is partly to make him see that I am serious this time and he needs to change if he wants to be a family. I also am scared that if I see him it will start this vicious cycle over again. I see his face and I just want to hold him..and be with him.
Now I'm babbling and trying to answer my own questions...when I clearly am not confident on which way I should go with this.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Pine Grove, PA
Posts: 146
Just remember as active addicts we will lie cheat and steal to get what we want and we want it now. I am reminded of the story - an addict will steal your wallet, tell you it is lost, and then help you look for it.
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Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 62
Big fish "an addict will steal your wallet, tell you it is lost, and then help you look for it." truer words never spoken. I know part of what really mentally and emotionally messed with me when I was living with an addict was never knowing what the truth was. I sometimes still torture myself wondering if this or that profession of love was true and then I have to remind myself it came from someone who is very sick whose brain is hijacked by very powerful chemicals. I remind myself that pretty much every single thing that came out of her mouth was a lie. The hardest but best thing to do is let it be and let it go.
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
Posts: 11,589
objectively it seems to simple...get the drugs OUT of your life and you can have your child IN your life. otherwise you are not a safe trustworthy guardian and as the only parent truly concerned with HER well being, I must make the tough calls.
but he's not doing that is he?
but he's not doing that is he?
●▬๑۩۩๑▬●
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 1,405
His pleas are. All. About. Him.
If you can honestly say the best thing for a 7 month old baby is to be exposed to active addiction, needles, and domestic abuse by someone who doesn't financially contribute to her well being. Then by all means let him hug and love on her...might as well take her down to skid row and let others do the same.
If you can honestly say the best thing for a 7 month old baby is to be exposed to active addiction, needles, and domestic abuse by someone who doesn't financially contribute to her well being. Then by all means let him hug and love on her...might as well take her down to skid row and let others do the same.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2013
Location: California
Posts: 44
Okay okay okay, I knew you guys would say that! I got the same advice in the chat room...even from addicts and alcoholics. I'll be strong, then.
Bi11fish, yeah I know EXACTLY what you mean. It's happened.
Anvil, no he's not doing anything. He's worse than ever. Doesn't help me with a thing, either...even when I know he got paid. But, I'm not asking him for anything!
You're right, Cynical One, it would be All. About. Him. Because even though I don't think I would be necessarily exposing her to addiction, needles, and abuse if we were walking around Target for 20 minutes with him, her seeing him isn't doing HER any good..it's doing HIM good.
Bi11fish, yeah I know EXACTLY what you mean. It's happened.
Anvil, no he's not doing anything. He's worse than ever. Doesn't help me with a thing, either...even when I know he got paid. But, I'm not asking him for anything!
You're right, Cynical One, it would be All. About. Him. Because even though I don't think I would be necessarily exposing her to addiction, needles, and abuse if we were walking around Target for 20 minutes with him, her seeing him isn't doing HER any good..it's doing HIM good.
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Colorado
Posts: 577
Good Morning Tleac, I agree with all above. Your job is to protect your beautiful children. It really is simple...get clean and you'll have access to all your children. One of you has to be able to provide a safe environment. One thing I always kept in mind with my son was whenever I established a new boundary I expected him to react against it...to pull out all the stops...testing to see if I'd give in. And....like clockwork...he always would. When we can anticipate this behavior before it starts we are better equipped to recognize it when it's put into play. Stay strong...you're doing great. Just a consistent message of....we will be right here, safe and sound, minus the chaos. I believe you can change when you are ready and once clean I'm sure the children will be thrilled to see you". I'd probably even throw in a "if the situation was reversed I'm sure you'd be very protective of them as well". I know reason doesn't really exist in their minds when using but it could help. You are doing the right thing. No one would benefit from him seeing them at the moment and it could actually be just enough to keep him limping along after getting his emotional fix....know what I mean? Hang in there....Big hug!
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Canada
Posts: 628
Let him earn the right to see his daughter.
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ic-addict.html
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ic-addict.html
Drug Addiction Has No Mercy
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Milwaukie Oregon
Posts: 875
He is trying to control your thoughts and decisions with manipulation and guilt. It is so easy for us to give in to the guilt trips.
Well what would it hurt if I let him.....????
Well what would it hurt if he went to rehab and got clean? If he weren't on drugs would there even be this issue? He isn't willing to change, but he is willing to guilt trip you into doing what he wants you to do. If you've ever given in even once he believes he will get you to give in again. Trust me!
