i ended it
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he emailed me and said he is working to change himself and threw some stuff in there about my negative reinforcement. said he knows he caused me all kinds of pain. talked about how he has to move forward because if he stays stuck in the problem he won't get the solution. i agree with that, but i also know that part of recovery is owning what you've done and seeking amends. whatever. that's his business. he told me he doesn't deserve me, which frankly just made me feel it was said because it sounds like something i might want to hear.
Mstrust - My ex said this to me almost word for word more than once. Each time I would find out he was relapsing again. It's all BS.
Mstrust - My ex said this to me almost word for word more than once. Each time I would find out he was relapsing again. It's all BS.
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so this email just came in...
"I am almost at the end of my time here and in four months you have been 90% discouraging and more concerned about yourself than anything to do with me or us or anything. It's about your hurt your pain your insatiable need for me to feel the hurt I caused. What you don't seem to get is the pain you cause or damage done by your excusable inability to deal or communicate whatsoever. I can't live my life under the control of your expectations. Can't. You don't see it or know it but you do expect a lot more than you tell yourself. I can't meet your expectations based on retribution for my past mistakes."
this is the kind of thing that i allow to mess with my head. this is the kind of thing that almost convinces me that, hey, maybe i am just awful and a better person would handle this differently. i get an acknowledge here and there and the "i don't deserve you" i mentioned earlier. then i get something like this. ugh! i just do not get it. can someone lend an opinion or some insight? please...
and thank you.
"I am almost at the end of my time here and in four months you have been 90% discouraging and more concerned about yourself than anything to do with me or us or anything. It's about your hurt your pain your insatiable need for me to feel the hurt I caused. What you don't seem to get is the pain you cause or damage done by your excusable inability to deal or communicate whatsoever. I can't live my life under the control of your expectations. Can't. You don't see it or know it but you do expect a lot more than you tell yourself. I can't meet your expectations based on retribution for my past mistakes."
this is the kind of thing that i allow to mess with my head. this is the kind of thing that almost convinces me that, hey, maybe i am just awful and a better person would handle this differently. i get an acknowledge here and there and the "i don't deserve you" i mentioned earlier. then i get something like this. ugh! i just do not get it. can someone lend an opinion or some insight? please...
and thank you.
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He's an addict, that's how they act!
Usually, the email above is during times of possibly withdrawals, so he lashes out at you.
Other email's like the I don't deserve you, most likely when he is feeling better and gets some sense of reality.
either way, it's addict behavior not logical. Unless, he get's clean his moods will always swing. Believe it or not though they are addicts, they do at times feel guilty and it's genuine. On the other hand they lie to satisfy themselves.
that's your explanation he is actively using and his moods are all over the place. take care of yourself.
Usually, the email above is during times of possibly withdrawals, so he lashes out at you.
Other email's like the I don't deserve you, most likely when he is feeling better and gets some sense of reality.
either way, it's addict behavior not logical. Unless, he get's clean his moods will always swing. Believe it or not though they are addicts, they do at times feel guilty and it's genuine. On the other hand they lie to satisfy themselves.
that's your explanation he is actively using and his moods are all over the place. take care of yourself.
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according to him...and his address, he is in a sober house where there is a zero tolerance policy for relapse. i asked him flat out if he did relapse because his behavior is so like that when i KNEW he was using. he denies. if he was relapsing, i wouldn't expect an admission. i just can't see how if he was truly clean and working the program, as he claims to be, how he could have this attitude. i understand being a little upset with me and discouraged because i DO and HAVE HAD a problem dealing well, but to seem to be putting it ALL on me? that i just do not get.
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Mstrust - exactly what words do you want to hear and why? You don't need to answer me but I too had to ask myself that very question. I had so many expectations of what I thought I deserved to hear. Today, I am working on amends for my own behavior and it is such a better place to be. Forgiving myself was the beginning of my healing.
Codependent behavior is not any better then an addicts, IMO.
Codependent behavior is not any better then an addicts, IMO.
