Sobriety and Xanax use
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Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: new moon road
Posts: 1,545
Have you considered any treatment for yourself?
It is a common refrain in recovery circles that recovery for the addict usually starts with recovery in the family.
Al-Anon and Nar-Anon are free, there are counselors with experience in codependency and families affected by addiction, and there are also codependency treatment centers which can give a jumpstart to family recovery. You haven't mentioned you are in active recovery, so I mention these as possibilities for you. Family members often wait for the addict to change. But they, too, need some serious work.
If you are handling this without any professional guidance nor with any experienced recovery people offering you feedback, you will very likely make some wrong turns which could be avoided. Addiction and addicts are cunning and powerful, and most people trained in recovery will recommend a family member never go it alone.
So I hope you will get some face to face support there and continue it for the very long term. Your daughter will have addictive disease for life. You will need ongoing support. Your thinking can become distorted and irrational, and you won't realize it. I hope you'll get some support in place that will continue for a very long time. Otherwise, you will suffer and you will enable. We are so easily confused when in relationship with an addict. And parents are easily manipulated and controlled because they are easily guilted by the addict or by their own ruminations.
I hope you get a support system in place there and check in every week with them. Wishing you a strong recovery.
It is a common refrain in recovery circles that recovery for the addict usually starts with recovery in the family.
Al-Anon and Nar-Anon are free, there are counselors with experience in codependency and families affected by addiction, and there are also codependency treatment centers which can give a jumpstart to family recovery. You haven't mentioned you are in active recovery, so I mention these as possibilities for you. Family members often wait for the addict to change. But they, too, need some serious work.
If you are handling this without any professional guidance nor with any experienced recovery people offering you feedback, you will very likely make some wrong turns which could be avoided. Addiction and addicts are cunning and powerful, and most people trained in recovery will recommend a family member never go it alone.
So I hope you will get some face to face support there and continue it for the very long term. Your daughter will have addictive disease for life. You will need ongoing support. Your thinking can become distorted and irrational, and you won't realize it. I hope you'll get some support in place that will continue for a very long time. Otherwise, you will suffer and you will enable. We are so easily confused when in relationship with an addict. And parents are easily manipulated and controlled because they are easily guilted by the addict or by their own ruminations.
I hope you get a support system in place there and check in every week with them. Wishing you a strong recovery.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 46
Originally Posted by EnglishGarden 
Have you considered any treatment for yourself?
It is a common refrain in recovery circles that recovery for the addict usually starts with recovery in the family.
Al-Anon and Nar-Anon are free, there are counselors with experience in codependency and families affected by addiction, and there are also codependency treatment centers which can give a jumpstart to family recovery. You haven't mentioned you are in active recovery, so I mention these as possibilities for you. Family members often wait for the addict to change. But they, too, need some serious work.
If you are handling this without any professional guidance nor with any experienced recovery people offering you feedback, you will very likely make some wrong turns which could be avoided. Addiction and addicts are cunning and powerful, and most people trained in recovery will recommend a family member never go it alone.
So I hope you will get some face to face support there and continue it for the very long term. Your daughter will have addictive disease for life. You will need ongoing support. Your thinking can become distorted and irrational, and you won't realize it. I hope you'll get some support in place that will continue for a very long time. Otherwise, you will suffer and you will enable. We are so easily confused when in relationship with an addict. And parents are easily manipulated and controlled because they are easily guilted by the addict or by their own ruminations.
I hope you get a support system in place there and check in every week with them. Wishing you a strong recovery.
It is a common refrain in recovery circles that recovery for the addict usually starts with recovery in the family.
Al-Anon and Nar-Anon are free, there are counselors with experience in codependency and families affected by addiction, and there are also codependency treatment centers which can give a jumpstart to family recovery. You haven't mentioned you are in active recovery, so I mention these as possibilities for you. Family members often wait for the addict to change. But they, too, need some serious work.
If you are handling this without any professional guidance nor with any experienced recovery people offering you feedback, you will very likely make some wrong turns which could be avoided. Addiction and addicts are cunning and powerful, and most people trained in recovery will recommend a family member never go it alone.