The stronger you get the harder he will come back at you. His mission in life is to keep using drugs and have all the benefits of a family *cake and eat it too* He will remain the same for as long as he can without changing at all if he can puppet master those around him. Addicts create a world with chosen people in it who will help support them in their addiction. As soon as someone decides their not going to be apart of supporting an addiction any longer then that person becomes the enemy, but first the addict pulls out all the stops to get their puppet back in place again. When that doesn't work then you will see the true colors of the addict bleed out and it ain't pretty.
He is all about what he wants, but deep down you know what he needs and that is recovery.
Seeing his daughter will only be an emotional rescue for him and give him the opportunity to see you in person and try to persuade you to see things his way.
As long as you remain in contact with him you'll find yourself like the waves of the sea tossing about.
His quest is to change your mind not change himself. That says it all right there.
No matter how much you want him to change unless he wants it for himself he won't.
He can tell you he wants to, but if his actions don't line up with what he says then it is all just a bunch of words.
It is the dance of addiction. I think it is past time you sit this one out. You know the right thing to do, but then you talk with him and he gets you to second guess yourself. It is like the angel on one shoulder and the devil on the other.
Nothing changes if nothing changes. It is high past time that the his addiction and all of the baggage of it be placed back in his lap. He owns it. Not you. Give it back to him gladly, take a deep breath, let it on and keep on moving in the direction that is right for you and your children. Let the consequences of his addiction fall where it belongs ... on his shoulders.
If he really wants to see his daughter then he will pull himself up by his boot straps and get his butt into rehab. If he is just trying to get what he wants then he will continue to do what he does and at least you and the kids will be in a safe, healthy place.
Hugs,
Passion
Well what would it hurt if I let him.....????
Well what would it hurt if he went to rehab and got clean? If he weren't on drugs would there even be this issue? He isn't willing to change, but he is willing to guilt trip you into doing what he wants you to do. If you've ever given in even once he believes he will get you to give in again. Trust me!
The stronger you get the harder he will come back at you. His mission in life is to keep using drugs and have all the benefits of a family *cake and eat it too* He will remain the same for as long as he can without changing at all if he can puppet master those around him. Addicts create a world with chosen people in it who will help support them in their addiction. As soon as someone decides their not going to be apart of supporting an addiction any longer then that person becomes the enemy, but first the addict pulls out all the stops to get their puppet back in place again. When that doesn't work then you will see the true colors of the addict bleed out and it ain't pretty.
He is all about what he wants, but deep down you know what he needs and that is recovery.
Seeing his daughter will only be an emotional rescue for him and give him the opportunity to see you in person and try to persuade you to see things his way.
As long as you remain in contact with him you'll find yourself like the waves of the sea tossing about.
His quest is to change your mind not change himself. That says it all right there.
No matter how much you want him to change unless he wants it for himself he won't.
He can tell you he wants to, but if his actions don't line up with what he says then it is all just a bunch of words.
It is the dance of addiction. I think it is past time you sit this one out. You know the right thing to do, but then you talk with him and he gets you to second guess yourself. It is like the angel on one shoulder and the devil on the other.
Nothing changes if nothing changes. It is high past time that the his addiction and all of the baggage of it be placed back in his lap. He owns it. Not you. Give it back to him gladly, take a deep breath, let it on and keep on moving in the direction that is right for you and your children. Let the consequences of his addiction fall where it belongs ... on his shoulders.
If he really wants to see his daughter then he will pull himself up by his boot straps and get his butt into rehab. If he is just trying to get what he wants then he will continue to do what he does and at least you and the kids will be in a safe, healthy place.
Hugs,
Passion
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Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,927
I don't know if you are familiar with the CRAFT method (community reinforcement and family training). It is supported by National Institute of Drug Abuse, and one of the goals is to teach family how to encourage our loved ones to seek treatment. It is done by using the power of our relationship, specific communication methods, and even incentives, positive reinforcements to encourage a person to obtain treatment - where they can begin to heal.
There are studies that show it has about a 74 % success rate of getting people into treatment.
I mention this because the concept your using with child visits is similar; the only thing is at some point if he does not give in to treatment, not seeing his daughter could become his norm, and to cope it's possible he will just use more drugs to block it out.
One of the concepts of CRAFT is that while negative consequences can lead a person to recovery; positive consequences of not using can also do the same, while also preventing a decline to "the bottom" which is a very dangerous place.
The first concern would be the safety of yourself and your child. There is info about this method in the stickys at the top of the forum, under Info for Familes - National Institute of Drug Abuse.