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i don't think my behavior is any better. i accept my responsibility. i don't expect words. i expect him to do what he says he is going to do. i expect honesty and consideration. that's about it. and i haven't gotten it which i why i ended it. i'm working on myself. but i didn't cause his issues and i can't control them...and i can't cure them. i was the only one working on this relationshit (love that, whomever i stole it from...) pretty much the whole time. and i drove myself crazy trying to control things i can't control. but if TWO people want to work a situation out, they BOTH have to be working on it. i wasn't put on this earth to be endlessly understanding of what he has gone through, needs to go through, regardless of how it has affected me. i've not gotten understanding in return. i allow emails like the one he sent me to mess with my head when truly, what i should do is stomp on the ignore button.
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for the record, i really am at a point where i think the first person i need to be forgiving is myself for selling myself short and allowing myself to stay in a situation like this when i knew it was toxic to me. i need to figure out why i think i can't do any better in life than to be with a lying, manipulative, selfish, narcissistic addict. i need to learn that my needs and what i want are just as important as the other person's need and wants. addiction doesn't excuse d**khead behavior and i have no excuse for allowing another person to treat me like i'm nothing.
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I found it amazing at how much I was getting out of any of my dysfunctional relationships. Even when my husband became addicted to pain killers, as much as I hated it, I can see now my own role in it. I am not saying I caused it but I sure tried to control it. Also, I think my own selfish codependency and my own fears contributed to much of the dysfunction. Being the victim and blaming him had become my way of thinking. It was much easier then looking in the mirror.
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yes. i've been there. the thing that is missing from this post is all the OTHER conversations in which i have outlined my role in this, my playing the victim, as you said. Me being mostly a victim of myself putting up with these things and always hoping they would get better. Me always feeling like as soon as we get through THIS, THIS TIME, then things will be good. what i selfishly wanted so bad was to be loved by someone. to the point that i sacrificed my dignity and self-respect.
things i know now-- i do NOT want to be in a situation where i will always wonder. as i said. i will take my share of the blame, and although it may not be evident from my brief posts, i have probably taken MORE of the responsibility than has been mine. i most definitely have tried to CONTROL this and all the outcomes and i have typed that in here multiple times.
none of this changes the fact that there is no question of his role in this. at all. no more than there is a question of mine. so again, i'm working on figuring out why i think i don't deserve better than what this situation has brought to my life...or why i have ALLOWED it to stay for so long. his approach to me has been terrible. independent of anything i have done. and the reverse is also true.
lastly, i think i've just recognized that this is now broken beyond all repair. my feelings are no longer the same. i want more out of my life than this. i want equality in a relationship and reciprocity. and anyone who has been involved with an addict KNOWS that life becomes ALL about them...always, all the time. if it's selfish to want a relationship that is a two-way street, then yes, i am selfish. guilty as charged.
things i know now-- i do NOT want to be in a situation where i will always wonder. as i said. i will take my share of the blame, and although it may not be evident from my brief posts, i have probably taken MORE of the responsibility than has been mine. i most definitely have tried to CONTROL this and all the outcomes and i have typed that in here multiple times.
none of this changes the fact that there is no question of his role in this. at all. no more than there is a question of mine. so again, i'm working on figuring out why i think i don't deserve better than what this situation has brought to my life...or why i have ALLOWED it to stay for so long. his approach to me has been terrible. independent of anything i have done. and the reverse is also true.
lastly, i think i've just recognized that this is now broken beyond all repair. my feelings are no longer the same. i want more out of my life than this. i want equality in a relationship and reciprocity. and anyone who has been involved with an addict KNOWS that life becomes ALL about them...always, all the time. if it's selfish to want a relationship that is a two-way street, then yes, i am selfish. guilty as charged.
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" anyone who has been involved with an addict KNOWS that life becomes ALL about them..."
this is simply not true. I have a dear friend of mine whose husband goes in and out of sobriety and active addiction. She is working towards her masters degree. She protects her finances. She spends time with her friends. She does not enable the disease, unless allowing him to come home while he is sober counts. maybe it does. I don't know.