So I hope you will get some face to face support there and continue it for the very long term. Your daughter will have addictive disease for life. You will need ongoing support. Your thinking can become distorted and irrational, and you won't realize it. I hope you'll get some support in place that will continue for a very long time. Otherwise, you will suffer and you will enable. We are so easily confused when in relationship with an addict. And parents are easily manipulated and controlled because they are easily guilted by the addict or by their own ruminations.
I hope you get a support system in place there and check in every week with them. Wishing you a strong recovery.
I have limited resources, but have been searching in my area for an addiction specialist/therapist. It's difficult finding someone when you have no insurance and limited disposable income, but I haven't given up yet. I find the best support is sharing with others who are in the same boat as me. In fact, I'm going to hit google again now about addiction specialists. Thank you. Wish that I could find a free one.
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Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,927
My husband had an opiate pain med addiction, and during this time he also picked up a xanax addiction. When he decided to stop, the xanax had the most serious effects on him, and he went into seizures. Please keep this in mind if she does try to quit. A medically assisted taper would be advised
I think your in a good position with your daughter as is sounds like you have a close and respectful relationship. Your saying she tries at leaast in minimal ways to listen to you.
My husband worked his recovery through private therapy. He did a non 12-step rehab that was based on private therapy, and has followed that up with the same since coming home. He will have a year this month.
When he was in rehab, they assigned me a therapist. She was a great help to me and I always recommend this option if possible.
My therapist recommended a book to me called: Get You Loved One Sober, Alternatives to Nagging, Pleading, and Threatening. By Robert Meyers, PhD. (You can google this and read book reviews.) The book follows along with what it seems you are already doing. It teaches positive reinforcement techiniques to encouragee positve behavior, and promote sobriety. It follows a method called CRAFT (Community Reinforfement and Fmaily Training) which you can also google. It has proven successful at getting people into tratment. Of course, once they are there - then they have to embrace it on their own.
It is also used by a recovery method called Smart (self management and recovery training): Self Help Substance Abuse & Addiction Recovery | SMART Recovery®
(online meetings, forum discussions, articles, and largely free materials). They offer assistance to those who want to recover from addiction, and also to family members dealing with addicted loved ones. It’s a great resource and can help you learn how to define personal boundaries, make sure you remember to take care of your needs along with your efforts to support yoru daughter. They have an online meeting on Mondays at 9pm for family. Its all free.
Since your daughter has had multiple treatments, my thought would be to try to determine if some of her needs have not been met. I really like your idea of talking to an addiction doctor and getting some feedback. I think it would be great to find one close to her. I also think visiting is a fine idea. Maybe you could put some things in place in advance with the addiction doctor, and she would go with you to meet for the first time, or even do it alone.
I also dont know much about methadone. My husband did a detox for the opitates adn then he did use a drug called vivitrol for a couple of months. I would recommend that drug for opiates. You can google it also. vivitrol.com My husband said it helped remove cravings in those early months while he got treatment.
One last things, the video mentioned by lovemenow, is on youtube. I would also recommend it as it describes what happens in the brain during drug use. It is very close to the way my doctors explained it, but this video is clear and easy to watch.
Pleasure Unwoven Full Movie Documentary by Kevin McCauley - YouTube
Anyway, hope some bit of this is helpful. Good Luck. Prayers going out to you.
I think your in a good position with your daughter as is sounds like you have a close and respectful relationship. Your saying she tries at leaast in minimal ways to listen to you.
My husband worked his recovery through private therapy. He did a non 12-step rehab that was based on private therapy, and has followed that up with the same since coming home. He will have a year this month.
When he was in rehab, they assigned me a therapist. She was a great help to me and I always recommend this option if possible.
My therapist recommended a book to me called: Get You Loved One Sober, Alternatives to Nagging, Pleading, and Threatening. By Robert Meyers, PhD. (You can google this and read book reviews.) The book follows along with what it seems you are already doing. It teaches positive reinforcement techiniques to encouragee positve behavior, and promote sobriety. It follows a method called CRAFT (Community Reinforfement and Fmaily Training) which you can also google. It has proven successful at getting people into tratment. Of course, once they are there - then they have to embrace it on their own.