I became familiar with this method through the therapist that was assigned to me by my husbands rehab. She recommended a book that is based on Craft (also mentioned in that sticky, you can also look it up on amazon for reviews) and I have used tools from that book to help in communication with my husband especially during his early recovery. Overall the book teaches us to evaluate our relationship, set boundaries to keep ourselves safe, effective means of communication to avoid conflict (no nagging, threatening) and then also to encourage recovery, or continued recovery. Just wanted to mention this approach in case you had not heard of it.
There are studies that show it has about a 74 % success rate of getting people into treatment.
I mention this because the concept your using with child visits is similar; the only thing is at some point if he does not give in to treatment, not seeing his daughter could become his norm, and to cope it's possible he will just use more drugs to block it out.
One of the concepts of CRAFT is that while negative consequences can lead a person to recovery; positive consequences of not using can also do the same, while also preventing a decline to "the bottom" which is a very dangerous place.
The first concern would be the safety of yourself and your child. There is info about this method in the stickys at the top of the forum, under Info for Familes - National Institute of Drug Abuse.
I became familiar with this method through the therapist that was assigned to me by my husbands rehab. She recommended a book that is based on Craft (also mentioned in that sticky, you can also look it up on amazon for reviews) and I have used tools from that book to help in communication with my husband especially during his early recovery. Overall the book teaches us to evaluate our relationship, set boundaries to keep ourselves safe, effective means of communication to avoid conflict (no nagging, threatening) and then also to encourage recovery, or continued recovery. Just wanted to mention this approach in case you had not heard of it.
Getting there!!
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 5,750
Wow Nytepassion!! You actually described the dance to a tee. Unfortunately, I had not found SR yet and danced until my feet bled. Looking back, I was so easy to manipulate.
Please reread her post, she described my experience exactly. Had I known better, I would have done better. Ughhhhh
Please reread her post, she described my experience exactly. Had I known better, I would have done better. Ughhhhh
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Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 4
Originally Posted by nytepassion 
Let the consequences of his addiction fall where it belongs ... on his shoulders.
I'm not saying that there is a lot of truth in your post, but this phrase is so cold. So if you got cancer, your significant other/family should automatically tell you "That's your disease, not mine. Figure it out on your own."
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Over here.
Posts: 369
i really don't think nytepassion meant it the way it seems to have been interpreted. i think supporting someone in their recovery is one thing...but who else can or should face the consequences of their addiction/behavior while actively using but the addict?
addiction and cancer are not the same.
addiction and cancer are not the same.
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Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 4
Originally Posted by mstrust
addiction and cancer are not the same.
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Over here.
Posts: 369
holy god. i think it's pretty clear that i wasn't saying all addicts WANTED to be junkies when they grew up. you realize that some people get cancer who have never engaged in an unhealthy behavior in their lives? and not everyone who smokes gets cancer. but, for someone with cancer the outcome is far more uncertain and although it has a great deal to do with how they engage in treatment, care for themselves, etc. some people will die no matter what from that disease. with addiction, if an addict makes a decision to engage in treatment, care for themselves, etc. they have a pretty good chance of not dying from their addiction.
just as codependents and those who partner with addicts and alcoholics are not "victims", neither are addicts. there is choice involved. otherwise, why bother with treatment at all? why bother trying? just tell yourself you were genetically predisposed to addiction, there's nothing you can do about it because it's just like cancer, and use to your heart's content.
just as codependents and those who partner with addicts and alcoholics are not "victims", neither are addicts. there is choice involved. otherwise, why bother with treatment at all? why bother trying? just tell yourself you were genetically predisposed to addiction, there's nothing you can do about it because it's just like cancer, and use to your heart's content.
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Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,618
Originally Posted by bluffing024
I find they are very much so the same. Do all addicts have a predisposition genetically to use? No, but there are a LOT who are. Just like some people just get unlucky and have a predisposition to cancer, but some self inflict it by smoking. No, your right, I'm sure all addicts wanted to be junkies when they grew up.
its not like cancer. I should know. So listen, please do we want to be addicted? NO do we want to get high? YES. I use because I choose to. the only reason we use the metaphor of cancer is because there is absolutely no cure. ever. end of story. There only is remission. we can only take that part of our mind and bind it up in the chains of recovery.
do all people want to be junkies when they grow up... wow... just wow.
how about you? why are you so worried about what the addicts are doing or not doing? as for me... I focused on my other addicts so muh so that I could stay and hide from my own issues.... just saying... take what you want and leave the rest. I know I'm not but wow. just wow.
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