The point is... Her life is about her and her relationship with her HP, not her and her relationship with her husband.
imho it is codependency that makes life all about the addict, not addiction in and of itself.
this is simply not true. I have a dear friend of mine whose husband goes in and out of sobriety and active addiction. She is working towards her masters degree. She protects her finances. She spends time with her friends. She does not enable the disease, unless allowing him to come home while he is sober counts. maybe it does. I don't know.
The point is... Her life is about her and her relationship with her HP, not her and her relationship with her husband.
imho it is codependency that makes life all about the addict, not addiction in and of itself.
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my point was that everything is all about the addict TO THE ADDICT. nothing and no one else matters TO the addict except themselves and their addiction.
i KNOW i'm broken...and i have owned it over and over, with him and on these boards. it's all in my past messages. i have accepted codependency was rampant in me and i am in therapy and working on it and have been. one of the things i have learned is that i deserve more than what i've been getting. not because i'm so awesome, but because ANYONE does. again, my number one problem is not that i can't handle HIS addiction, it's that my self-esteem was so low that i thought this was the best i could do.
just to be clear, i have a master's degree, i have a professional job that i've held for years, i take care of my own finances. i also spend time with my friends. i exercise and eat healthy. this relationship does not run my life (anymore). i have held it together the whole time, so it's not like MY WHOLE LIFE has revolved around him and his addiction. and if you are in a relationship with someone, shouldn't at least SOME of your life be about that?? otherwise, why be in it?
have i done or said something to offend someone?? because really, i feel like my point is almost intentionally being missed. i feel it was a mistake to share that email from him without at least more than that to illustrate my point. i am not working on myself so that i can learn how to get over things so that he and i can work things out. we can't. i am working on myself to fix myself so maybe next time i will aim just a little higher.
i KNOW i'm broken...and i have owned it over and over, with him and on these boards. it's all in my past messages. i have accepted codependency was rampant in me and i am in therapy and working on it and have been. one of the things i have learned is that i deserve more than what i've been getting. not because i'm so awesome, but because ANYONE does. again, my number one problem is not that i can't handle HIS addiction, it's that my self-esteem was so low that i thought this was the best i could do.
just to be clear, i have a master's degree, i have a professional job that i've held for years, i take care of my own finances. i also spend time with my friends. i exercise and eat healthy. this relationship does not run my life (anymore). i have held it together the whole time, so it's not like MY WHOLE LIFE has revolved around him and his addiction. and if you are in a relationship with someone, shouldn't at least SOME of your life be about that?? otherwise, why be in it?
have i done or said something to offend someone?? because really, i feel like my point is almost intentionally being missed. i feel it was a mistake to share that email from him without at least more than that to illustrate my point. i am not working on myself so that i can learn how to get over things so that he and i can work things out. we can't. i am working on myself to fix myself so maybe next time i will aim just a little higher.
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I don't think anyone is judging you, by their comments. To me, it seems that they have been expressing their point of view, which, when filtered through experience, can be helpful. You're in a very vulnerable place right now (I say that because I am in a similar situation) and so everything seems a bit overwhelming. Although I feel so much better -- clearer mind, freer breathing, less fear -- I'm still very sensitive and keeping to myself a lot. My phone is off, my doorbell is disabled, and I'm spending quite a bit of time in the quiet, working.... I'm not hiding -- I am visiting friends, going to groups, taking leisurely strolls -- but I am being very quiet.
This is a big change for me, not only because I've cut all contact with my former partner -- I'm also taking some of my first decisive steps in my recovery, and I feel a bit unsure of things. With each day, however, I feel stronger, and I've reached the point where I've stopped looking back.
I'm going to suggest again that you give Al-Anon/Nar-Anon another shot. Private therapy has been wonderful for me and it's irreplaceable, but the wisdom and support from the groups offers something you'll never get from a therapist: a sense of community. From what you've written, I can see that you are working on WHY you became involved with someone as ill as your ex-boyfriend. In the groups, you are bound to hear stories from others in a similar situation, and you won't feel so alone.... that's what I sense from what you've written: that you feel alone in your struggle. That doesn't have to be the case.