It is also used by a recovery method called Smart (self management and recovery training): Self Help Substance Abuse & Addiction Recovery | SMART Recovery®
(online meetings, forum discussions, articles, and largely free materials). They offer assistance to those who want to recover from addiction, and also to family members dealing with addicted loved ones. It’s a great resource and can help you learn how to define personal boundaries, make sure you remember to take care of your needs along with your efforts to support yoru daughter. They have an online meeting on Mondays at 9pm for family. Its all free.
Since your daughter has had multiple treatments, my thought would be to try to determine if some of her needs have not been met. I really like your idea of talking to an addiction doctor and getting some feedback. I think it would be great to find one close to her. I also think visiting is a fine idea. Maybe you could put some things in place in advance with the addiction doctor, and she would go with you to meet for the first time, or even do it alone.
I also dont know much about methadone. My husband did a detox for the opitates adn then he did use a drug called vivitrol for a couple of months. I would recommend that drug for opiates. You can google it also. vivitrol.com My husband said it helped remove cravings in those early months while he got treatment.
One last things, the video mentioned by lovemenow, is on youtube. I would also recommend it as it describes what happens in the brain during drug use. It is very close to the way my doctors explained it, but this video is clear and easy to watch.
Pleasure Unwoven Full Movie Documentary by Kevin McCauley - YouTube
Anyway, hope some bit of this is helpful. Good Luck. Prayers going out to you.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 46
I want to thank everyone for their input. It was helpful and appreciated.
My daughter's most recent texts just made up my mind to have absolutely no contact until she can prove that she's been sober and working a program for one year which includes prescription drugs. I asked her for specific dates of her most recent drug use, and her stories changed again. I asked her to sign a release at the Methadone clinic, so I could find out when and if she stopped going there, and she said that she'd get around to it when she could. That's a euphemism for "no can do". She's a maninpulator and professional liar, as a result of her addiction. She ends our dialogue with, "You're unhappy and unstable, and I can't have someone like you in my life. My sponsor (imaginary one) loves me and my friends (drug buddies) are my real family. I hope that you can one day find happiness."
How the hell did she turn this around on me? Shouldn't I have been saying this to her? I am done. She made it easy. I deleted her number from my phone.
She will never change, and I can't live with her insanity, lies and chaos. I knew that reconnecting with her last week after seven months was a mistake. She hasn't been using long enough to even consider sobriety. She's lying to me and to herself about her addiction.
She threw private thoughts that I shared with her in my face. She's good at that. She has successfully alienated all of the good people around her. Now she and her white trash buddies can party like it's 1999.
She can now get high 24/7 because she now has two parents who won't be involved in her life. I am so hurt and mad right now. I hope the party was worth it...
Sorry for the rant. Very upset...
My daughter's most recent texts just made up my mind to have absolutely no contact until she can prove that she's been sober and working a program for one year which includes prescription drugs. I asked her for specific dates of her most recent drug use, and her stories changed again. I asked her to sign a release at the Methadone clinic, so I could find out when and if she stopped going there, and she said that she'd get around to it when she could. That's a euphemism for "no can do". She's a maninpulator and professional liar, as a result of her addiction. She ends our dialogue with, "You're unhappy and unstable, and I can't have someone like you in my life. My sponsor (imaginary one) loves me and my friends (drug buddies) are my real family. I hope that you can one day find happiness."
How the hell did she turn this around on me? Shouldn't I have been saying this to her? I am done. She made it easy. I deleted her number from my phone.
She will never change, and I can't live with her insanity, lies and chaos. I knew that reconnecting with her last week after seven months was a mistake. She hasn't been using long enough to even consider sobriety. She's lying to me and to herself about her addiction.
She threw private thoughts that I shared with her in my face. She's good at that. She has successfully alienated all of the good people around her. Now she and her white trash buddies can party like it's 1999.
She can now get high 24/7 because she now has two parents who won't be involved in her life. I am so hurt and mad right now. I hope the party was worth it...
Sorry for the rant. Very upset...
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Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 505
"...my friends (drug buddies) are my real family."
Wow, this must be a line taken out of the addict handbook....my XA said the SAME EXACT THING to me. I guess it's just so much easier for them to be with their 'real family,' made up of fellow addicts/users who aren't always 'on them' about their drug use, than to be with people who ACTUALLY care about them and love them. It's so very sad....
Wow, this must be a line taken out of the addict handbook....my XA said the SAME EXACT THING to me. I guess it's just so much easier for them to be with their 'real family,' made up of fellow addicts/users who aren't always 'on them' about their drug use, than to be with people who ACTUALLY care about them and love them. It's so very sad....
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 46
Originally Posted by EverHopeful721
"...my friends (drug buddies) are my real family."
Wow, this must be a line taken out of the addict handbook....my XA said the SAME EXACT THING to me. I guess it's just so much easier for them to be with their 'real family,' made up of fellow addicts/users who aren't always 'on them' about their drug use, than to be with people who ACTUALLY care about them and love them. It's so very sad....
Wow, this must be a line taken out of the addict handbook....my XA said the SAME EXACT THING to me. I guess it's just so much easier for them to be with their 'real family,' made up of fellow addicts/users who aren't always 'on them' about their drug use, than to be with people who ACTUALLY care about them and love them. It's so very sad....
She wants me in her life desperately, but she doesn't want me to question or confront her about her usage. If I didn't say something, that would mean that I didn't care, and I do. So, it's time for me to remove myself again.
I was naive to even try and believe her bs. One look at her FB page, and a blind person can see that she's using. She still communicates with the people who introduced her to heroin. That sounds like sober behavior. The photos of her with the pinned pupils three months ago also screams out, "I'm not using Methadone or heroin anymore!" She says that she thinks that one day she can use pot socially, which is definitely a sober thing to say.
Ironically, she "claims" to have had a half way to a year sober party at her home group in March. Hmmmmm. She was on Methadone this Fall, and is most likely still on it. She currently takes 6 mg of Xanax. She got an underage consumption ticket (BAC .16) in late October. She smoked pot in December. I'm no mathematician, but aren't those all within the past six months? Denial 101.
This is just what she's telling me, and I'm sure it's just the tip of the iceberg.
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,384
Welcome to SR. I'm sorry about the situation that brought you here. This is a great place for support. It is very hard to watch someone you love repeatedly hurt themselves with drugs.
I have a lot of loved ones who are addicts. I have learned a lot of tools on this website for myself. One of those things is the 3 c's--you didn't cause it, you can't control it, and you can't cure it. I also practice boundary setting. It sounds like you have done that for yourself. You have a boundary that you will not talk to an active addict. It also sounds like you are willing and able to enforce it. Good for you!
I've also learned a lot about self-care. It is important that I take care of my needs. I remember that I cannot make other people happy or well, but I can work on my own wellness and happiness.
Take care!
I have a lot of loved ones who are addicts. I have learned a lot of tools on this website for myself. One of those things is the 3 c's--you didn't cause it, you can't control it, and you can't cure it. I also practice boundary setting. It sounds like you have done that for yourself. You have a boundary that you will not talk to an active addict. It also sounds like you are willing and able to enforce it. Good for you!
I've also learned a lot about self-care. It is important that I take care of my needs. I remember that I cannot make other people happy or well, but I can work on my own wellness and happiness.
Take care!
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 864
Bobolicious....
I call my dad my hero, and with good reason (more than I will share here). He did not confront me or get on me about using drugs or alcohol. And my drug use was not ignored either. I have no doubt he loved me. That shined in his eyes just as the pain did as I used.
She does not need you to be her moral conscious, or someone to protect her from herself, or to tell her that she is a liar, because she knows the truth, and it in many ways probably helps to keep her trapped. She also surely loves something about the high, or why the hell would she seek it out. It isn’t just about the pain one carries and removing it. For all the pain, abuse and confusion, I loved the high, always did and was always seeking out more and better from very young in and out of drugs and alcohol. It was survival.
And the master manipulator comment. First to be clear, manipulation is a learned behavior. They learned how to be that way somewhere. I know exactly how I learned.
And second no one has to play into the manipulation, but they do and usually are all in, and it does have so much to do with who they are and not much to do with the addict in ones life. Some I think need the chaos, they can’t survive without it. And that might be a question you need to ask yourself. What is her addiction feeding in you? Does her addiction keep you stuck? Does her addiction give your purpose?