This is a big change for me, not only because I've cut all contact with my former partner -- I'm also taking some of my first decisive steps in my recovery, and I feel a bit unsure of things. With each day, however, I feel stronger, and I've reached the point where I've stopped looking back.
I'm going to suggest again that you give Al-Anon/Nar-Anon another shot. Private therapy has been wonderful for me and it's irreplaceable, but the wisdom and support from the groups offers something you'll never get from a therapist: a sense of community. From what you've written, I can see that you are working on WHY you became involved with someone as ill as your ex-boyfriend. In the groups, you are bound to hear stories from others in a similar situation, and you won't feel so alone.... that's what I sense from what you've written: that you feel alone in your struggle. That doesn't have to be the case.
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i am hyper-sensitive. no question about it.
it's hard for me to find the words to say exactly what i what to say and feel i can be understood. i feel sometimes that focus is so much (sometimes) on what WE as partners to addicts are doing, have done "wrong" or at least in an unhealthy way, that it seems to negate anything and everything the addict has done. i don't think dwelling on these things is helpful, per se, but i do think it's part of the whole process to work through it. i'm not going to sit here and pretend that i have not been damaged in this relationship simply because the codependent me chose to be in it. the damage has still been done. a person i was in a relationship with s**t on me and took advantage and was completely dishonest and has used every textbook tactic an addict uses to mess with my head. why shouldn't i be angry about it? why shouldn't i be hurt? seems like a pretty normal reaction to me. to get stuck there, however, would be detrimental to MY health all the way around.
i entered into this relationship believing things were one way and i found out the hardest way possible that they were not what i thought. not what i had been told. and yes, to repeat myself some more, much of my anger is directed at myself because i could have saved us both a lot of trouble had i ended it when the issues became obvious. i actually like to believe the best about situations and my hope tricked me. i thought i met the person i was going to be with for the rest of my life and it totally broke me to go through what we went through. i didn't want to give up because i wanted what i thought we had.
no one is perfect and we all deal with things differently. i'm not going to deny the things he has done or minimize them because that would not be real. i won't blame myself any more than i already have for what has gone on. i don't control what other people do...good, bad, or indifferent. he made his choices and i made mine. in the heat of the moment with everyone's emotions turned up to eleven, it's not always so easy to be a picture of composure and grace. i have been able to admit all along that i have made mistakes in dealing with this, that what happened was both of our "faults", for lack of a better term. he chooses to conveniently forget that or ignore it when he sends me an email like the one i copied and pasted. it makes me doubt myself. because i let it. it doesn't change the fact that his words are manipulative and essentially he is doing exactly what he is accusing me of doing/being. i suppose my next step should just be no contact since this is the effect this bull has on me. i am just not yet ready for such an extreme step. currently, i'm just choosing not to contact him in any way.
it's hard for me to find the words to say exactly what i what to say and feel i can be understood. i feel sometimes that focus is so much (sometimes) on what WE as partners to addicts are doing, have done "wrong" or at least in an unhealthy way, that it seems to negate anything and everything the addict has done. i don't think dwelling on these things is helpful, per se, but i do think it's part of the whole process to work through it. i'm not going to sit here and pretend that i have not been damaged in this relationship simply because the codependent me chose to be in it. the damage has still been done. a person i was in a relationship with s**t on me and took advantage and was completely dishonest and has used every textbook tactic an addict uses to mess with my head. why shouldn't i be angry about it? why shouldn't i be hurt? seems like a pretty normal reaction to me. to get stuck there, however, would be detrimental to MY health all the way around.
i entered into this relationship believing things were one way and i found out the hardest way possible that they were not what i thought. not what i had been told. and yes, to repeat myself some more, much of my anger is directed at myself because i could have saved us both a lot of trouble had i ended it when the issues became obvious. i actually like to believe the best about situations and my hope tricked me. i thought i met the person i was going to be with for the rest of my life and it totally broke me to go through what we went through. i didn't want to give up because i wanted what i thought we had.