I do hope you can see her for what she is in the moment, just a girl who lost her way. And understand that nothing for her is set in stone. Love her as is with no conditions and allow her to find her own way without the need to interject or interfere or bring to light what you already know that she is using ... Let her go. She is so capable of saving herself and will if and when she is ready. She also has to tools to do so. Praying a lot is good too.
Also boundaries would help you as well as counseling which I hope you can find.
I will keep her in my prayers.
I call my dad my hero, and with good reason (more than I will share here). He did not confront me or get on me about using drugs or alcohol. And my drug use was not ignored either. I have no doubt he loved me. That shined in his eyes just as the pain did as I used.
She does not need you to be her moral conscious, or someone to protect her from herself, or to tell her that she is a liar, because she knows the truth, and it in many ways probably helps to keep her trapped. She also surely loves something about the high, or why the hell would she seek it out. It isn’t just about the pain one carries and removing it. For all the pain, abuse and confusion, I loved the high, always did and was always seeking out more and better from very young in and out of drugs and alcohol. It was survival.
And the master manipulator comment. First to be clear, manipulation is a learned behavior. They learned how to be that way somewhere. I know exactly how I learned.
And second no one has to play into the manipulation, but they do and usually are all in, and it does have so much to do with who they are and not much to do with the addict in ones life. Some I think need the chaos, they can’t survive without it. And that might be a question you need to ask yourself. What is her addiction feeding in you? Does her addiction keep you stuck? Does her addiction give your purpose?
I do hope you can see her for what she is in the moment, just a girl who lost her way. And understand that nothing for her is set in stone. Love her as is with no conditions and allow her to find her own way without the need to interject or interfere or bring to light what you already know that she is using ... Let her go. She is so capable of saving herself and will if and when she is ready. She also has to tools to do so. Praying a lot is good too.
Also boundaries would help you as well as counseling which I hope you can find.
I will keep her in my prayers.
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 5,750
Originally Posted by cynical one
More proof that the 3 C's of AlAnon are just WRONG.
We didn't cause it
We can't control it
We can't cure it but boy can we contribute to it.
Isn't that the truth?
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
Posts: 11,589
were there any traumatic events or history of drug or alcohol abuse in the family that precipitated her taking up drugs at 13?? sorry I don't know the whole story. her behaviors sound very much like a young girl desperately seeking attention and approval in very unhealthy ways.
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Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 951
So sorry you are hurting.
You asked about track marks - I've seen an addict's marks heal greatly after a few months. No purple or bruised appearance after a year but perhaps some scarring.
I understand what you mean about needing feedback. I like the twelve steps and just recently started working them, but I don't go to meetings. I post here and also share work over email with a partner. I had good coping skills after first coming here. But the growth I already feel after a few weeks of step work is incredible.
I can tell you this- if you change your own attitude and way of look long at things it WILL get better. She may or may not, but you can develop the tools you need to be okay no matter what happens.
And there is hope. She has had enough experience in rehab that when she is ready to quit she will know what to do.
I also understand you anger- it comes from anguish. Please consider feeling it deeply then releasing it. She is in alot of pain, too. Likely much worse pain than what she is causing you. No one deserves to be in the position she is in today, even if they do it to themselves.
I pray, so I am going to pray now for you and for her.
Peace,
Hanna
You asked about track marks - I've seen an addict's marks heal greatly after a few months. No purple or bruised appearance after a year but perhaps some scarring.
I understand what you mean about needing feedback. I like the twelve steps and just recently started working them, but I don't go to meetings. I post here and also share work over email with a partner. I had good coping skills after first coming here. But the growth I already feel after a few weeks of step work is incredible.
I can tell you this- if you change your own attitude and way of look long at things it WILL get better. She may or may not, but you can develop the tools you need to be okay no matter what happens.
And there is hope. She has had enough experience in rehab that when she is ready to quit she will know what to do.
I also understand you anger- it comes from anguish. Please consider feeling it deeply then releasing it. She is in alot of pain, too. Likely much worse pain than what she is causing you. No one deserves to be in the position she is in today, even if they do it to themselves.
I pray, so I am going to pray now for you and for her.
Peace,
Hanna
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Savannah
Posts: 190
All I hear from her is excuses. Benzos are very addictive & are just another drug. If she truly wants to recovery, she needs to learn to live without any mind-altering drug. I was prescribed 4 valium before a sugery & I thought, even though the effects were very mild, it to be very calming; almost to the point that had I been prescribed a full prescription, I would have continued to take them after the surgery was said & done. I suffer from anxiety as well but choose to use exercise as my relief. There are other, natural alternatives, to help your daughter if she really wants it.
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Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 46
Originally Posted by AnvilheadII
were there any traumatic events or history of drug or alcohol abuse in the family that precipitated her taking up drugs at 13?? sorry I don't know the whole story. her behaviors sound very much like a young girl desperately seeking attention and approval in very unhealthy ways.
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Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 46
Originally Posted by AnvilheadII
because if i have the math right, that's when she started using drugs...and SOMETHING usually triggers that, especially at such a young age. sorry i thought that was a perfectly normal question.
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
Posts: 11,589
geezus, never mind. you seem to have no problem giving out every other detail about everything that is WRONG and f'd up with her. i just thought she sounded like she must be a very confused and messed up kid whose having a really hard time. i know i started traveling down the wrong path about 14 and it wasn't just CUZ i was looking for something to do......i was acting out in some unhealthy ways in response to the world around me.
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Join Date: Apr 2013
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I want nothing more than my daughter to be happy, healthy, drug free and successful. I had no contact with her for seven months because she needed to be sober for 6-12 months before I allowed her back into my life. After daily messages from her over that period, I returned her calls a few days ago to see if she really was sober, as she has professed. Based on her actions and refusal to allow me to confirm her sobriety, I decided to not continue contact again. I told her that I love her and have full confidence in her ability to find peace and sobriety, but won't speak with her until a year of sobriety. She responded by turning it around on me, which isn't that unsual for someone in active addiction. I ignored her response, as I know that it was said out of hurt.
What and how I say things on here, is not how I communicate with my beloved daughter. I came to this forum to seek help, in addition to vent my frustration and hurt.
For a woman, any woman, to even suggest that I somehow get off on my daughter's addiction (that may potentially lead to her untimely death) because I enjoy chaos and find purpose, is not only profoundly hurtful, it couldn't be further from the truth. In addition, everyone knows how manipulative addicts learn to be, and for someone to suggest that I taught her how to be manipulative, is hurtful. I have disclosed a tiny fraction of my and my daughter's life on here, not enough for someone to even make an educated guess that I enjoy chaos and find purpose in her addiction. Some posts on this thread were not written with good intentions.
If you want to respond to my threads because you want to help, I welcome that. If you want to respond because my story hit your hot button or reminds you of your past, and you want to be hurtful, I do not welcome that. I welcome people telling me what I don't want to hear, but not words that are written with an intent to hurt. Please direct those words toward the people who really hurt you, not me.
Thank you
What and how I say things on here, is not how I communicate with my beloved daughter. I came to this forum to seek help, in addition to vent my frustration and hurt.
For a woman, any woman, to even suggest that I somehow get off on my daughter's addiction (that may potentially lead to her untimely death) because I enjoy chaos and find purpose, is not only profoundly hurtful, it couldn't be further from the truth. In addition, everyone knows how manipulative addicts learn to be, and for someone to suggest that I taught her how to be manipulative, is hurtful. I have disclosed a tiny fraction of my and my daughter's life on here, not enough for someone to even make an educated guess that I enjoy chaos and find purpose in her addiction. Some posts on this thread were not written with good intentions.
If you want to respond to my threads because you want to help, I welcome that. If you want to respond because my story hit your hot button or reminds you of your past, and you want to be hurtful, I do not welcome that. I welcome people telling me what I don't want to hear, but not words that are written with an intent to hurt. Please direct those words toward the people who really hurt you, not me.
Thank you
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Let's all just step back for a second, okay?
It's very difficult to know what another is intending when relying on the written word.
If this thread deosn't take a very quick up-swing in tone, it will be closed.
It's very difficult to know what another is intending when relying on the written word.
If this thread deosn't take a very quick up-swing in tone, it will be closed.
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