no one is perfect and we all deal with things differently. i'm not going to deny the things he has done or minimize them because that would not be real. i won't blame myself any more than i already have for what has gone on. i don't control what other people do...good, bad, or indifferent. he made his choices and i made mine. in the heat of the moment with everyone's emotions turned up to eleven, it's not always so easy to be a picture of composure and grace. i have been able to admit all along that i have made mistakes in dealing with this, that what happened was both of our "faults", for lack of a better term. he chooses to conveniently forget that or ignore it when he sends me an email like the one i copied and pasted. it makes me doubt myself. because i let it. it doesn't change the fact that his words are manipulative and essentially he is doing exactly what he is accusing me of doing/being. i suppose my next step should just be no contact since this is the effect this bull has on me. i am just not yet ready for such an extreme step. currently, i'm just choosing not to contact him in any way.
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well yes the addicts are all about themselves. Whether or not they are in active addiction or recovery.
I seemed to have misunderstood.
I personally only focus on my side of the street because it is the only thing I can change. No point in ruminating over all the things he has done or will do because I can't change any of that.
I feel like anger is like a hot coal I pick up to throw at someone. I get burned before it even leaves my hand, and most of the time I miss. Forgiveness is like aloe vera it soothes the wound, but the scars remain.
I will never minimize the things that the addicts in my life have done to me. They were wrong, every single one of them (practically my whole family is addicted) but... I am only responsible for focusing on me. I was a victim of my addict mom because I was only a child, but I was not even once a victim of my XBF... I was a willing participant.
I seemed to have misunderstood.
I personally only focus on my side of the street because it is the only thing I can change. No point in ruminating over all the things he has done or will do because I can't change any of that.
I feel like anger is like a hot coal I pick up to throw at someone. I get burned before it even leaves my hand, and most of the time I miss. Forgiveness is like aloe vera it soothes the wound, but the scars remain.
I will never minimize the things that the addicts in my life have done to me. They were wrong, every single one of them (practically my whole family is addicted) but... I am only responsible for focusing on me. I was a victim of my addict mom because I was only a child, but I was not even once a victim of my XBF... I was a willing participant.
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MTrust....you're allowed to vent....I feel for you, and your anger, I must be in the same place b/c I felt hyper-sensitive right along with you. There is so much info that everyone wants to share. Not everyone is working the steps, not everyone understands all the nuances of ownership ,etc YET...But we'll get there! Stay Strong. And don't read the emails if at all poss. just my opinion xo
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spot on, you guys. and as they say, about resentment, anger, bitterness, whatever, it's like drinking the poison and waiting for the other person to die. this i know. but anger is one of the many emotions we feel as humans. i have learned to make sure to keep the anger confined to this situation, at least, and not take it with me throughout the rest of my day-to-day life. that is something i have been guilty of in the past, but i refuse to let this wreck everything for me. it shouldn't have that kind of power.
and lily, yes...willing participant. once i realized what was happening and once he showed me who he is. i think a lot of my fight was wanting the wrongs to somehow be made right...an apology with some sincerity...an actual change...an acknowledgement. i know now that this is not going to happen and it likely wouldn't really help me anyway.
maybe this is all really boiling over for me now because i really feel just plain DONE. next month would be our two-year anniversary. i see a lot of wasted time. i also see a lot of lessons learned...and some that are still coming, however slowly. i hope not to lose the lessons. i will get past the anger and hurt. just not yet. not right now.
and lily, yes...willing participant. once i realized what was happening and once he showed me who he is. i think a lot of my fight was wanting the wrongs to somehow be made right...an apology with some sincerity...an actual change...an acknowledgement. i know now that this is not going to happen and it likely wouldn't really help me anyway.
maybe this is all really boiling over for me now because i really feel just plain DONE. next month would be our two-year anniversary. i see a lot of wasted time. i also see a lot of lessons learned...and some that are still coming, however slowly. i hope not to lose the lessons. i will get past the anger and hurt. just not yet. not right now.
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